Have you ever had your cat de-clawed?

[kwassa]

We have two wonderful three-year old cats that are currently destroying rugs and one old couch that we don't care about. We are about to get into major home renovation, including some new furniture, and I am advocating having the cats, who are strictly indoor animals, de-clawed. I had this done to another cat in the past, who wrecked a sofa and lounge chair, and after a day or two of uncomfortableness following surgery, never realized she didn't have claws. She would continue to "sharpen" her paws on my new sofa, my record collection, all her old favorite places.

My wife is of the opinion that de-clawing is cruel. What do you think?
What experience have you had?

[realisticphish]

1. I despise it

i understand that some people have good results, but the simple fact is that you are NOT trimming their fingernails off permenantly. you are cutting their fingers off. every cat that i've seen declawed loses a LOT of balence. and, even if it's an indoor cat, they DO tend to get outside once in a while (door left open, etc) and they will be totally defenseless

[RebelOne]

2. Extremely cruel. n/t

[Ezlivin]

3. Don't do it!

I had two cats declawed back in '77. They seemed to adjust okay, but knowing what I know now, I'd never do that to my pets again.

Declawing a cat is analogous to removing each of your fingers to the first joint. Not only is it painful, it alters a cat's sense of balance. Another unintended side-effect is that many cats associate the pain in their paws with the litter pail, thus making them try other places in a vain attempt to escape the pain they are experiencing.

I have two Russian Blues that are not declawed. We have many things they could shred, but they don't. Why? We've provided many scratching posts for them.

But the most important thing we do is clip their claws weekly. It's an easy, five-minute process and it has solved nearly all our "cat claw" problems. (We accept that they are still animals and nothing is 100% perfect.)

[kick-ass-bob]

4. We did a long time ago

before we really knew what it meant. Our second cat (a former feral) still has claws and has never scratched anything up (including us). We play with her and she knows exactly how to not scratch any of us.

Actually our older cat has scratched more because he has to use his back claws more for balance, etc. I wouldn't ever do it again.

[radwriter0555]

5. Only if you have your nails removed down to the first knuckle on your toes

and fingers first.. Declawing is mutilation.

There are thingies you can put on your cat's claws that you can find with a little bit of research... like softpaws.

Other things such as cat trees or whatever those carpet covered cubes are keep the cats amused and are far more humane than chopping off your cats toes.

Why keep an animal if you have to mutilate it?

[realisticphish]

9. that's the way i feel

if i have an animal, i just accept that it's an animal, and suck it up. i don't get pissed at dogs for drooling, or at fish for not breathing air.

[stellanoir]

11. Please consider other options

I posted an inquiry about the plastic covers one can affix to the cat's claws. I got a lot of informative responses and saved a cat form that fate. Meanwhile my son's cat has thorughly trashed a rug I bought last fall. So go figure.

If they are outdoor cats, they'll be coyote fodder without their claws.

Still it does qualify as mutilation and not kind to our furry friends.

[MissMillie]

20. Does this mean they shouldn't be spayed or neutered too?

I mean, why keep a cat if you're going to mess w/ it's genitals?

[jukes]

33. MissMillie

an interesting point.

i neuter my animals for THEIR good; fixt animals do not become kitten/puppy factories, nor are they inclined to fight each other NEARLY as often or as viciously.

since most of my cats are feral-born (NOT strays, actually born out of contact w/ people) they sometimes still spray, even after neutering. as a responsible pet-owner, i clean-up after them & protect surfaces that are likely to be harmed, as well as gently attempting to correct the problem.

any1 that neuters only to protect their possessions needs to re-assess their desire for a companion animal. perhaps they shd breed a child instead; after all, children can be beaten into compliance where-as animals often can't.

[hyphenate]

34. I'm not the one you addressed your question to

but I can answer for myself in this matter. There are millions of kittens (and puppies) born each year that will never have homes, and will be put down simply because there are not enough homes for them all. Neutering and spaying helps curb that overpopulation problem. I don't think stopping an animal's ability to reproduce is wrong, simply because it will help keep the population at a more manageable level. It's definitely not something I like to talk about simply because of the fact that I love animals, and I can't go to a rescue center or anything because I would leave crying hysterically. The thought of putting down a healthy animal is very frustrating and very heartbreaking.

However, if there is a choice between someone choosing to adopt an animals ONLY if they can get it declawed, or someone deciding AGAINST adopting because of the cat having claws, I would certainly, but reluctantly, give them kudos for adopting the animal, and hope to somehow change their mind about the declawing part.

One additional comment on declawing that I posted a short while back on another thread: declawing a cat makes it more aggressive in that they become biters. Without their claws to help them defend themselves, they WILL use their teeth more as a result.

[prole_for_peace]

6. cats need good surfaces to scratch.

rough wood and sisal covered posts and / or slant boards. some cats like to scratch vertically and some, horizontally.

pam johnson-bennett is a cat behaviorist. her book "psyco kitty?" has a good chapter about scratching behavior and how to correct it. maybe the library has one. i got one for $7 from amazon

[Divameow77]

7. I had my cat declawed and he is fine,

barely seemed bothered by it at all, and neither of my cats have EVER been outside in 6 years. Alot of people see it as cruel but alot of people wouldn't have cats as pets if they weren't declawed and then it would be cruel to have all these cats without homes.

BTW- My son found my cat after he had been abandoned and if he could say it I bet he would rather have been declawed and part of our family then left out in the cold.

[kwassa]

13. well, my de-clawed cat was fine, too, and never had balance problems

or any other problems, either.

So, what exactly is cruel about it?

[Divameow77]

15. Alot of people think it's cruel

I have seen other threads of this topic on this board and some people are really against it.
I personally don't think it's cruel.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

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[Divameow77]

41. How did you know I had my child's fingers amputated?

What a stupid thing to say.

Why don't you go tell your 34 cats how lucky they are to have you for an owner.

[jukes]

63. what a stupid response

my cats tell me how lucky they are to have been cared for by me.

none of them have suffered an unnecessary amputation at my hands.


i won't respond to your silly baiting again. waste someone else's time.

[RebelOne]

16. I guess you haven't read the other posts.

It's cruel because it is like chopping off your fingers down to the first knuckle. That's not cruel?

[Divameow77]

17. That was not how my Vet described it to me.

I understand and respect other peoples opinions not to have their cats declawed. What about having him fixed, that basically cut off his balls, had an incision that took alot longer to heal then his paws did.
The OP was just asking opinions and I gave mine. I did what was best for my family, if I didn't have that option then I probaly wouldn't have him as a pet, he was destroying my furniture and hurting my other cat when they played.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

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[Divameow77]

40. Like I said

did you have your cat fixed? To me there is little difference.

I'm sure my cat feels differently then you do.

If you have such a strong opinion maybe you should take in ALL the cats that would be without homes if declawing wasn't possible.

[jukes]

65. i do believe

you don't understand the difference between declawing and neutering.

unfortunately, i don't have the time to repair your education.

[Hugin]

8. I adopted a de-clawed cat once...

I guess she didn't "go-with-the-decor" in her former
owner's house.

Anyway, she didn't claw things anymore... She'd learned
to compensate by biting.

She became used to me... But, she never accepted anyone
else.

I'd say it's a bad idea.

[xultar]

10. Nope, NEVER EVER EVER NEVAH!!! I clip their nails every

coupla weeks or so.

[Patiod]

12. Thank God for cat-fanatic friends - I listened to them and

started clipping her tiny kitten-claws the first week we had her, then immediately gave her a treat.

She yells a little, but basically allows two paws at a time to be clipped without a struggle, and then runs for the kitchen, where the treats are kept.

Treats are only for
1) coming inside when she's called
2) post-clipping
and they seem to work as an incentive for both

She still claws the furniture, but doesn't do much damage.

[xultar]

31. get her a post or one of those cardboard magic box things that you put

cat nip in. She'll completely forget about the furniture.

[JitterbugPerfume]

14. a cruel and inhumane practice

Iwould NEVER do it

[Trigger Hippie]

18. Yuck

It seems pretty cruel to me. Plus with all my crappy furniture, I don't care if my kitty, Petunia, shreds it all. :)

[MissMillie]

19. All of mine are declawed

The way I see it, they're not on the streets or outside being eaten by coyotes, they're in where disease cannot get them, they are fed and warm and loved.

Honestly, if I had to worry about my furniture, I wouldn't have them, and God knows where they'd have ended up.

[jukes]

69. that clarifies THAT

they sure are lucky, and surely love you despite the amputations.

[Bridget Burke]

21. How about Soft Paws?

They're glued on like fake nails. Perhaps a kitty beauty shop could help with the first set? Or try clipping the nails--although I think you should start when the cats are young.

My cats were declawed before I got them. Their former owner had multiple health problems--excessive bleeding was one of the symptoms. The vet suggested declawing & they recovered quickly. But they were little kitties--& only lost their front claws. Of course, they've been indoor cats all their lives.

Grown cats might find it more upsetting. I'd look at some of the less radical solutions.

[Jersey Devil]

28. ROFL, I'd like to see someone put those on a cat

I think it would be sort of like giving your cat a pill:

http://www.mamarocks.com/how_to_give_your_cat_a_pill.htm

[China_cat]

50. Soft Paws are actually very easy to apply.

And a very humane answer to the problem.

[RebelOne]

22. Take a look at this Web site. It shows exactly what

the declawing operation involves.

"Contrary to most people's understanding, declawing consists of amputating not just the claws, but the whole phalanx (up to the joint), including bones, ligaments, and tendons! To remove the claw, the bone, nerve, joint capsule, collateral ligaments, and the extensor and flexor tendons must all be amputated. Thus declawing is not a “simple”, single surgery but 10 separate, painful amputations of the third phalanx up to the last joint of each toe. A graphic comparison in human terms would be the cutting off of a person's finger at the last joint of each finger."


http://www.declawing.com/htmls/declawing.htm

[dajoki]

23. NO!!!!

it's cruel. would you like your fingers cut off? well that's basically what declawing is.

[kick-ass-bob]

24. About.com...

http://cats.about.com/cs/declawing/i/declawlaws.htm

The declawing of cats is a relatively new surgical procedure, practiced most commonly in North America. Declawing, or onychectomy, is the surgical amputation of the first joint of a cat's toes, including the nail. It is commonly performed using a guillotine-type blade, and is always done under general anesthesia. Because of associated post-operative pain, pain control medication is often prescribed for the recuperating cat. Laser declawing, more recently introduced, is said to be safer and less painful, with a quicker recovery and less need for post-operative pain medication.

A third procedure, tendonectomy, involves the cutting of the ligaments behind each toe, which prevents the claws from being extended. Regular trimming of the nails after tendonectomies is strongly recommended. The AVMA does not recommend tendonectomy.

[Shrubhater]

25. It's cruel, no doubt about it.

It's not the cat's fault that he's clawing things, it's their nature to do so.

[Balbus]

26. Another procedure you might ask your vet about.

It's where they actually slice the tendons that lead to the cat's claws so they are unable to extend them. Supposedly much less of a painful procedure and less recovery time. I've had one cat declawed, and one cat this procedure done. Honestly, the recovery time seemed to be about the same for both. But with the tendon procedure I still have to clip the claws every few weeks and, as stated in other posts, the cat needs to be a strictly indoor cat - it's just as defenseless as a declawed cat.

[Jersey Devil]

27. No, and we have completely destroyed furniture to prove it

I've had 3 cats. The first two took well to scratching boards and left the furniture alone, both neutered males. Our current cat, a 15 year old spayed female, has been ripping the living room furniture to shreds her whole life and no scratching boards, sprays or anything else can deter her.

I wouldn't have the heart to remove their claws. As for people saying their cats are house cats and never go out, one of our cats took a liking to the outdoors starting at about 14 years old and he loved just hanging around the back yard. I would have hated to have deprive him of that in his old age had he been declawed.

It's gotten so bad we are embarrassed to have company because we don't dare to replace the furniture until she passes away.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

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[Steph13]

30. Yep!

I had 2 of my 3 cats declawed, just because they were kittens when I got them. My 17 year old cat still has her claws. I think there's a certain age they're just too old to have a procedure like that done. Neither of my declawed kitties have ever had problems, and still 'claw' on things like they're sharpening their nails. I honestly think it's cruel & inhumane to let cats go outdoors. Mine have always been indoor kitties, and always will be. They're afraid of the outdoors, unless it's to sit at the screen & bird watch. And what of having the first knuckle of the toe amputated? I know I wouldn't miss mine! I would NEVER have the back claws removed, only the front. That's the equivalent of having our fingertips removed, and we couldn't scratch an itch or whatnot. But our toenails.. what purpose do those serve? Nothing. I could do without my toenails.. I couldn't care less.

But anyway, it's up to you guys as to how old the kitty is, and how much you like your furniture (& if you think it'd be easy to train the kitty to claw on their own things). All of my furniture is ruined because of my 17 year old cat that, no matter what, wouldn't claw on anything we bought her to claw on. And it's ultimately up to you guys.. it's YOUR cat. There are people against it, and for it.. but none can tell you what to do. One major thing is they can NEVER go outside if they are declawed.. if they're strictly indoor.. IMHO, it doesn't matter.

[jukes]

36. people shd be required

to have an education before having children or companion animals.

the clue to your attitude is in the phrase "it's YOUR cat."


your car. your lounge-chair. your bed. YOUR cat.

not a friend, or a dependent; an object of possession.





certain posts in this thread reek of the dank smell from the underside of a bridge.

[Balbus]

43. Whose cat is it, then?

Is it yours? You should be the one to decide how it's raised?

[jukes]

45. obviously

someone w/ a heart and concern for the animal's welfare shd be responsible for defending the animal from mutilation.


more directly, yes, i shd. since i wdnt allow it to be mutilated.
look elsewhere in this thread for the NUMEROUS countries where this barbarity is outlawed.

this practice is an act of animal cruelty. hence; i retain my expressed opinion.

[Balbus]

46. But why isn't it outlawed here?

If it's such a cruel and barbaric practice, why has it not been outlawed in this country? There are many laws in the books regarding cruelty to animals but you can't find this one here. You say it's an act of animal cruelty but do you have anything, beyond your opinion, that justifies that belief?

And before you make such a narrow-minded generalization of someone based on this belief, maybe you should actually know the person you're making this statement about. For all you know, this Steph13 that made the post you're referring to could work in an animal rescue shelter and be a volunteer foster mother for several homeless cats/kittens. That wouldn't be an indication of a heartless/non-concerned person, would it?

[slutticus]

53. It is illegal in several countries.

The US isn't always at the forefront of doing what's right you know...


I know that one county in California has made it illegal, and San Francisco is considering the ban also.

[jukes]

60. because america's laws are unjust?

it's pretty obvious where this line of "reasononing" is headed.

you are not going to be convinced by rational discussion because your mind is made up. apparently, declawing is an offshoot of "tough love"....


elective amputation of an animal's toe joints is abusive And sick. anyone that condones the practice should not own an animal & CERTAINLY shdnt be working in a shelter.

and gacy shdnt have been a clown.

i'm done w/ you. you have nothing of merit to say.

[Steph13]

54. It's this type of narrow-mindedness..

..that makes me post my opinion on this. I do work at an animal shelter, volunteer my time, and foster mom cats & kittens, and yes, OWN 3 cats of my own. They ARE mine.. taking care of them, paying their medical bills and housing them & loving them are all MY responsibility. Do you have kids? Would you not think their YOUR kids?

Does anyone here against declawing have a son that's been circumsized?? WHY?? I just don't understand the double standard.

This post will probably be deleted, but I don't really care. I really wouldn't care if the tips of my toes were amputated & removed! They're of no use to me! I take in these cats, provide them food, shelter, love and companionship.. and they live to sometimes over 20 years old. Would they have lived to the ripe old age of 20 out in the wilderness using their 'defenses' to protect them against cars squashing them or coyotes running off with their bodies?? No! They were considered geriatric (& still are) at the age of 6 or 7. To me, that's still a baby. Domesticated cats have come a long way from hunting in the wilderness and allowing us to take care of them.

It seems to me a decision to declaw is someone's personal choice. Arguing about it isn't going to change someone's mind if they're for or against it (usually).

[Balbus]

56. I bet you own a Pit Bull, too!

Declawed cats and a Pit Bull - double curses to you!! :P

[Steph13]

58. Why yes I do!

Here's my declawed kitty in love with my ferocious pit bull mix! :P

[Divameow77]

66. I see nobody has answered your question-

Does anyone here against declawing have a son that's been circumsized??

To some that is an inhumane practice, and the baby is awake for the procedure and does feel pain during and afterwards.

[hyphenate]

32. It's definitely cruel

it is, in essence the cutting off of the top phalange on each paw. Sort of like if the tops of each of your fingers was cut off to the first joint.

There are other ways of dealing with scratching kitties. 1) Groom them as much as possible, and cut their nails as often as you can.

2) Substitute a proper scratching post for them with both sisal and carpetting. Place it on the other side of the room from the furniture they're tearing at, and spray it with a mild catnip spray to make it appealing to them.

3) As I've already told a lot of people, they have these little "caps" that can be fitted by the vet over their claws. They're glued into place, and the cat can't scratch with them on. The vet does need to replace them every so often, I think it's every 6 months, but I could be wrong on that.

4) Put plastic around the furniture spots where they're scratching. Also, try temporarily putting aluminum foil on trouble spots. They hate foil. Or double stick tape--that works well, also, but obviously it doesn't come in larger sizes.

Each and every one of these things will help keep cats from scratching various spots. I have an old and pretty nasty loveseat from years ago that should have been tossed years ago. I keep it in an area that the cats are mostly in so that they can continue to use that for scratching purposes. Someday I will have to toss it for good, but in the meantime it keeps the cats away from other items of furniture. Before the loveseat, it was an old wicker hamper that was their favorite. Give them one item and reconcile yourself to its destruction, and you will find they will be happy with the arrangement.

[Divameow77]

37. Is giving a cat a piece of furniture to scratch really going to teach

them not to scratch on other furniture?

[shockra]

38. A list of countries where declawing is illegal...

Or considered extremely inhumane and only performed under extreme circumstances.

England
Scotland
Wales
Italy
France
Germany
Austria
Switzerland
Norway
Sweden
Netherlands
Northern Ireland
Ireland
Denmark
Finland
Slovenia
Portugal
Belgium
Brazil
Australia
New Zealand
Yugoslavia
Japan

http://www.declawing.com/htmls/outlawed.htm

[Jessica]

42. Never have, never will.

It's their main source of defense - and even if they don't ever have to use it to defend, I believe stripping them of it is downright cruel. I agree with your wife. :)

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[UncleSepp]

62. I see your posts and raise you one of mine

In the ones that are still up, you seem to attack the individual who holds the opinion as much as or more so than the opinion itself. Were you perhaps doing that in the posts which were deleted? It's something many people will do on a topic they feel very strongly about, and it's something many people also seem to do without realizing it. That might have been the problem, and might have been the reason some of your posts were deleted. Since you still have other posts on this same thread which were not deleted and which oppose the declawing of cats, it's more likely to conclude that your deleted posts were alerted on by the user to whom you were responding - probably for ad hominem attacks - than that the moderator is attempting to stifle your opinion.

Go love on your kitties for a while :-)

[newportdadde]

47. Yes we had our cat declawed.

We adopted her as a kitten from an animal shelter. She never did too much damage to the furniture it was our walls. She would climb straight up the walls 7 feet or more then slide down. We tried all the methods, scratching posts, we had aluminum foil all over the walls of our house but this cat would not stop.

I've had cats all my life some adopted declawed and others not at all and she is the strangest one I've ever had.

As a side note my 17 month old who loves 'kitty kitty' would have have no face left if she had claws.

[Bridget Burke]

51. While wating in the vet's office, a couple came in for advice.

They had a new kitten & wanted to know the best age to have him fixed. And when he could be declawed.

The kitty's name was "Raptor."

(Kinky Friedman plans to make declawing cats illegal when he becomes Governor of Texas.)

[MrSlayer]

48. Yes but I had to.

My Eddy cat (R.I.P.) was so vicious we had to get him declawed or he would have killed everyone in the house. Awesome cat he was. My other cat is not declawed because he isn't a homocidal maniac.

[shrike]

49. My cat doesn't even know she IS de-clawed

Every once in a while she'll stretch out her paws and "scratch." As for balance, hell, the darn thing's an acrobat. If de-clawing slows her down, I'd hate to see what she'd be like with front claws. Her latest deal is the duct work down in the basement. She likes to climb in it. We made that impossible, and now she's figured out how to climb up on the ceiling eaves. She's 13 years old, BTW.

She came to me de-clawed; I adopted her as a stray 12 years ago.

[grace0418]

52. I had to, I wasn't thrilled with the idea but it was the only option at

the time. I was afraid my one cat, who was mentally handicapped, was going to get himself killed because he kept getting trapped in the strangest places (under furniture, between doors, in curtains, under the bed, in the bedcovers, , behind the tv, in window screens, etc). We tried the claw covers, he gnawed them until he was bloody. He raised holy hell when having his claws trimmed (I have scars to prove it), even though otherwise he was a very laid-back kitty. Eventually, we felt we had to do it. I decided that him breaking a limb or suffocating by getting himself caught on something would be far more cruel than having his front claws removed under anesthesia. And because of their constant sibling wrestling, we decided it wouldn't be fair if one had front claws and one didn't. So both had the procedure. They healed right away, had no balance problems, no behavioral issues, nothing. They were already 100% indoors, so that wasn't a problem. They are (were, one has since passed away) the sweetest, friendliest kitties on earth. And little Beans never got trapped in anything again.

I'm not saying I advocate the decision, it's definitely not a first choice option by any means. But sometimes it's a lesser-of-two-evils decision.

[newsguyatl]

55. declawing is MUTILATION -- plain and simple

do the research, and after, if you could do this to an animal, you should probably question your humanity.

i look forward to the day that this practice is outlawed.

if you can't deal with the scratching of furniture etc, you shouldn't have ever gotten a cat.

[slackmaster]

57. No - Please don't do it

Give your cats up for adoption and get a goldfish.

[deadparrot]

59. No,

because she's an outdoor can in a neighborhood with several dogs.

She's pretty feisty, and could probably stand her own, but we thought it best to allow her to keep her best means of defense. :)

[VOX]

61. I adopted a "declaw." It is pitiful. It causes many behavioral problems.

She has to lift goodies, toys, etc. up to her mouth with her "wrists" -- her front paws are fairly useless as tools. Declawed cats also use their teeth much more frequently, since that's the only way they can get ahold of something that is in front of them. My declaw has a chipped canine tooth from all the crocodile-like snapping she's done at various objects.

She's a great cat, really, but often seems restless, no matter how much stimulus she's had. I believe that her declawed-ness has led to this.

It's also believed that, later in life, the declawed cat can have pain problems with the "empty" paws.

Declawing should only be done as a last resort, and even then, it shouldn't be done.

[grace0418]

68. Mine had no behavioral problems whatsoever.

He's quite adept with his paws and can pick things up without any problems.

[Felix Mala]

64. It's like having your fingers cut off at the first knuckle.

You can live, but what's your quality of life? Cats can be trained to stay away from things. They need something to scratch. Go to the lumber yard and get a serious block of hardwood. You can get false fingernailes that will cover cats nails for a period, but then they fall off and they are pricey. They come in cool colors, tho.

You can get chemicals that dissuade cats, but a spray bottle with water is just as effective. Keep them in a "safe" room when you're not home.

[bicentennial_baby]

67. No, b/c I don't needlessly mutilate animals for my own comfort

If your furniture is soooo fucking important, give the cats to someone else, who won't mutilate them.

[Midlodemocrat]

70. I am going to lock this.

There are a lot of personal attacks that have been removed from this thread already and I, personally, don't think that folks on either side of the declawing issue will reach a consensus.

Thanks.

DU Moderator.

[Midlodemocrat]

71. Flamebait.

This thread has become a flamefest.