Forget spanking..did you ever get the shit beat out of you as a child

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

while the rest of your parents peers regarded it as "spanking" or discipline?

At what point does it rise from a benign term like spanking to violence against children?

[redqueen]

1. I'll answer your second question first: not soon enough.

Does that answer your first question?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

4. Probably. I just really get sick of all of it being lumped under the term

"spanking" when more appropriate terms like "BEATING" should be used.

[Shrubhater]

10. I compleatly agree with you.

Parenting requires a LOT more love than that.

[sui generis]

13. yes, butt

:evilgrin:

you also want to lump all swats on the rear as child abuse, and I completely disagree with that.

I don't think you should ever swat a misbehaving kid hard enough to really cause pain; it's more the idea that you have escalating options that matters (to the kid).

It's funny, those of us who got an occasional swat on the butt are okay with it and those of us who got the shit beaten out of them are completely against it.

I'm guessing the two experiences don't really fall under the same name.

[Misunderestimator]

33. They sure do start out falling under the same name.

[tk2kewl]

2. yep

and when i was strong enough, i gave it right back

that pretty much put an end to the physical abuse.

[Misunderestimator]

3. Indeed I did...

and even in front of relatives... IMO... there's no rising at all... it starts as violence.

[Shrubhater]

5. No.....

besides, ANY form of physical discipline can be considered child abuse, IMO.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

6. By today's standards my parents would have been taken

out in handcuffs.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

8. I am sorry to hear that, my dear Crazy Guggenheim...

No child deserves to be treated the way you were...EVER.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

7. Hi, NSMA!

I got spanked, had soap in my mouth and there were a couple of slaps, but no, I NEVER got the shit beaten out of me, EVER.

[TlalocW]

9. I think I got one spanking as a kid

And that's it.

I have an incredibly religious uncle though who decided to beat the crap out of his daughter (15 years older than I am) when she was a little girl because she was acting up in church. He was of the opinion that she needed the devil beaten out of her so he took her out of church onto the lawn and started to wale on her so badly that members of his congregation intervened.

Certain elements of my family think that's why my cousin is a lesbian, which I always argue against.

But it is somewhat ironic that my uncle is in the ranks of Phyliss Schlaffley, Alan Keyes, Randall Terry, Dick Cheney, etc of being a religious nutjob and having gay offspring.

The uncle and cousin actually do have a pretty good relationship now, but it's funny to watch him interact with his daughter's girlfriend at family get-togethers.

TlalocW

[GOPisEvil]

11. "Once gets the kid's attention, every other one is for you."

I heard that in a lecture in college, and it has always stuck with me. I'm not a parent, but that seems reasonable to me.

I was lucky, my parents weren't big spankers.

[Shrubhater]

18. You must've been in a great college.

[GOPisEvil]

21. Actually...this was a community college.

San Antonio College, San Antonio, TX. This was a sociology class. I don't remember why we were discussing this issue, but that line jolted me. It's been 17 years and I still remember it.

[SOteric]

19. Yes, that makes good sense.

My parents didn't spank much, either. And they never 'beat,' preferring forms of discipline that addressed the consequences of ill-considered actions.

[GOPisEvil]

22. My folks were masters of letting my own mind work against me.

My mom smacked me a few times, but nothing serious. My dad never laid a hand on me. Just his look could turn me into mush.

[SOteric]

25. Yeah, my dad too.

Just a look and the quietly uttered phrase "that's very disappointing" could bring me to tears.

[GOPisEvil]

26. *shudder*

"Now you've made your mother cry."

Sometimes I wished he would have hit me. ;)

[4_Legs_Good]

12. No, never ever a beating

in what I would consider a beating. Never more than quite a few lashes with a spatula, paint mixing stick (with like 500,000 coats of paint on it, and my dad never painted that much! Where the hell did all that paint come from???), or I think a few times a commercial paddle.

Gawd, can you imagine going into a store and buying a commerically made paddle?

Anyway, always on the butt (maybe a few smacks on the upper legs, which hurt like hell), always to be painful to teach us a lesson, always very sad, and almost always the anticipation worse than the spanking.

I can't even imagine doing something like that to my sons, let alone an actual beating.

david

[mahina]

16. Cool bumper sticker, can you buy that?

I'd love to know where...

[4_Legs_Good]

48. Thanks! I've been asked that a surprising number of times!

I think I'm going to order a bunch and pass them out to anyone who wants them!

Now I just need to figure out what the exact defecit was for last year including all the Iraq supplemental B.S. I think it was $412B + at least one supplemental.

Anyway, I'm glad you like the sticker, even conservatives have a hard time arguing with it.

david

[mahina]

52. Remember me if you do. I'll chip in.

Wonderful!

[Shrubhater]

17. Very good philosophy. You will be succesful in life.

O8)

[mahina]

14. Why yes I did.

To answer your question, when closed fists are used, and when the kid goes through windows or damages walls. Not meant to be a conclusive definition, just a distinction drawn from personal experience.

[Burma Jones]

15. Bleeding, Bruises, Fists - From Mom

Not to mention all sorts of verbal abuse. She hit me with her fist when I was about 13 and broke her finger - I told her that I would kill her if she tried that again. It never got out in public because my Dad was in College most of the time I was growing up, from B.A. to PhD. So, this kind of discipline was not acceptable to Graduate Students or the sort of professionals my Dad worked with.

Dad was much more restrained.

I really can't see what the hell people thought they were doing beating their kids. I suppose part of my situation was that my Mom came from Southern, uneducated people that got the shit beat out of them when they were kids. On my Mom's side of the family, I am the third person to graduate from High School and the first to go to College. My Mom's female cousin had the most effiminate boy for a son I ever saw and his Dad tried to beat the sissy out of him, this was truly scary. It got to where my Father would threaten us with going to visit our relatives in Tennessee.

Of course, Dad divorced Mom and we all decided to stay with Dad. Now, Mom is paying the price, she's completely isolated from her Grandchildren and the Grandkids consider my Step-Mom, not my Bio-Mom as their Grandmother.

[Mr. McD]

20. Yes, by my oldest brother

I was often left in his care and he treated me like he did his own kids.
Often with fists. :( :(

[Misunderestimator]

35. I had the same experience...

with both my older brothers... often worse than my father. Damn... there is SO MUCH FUCKING NEEDLESS VIOLENCE IN THE WORLD! :mad:

[sniffa]

23. bout everyday

but not by famiLy.

[SoCalDem]

24. I was a straight-A student who never got into any trouble, BUT

I also had an evil father who beat me with belts (bigger buckles were better), cracked me on the head with the butt of knives (many emergency room visits), and was not above grabbing me by the hair and slamming my head into walls.

My transgressions? "Talking back" or "disrespecting"..

Where was my mother?.. Afraid to intervene..

Did I spank MY kids?.. other than the occasional "whomp" on a diaper or upper thigh, with a "balsa wood-ish" wooden spoon..NOPE

Are my sons "violent" or mean-tempered? NOPE.. They are 26,27 & 31 and still get teary-eyed when we talk of dearly departed pets..and they all have loving relationships with great women :) (only one is married so far )

[sasquatch]

27. Damn straight

I've been beat with fist, belts, glass bottles, pipes, 2x4's and types of other shit.

[Blue Diadem]

28. Yep, and as I got older,

I made sure I wore sleeveless blouses/tops to show my bruises to the world. I was 10 and my sister had knocked over a knick knack. I was the target since she had downs syndrome. Only had it happen once after that, when I was 14 or 15. I covered my head with my hands as my Dad was punching me. He hit me so hard that my rings flattened against my fingers.

Ya know though..the beatings didn't affect me as much as when he used to hold me down and cut my bangs clear back to my ears telling me I wasn't going to be a whore. He called me that alot and considering the only thing I ever did was go to school and come home, it was a little difficult for me to be a whore. If I stuck up for myself, he'd throw whatever he was drinking in my face. That humiliation along with everything else, took it's toll on my self esteem.

It sounds awful to say..but Thank God the man had a stroke. The last ten years of his life, he was a different man.

[lateo]

29. Daily.

Sigh...

[radwriter0555]

30. In this day and age, my parents would have been jailed and I would have

been placed in protective custody.

It's all better now though.

[progmom]

31. no.

And that shit is indefensible.

[GumboYaYa]

32. Oh yeah,

but there was never any thought of calling what I experienced a "spanking." It was full-fledged fist hitting, bruising, physical abuse from my step-dad. One day my mom and I had enough and got the hell out. It was the best move of my life. It took me a lot of years to get the violence out of my system.

[WeRQ4U]

34. Never.

My father spanked, but without much passion. He would grip our necks instead. Nothing bad though. He played more to the emotional side of us. He could look at us, and clench his teeth. His cheek muscles would flex (you could see them flex) and we just shut up right then. He always said things like "I'm very disappointed in you" That did the trick.

His father beat them up a bit growing up and I think he saw that it did more harm than good.

[hunter]

36. No. I got "spanked" in a highly symbolic way.

Anticipation was much, much worse than the actual event.

My younger well-rounded siblings got off easy. They never got spanked. Spanking was clearly ineffective on the prototype children.

[Madrone]

37. Shit beaten out of me?

Check.

Humiliation?

Check.

Mind fucks?

Check.



Ahhh...the childhood years.

[sundog]

38. not me, but some of my childhood friends did...

some evil 'christian' woman would babysit some of the neighborhood kids and beat the shit out of the ones who got 'out of line'... my playmates said she had a paddle with some lambs and a cross on it or some shit

discipline in the name of christ :eyes:

and the parents turned a blind eye & thought it was ok i guess :shrug:

kinda fucked up... maybe a different set of ethics back in the late 70s / early 80s :wtf:

[derby378]

39. Some good news...

Apparently, a group of Christians managed to halt the manufacture of a rod specifically designed for beating children:

http://stoptherod.net/rod-petition.html

[derby378]

40. ...and some bad news

Get a load of this "chastening instrument." Don't some dominatrixes use a similar device on their clients?

http://biblicalchildtraining.com/order.htm

[Jara sang]

41. Yes I remember getting the shit kicked out of me.

Being severely whipped with a belt, sometimes the metal end would hit me in the face. I can still see the look on my mother's face while she did this and I was really little when it happened, it is a memory I wish I didn't have of her.:-(

[maveric]

42. Belts, sticks and electriclal cords.

That was acceptable, late 50's early 60's.

[Madrone]

47. Interesting.

All this time I thought my mom was the only one innovative enough to come up with an electrical cord as a tool in her arsenal of abuse. :shrug:

Sorry, friend. :hug:

[maveric]

49. It was tied together at the end, hung on a doorknob and referred to as...

the "Piggin String".

[dhinojosa]

43. Yeah, but after I started lifting weights....

I started laughing and taunting my mom, and out of fear my mom stopped.

I wasn't going to do anything though, I am such a pacifist.

But I have had pipes, coffee cords, shovels, scissors, you name it, beaten into me. But I had look past that and love my mom anyways.

[grace0418]

44. My mother commited a whole bunch of physical and mental abuse

but everyone outside my family thinks she's such a saint. And people wonder why I'm not more upset that she has cancer.

[samplegirl]

45. all my dad ever had to do to me

is shake the shit out of me. I was very fearful. Even his tone
of voice made me know i was in trouble. My mother or father
never beat us.

[Taxloss]

46. Yes.

But only by other children, and it has utterly altered my view of children and myself.

[Dr Fate]

50. My Dad threw me into the living room wall when I was 17.

I admit I probably deserved it!!!

[bamademo]

51. I got switched a lot

"Go cut a switch" I got spanked with a belt, switches and bare hands.
I got soap in the mouth for cussing and slapped for sassing. It was considered normal in the South at the time. I do not have a good relationship with my parents as a result. Especially my mother. I love her but I don't like her if that makes sense. She's gotten crazier as she's gotten older.

[Karenina]

53. There's a BIG DIFFERENCE

between corporal punishment and abuse. But ya know, as horrific as the blood or bruises are, PSYCHIC ABUSE is the real hammer.

[tjwmason]

55. Exactly

I had corporal punishment several times - but nothing even approaching abuse, and certainly never anything psychological.

[Liberalynn]

54. A Lay Teacher at Catholic School

pulled me into the bathroom, unzipped my uniform, pulled up my blouse and beat me across the bare back with a yard stick until she left several bloody welts.

I was five, in kindergarten. My offense: I laughed at a boy making a funny face. She didn't even asked me to stop first. Just came up behind me and grabbed me.

She also wasn't finished after she beat me. She put me on the dunce chair after that and had all the other kids mock me and then she had me stand hunched over in the coat nook for about a half an hour. All for this same "offense."

Now I know I may be accused of feeling sorry for myself or being in the "culture of victims" but I consider that I was a victim of child abuse and not discipline.

My parents did go in and tell the princpal that they did not approve of the teachers' actions and never wanted that done again but they did not pull me out of Catholic school. I was never physically assaulted again but the verbal abuse from my didn't stop but got worse, and has been mentioned by others that hurts just as much if not more than the physical beating in a sense.

At least I was luckier than one of my classmates in six grade. The teacher slammed his head into the blackboard and gave him a concussion. We had a new principal by then, however, and that teacher was fired. It also helped that the parents in this case threatned to sue.

I cringe now every time I hear the possibilty of corporal punnishment being mentioned as a discipline agent in schools again. It does not teach respect, IMHO. What I base my opinion on is only my own experience. It taught me fear, mistrust, hatred, and even inner self hatred. It made me wonder and still makes me wonder if somehow I was and am a bad person who deserved it whether that makes logical sense or not.

IMHO, It didn't make me a better person. It made me an emotional cripple who now has OCD and Depression so bad I can't function in a work place. I have to check work over and over because I fear making the tiniest mistake, I jump a mile when someone comes up behind me without warning, etc. It also didn't make me a better Christian. It left me an agnostic moving closer and closer to all out atheism.

It also wasn't just what was done to me but other classmates as well. You never knew what was going to set one of the teachers off and who was going to get it and how bad. They used to rip the pens out of our hands if we were holding them too tight and swat us hard across the hands with a ruler if we were. We lived in constant fear. That's not education to me.

JMHO Violence is not the answer to better behavior.

[bleedingheart]

56. In retrospect I deserved the smacks on the bottom or legs

I recall "taking a walk" ...with my younger brother and dog and leading them on a fantastic journey and my parents nearly lost their minds with worry....my dad who rarely hit us...beat my butt with a belt ...as a warning never to do what I did again...(note ...my dad had to take the car to find me and the rest of the entourage......)

Then there were the times I tried to drive my then widowed mother crazy....and she would hit me with a fly swatter.

However none of it was abuse...I was in a loving home but I drove my parents completely ape shit.