I don't care how they package it, Christian Music is not cool! Christians

[Catfight]

are a bunch of followers, never leaders, that's why it's just copycats of the authentic talent of real artist. Christian Music is mimic-music. Christian Faux Music doesn't rock.

[jamboi]

1. Well, I'm a Christian and a musician and I can rock originally. :-) n/t

[sbj405]

2. lol. I was thinking the same thing as the story came on. nt

[0rganism]

3. Ever listen to Bach's Mass in B Minor?

That there's some badass Christian music.

[FizzFuzz]

7. ooops you're right--THAT kind of Christian music rules.

love early renaissance church music

[Aristus]

20. Or Mozart's Mass in C Minor.

That's some out-of-this-world Christian music! It's dark and moody, but it seems to be saying 'God's in charge. Everything's cool.'

B-):smoke::hippie:

[FizzFuzz]

4. my work department is fillllllled with them and so I've had the misfortune

to hear a tiny little bit.

It sucked.

I mean s u c k e d

even heard a little Xtian stand up comedy. A little too heartwarming for me. It was pretty much stand up "The Family Circus", you know. that incredibly lamelameLAME cartoon strip that every paper has been running for the last 40 years. BARF

[Okieprogie]

5. I assume...

You are talking about modern Christian music, as opposed to Bach. But anyway, 99% of it sucks. Charlie Daniels has some good songs, and Third Day is one of the greatest rock bands ever imho. The rest of it all sucks.

[sbj405]

6. This piece is giving me the creeps

:puke:

[Catfight]

14. Me too, the zombies move IN SYNCH! LOL God SAVE me from Your

followers! They are CREEPY...how come they never question they are marketing God and Jesus for profit? Why do they always mask it with, 'saving' souls along the way while the souls get poorer everyday? I don't get it...I think they are more lost than they can see.

[wildeyed]

8. Moby's Play is Christian music.

At least that's the way I was hearing it.

[enki23]

9. please, please, please god...

bring us a Stryper reunion!

[frylock]

27. we are the soldiers under god's command ..

thank you so much for reminding me of this god-awful music.

[tk2kewl]

10. i kinda think calling yourself Third Day is blasphemy

but i think most of the Christian crap i hear from the wingnuts is blasphemy, so stone me

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

11. John Coltrane's "A Love Supreme" is Christian music

...and he didn't follow ANYONE...INCLUDING Miles Davis.

Mimic-music? Copycat? NOT COOL?

Great, find a Coltrane fan and tell them that, then report back here.

:evilgrin:

[Sterling]

35. Yes but black junkies are not tolerated in todays xtian music biz

No matter how much they kick ass. Apples and oranges I am afraid.

[progmom]

57. He wasn't a junkie when he recorded A Love Supreme

[davekriss]

39. Resolution

I can't pick a favorite because there are too many favorites (the world is filled with wonderful music), but Resolution has to be in my top 3 pieces of music of all time.

Anyone out there enjoy Pharoah Sander's Karma, with vocals by Leon Thomas?

"The Creator has a master plan, peace and happiness across the land /
The Creator makes but one demand, peace and happiness for every man!"

Great, great stuff!

[progmom]

58. You should also check out Pharoah's "Jewels Of Thought"

With the tune Hum-Allah-Hum-Allah-Hum Allah. Very much along the same lines as "The Creator..." - lyrics are something like:

"Prince of Peace, won't you hear our pleas, let loving never cease"

[Redleg]

50. Coltrane was a talentless hack.

Just kidding, just kidding. I just bought his "Giant Steps" CD. Some great stuff on there. I am going to get "A Love Supreme" next. I have heard parts of it and it is sublime!

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

53. Oh man, did I have the flamethrower ready...

:-)

A few Coltrane suggestions for you:

Blue Train
My Favorite Things
Coltrane's Sound (primarily for the track "Equinox"
Crescent (recorded six months before "A Love Supreme")
Live At The Village Vanguard ("Spiritual" is pretty amazing)

There are plenty of others, but these CDs (plus "Giant Steps" and "A Love Supreme") form the "core essentials."

:toast:

[Redleg]

81. Thanks for the recommendations!

I have just gotten into Coltrane. I like a lot of what I hear except the stuff that is just way out there (his mid to late 60s stuff). Some of his work is truly sublime. Jazz is so wonderfully diverse.

[progmom]

59. Yay Redleg!

I hope you love it!

[BlueJazz]

They can preach and play and holler and "holy Roll" or

..whatever pleases them...BUT...when they try to make it into law (and you can bet your sweet ass that they will) then it's personal to me and very personal at that....

Keep your religion out of my body, being and laws.

[bullimiami]

12. i always though folk/hippie 'heard it at the protest by some dude"

music was bad. until i heard some crap on one of the many jesus stations, holy horse feathers it was horrible, and the zombies were smiling and toe tapping.

[UpsideDownFlag]

13. where the hell are you guys hearing this?? you're talking about a song

that i cant hear. what are you watching?

[scarletwoman]

15. 60 Minutes piece about "Christian Rock" -- on CBS right now. (n/t)

[sbj405]

16. 60 minutes story on Christian music nt

[mattclearing]

17. I really dug Zwan

As a Pumpkins fan, I thought Corgan trying to make a positive statement that acknowledged Christian ideals was pretty cool. And anything with Jimmy Chamberlain in it demands to be listened to.

I don't think Christianity automatically disqualifies something from being good music.

That said, most music marketed as Christian-friendly is suck-tastic.

[kaitykaity]

18. Agnostic here and I can say for sure POD

rocks. Their disc Satellite is great.

:eyes:

[UpsideDownFlag]

23. yeah, they're pretty, um...hardcore. nt

[kaitykaity]

28. On the scale of industrial, they're babies.

Smooth as butter.

You want hardcore you're gonna have to go secular and
try NIN or Ministry or something.

[UpsideDownFlag]

29. lol yeah, i was kidding. I prefer bane, or converge.

or cannibal corpse.

[kaitykaity]

31. We need a genre music forum so we can discuss these

things and not hijack flamebait threads to talk about
this stuff.

Yeah, I like Fear Factory and Sepultura and Type O Negative
myself.

:hi:

[wildeyed]

19. Also, have you heard the more recent Johnny Cash?

The stuff produced by the guy from Def Jam records? Incredibly powerful and honest music. That man has an almost elemental faith that is awe inspiring. And about as authentic as anything I have heard.

[enigmatic]

56. "My Mother's Hymn Book" is great...

I should play that on my show...

[wildeyed]

62. I haven't heard that.

I have only listened to the last American Recordings (I think it was IV), the one he made right after his wife died, right before he died. It is a mix of covers, many with religious tinges all about mortality. He does a cover of Personal Jesus, an old Depeche Mode song, which will be interesting to any Depeche Mode fans. The Streets of Laredo, Deperado. Very eclectic mix. But it works.

I am interesting in getting into his older stuff after hearing the recent recordings.

[enigmatic]

67. The one I mentioned was his last CD....

It was released after his death. Stunningly beautiful stuff. His American Recordings CD's are classics; I'm partial to his version of Will Oldham's "I See A Darkness" and his most recent version of "Danny Boy" w. just him and a pipe organ. Beautiful, and never fails to put a tear in my eye...

[wildeyed]

68. Bridge over Troubled Waters

is fabulous, too. Is that his daughter singing harmony?

[LittleClarkie]

21. I dunno, I thought the Byrds did pretty well

"Turn, Turn, Turn" was based on Ecclesiastes.

"What if God Was One of Us" was quite spiritual in it's own way.

Poison's "Give Me Something to Believe In" was heart-wrenching in its honest questioning of why the hypocrasy and why bad things happen.

It depends on how self-conscious it comes across. But I agree. As a Christian, "Christian Rock" makes my teeth itch. It was shoved down my throat too much as something I had to replace my normal listening with.

I'd rather a good old-fashioned German marching hymn, to tell you the truth. "A mighty fortress is our God..."

[davekriss]

30. ...and who's song was

"Come on, people now, you gotta' love somebody right now...right now...right now!" Sounds to me like Gospel according to John, the Book of Love!

But I'm a wierd one. I even like the Soul Stirrers with Sam Cooke, and the Swan Silvertones (now who out there ever heard of that?!).

[progmom]

60. Me!

Love the Swan Silvertones! And the Fairfield Four. And the Golden Gate Quartet. And Sister Rosetta Tharpe. And and and...

Yeah.

[Bullseye10]

22. Way to be Inclusive!

That elitist view of "your" music over "their" music really helps win votes in the next election.

[Catfight]

26. Not everything in 'your' repug world is about winning votes. Some

people just know what is 'real' and what is 'fake'. Christian music=fake, authentic artist who are original=real. Why when someone has a different opinion than AM Radio, Bush/Fox TV or the Immoral Majority you all point your fingers to divert you from your own hypocrisy? If having to succumb to the hypocrisy of so called, 'Christian values' no thanks, I'd rather not be inclusive, I will gladly separate myself from the pack of hypocritical wolves of them vs. us.
I think it's your elitist religion that will win the next election no matter what anyone says on DU. War is peace, Christian rock music is good...LOL....it gets more absurd every day Christians and talking heads on the radio don't have anything to bitch about. Funny how today I scanned past the talking points to discover steroids is the big topic while a war is going on...who's out of touch and who's promoting propaganda? FACT: Christian music sucks big time and it is a bunch of sorry asses trying to copy a genre of music. Stick to what they know...boring hymns. Instead of "bust a rhyme," go "bust a hymn." I'm NOT down with G-O-D.

[MelanieArt]

32. LOL! Bravo!

Couldn't say it better! :)

[LittleClarkie]

37. Bad kitty. Bad, bad kitty.

Nice Democrat Freeper impersonation. Hope you're not serious.

Who is "you all" anyway. Why are you assuming the person you're talking to is a Republican? Are you assuming all Christians are Republicans. Are you assuming all Christians listen to AM Radio, Bush/Faux TV and all follow the Jerry Farwell. Well, we don't. Why the Sam Hill do you think I'm here? And I've got a whole church full of folks who voted for Kerry who can also prove you wrong.

Elitist religion? Is that anything like an elitist political party? Sounds like it would be perfect for the Dems then. We're elistist, doncha know.

I must say, Democrat bigotry is SO much more attractive than Republican bigotry.

There is precious little I like about "Christian Music." I have a knee-jerk reaction that I have to overcome when I encounter it. However, I have one Michael Card tape, and one Rich Mullins tape I like. There is some Michael W. Smith I don't mind. By the way, I know a Druid who likes some Christian music too. I guess Druids are just more open-minded.

Much of the rest is as you say, rather plastic. Even so, your prejudiced attitude does not do you, or us as a party, much credit.

[MelanieArt]

41. Whatever happened to just not liking something?

Being tolerant of something doesn't mean that you have to like it, it just means that you have to tolerate that it exists. (loosely quoted from South Park, I believe the "Tolerance Camp" episode :)) Noone here is proposing banning Christian music, or starting a movement against it. A lot of people just don't like it, and that's okay. People are different.

Go ahead and make fun of something I like, I'm secure enough to handle the fact that not everything I enjoy is loved by all. Hell, I might even laugh too.

Feeling better? :)

[LittleClarkie]

48. That's the point, the person I was responding to wasn't being tolerant

She was ranting at the person she was replying to as if that person was a Republican for disagreeing with her. It came close to an anti-Christian rant, and as a Democrat and a Christian, I didn't appreciate the stereotype.

Nope. Not yet. Catwoman needs to pipe up. But thanks for trying anyway. :)

[hollowdweller]

24. Universal House of Prayer by Buddy Miller is great!! Anti bush

"Miller finally felt compelled to make music out of the Christianity Julie induced her Jewish boyfriend to embrace in the early '80s. The other was "the way Jesus has been hijacked by the Bush administration." I wondered whether he identified with any of four descriptives Christians favor: devout, evangelical, born again, saved. "I wouldn't have a problem with them," he responded, "except in the way they're taken by the rest of the world."

snip

That's the idea—to voice a wide range of Christian responses to crises personal and/or political. Even the Victoria Williams-co-written "This Old World," a loose-limbed shuffle whose refrain insists "You can't worship money and God," preaches reconciliation rather than struggle: "Pray, pray/Time to love every man, woman, and child/Pray, pray/Just forgive and let live for a little while."


Check out the video for "worry too much" www.buddyandjulie.com

This album is the only thing that's getting me through seeing my faith hijacked by a bunch of hypocrites.

[MelanieArt]

25. Even worse... Christian Metal!!!

http://www.metalforjesus.org/

LOL. I think they include "Christian Death Metal" as well.

[mattclearing]

33. Obviously you missed Stryper.

Where was God when we needed Him on that one?

Edited to add the capital "H" for the big guy.

[fnottr]

45. LOL, check this out

The tracklist of Horde's "Hellig Usvart" album. I couldn't make up something this good. http://come.to/legacyofhorde

A CHURCH BELL TOLLS AMIDST THE FROZEN NORDIC WINDS
BLASPHEMOUS ABOMINATION OF THE SATANIC PENTAGRAM
BEHOLD, THE RISING OF THE SCARLET MOON
THINE HOUR HAST COME
RELEASE AND CLOTHE THE VIRGIN SACRIFICE
DRINK FROM THE CHALICE OF BLOOD
SILENCE THE BLASPHEMOUS CHANTING
INVERT THE INVERTED CROSS
AN ABANDONED GRAVE BATHES SOFTLY IN THE FALLING MOONLIGHT
CRUSH THE BLOODIED HORNS OF THE GOAT
WEAK, FEEBLE, AND DYING ANTI-CHRIST
THE DAY OF TOTAL ARMAGEDDON HOLOCAUST

[Sterling]

34. You are right. It's lame. What's worse is most of the no talents

that go into that side of the Biz are not even real Christan's. At least not in the sense that they walk the walk.

The whole idea behind it is to coop counter culture and make it safe for the darling little sheep to consume. It is always years behind the trend and watered down to the point of parody.

It is promoted by the Church hes and does not really have to turn a profit to sustain the careers of the douche bag no talents that pollute the genre since churches will pay these acts to play at their churches and facilitate captive audiences in their congregations.

Not to say some Jesus bands don't make money but it's not about profit it's about sheltering young virgin minds from scary ideas. And some naive parents will will pay a lot of money to keep their little girls from blowing rock stars back stage or losing their virginity to Led Zeppelin in the back of some long hairs car. I hate to break it to you but my scumbag friends who went into the Jesus rock biz did it for the free money and pussy.

[Cobalt Violet]

36. Isn't Chevelle a Christian Band.

Real Player has them classified that way.

[Taxloss]

38. I used to be Christian and got to like a band called Flow

And now I'm atheist, but they're still good. So is Bleach's early stuff. I still have a Bleach T-shirt and a Greenbelt '97 (a Christian music festival in the UK) T-shirt somewhere ...

But most of it sucks. At Greenbelt '97, the headlining act was the Sneaker Pimps. (No, not Christian.) This still amuses me. They started the hit "6 Underground" by saying (to a crowd of partying Christians): "This is six ... six ... six Underground!"

It had me in stitches then. It has me in stitches now.

[jayctravis]

40. Great South Park episode...

where Cartman figured out they could be a sucky contemporary christian band and make money.

[Jack_DeLeon]

42. Creed ++

althought when they were around they claimed not to be a "Christian band."

I also never knew P.O.D. was a Christian band till my girlfriend told me.

[Redleg]

43. That's a sweeping generalization.

And offensive to boot. And I'm not even much of a Christian. Why stir up the shit in here like that? Why not instead name a particular band that sucks and leave it at that instead of indicting the whole christian music scene?

[LittleClarkie]

49. Thanks Redleg

My point exactly.

[0rganism]

44. I do like some King's X, they have the capacity to rock fairly hard

They came on the scene during the early '90s Grunge Renaissance and did quite well for a while. Check out their album "Gretchen Goes to Nebraska" sometime, you won't even know you're listening to Christian rock music except I told you so.

[AntiCoup2K4]

51. Well, when you entitle an album "Faith Hope and Love".....

...and make it clear that you're quoting 1 Corinthians 13, it ain't exactly going to get you branded Devil worshippers. And the fact that they were Phil Keaggy's backup band for a while didn't hurt either.

But once Doug came out of the closet, that pretty much ended any endorsement from the Christian music establishment. Can't have any Sodomites in our Family Bookstores, ya know.

[0rganism]

54. True enough, but that's not GGTN...

I'd agree that "Faith Hope Love" was a far more obvious album -- but still much less blatantly preachy than the stereotypical Godrock. They were certainly Christians but they were also TrippingSpaceAlienChristians, which I find enjoyable in moderation.

So Doug Pinnick came out, eh? He kinda gave me that impression from the start, but I don't usually pay much attention to those things. Still, that would play hell with his career... Hmm. Interesting plot twist, but a significant blow to a talented individual given the constraints of his market. Now excuse me while I google some articles about how that all went down.

This is almost Jerry Springer stuff. Hehe.

edit: Whoa! Not only did Pinnick come out, he left religion! (or found agnosticism, depending on how you slice it)

http://www.sonicgarden.com/sonic-web/news.cfm?newsid=642&newstypeid=5

"Religion, to me, is just a terrible, terrible disservice to mankind. Everybody feels they've interpreted the Bible correctly and their way is right. I look around and go, 'You know, if Jesus came right now and said, 'Hey, here I am. I'm the Son of God. I've come back to you,' these same guys would go, 'Get the fuck out of here!' It's stupid. Give me a break."

Now that's what I'd call a reversal. I may even have to give their newer albums a listen. Apparently it wasn't quite the blow to their careers that I thought it would be at first, since the Christian bookstore chains that dropped them had only carried their music for a couple weeks. This is looking to be a rich line of inquiry tho...

[mcscajun]

46. Robert Randolph & the Family Band

Forget about "Christian Rock"...but there is some Christian music worth listening to, and these guys are it. "Sacred Steel" music comes out of the "House of God" a New Jersey church, and Robert Randolph has turned on more than just the congregation. I heard their music on a public radio station last summer...and damn it was amazing!

I'm not the least bit religious, and I find their tune "The March" totally awesome. You can find it at their website: follow the links for "music", "hear live and studio recordings", and then click on the "Live at the Wetlands" album cover, and listen to "The March" clip.

http://www.robertrandolph.net/

[Columbia]

47. How do you turn a regular rock song into a Christian rock song?

Change every "baby" to "Jesus."

[progmom]

61. A lot of early rhythm and blues did it the other way around.

Took spirituals and changed "Jesus" to "baby" and "God" to "love".

[AntiCoup2K4]

52. Check out the 77's

www.77s.com - Great rock band, no cliches, no bullshit.

Unfortunately, because they are Christians, mainstream radio wouldn't touch them, and because they don't say "Jesus" every third word in a song, the Christian music "community" rejected them.

Therefore, they became one of the best bands almost nobody ever heard of.

[personman]

55. I've heard some bad stuff

comming out of my ex-boss's radio.
I think the problem is that most cool music is either sad, angry or edgey & (main stream)Christians are not.

There are exceptions of course, but the Christian radio my old boss listened to was, pardon the pun, God-aweful...

all upbeat, all happy all mindless quasi-popesque crap.

I was raised Christian and I am a (crappy)musician, but I also think most organized religion is crap.

[wildeyed]

65. I think you are right.

There is tons of interesting christian music, but it is not being market as christian, just as good music. The 'christian radio' folks are not interesting in being challenged. But hey, there is plenty of god awful secular music, too. So why pick on the christian stations?

[BurtWorm]

63. African American gospel music pre-1970 is cool.

Late gospel sucks, though.

[tjdee]

64. Would U2 count in that? Half of the songs on their new album are about God

Okay, at least one.

They obviously aren't in the Christian genre, which I do agree is mostly bad, milquetoasty unrisky music.

But U2 has three Christian members and Bono regularly writes about God and the old JC.

[wildeyed]

66. Moby is a christian.

Many of his songs are about faith. Play is on almost everyone's 'Albums of the Decade' list.

[GreenPartyVoter]

69. I don't like the Bible Thumper kind anymore, but groups like

U2 and King's X and POD are cool. :)

http://timeforachange.bluelemur.com/Arts.htm

[gingergreen]

70. Thank you Cat Fight!

Christian music is way uncool

[Cheswick2.0]

71. Christians" are a bunch of followers, never leaders

one of the dumbest statements I've read on DU in a while.

Mozart
Beethoven
Verdi
Brahams
Faure
.................etc etc

[progmom]

74. I have to agree with you Cheswick.

And I actually agree, I think, with Catfight's basic point - that there are a lot of really crappy Christian records out there that sell a lot of copies just because of the subject matter.

I just wish people would be a little more careful about sweeping generalizations about Christians. I'd find it a lot easier to agree with your point if I didn't feel like you were attacking me at the same time.

[Left Is Write]

78. Bingo.

You hit the nail on the head with this statement:

I'd find it a lot easier to agree with your point if I didn't feel like you were attacking me at the same time.

I am a Christian. I am also a liberal Democrat. I really don't understand why some people have a hard time with that concept.

On the Christian music front - I like some of it, I don't like some of it. As with any genre of music, there are good artists/songs and bad artists/songs.

Personally, I'll take the Kry's version of The Rivers Of Babylon any day.

[Zuni]

76. Thank you. As a Christian I find this revolting

why people have to make bigoted and dumb comments like this is beyond me.,

[RUDUing2]

77. to try and convince themselves of their superiority..to bad it actually

has the opposite effect.

Interesting to know that MLK was not a leader..that JFK was not a leader..that Harry Truman was not a leader...that Winston Churchill was not a leader...that Ike was not a leader...etc. etc...

[Fleurs du Mal]

72. It sure isn't

[Floogeldy]

73. I liked PFR

Some christian rock bands have some very good musicians.

[Zuni]

75. What about gospel, what about classical, what about U2, what about

Johnny Cash---I could go on and on

AndI am a Christian, and a proud one at that and a blues/soul musician. I don't think of myself as a sheep

[Beware the Beast Man]

79. Trouble trumps that theory.

Super-heavy, Sabbath-esque metal band with positive lyrics, but you would never know the difference.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

80. Contemporary Christian is really good though...

The rock does leave something to be desired, however.
Duckie