Billy Graham and me

[NNN0LHI]

I was eleven or twelve years old, circa 1966. Some kids I used to hang with in the hood were going to see Billy Graham at one of the ball parks in Chicago with their parents and asked if I wanted to go. I didn't know who Billy Graham was. But my friends were going so I went for the ride. Don't remember much. But I do remember when it was time for collecting donations. Bunch of Graham's people began handing out blank generic looking checks to be filled in by the faithful. I was handed one. I didn't know what to do with it. I was encouraged by someone to fill in my banks and my name and donate 20 dollars. I didn't have a checking account. Just a little savings account with $40 or $50 bucks from cutting lawns and gifts. Didn't have my account number with me or the banks address either. So I filled it in with my name and the name of my bank.

Well God as my witness, Billy got his 20 bucks from my little savings account a week later. Yea he did. I remember my mother reading some minor investigative report about Billy wearing $200 pairs of shoes at that time during the mid sixties. I remember thinking that there must be good money in that religion business.

Don

[Reverend_Smitty]

1. Billy Graham and his ilk...

are all greedy sharks, I don't care what anyone says. I have a theory that they are all carving out their own little nook in hell. How many thousands of people have they bilked out of their life savings? Why the hell does God need so much money?

[recovering democrat]

4. How to distribute the money...

There is a wonderful little joke of which I do not remember all the details.

Three of our most well known evangelists are discussing how they decide how much of the money they collect goes to the Lord and how much to them. The first draws a circle, throws money up in the air, and announces that whatever comes down inside the circle goes to God and outside the circle to him; the second draws a smaller circle, with the same distribution. The third has the best plan - he throws the money up in the air, and announces whatever stays up in the air belongs to God and whatever comes down belongs to him. Choose your own names from among the greedy evangelists - the third one is probably true of all of them!

:-)

[peekaloo]

2. God doesn't need money grams He has Billy Graham(s).

sorry....paraphrasing an old SNL BG joke.

[ckramer]

3. In today's NBC Today show

Bill Graham said he's a democrat, and was sorry about the blue states' lost.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

6. Out Of All The Televangelists Billy Graham Leads The Most

Modest Of Lives...


He was a friend of Bill Clinton and wrote that Clinton's speeches after Oklahoma City were things of beauty...


He spoke out against impeachment and opined how he could see how women were attracted to Clinton...


He doesn't bash gays or other groups... He just tries to lead folks to Christ...

He's an incredibly charismatic man who would have been a success in any field he chose...

[Lydia Leftcoast]

7. Of all the televangelists, he gets the most respect from

mainstream churches. That's because he doesn't try to convert people to his own organization--he tells them to get more involved in the churches they already attend. (And in fact, most people who attend these crusades are already involved in some church or other. I can't imagine why an atheist would attend except for entertainment.)

[Crankie Avalon]

8. That's strange...

...I went on the Today Show link to check that out and couldn't find anything about him.:eyes:

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3032633/?ta=y

[DemocratSinceBirth]

9. He's A Registered Democrat...

He supported Bush and is the person who allegedly led Bush To Christ but he's been a friend to all the presidents including JFK and Clinton....

In fact Billy Graham is the man who Barbara Bush bought in when Dubya said Jews can't go to heaven because they haven't accepted Jesus Christ as their savior.. I have to give Barbara Bush credit for not endorsing this notion... While they were actually having this discussion she brought in Billy Graham to opine on whether Jews can or can not go to Heaven...

Billy Graham said that we can't divine what's in God's mind... That's a clever way of avoiding the controversy but better than Dubya's view....

Also, in his biography he speaks very highly of Clinton...

[Crankie Avalon]

10. He still seems like a douche bag to me...

:shrug:

[DemocratSinceBirth]

11. Why

he doesn't bash gays...


he doesn't bash Muslimss....


he doesn't bash liberals...

he just tries to lead folks to Christ...

I can think of more malicious pursuits...

[Lavender Brown]

12. It's his son who bashes other religions

http://slate.msn.com/id/2081432/

[DemocratSinceBirth]

14. Franklin Graham Speaks For Himself...

I'm not too familiar with Franklin...


I just know Billy Graham is pretty moderate...


In fact when he defended Clinton during impeachment Bill Bennett wrote a piece in either the Times or Wall Street Journal criticizing Graham for defending Clinton...

What an irony...

[NNN0LHI]

13. "he just tries to lead folks to Christ..." Yea, for a price

What were they even doing handing a kid some kind of promissory note at one of his "Crusades"? "Crusades"? Hmmm. "he doesn't bash Muslimss...." Ask some Muslim what he thinks of Billy's "Crusades".

Don

[DemocratSinceBirth]

16. He Leads A Modest Life...

All his books are open...


Billy Graham calls his evangelizing "Crusades"....

He doesn't bash Muslims...

I stand by that...

You have access to the whole internet... Show me a link where Billy Graham bashes Muslims and I'll withdraw my statements if not I'll just think you're out looking for an argument...





Brian

[NNN0LHI]

20. Not looking for an arguement. You say "All his books are open..." Prove it

Might want to peruse this first though:

http://www.cephas-library.com/evangelists_when_is_it_going_to_happen.html

<snip>Although Billy Graham encourages religious leaders to be open about their salaries and publish their finances, Howard-Browne would not disclose what he earns. He says his salary is determined by his board of directors, which is comprised of four pastors, himself and his wife. The couple does not vote on his salary. ``People get hung up on the figure,'' he says. ``But they don't take everything into account. I don't get a housing or clothing allowance. We take our kids on the road and that's very expensive.''

Not good enough, says Paul Nelson, president of the Evangelical Council of Financial Accountability in Washington. Revival Ministries International is not among its 925 members. ``When you hold yourself out as a public trust, it's just good practice to be open about your finances,'' he says. ``If you're not forthright, you leave a question in the minds of your potential givers.''

For the past five years, the ministry has been audited by Katz & Kamm, a Baltimore accounting firm. But the tax-exempt church association is not required to open its books to the public. `While I applaud them for getting the audit, I would strongly suggest they go one step further and make their records public,'' Nelson says.

Speaking of making their records public, "open about your finances'' and "forthright," while Paul Nelson, President of Evangelical Council of Financial Accountability reveals upon demand even to strangers his total salary of $ 123,000 and IRS tax form 990 Billy, Ned and Franklin Graham do not. This makes the Grahams and ECFA hypocrites.

Many prominent Baptist evangelists in America, such as Billy and Franklin Graham, belong to the Evangelical Council of Financial Accountability that purports to work on behalf of the donor but in reality exists for the spenders. For although ECFA has in its possessions the total salaries of all the religious evangelical non-profit organizations that belong to it, it will not disclose them?"

Why is it that the Religious Evangelical leaders in America such as Bill Bright and Billy Graham who profess Christ and the love of Truth will not disclose their total salaries nor release their personal income tax to their donors? Is it possible that they are really crooks who use the separation of Church and State to fleece the sheep as South African Evangelist Dr. Rodney Howard-Browne had said, it was their responsibility to fleece the sheep?

more

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. He Got Paid A Salary While He Was Sick...

I worked in a small business.... Less than ten people and one of the workers got cancer of the uterus.... She missed six months of work.... My boss continued to pay her $60,000.00 a year salary (in 1990 dollars)...


I don't see the big problem....

But I think the more grievous charge is the Muslim bashing charge....

[Crankie Avalon]

15. I never got involved with his "ministry..."

...but my folks did, many years ago, along with the one for Robert Shuler.

The honeymoon ended gradually and my folks came to see them both as greedy crooks. I guess "leading folks to Christ" is expensive if not exactly "malicious."

In any case, he certainly won't get $200 dollar shoes (in 60s era buying power) from me.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

17. I'd Like To See Documentary Evidence About The $200.00 Shoes...

I remember a piece in GQ about Billy and Franklin Graham ...

Franklimn Graham was the slick looking one.....

Billy Graham's suit looked like something you would buy at Penneys...


Now, that's my anecdote but I think I can distinguish between say a Hickey Freeman suit, an Armani suit and a off the rack $299.00 suit from Penneys...

[Crankie Avalon]

18. If you obtain solace from his preaching...

...I'm happy for you.

Good day.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. No... It Really Doesn't Move Me One Way Or Another...

I just think of the lot he's the best ....

And he defended Clinton during impeachment...

I keep a list of Clinton's detractors and defenders in that time period...

Good day....

[Jose Diablo]

23. Hey, whats wrong with a Hickey Freeman suit?

I liked them, is it still possible to buy a Hickey Freeman?

[jdots]

5. It's sad that people think that God can be franchised

and this goes across all religions.

[Jose Diablo]

22. In the very early 70's I used to listen at work on am radio

on Sunday mornings to Rev Ike. The guy was refreshing in his honesty. Claimed that the LACK of money was the root of all evil. And to solve his lack of money problem, the listeners should send in their checks, which some did.

Even I was was tempted by his honesty to slip him a finn from time to time. His philosophy was spot-on I think.