I've figured out why my wife can't open up to liberalism.

[Aristus]

Most of us can only truly relate to something based on the way it affects us personally; and by the examples we see in our daily lives.

Well, my wife's family is conservative republican; every last one of them. Now her family is wealthy, and 'born-again', so that pretty much explains why. But here's the thing: They are all of them nice, kind, friendly, warm and generous. Don't EVER talk politics around them, but they are very pleasant otherwise.

Now, my family is die-hard Democratic, and liberal to the bone. But we tend to be cranky, bad-tempered, cynical, and often surly. Even a little neurotic, at times.

So my wife sees this, the demeanor of our two branches of the family, and decides that liberalism is not for her, based on the way my family is. I've tried to explain to her that we are this way as a reaction to the repub idiocy we have to deal with on a daily basis, but she's not convinced. She hates B*sh and thinks he is a very bad joke, but she still supports the Republicans in general. Should I take this small victory, and ignore the rest?

[WilliamPitt]

1. Well, since Bush is not a Republican,

and since Republican people are not inherently evil, I'd say you're doing OK. I'd also say you might find some liberals who aren't neurotic and expose your wife to them. I *twitch* volunteer.

:)

[Aristus]

5. Thanks, Will. I'm not neurotic either, (I think), but all it takes

is for my wife to watch my mother and my sister do a complicated ballet on eggshells around each other, and that's does it for her.

Good point about B*sh not being repub. My in-laws worship the ground he walks on, though, which since they're supposed to be Christians, probably makes them evil by definition. Makes me grate my teeth, because they really are wonderful people.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

2. It's a step in the right direction!

it sometimes takes people years to see the light. at least she's willing to see Bush's hypocrisy. I have had the opposite experience from your wife. The few Republican families I have known are spiteful, nasty and neurotic. I think it's all that born-again crap: they think they can act like assholes because Jesus will forgive them!

You should come to Boston sometime so she can meet so nice, warm, healthy liberals!

[E_Zapata]

7. Noooooooo, introduce her to some nasty republicans!

Show her what her party really stands for.

Or just print some threads from that other board.

[arcane1]

3. let her read from a repube like Ron Paul

that should be interesting, to say the least...

[Brucey]

4. It's all genetic anyway,

so don't sweat it.

[Aristus]

8. I've been thinking 'genetic' for a while now.

My wife opposes legal abortion, but every other issue she supports would seem to make her a Democrat. Death penalty, the war in Iraq, gun control, health care, you name it. Her family is Republican, so she must think she has to be one.

[Cheswick2.0]

21. expose her to the sad places and people that repugs leave behind

don't just focus on bush, but on all kinds of policies and legislation that hurt people. show her some stories about women who were not allowed to get abotions they needed and died, or pro-life women who have had abortions but feel they deserve special dispensation from God because of their special circumstances.

[Aristus]

22. Actually, my grandmother has been great help in that regard.

She is an ultra, ultra conservative Southern Baptist. (How she gave birth to my liberal mother, I'll never know.) But she is pro-choice. Her attitude is: "If a Christian woman got an abortion, she must have had a good reason." My grandmother does NOT like to be told what to do......by anyone. She and my wife have talked occasionally; maybe someday, the topic will come up, and my Grandmother can enlighten her.

[E_Zapata]

6. Any way to explain to her:

that being clued into the suffering and injustice of the world makes one generally ill at ease?

My hat is off to you dude. I could never have a spouse who espoused all that evil. (Denying or ignoring it exists is the same as voting for it - sorry to say).

[Aristus]

11. That's the thing, though: She doesn't espouse evil. (Except in her

tacit support of those who do. Small distinction, but an important one.) My wife has a strong hatred of injustice and bigotry, but she's been so programmed by her family to think that the Democrats are 'un-Christian' that it's hard to get through sometimes. She's getting an education, though, watching B*sh, and his so-called 'Christian' behavior.

[Darth_Kitten]

9. Whenever I'm cranky.....

it's because I have to go work at a crappy job (atmosphere wise) and never had daddy's money to fall back on. :evilgrin:
I'm a "liberal" because life was never handed to me on a silver platter. (not saying it was in your wife's case, trust me, no bashing intended!!!!!!!! it's just that I don't care for the "to the manor born" attitude of some people who ARE right wingers)

Just where I stand :)

[Aristus]

12. That's what makes my wife so wonderful; She doesn't

rely on her family's money. She's made her own way, working hard and getting an education. Moving up in the world the old fashioned way. Her education may explain why she's far more progressive than the rest of her family.

[Darth_Kitten]

24. Good for her!

it's just that some privileged person's attitudes leave alot to be desired. :) I've always had that opinion, your post just left me an opening in which to express myself. ;) Your wife indeed sounds like a special person. :) :hi:


I've known nice conservatives myself, many who have no tolerance for Bush at all. :)

[DarkPhenyx]

10. Just becasue they are Republican dosen't make them bad.

Simply becasue their ideology is rightwing dosen't make them wrong. Tke the victory and move on.

[Kamika]

13. Ignorance is bliss

The most harmonic happy ppl i ever met are republicans.. democrats see the unfairness in life. How ppl exploit everyone etc etc

So ofcourse were cranky and cynical.

I wish i was a freeper sheep who knew that the solutions to life came out of bush mouth too. Life would be great, I wouldnt have to think at all.

[Aristus]

14. I was thinking the same thing.

As much as I love my in-laws, I can't stand their smug self-assurance that since the Chimp is in charge, everything is going to be all right. Thank you, Fox News. :grr:

[supernova]

17. Exactly - bliss v. opening your eyes

It's much easier to ignore the complexities of life if you trust that the people in charge are supposed to be there and are much smarter than you are.

This relieves you of the personal responsibility of doing your own thinking about such exitential matters as "why are we here?", "what can I do?", and "what does another person experience?" Thinking about these topics does produce a more complex outlook on life, and sometimes a person is bound to be cranky about it all. Only natural.

What I think is unnatural, is being too nice and too "swell" all the time. Nobody is emotionally that perfect. If that's the case, there's a lot going on that doesn't get expressed.

To get back on topic, I think us liberals are just more honest about our dispositions overall.

Aristus, just be glad your wife sees through Smirk.

[Aristus]

19. Oh I am! Her favorite President?

Jimmy Carter! She understands that he, unlike B*sh, Ron-nut Raygun, and the others, is a true Christian who reaches out to others to ease pain and suffering.

[VelmaD]

15. My cynical kee-jerk response...

is that it's easy to be nice and kind and friendly and happy when you've had your brain washed and you don't have to think.

But that's too mean spirited so I'm gonna try for a kinder, gentler response. I think one of the previous posters was right. It's very hard to break away from conditioning that has gone on since childhood. That she supports many liberal ideals is a good thing. However, I'm at a loss why she would continue to vote for people who believe the exact opposite and whose behavior makes it obvious that they do not support social justice.

I think you can be happy that she's moved so much from her upbringing but don't rest on your laurels or there's no guarantee she'll ever make the next step. My own tough-love approach would be to make her as psychologically uncomfortable about voting Republican as possible. Make her tell you why she supports them. And none of that namby-pamby feelings stuff. Make her give you concrete reasons and examples of actual laws they passed that she supports. And hit her with examples of things they have passed that she REALLY opposes. You know what her hot-buttons are - use them.

I'm not saying be mean about it or anything. Just give her some cognitive dissonance until she decides what she really wants to be politically.

Just my 2 cents.
Darth Velma

[Aristus]

16. I know you weren't being mean. You made some excellent points.

Some of the things I've done already include letting her know about the Repuke plan to eliminate overtime pay and comp time. She makes an hourly wage (admittedly a fairly high one) and she was more than a little upset at such blatant pandering to the corporations.
My stepson (who is constantly channeling Rush Lamebrain) has been educated by me in the ways the repukes are trying to eliminate workplace safety regulations, and destroy the unions. His dad is a union construction worker, so these points really hit home. It's interesting now that I think about it, but B*sh and his minions are giving my family members all the reasons they need to abandon the Repubs. I'm growing more hopeful.

[VelmaD]

18. The repukes are their own...

worst enemies sometimes aren't they. :evilgrin:

It's just important that you keep pushing them a little bit or they backslide. It happens. They are uncofortable with the repugs but if they aren't uncofortable enough then they'll fall back on old patterns when they get in the voting booth. Or they just won't go vote at all.

Texas is a great example. No one in this state will admit to liking our governor but damn if a bunch of people didn't vote for the bastard. My best friend's dad ranted about the man constantly leading up to the gubernatorial election - but he didn't DO anything to help keep him from becoming governor, like, ya know, actually getting up and going to vote against him. Drives me nuts. *sigh*

Sorry, off my soapbox now. :-)

DV

P.S. Hey, where's my daily donut Dude? ;-)

[Aristus]

20. Right here, Vel.

:donut:

[populistmom]

23. To me Christianity can't coincide with being a Republican

The whole agenda of the Republican party seems to be completely against what Christ taught- peace, compassion, forgiveness, taking care of the poor. To truly call yourself a Christian and a Republican to me is an oxymoron.
http://www.liberalslikechrist.org/

[Aristus]

25. I agree. I'm a liberal Christian.

My in-laws just can't see the disparity between conservatism as it is practiced today, and the teachings of Christ. Fox News and a right-wing evangelical church take care of any 'unorthodox' thoughts they might ever have.

[Zephyrbird]

26. Ask her a couple questions:

1) Ask her why she hates bush and thinks he's a joke. After she answers, then ask her this question:

2) If she thinks Bush is a joke and his policies ruinous (or whatever reason she gives you for hating him) ask her why, then, would she keep supporting and voting for the party that keeps him in power and supports continuing his policies?

Don't be rude, and don't demand an answer. Let her think about it for a good long while. Plant the seed and let the flowers grow. Then bit by bit, she may start thinking differently. Part of it is family, part of it is past entrenched practice, part of it is listening to the constant barrage on TV, radio and the media about dirty democrats, liberals being socialists, socialists ruining the country. Let her think about it.

I have a friend who is an old school, dyed in the wool Republican. Lately she had been complaining about vets' benefits being cut; social programs for the worthy being cut; the deficit; folks with disabilities being cut from welfare, concern about the environment. All of a sudden she stopped in mid-stride, turned and looked at me and said "oh my God, I sound like a liberal Democrat!!" I smiled and said "you wanna come to a meeting for Dean or Kucinich?" She cried out NO!!!! but I'm waiting for her to talk herself into it! :-)

Your wife's not mean or stupid. I was once a Republican myself, was brought up in it, but you have trouble being more lib Dem than I. My mother has turned her back on the Repub party, but alas, my father still votes it most of the time.

[Kolesar]

27. Do they share their success by donating time or money to the needy?

There are people who, through no fault of their own, are in bad conditions. For example, orphans, disabled, mentally impaired. Do they share their wealth substantially to ease suffering and create hope?

If individuals do not fund the safety net (which is NOT being funded adequately), then the public must fund it through the government. At this point the whole "low taxes, small government" thesis of the right collapses.

Then there are the other issues of managing the public good. Pollution and resource depletion are quite likely going to cause starvation, war, and the end of many species on this planet, including our own species. Free marketeers, libertarians, conservatives, and republicans are grossly negligent and irresponsible on these issues.

Tell 'em!

[Aristus]

28. Nope. All their money goes to the church. And the church

keeps it. You should see the place. A gilded, thyroidal, monstrous monument to greed. I seriously doubt Jesus would want to live there.

[bloom]

29. My parents/siblings are Republicans

it amazes me that they can be very intelligent in many ways and then in other things...

I think I really made the break in High School where I was attracted more to liberal, creative, environmentally conscious people. My siblings probably think I was brainwashed by the secular humanists - but I certainly don't see it that way.

I think I am more idealistic and they are more practical, generally. And something about their religion. I do think there is something going on with the type of people they identify with.

[Iris]

30. Going through life with blinders on can make one very agreeable.

Once you take them of, why of course you become cynical and cranky!