johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:33 PM
Original message |
It seems like most of you wanted to see Jackson fry |
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From the things I have read and heard, the accuser's parents are money hungry freaks. Do you really think that because Jackson had a lot of cash, that's why he was found innocent? Did you really want to see him spend time in prison because he is rich? Two times the investigation has found him innocent and people still want to see blood. This is not a baseball game people, it's reality. It's not a win or lose situation, it is a person's life. Get over it and concentrate on something that can make our world better.
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Tandalayo_Scheisskopf
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:34 PM
Response to Original message |
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Yay for you and your words. Enough of this bread and circuses bullshit. There is a country crumbling out there.
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:34 PM
Response to Original message |
2. Uh, the last alleged victim was paid off... |
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Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 04:36 PM by BikeWriter
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
5. I personally think it's bullshit |
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I think a lot of people want to see famous people burn. Sure Jackson is a bit strange, but that doesn't make him a child molester.
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
17. A bit strange? A forty year old man with boys in his bed? |
samplegirl
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
24. Yeah lets move on to the real criminals |
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like Ken Lay...who keeps getting his trial delayed.
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kanrok
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
JimmyJazz
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
30. Would you let your children spend the night at his ranch and sleep |
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in his bed? If not, why not?
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #30 |
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I doubt I would have let them stay there if I had children. I guess that is one of the things that makes me think this is all bullshit. He has been accused of molestation many times, and these "parents" still let their children go there. Their "case" seems to be a bit transparent to me. Heh, I said trans-parent.
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nothingshocksmeanymore
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
6. No, the last victim's parents asked for money BEFORE they reported |
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a crime..then the victim received a settlement..whether it was to silence him or simply to overcome the bad PR to a top star is a matter of conjecture
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
19. So you think he paid tens of millions in extortion and he's innocent? |
Kraklen
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #19 |
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Would you accept a cash settlement if you thought your kid was molested?
No, you'd take it to trial.
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ComerPerro
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #22 |
34. Well, and consider what this trial has cost him |
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Seems to me that if he had the money, the settlement would just have seemed easier and better for him at the time.
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #22 |
36. No, I'd kill the asshole. |
Kraklen
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
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It was extortion. And the problem with paying extortion is that it attracts other sharks. And that's exactly what happened to MJ.
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #37 |
39. If so, he's the stupidest person on the planet. I watched.. |
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the TV special where he talked of all the children in his bedroom.
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nothingshocksmeanymore
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #19 |
25. Prove he paid TENS of millions |
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The amount IIRC was ten million and if you are worth half a billion, then yes, you have a portfolio to protect that might be worth ten million in order to buy your peace
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #25 |
38. "Jackson did not admit guilt in the settlement, which Court TV" |
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later reported was more than $20 million. http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/27/jackson/
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nothingshocksmeanymore
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
40. The settlement was confidential so any reporting was speculative |
BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #40 |
41. "document states that $15,331,250 was put into a trust fund for Jordan" |
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Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 05:39 PM by BikeWriter
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nothingshocksmeanymore
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #41 |
44. So..it's a web site with no actual documents |
BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #44 |
48. Dozens of websites... |
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"who settled a related civil lawsuit for more than $15 million)." http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0328051jacksonpast1.html
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Zuni
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
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read "All that Glitters" by Raymond Chandler---the 1993 boys uncle.
They reported MJ to the cops. MJ went on the offensive, and the kid was having enough emotional problems, so they didn't want to subject him to any more abuse so they decided to make MJ pay a large amount so it would hurt him and make him think twice, but wouldn't force the kid to have to endure a trial
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BikeWriter
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #46 |
50. I can believe that. Unfortunately, it didn't stop him. |
nothingshocksmeanymore
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #46 |
54. Nope..they asked for money FIRST then went to the cops |
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THEN made the settlement. The book rewrites the history of the case.
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Zuni
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #54 |
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I have seen no reason to believe Mr. Chandler is lying
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Zuni
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:34 PM
Response to Original message |
3. I honestly, truly believe he is guilty |
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the jury essentially said that all his victims were lying. 3 seperate victims testified as witnesses here---
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
9. There is a lot of cash to be won |
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Money makes a lot of people do some fucked up things. Probably thousands of kids that Jackson came in contact with and there are 3 that accuse him? And thousands that don't?
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Maddy McCall
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:35 PM
Response to Original message |
4. Even the children of despicable parents can be molested. |
qnr
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
Debi
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
12. Even really weird former rock starts that act in a bizarre manner |
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can be innocent of molesting children.
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NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #12 |
SOteric
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:37 PM
Response to Original message |
7. I try to refrain from making judgements about other people's |
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guilt or innocence. I likely wasn't there when the alleged acts were committed. Moreover, I've actually done quite a lot of service on juries. (Probably because I vote in all the elections.) In my experience the details divulged for a juror's consideration are rarely anything like the rampant speculation and character assassination set out in the mainstream mass media.
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Bullwinkle925
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
11. You're correct. I also have served on juries and what you read in |
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the papers or hear on the news may not exactly reflect what is taking place in the courtroom.
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
13. That's my point..I think..LOL |
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Most people who are judging Jackson are doing so through "Entertainment Tonight".
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NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #13 |
52. Thanks for your post johnnie. n/t |
NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
51. There's a sane response! |
4_Legs_Good
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
66. Very good point - I think most of the court hysteria is utter BS |
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Yes, sometimes a jury gets something wrong, but from Jackson to McDonald's coffee, I think the judicial system usually works well, and the Mind Control Media and water cooler chats don't have all the facts and feed us into this "we live in a litigious society" BS.
david
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qnr
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:39 PM
Response to Original message |
10. No, I wanted him to stop taking up valuable air time that could be applied |
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to something useful. So, you're jumping on people for making judgements about Jackson by ... um... making judgements about them?
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
15. He isn't taking up air time |
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Or do you think he is buying "spots" on CNN? And yes, I am judging based on what I am reading here, not by what the media is telling me.
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qnr
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #15 |
20. You're judging. I could give a rats ass about him or the trial, yet you |
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Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 04:48 PM by qnr
say "most of you" get a clue
Edit: Never mind, I've saved you the trouble.
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elperromagico
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:42 PM
Response to Original message |
14. Aside from a rubbernecking sort of interest, |
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I really don't care about the case.
Nor do I need to. The jury made its decision and that is what counts.
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #14 |
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I saw a bit here and there, and had no idea that the verdict was reached until I checked in here to DU. I think, the jury's verdict is what counts.
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On the Road
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:46 PM
Response to Original message |
18. If You've Been Sued Under False Pretenses |
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you would give more credence to the possibility that the accusers may not be playing straight. Personally, I haven't had that experience, but my girlfriend has been sued twice in three years. She's a landlord, and yes, I'm convinced both cases were absolutely bogus.
I really don't know if Jackson was guilty. However, the accusers seem to be tainted. If I were on the jury, there would certainly be some doubt in my mind.
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sniffa
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:47 PM
Response to Original message |
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i spit on him and every other fucking pedophiLe. :mad:
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
23. Were you in the courtroom? |
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Or are you finding him guilty because you watch a lot of TV?
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sniffa
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
26. no, because i'm racist |
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because he used to be african american.
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #26 |
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Since when can't a bleach job assure your innocence?
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mondo joe
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
43. We consider Bush guilty of a lot of things too. Did we have to be in the |
johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #43 |
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georgie said his shit right out in the open. It's apples and oranges.
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mondo joe
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Mon Jun-13-05 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #58 |
72. Said it out in the open? Like MJ admitted to sleeping with kids. |
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Yet DU is pretty confident he was a cokehead, might be drugged now, had a wire for the debates and so on. And all without benefit of conviction.
Mind you I am confident he did those things too, just as I'm confident that MJ is a danger to children.
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tigereye
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
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I guess I hoped the evidence would be enough to keep him away from children.
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Debi
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
53. Parents who don't approve of his behavior should be enough |
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to keep him away from their children.
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tigereye
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Mon Jun-13-05 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #53 |
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but it saddens me that he preys on the gullible, vulnerable, foolish ( and greedy?). I don't even know if that is what he means to do, but that seems to be what occurs.
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NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
56. I spit on pedophiles too, sniffa. I'm living proof that they can really |
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screw you up, but I think it is important that someone as strange as MJ gets a damn fair trial. I never read, heard or saw the proof that he was guilty of anything other than maybe being from another planet!!!( the man is a bit odd) Seriously, I respect your posts and enjoy your company here on DU. No offense intended. I'm surprised that the jury was open minded enough to see that there was no conclusive proof of the crime. We live in a world that persecutes those who don't "fit in". The repukes are trying to say that Democrats aren't patriotic because we don't want to kill for money, or make bullying a significant feature of our foreign policy. I often feel like the religious right is trying to marginalize anyone from those who don't dress modestly to people who believe in science. Hell, not to mention those of us who are gay, lesbian, people with tatoos....see what I mean? Now I'd be willing to read anything you have to say about why you are so convinced that he is guilty. But I just haven't seen it. Don't get mad...enlighten me. Here, I'll buy you a beer. :toast: :beer:
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JimmyJazz
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:53 PM
Response to Original message |
27. Correction: He was not found "innocent" - he was found |
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"not guilty." Sorry to nit pick, but there is a difference. No one is found "innocent" as a result of a trial.
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #27 |
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I didn't read the stories. I was just going on what was said here at DU. You nit-picker!!!
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NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #27 |
57. hmmm. That's a good point Jimmy Jazz. |
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What's your opinion? Hell, no one knows for sure and I'm not even a fan. I'm just kinda weird and feel somewhat persecuted by folks who call themselves normal. Never saw any conclusive evidence. Extortion looks possible. I've done some things that would baffle the hell out of some people but are not evidence of anything that might hurt another person. I think this shit is fascinating, especially as a topic for discussion on DU, because we are all weird according to the neo-cons. Labeled traitors, etc.
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JimmyJazz
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #57 |
63. My opinion. Thank you for asking. I am not going to jump up |
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and down and say he's guilty, but he does exhibit behaviors that raise red flags indicative of a child molester and I would not ever in a million years let my children spend any amount of time with the man alone given the opportunity.
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NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #63 |
65. Nor would I. He needs more adult friends, I'd say. |
JimmyJazz
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #65 |
68. Unfortunately, he probably can't trust very many adults which |
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probably adds to his desire to be with children. :( It's a sad story all the way around.
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NoSheep
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #68 |
69. Well said. Yes, it is. |
kanrok
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Mon Jun-13-05 04:53 PM
Response to Original message |
mondo joe
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:40 PM
Response to Original message |
42. Yes, I did. And do. Because I disagree with your assessment. |
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I think he's guilty, and I'm tired of seeing rich powerful people get away with crimes.
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Seabiscuit
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:44 PM
Response to Original message |
45. Same problem with Jacko and OJ: We'll just never really know, will we? |
Left Is Write
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Mon Jun-13-05 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
47. We'll never know for sure either way. |
johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
60. It's our judicial system |
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We don't hear everything in both cases. As Americans, we like to see people fry for anything, and we bitch if they are found not guilty. OJ and Jackson have been found not guilty in both cases, but yet people still want to see them burn. I can be a total anarchist when it comes to the American way, but I will stand by out judicial process, it is one of the best so far. Until they find a better way of putting someone on trial, I will go with what we have. Sure, some things fall thru the cracks, but it is the best so far. I just wonder if anyone on DU has a better justice system?
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Seabiscuit
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Mon Jun-13-05 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #60 |
71. I agree. Stand by the judicial system. Criticize it, question it, but |
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once someone's acquitted, let it go, no matter how convinced you are of someone's guilt.
I don't think we'll ever have a "better" judicial system - it will always of necessity be a human system full of many human flaws.
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Jamastiene
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:26 PM
Response to Original message |
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Call me naive, but I don't think he's really guilty of child molestation. The mother had to plead the 5th to keep from perjuring herself and there were more "victims" taking the stand saying he didn't molest them and they were just more credible. If the prosecution had had evidence that was not circumstantial, I would be among the first to want to see him sentenced to a long prison term and castrated, but I just believe our system works for better or worse. I'm glad we have the innocent until proven guilty system and that a guilty verdict can't be made with it being "beyond a reasonable doubt". Granted, I wasn't inside the court room throughout the trial, Nancy Grace and her cackling spun to her heart's contenct and based on her best assessment, I have my reasonable doubts.
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #59 |
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The people who are jumping to their own judgment based on "Entertainment Tonight" are naive. I too would be the first in line to see any pedophile convicted and sentenced to castration (if that was a choice), but I see nothing but a load of crap here with Jackson. And excuse my language but, Fuck Nancy Grace. What a despicable hunk of flesh.
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Jamastiene
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #61 |
67. You got that right... |
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Nancy Grace is beyond obnoxious. And, yes, most people are basing their opinions on what they have heard in the media. Some people are just so convinced that they are going on pure emotion, which is forgiveable in a lot of ways. None of us on DU wants to see a child get molested and the perp get away with it. I honestly believe that if this jury had been convinced, there would a been at least one guilty verdict in the 10 felony list if not more... MJ should learn from his mistakes and either videotape his own every move or quit letting children in his bedroom at all. If it is causing that much of an uproar or gut reaction, maybe he'd be doing himself a favor. As far as his guilt or innocence, my personal take on this case is extortion. The last time, the people took a payoff. I cannot see any parents taking a payoff if their child had really been molested. From what I heard, this family took a payoff as well and the mother of the boys had to plead the 5th to keep from perjuring herself and at least one of the accusors admitted he lies quite a bit. Plus, there was no physical evidence. It was circumstantial from what I have heard.
I guarantee if we did a role playing test on DU, where someone who still wants MJ to fry played the role of accusee in a mock child molestation case, they'd start to see my point. Anyone can be accused and the public's gut reaction is fry the bastard and castrate them beforehand. Any defendent should be considered innocent until proven guilty. I'd agree with anyone who said that MJ is weird and incredibly stupid to let any children near him after the first allegation years ago, but neither weirdness nor stupidity are against the law.
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LisaL
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:36 PM
Response to Original message |
62. No, I wanted to see him go free. Not Fry, Fly. Fly little birdie, fly. |
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Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 06:36 PM by lizzy
:eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:
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johnnie
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #62 |
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LOL, no, I think you are awesome!...but weird..LOL
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4_Legs_Good
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Mon Jun-13-05 06:41 PM
Response to Original message |
64. Our District Attorney (SB) has wanted a high profile celebrity conviction |
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for a while - the kind of thing that shines on a resume.
After wasting who the hell knows how much of Santa Barbara's tax money, I wonder if he'll have a job.
david
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elshiva
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Mon Jun-13-05 10:47 PM
Response to Original message |
74. Don't believe in the death penalty, so I don't want him to fry or |
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anyone else for that matter.
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autorank
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Mon Jun-13-05 11:14 PM
Response to Original message |
75. Not really, just life on a slow flame...get him ready for this. |
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