So, is "24" a freeper show?

[stanwyck]

I'm watching for the first time tonight, and Jack just shot a guy he's interrogating in the knee in order to get information. Apparently, Jack is simpatico with Attry. Gen. nominee Gonzalez when it comes to torture. And I thought POW John McCain told us torture didn't work...it's just not effective. Not so for Jack. Worked great.
Show seems a little freeperish. I guess this will be my first show. And last show.
Maybe I'm wrong. Feel free to set me straight.

[Z_I_Peevey]

1. Tonight was my last night with "24."

The "dirty hippie" son of the William Devane character gets chastised for his "Michael Moore logic." That was the last straw. Screw Fox and screw this show.

[Lenape85]

6. But still, they have the Simpsons

[AwakeAtLast]

31. But I thought that comment was used to make him villainous!

Must be the cynic in me, but I thought that comment was a setup for something in the future. I'll let ya know! :)

[atre]

2. Also the first for me and I'm getting similar impressions

The militant Secretary of Defense (played by an actor who is a ringer for the real one) is made to be a sympathetic figure? His peacenik son is somehow culpable in his kidnapping by tipping off the terrorists (thereby suggesting a link between protestors and terrorists)? "8th grade Michael Moore logic?" Absolutely disgusting tripe.

I wonder if the series writers are being paid by the Administration like Armstrong Williams, because this is far, far more effective propoganda for them.

[Beware the Beast Man]

4. As goes with many 24 characters,

he may not be the "sympathetic character" in the end.
I always saw Jack Bauer as a non-partisan type, loyal to his country, not to any party or agency. The show to me was neither liberal nor conservative. I'm taping the season premiere right now, and I'll decide for myself.

[fishwax]

10. The Defense Secretary's speechifying turned me off too

I can't help but wonder about the story arc of the son--will he see the error of his ways and embrace the military industrial complex? Or will he perhaps sympathize with the terrorists, like most protestors do? :eyes: :puke:

I've watched previous seasons of 24 on DVD, and always had certain qualms about tactics, but those scenes in tonight's show really pissed me off.

[Seabiscuit]

3. Answer: Yes.

It sucks.

Just one more Fox show that sucks.

[Left Is Write]

7. Wow. That's disappointing.

I've always rather liked Kiefer Sutherland, and had been interested in this show (although I've never had a chance to watch it).

[Lisa]

18. plus Kiefer's folks are big-time leftists ...

His grandpa, Tommy Douglas, led the first socialist government in North America (province of Saskatchewan) and founded Canada's medicare system. Kiefer himself is still supportive of the New Democratic Party and has done work for them in the past (see video link). I wonder what he thinks about the direction the show has gone? Perhaps he's playing the role in terms of social commentary?

http://www.workingtv.com/mouseland.html

[Uzybone]

5. My first time too

and Im quite disappointed. The show is filled with propaganda.

[Sean Reynolds]

8. Wasn't the original president a Democrat?

I've only watched a few episodes.

[NYC Liberal]

9. Yep.

But he did not run for another term....for good reasons. (Hint: he did some things that Bush has probably already done, many times)

[MrScorpio]

12. Bingo

The previous administration were Democrats, these guys are Repugs.

Everything else is the same.

Expect lots of plot twists. Nothing is as it ever seems on 24.

[crimson333]

13. I thought this president was the previous vice president

from the 1st administration

[rocktivity]

11. Of course it's a freeper show

So was that smallpox miniseries. It's trivializing the war on terror into a glorified video game which of course the all-American good guys win!

:headbang:
rocknation

[SmileyBoy]

15. "Smallpox" was NOT a RW show.

It turned out in the end that the terrorist who started the outbreak was an insane white Christian lunatic, ala Timothy McVeigh.

[rocktivity]

34. You took me too literally

I wasn't talking in terms of who the culprit was, but in terms of the subtext that the war on terrorism can't be won without Bush in office, and, by extension, that torture is a necessary evil.

:headbang:
rocknation

[gatorboy]

39. Doh! Thanks for the ending....

Guess I don't have watch it now.

[stanwyck]

14. I've switched to Desperate Housewives

Yes, I'm that shallow. Thanks for the feedback.

[NWHarkness]

16. No, it's not

At least it hasn't been in the past seasons.

Last season, everyone here was hailing it as a devastating attack on the Bush administration.

Are we now to denounce every show or film in which one character expresses views we don't like as "freeper"?

[AG78]

17. No

It's just a TV show. They've implicated at least one oil company behind the starting of a war in the middle east in season 2 I believe.

They write the script to piss people off, to get them to watch again. It goes both ways.

[Osamasux]

19. The first 18 episodes of the first season were good.

After that is was all downhill. I watched the end of season one, just playing out the string and hoping it would end okay. That show is so over.

[Deja Q]

20. You mean, you're 86'ing 24?

That leaves 62. Whatever that means. :D

[neebob]

21. If so, that would explain why I was never able to get into it. nt

[Beware the Beast Man]

22. No, no, no and again no.

If anything, the show is apolitical. Not to mention, don't get too hung up on character personalities, this show is notorious for plot twists.

[high density]

23. I think the Secretary of Defense was just being a typical Republican

towards his liberal/"hippie" son. I thought it seemed played pretty realistically and rather bipartisan.

It's a freaking fictional drama, folks. Do we need those to reinforce our views as well? By the way, the show has always gone overboard on the torture thing.

[Z_I_Peevey]

24. Sorry, I disagree.

Once my ears perked up at the Michael Moore reference, I paid a little closer attention. The costuming and hair of the protestor son fit every stereotype of the "dirty hippie." Dirty, greasy hair hanging in strands over his eyes, etc.

And of course he then lit up a joint in front of his upstanding father.

It's straight-up anti-left propaganda. If I wanted to watch that, I'd go back to watching CNN.

[E_Smith]

40. true

the presentation of the son was "fair and balanced" only in the Fox News way. the son got some good jabs in but in the end cowared in the corner like a defensless baby when daddy was kidnapped. also "sixth grade michael moore logic" was a bit much. all I know is that the Bush administration is LOVING this show!

[liberalpress]

45. People... calm down.

It's a TV show... the plot twists every hour. The characters are tightly drawn. The roller-coaster ride is exhilerating.

DOn't diss everything see as right-wing propaganda. We do that too much. We also make a lot of a little.

LEt's NOT use the tactics of the right. We're better than that

[Yavin4]

25. 24 is not right-wing; it may be Liberal if anything

First of all, the show is made by Ron Howard's company, Imagine, not Fox. The same company that does "Arrested Development", which is a slam on the rich. Second, the Michael Moore reference was made by a character to show his politics and to set up future events.

Finally, in the second season of the show in 2002-03, Jack prevents the administration from starting a war with a Middle East nation because he wanted the president to have accurate intelligence. To me, that proves that the show was making a bold political statement against Bush, something that other entertainment fare refuses to do.

[stanwyck]

OK. You've convinced me

to give it another chance. We Tivo'd the 2 hrs tonight. So...I'll go back and watch. I was really turned off by Jack's character shooting the man being interogated. I just can't see that as a positive trait for the hero of the show. It looked like a play to the worst part of our nature.
Apparently, this show is fairly complex and ambiguous. I need to keep a more open mind.

[curse10]

27. that's exactly my take, too

It sets up the character. Not everyone can be liberal-- especially in a show about terrorism.

[PopSixSquish]

26. Having Just Watched the Premier....

I thought the shooting of the suspect was simply a stupid and shocking plot device more than a political statement.

Jack Bauer has always been portrayed as someone who would do whatever it takes/took.

One of last year's subplots was the fact that he'd gotten hooked on heroin while working undercover to bust a drug dealer and was not off the stuff completely. And you've missed more than a few Jack interrogation scenes in the past 3 seasons.

Oh, and Jack executed the former head of CTU last season as well because the terrorists who were threatening to release a bioweapon in LA demanded it. The reason escapes me at the moment.

You have to have a strong stomach to watch this one sometimes and the plot twists come out of nowhere.

[madison2000]

28. I watched the entire first season but not since then

Kiefer Sutherland is fantastic, and its really exciting. If you get hooked on it you're going to keep watching. But the story lines are ridiculous and all the women are nuts. The politics are annoying too but they make for good television.

[mikehiggins]

29. Madelaine runs CTU now

Alberta Watson, the chilling co-commander of Section, is now the head of CTU. Considering the history of the La Femme Nikita series I'd be surprised if she didn't have some evil tactics up her sleeve.

Nah, actually, the DefSec sounded like every big mouth Repug who has bought his own line of garbage. His defiance of the terrorists is fine and dandy but made him look just stupid, not heroic. He looks a lot like someone who really doesn't understand how deep the water is that he is in.

As to Jack Bauer shooting yet another prisoner, hey, that's what he does. At least he didn't outright kill this guy like he did a captive in another episode. Didn't cut his head off either.

It's just too early to see where this is going but I would be very surprised if FAUX NEWS will be any happier with this one than they were with the earlier ones (folks in the stories kept pointing out that most of the US's problems with the rest of the world were caused by, guess who? US)

The bad guys will get thwarted by the last few minutes but things are never made so clean and sanitary in this series that the red states could be totally comfortable with it. Just my opinion, of course, but I really like this show.

Now, if they could introduce Peta Wilson as a character my life would be full.

[proud2BlibKansan]

30. My best friend is a die hard liberal

and she loves the show.

[DrZeeLit]

32. Well, they are going to piss-off even more people -- cuz they are

about to focus on a "middle east Islamic family" and rough them up a bit as potential terrorist cell. Whether or not they end up as the "real terrorist cell" will remain to be seen.

I read up, in NYT, about the focus of the show this year. They decided not to be vague, but actually use fanatical Islamic terrorist -- to make it more "real."

Swell, just what we need... more racism.
Watch and learn?

[El Fuego]

33. That was nothing, you should have seen it last season.

Torture in "24-world" is totally institutionalized as a legitimate U.S. government tactic. Yes they show the torture somewhat graphically, and for me it is sometimes difficult to watch.

24 came out with the torture scenes pre-Abu Ghraib. After the Gonzalez memo was published, I was like, holy fuck, '24' was a prophetic show. Scary stuff.

Is it a freeper show? When I watch it, I see it as an indictment of the Bush administration. But, righties probably view it as just further glorification of the Reich.

[Mojambo]

35. It wasn't just that the torture tactics were used

It was the fact that they displayed all attempts to gather information before the torture as pathetically inept.

It seemed like the producers were saying, "See, the only thing that works is torture! If you don't do it this way the bad guys always win!"

I have to be honest, I found the first couple seasons of 24 very balanced, but I think that premiere was one of the most right-wing television shows I've ever seen. Think about what we learned tonight...

1. There are Arabic "Mom and Pop" terrorists living right next door in our idyllic middle class neighborhoods.

2. Liberals are weak, whiny snots who don't really believe in their cause, but just do it to piss off daddy. I come to this conclusion not because that's how the Secretary of Defense sees his son, but because that was how he was portrayed (to an almost comical degree.)

3. Normal interrogation techniques consist only of yelling "What do you know!!" Again, the only way to get these guys to talk is to shoot them...

With last season's villain being a radical left wing terrorist, I think I'm seeing a trend.

I'll give it several more episodes to see how it plays out, but tonight's episode could have been written, produced and directed by the Bush administration.

(BTW - The woman playing the new head of CTU might be the most wooden actress I've ever seen. In fact, they could replace the entire CTU cast with androids and not lose anything)

[ThorsHammer]

36. I actually like the show

I treat as entertainment, nothing more. It's one of the few newer shows that I watch (I can't stand the reality shows), and I think it's a pretty well written show, albeit violent and extreme.

[question everything]

37. Taped tonight episode and will tomorrow.

I have been watching "24" since the beginning and would participate in the message boards where many would discuss the moral implications of many of his activities vs. some "super patriots" and the conclusion eventually would be that it is just a TV program that is supposed to put you at the edge of your seat.

Certainly the first year was the best.

My spouse watched it this evening and said that Muslims are not going to be happy with the program.

[grasswire]

38. oh brother

24 is about as realistic as a superhero comic book. It must be approached in the same manner. You must suspend disbelief over and over again, and you must NEVER think you have the next plot twist figured out, cuz you'll be wrong and probably horrified.

It's just a roller coaster. Not a drama. Put your hands up in the air, scream, and enjoy!

If you can't view it in that heart-pounding yet disengaged manner, then don't watch it. It's just pure entertainment. Bad dialogue sometimes, outrageous interference of personal detritus in agency business, impossible situations...all there.

Can't wait till tomorrow night.

[coloradodem2005]

41. It's just a T.V. show. I like the story telling.

Serialized episodes in real time. Action packed. I enjoyed the Season Premiere, the only thing that really bothered me was that the son was depicted as a "whiny dirty" liberal. The depiction of the son's character did bug me but not much else.

[grasswire]

42. I suspect..

...that the son will be transformed into a brave and strong character soon.

[coloradodem2005]

43. How so?

n/t

[liberalpress]

46. Because it 24...

...every thing you see at first changes into somnething completely different.

[E_Smith]

44. not only that

this episode was right wing IMO:

1. son is defintely presented as a weak and dirty druggie, he makes some points to his dad about RW hypocrisy but when the rubber meets the road he is a coward.

2. torture works! shoot the arabs in the legs to get info!

3. terrorists kidnap defense secretary and put him in the beheading position on the internet... we are fighting them in Iraq so this doesn't happen here!

4. the terrorist dad is a totalitarian control freak who tells his son he doesnt have any rights under his house... he HATES FREEDOM!

5. Michael Moore uses sixth grade logic! also, the hot sister laments that her hippie brother has "no understanding of the politics involved"

I have to admit though, I plan on keep watching because it was entertaining.

[Bill Lumbergh]

47. I don't like it, I think it is somewhat Repub

But Fox has other good shows like their NFL games.

Joe Buck is a great announcer, for example, and it's great watching NFL games on FOX in HDTV