US using outlawed Napalm gas in Fallujah???? Link Article

[noclonyofthechimp]

Nov 28 2004

US uses banned weapon ..but was Tony Blair told?

By Paul Gilfeather Political Editor


US troops are secretly using outlawed napalm gas to wipe out remaining insurgents in and around Fallujah.

News that President George W. Bush has sanctioned the use of napalm, a deadly cocktail of polystyrene and jet fuel banned by the United Nations in 1980, will stun governments around the world.

And last night Tony Blair was dragged into the row as furious Labour MPs demanded he face the Commons over it. Reports claim that innocent civilians have died in napalm attacks, which turn victims into human fireballs as the gel bonds flames to flesh.

Outraged critics have also demanded that Mr Blair threatens to withdraw British troops from Iraq unless the US abandons one of the world's most reviled weapons. Halifax Labour MP Alice Mahon said: "I am calling on Mr Blair to make an emergency statement to the Commons to explain why this is happening. It begs the question: 'Did we know about this hideous weapon's use in Iraq?'"


http://www.sundaymirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=14920109&method=full&siteid=106694&headline=fallujah-napalmed-name_page.html

[slackmaster]

1. I'm calling BS on this story

First of all, napalm isn't a gas. It's a gel.

Read the Al Jazeera's report. The "strange bombs" described sound just like phosphorus munitions and not at all like napalm.

http://www.aljazeera.com/cgi-bin/news_service/middle_east_full_story.asp?service_id=5875

Why would the US military bother taking defoliant munitions to a place that has no jungles?

:shrug:

[noclonyofthechimp]

3. It mentions something about the gel. They say we admitted to using Napalm

before????????? I'll see if I can find anything about it in the UK papers.

[slackmaster]

8. I'll believe it when the Red Cross or Red Crescent say so

Or some other credible NGO like Doctors Without Borders.

Oh yeah, they left Iraq a couple of months ago.

So far we have one British tabloid and Al Jazeera as quasi-primary sources.

[mdhunter]

10. Napalm was not designed to be a defoliant

It was deliberately designed to physically injure, but not kill, human beings. It went through several iterations in Vietnam whereby it became stickier, hotter, and gained the ability to burn under water - after it was learned that "merely" jumping in a lake would stop the burning.

Perhaps you were thinking of Agent Orange?

[slackmaster]

12. No, not thinking of Agent Orange

There is no way napalm was designed as an anti-personnel weapon.

It's classified as an incendiary - meant to start fires and keep them burning.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/incendiary.htm

There are many types of napalm, with dozens of different compositions. Napalm (trade name) is a powder. Mixed with gasoline, it is a tactical weapon used to remove vegetative cover and instill fear. Fire bomb fuel gel mixture, the new nomenclature for napalm, is a mixture of fuel and gelling solution that are combined to produce a thickened mixture. The fuel gel mixture is stringy and sticky, and readily adheres to most surfaces. The fuel gelling system consists of a fuel gelling unit, drums of gelling solution, and aviation gas, mogas, JP-4, or JP-5 fuels.

[mdhunter]

24. Hmm.

I guess starting fires and burning jungle is one use of the weapon, and your link confirms that, at least at one point, was its intended use. And I just now looked up that the inventor thought it best used for killing crab grass, though it was developed under grant from and for the use of the U.S. government.

It is a fact, however, that the chemical agent was refined explicitly for more "effective" use on humans. Consider the following (Found on an anti-Dow site, the quote from one of Roy's books).

"We sure are pleased with those backroom boys at Dow. The original product wasn't so hot -- if the gooks were quick they could scrape it off. So the boys started adding polystyrene --- now it sticks like shit to a blanket. But then if the gooks jumped under water it stopped burning, so they started adding Willie Peter (white phosphorus) so's to make it burn better. It'll burn under water now. And just one drop is enough; it'll keep on burning right down to the bone so they die anyway from phosphorus poisoning."

So, it seems to me like we're agreeing in principle but coming at this from opposite sides. I feel like the psychological fear and "effectiveness" of napalm doesn't lay in its ability to clear out trees, but in its painful, distressing use on humans. Why napalm would be reengineered to be more effective use against sentient beings, as opposed to trees, for reasons other than the explict use of it against human targets isn't clear. Given that there were more effective defoliants being used, at least in Vietnam, and the broader documentation of the use of napalm on military personnel and civilians, I have to question whether the U.S. military ever did not intend to use napalm on human populations, regardless of the uses for which is was designed.

The point remains that napalm is not currently used for defoliant purposes, and incendiary devices that are painfully similar are being used in urban, populated, centers.

[Fridays Child]

17. US admits it used napalm bombs in Iraq

US admits it used napalm bombs in Iraq
By Andrew Buncombe in Washington
10 August 2003


American pilots dropped the controversial incendiary agent napalm on Iraqi troops during the advance on Baghdad. The attacks caused massive fireballs that obliterated several Iraqi positions.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=432201

(This is a paid archive article, with only the first paragraph for free.)

[mdhunter]

2. According to the DOD...

It isn't napalm, but a napalm like flammable gel.

Essentially, they changed the medium from gasoline to something else. This was confirmed last week.

[slackmaster]

5. Welcome to DU

Have you a link to official DoD information on what this flammable substance might be?

[bif]

6. It's new and improved!

I read they're using kerosene instead of jet fuel. Probably a cost saving measure.

[slackmaster]

9. You've read...

Got a link?

[bif]

11. It was posted here a couple times yesterday

But I didn't bookmark it.

[noclonyofthechimp]

13. Sorry..Didn't see the link.

[slackmaster]

16. Ah, I think I found it

http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2003/030805-firebombs01.htm

Results are 'remarkably similar' to using napalm

[noclonyofthechimp]

7. Ah!

[mdhunter]

14. Link about Mark 77 Firebombs, the "remarkably similar" napalm alternative

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/6465972.htm

If you poke around there are other reports cofirming use in different areas and more about the similiarity between these firebombs and old fashioned napalm.

The difference is semantic, not functional.

[slackmaster]

18. Agreed

The difference is semantic, not functional.

I can't help myself. I was a technical writer for several years.

[noclonyofthechimp]

20. Thanks for the detialed info and research

[noclonyofthechimp]

21. typo

[DS1]

4. Mirror = Enquirer

[bowens43]

19. How about CNN?

"It is now estimated the hill was hit so badly by missiles, artillery and by the Air Force, that they shaved a couple of feet off it. And anything that was up there that was left after all the explosions was then hit with napalm. And that pretty much put an end to any Iraqi operations up on that hill. "

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/21/otsc.irq.savidge/

[gWbush is Mabus]

15. i remember the original jetfuel article in 2002, i think

this may not be bs

[slackmaster]

22. Substitute "incendiary weapons" for "Napalm" and it's clearly true

n/t

[gWbush is Mabus]

23. one mention

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/21/otsc.irq.savidge/

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

25. kick

[Aristus]

26. Wow. Every day we get a new link to Vietnam.

Now, should the Iraqis express their gratitude to us for "liberating" them BEFORE or AFTER we shower them with napalm?

Just asking.


Well, hellfire is hotter than napalm and B*sh is going to get an eternal dose of it when he heads for the big golf-cart roundup.
:grr::mad::grr::mad::grr::mad::grr:

[underpants]

27. Have you seen Farenheit 9/11? A soldier mentions it in the movie

He says "We called in a napalm strike over there" or something like that. It was shocking when I heard it-I had no idea we still used that.