Have you ever become enemies with people by loaning them money?

[BikeWriter]

Inquiring minds want to know. :shrug:

[EST]

1. Happens almost every time.

[BikeWriter]

6. Yep, I'm reluctant to loan anything now. :-(

[EST]

80. Yeah, when they come around,

looking totally torn up, letting you know you're their last hope - without you, the world's gonna end...

Daaamnn...and you know, you KNOW, that this will end whatever friendship you may have once had and you tell them what's going to happen; it always does.
Human beings are such complicated creatures. (bless their hearts)

[BikeWriter]

87. A couple of years ago I had a friend ask if he had to get down on...

his knees and beg. He needed money "desperately" for a retainer for a child custody case. I loaned him $400 cash. He nickel-dimed me twenty and fifty dollars at a time for a couple of years, then died still owing me money. You can't win for losing...

[EST]

92. Having a soft heart is such a downer.

Makes you understand bankers a little better.

[BikeWriter]

94. Yes, it does. Loaning money to friends and relatives is...

a sorry business to be in. It has to rate close to owning a boat * as ways to lose money.

* A hole in the water to throw money into.

[EST]

102. Yup.

[obxhead]

2. yes - the best 10 bucks I ever spent.

I was pissed when they paid me back because then I knew they would start stopping by again. :)

[BikeWriter]

7. I have felt that way before, too.

[Mizmoon]

3. I never lend, I only give

Everyone stays friends that way.

[BikeWriter]

8. That's probably the best way to do it. I have several dodging me now.

[Shell Beau]

83. My philosophy as well!

[BikeWriter]

88. You're a smart Lady, Shell.

:)

[Shell Beau]

93. Aww shucks! Thanks!

;)

[BikeWriter]

95. You're welcome! :-)

[Aristus]

4. I became an enemy of a guy I knew in the Army to whom I refused

to lend money.

He hurled "JEW!" at me as loud as he could. I'm not Jewish, but ANYONE would have been offended by such a hateful outburst. I'm glad now I didn't lend him so much as a wooden nickel. Bigots get nothing from me.

[BikeWriter]

9. Damn, I'm glad you found out about him!

[Aristus]

11. The sad thing is, I met his mother and father during graduation from

Basic Training, and they were sweet, warm, nice people. I don't know if he nursed his own hatreds, or if his family were raving bigots under that appealing exterior. I just wanted to say to him: "Hey man, I know your mother! What would she think?"

[BikeWriter]

13. Really! I could say the same thing to some who owe me. :-(

[SOteric]

5. Not since I was a teenager.

Thereafter I changed my approach to money between friends. If I'm not giving it to them as a gift, under no expectation of return, and well and fully able to do so...

I don't share access to funds with any but the closest, most deeply trusted friends.

[BikeWriter]

10. Generosity has cost me some friends before. I'm changing my policy.

[sparky_in_ma]

12. Lost friendships

but didn't make enemies. I don't lend, I just give it and if it comes back, fine. Only problem is some feel they need to avoid me after. I've never made a big deal of it, just ask them to pay it forward if they ever get a chance.

[BikeWriter]

15. That's probably the best if you can afford to. This hasn't helped...

my disposition at all!

[sparky_in_ma]

16. It's like gambling

only give what you can afford to lose. :-(

[BikeWriter]

18. Yep, a friend needed money for his grand child two years ago...

I gave him $200. He saw me out night before last and told me he had just put it in my mailbox. Guess what? No money when I got home...

[Historic NY]

14. I've been burned........the guy still owes me on a 90 day note.

Back when interest rates were up I loaned a guy 10g's on a 90 day note at 10% interest. I've collected some but never the entire amount. The court reverted the note to standard interest. He still makes me track him down and I've even won in court. So now if someone asks me I say no go see....Charlie he has my money.

[BikeWriter]

19. That's a good reply, Pard!

[ikojo]

17. I loaned some money to a "friend" and

at first she paid me back regularly...then she had excuse after excuse as to why she could not pay me back....

I was one of the first people to befriend her when she moved to St Louis. Well, once she got comfortable in St Louis she no longer needed me. I did not fit what she thought a woman should be (I am into LOTR, Star Wars and such..what she calls the interests of a 14 year old boy) so she became friends with someone else in the building and distanced herself from me.

As she distanced herself from me, the payments became fewer and more far between. I finally had to confront her and threaten to take her to small claims court. THEN the payments were more regular until the loan was paid off.

[BikeWriter]

20. I'm glad you got yours back. I may have to break some fingers...

[In_The_Wind]

21. unfortunately the answer is yes

I would rather not have it come between us but it happens sometimes because the person feels embarrassed about not being able to keep their word.:shrug:

[BikeWriter]

27. Yep, I know the feeling. One told me the other night...

he had not forgotten he owes me. Hell, he has missed three or four weekly payments now. I got out of bed and spent all night bailing him out so he could dodge me? I don't think so...

[In_The_Wind]

33. IF I care enough to go out on the limb for someone ... I think of them

as a friend. If they are still having problems ... well I can understand that. But when I see them out F`n off and partying it up :wtf: ... I sorta feel screwed without a kiss.

[BikeWriter]

36. No shit! If they can afford to drink they can pay you and me!

[In_The_Wind]

40. yep! That's the way I see it.

[all.of.me]

22. yup, just once. that's all it took to learn the lesson!

it's a very long story, but i sold a piece of land to a 'friend' and she sold it to her brother in law so she could pay me. he paid her but she did NOT pay me! when he found that out, he hit the roof. i sued her, and ran around the country looking for her, and since i'd sued the brother in law, too, i think he paid her AGAIN to pay me, which she did. she miraculously came up with $21,000 one afternoon, and i KNOW she doesn't have that kind of money. i finally got paid after almost three years. we were really good friends, and i wouldn't say we are enemies, but we don't talk anymore. very sad. we were very close.

[BikeWriter]

28. Whew! My Dad made that sort of property deal with an aunt of mine...

He and Mom finally wrote it off as a loss. They could have used the money, too. :(

[all.of.me]

37. it was awful!

i was naive. i gave her the warranty deed, but didn't know that i could have put a lien on it. simple thing, i didn't know, and it caused me three year's worth of grief and a lost friendship. i'll NEVER do business with a friend again. never. ever. ever.

[BikeWriter]

41. I can agree with that. It's a prescription for trouble!

:(

[progmom]

23. no

it's just money.

[BikeWriter]

29. Yes'm, I've always had too many hands outstretched asking for more...

to afford to give much away. :(

[Lilith Velkor]

24. Yup

Unfortunately, I discovered in the process that I didn't have any friends. I've made a couple since then, but never fully recovered from it emotionally.

[BikeWriter]

30. Oh, that really sucks! I'm sorry!

[Lilith Velkor]

39. Thanks

It was my SO, of course. He owed me $700 I needed for school, so he went to work one day at his new good paying job and never came back.

Months later, I sold some of his stuff and burned the rest in a bonfire. Apparently that makes me a horrible mean person.

The following year Bush was appointed, and the aftermath of that proved to me that most people are too stupid to be worth knowing, and the rest hang out here on the DU. :hi:

[BikeWriter]

42. Oh, my Dog! Another good friend had her life savings and husband...

disappear to Mexico that same year. She was smart enough to call the cops six months later when his broke ass called wanting her to bail him out of a Mexican jail.

[Lilith Velkor]

49. Ouch!

I will never understand some people. Guess they were raised in an environment where you don't get shot for shit like that. :shrug:

[BikeWriter]

51. Yes, and this was a righteous Lady who was raised to take good care...

of a man by Texas parents, too. She's damned good people. I had the honor of being a guest on her couch through Christmas and New Years that year. We were both newly deserted, but at least we were not alone for the Holidays.

[Lilith Velkor]

53. The words you use...

remind me of my biker buddies I lost track of when I quit drinking. Good people indeed. I gotta check my local VVAW or VFP, I bet they're there.

[BikeWriter]

56. Thank you, Ma'am. There are many of us for peace, others...

are still twisted and follow the wrong leaders.

[friesianrider]

25. Money and friendships are difficult.

Someone always gets hurt or offended - its usually not a good scenario unless you REALLY, REALLY trust the person and wouldn't mind not ever getting the money back.

[BikeWriter]

31. Yes, I've given several thousand away this year to friends...

but others (some in the same family) I'm requiring to pay it back...

[skygazer]

26. Not by loaning the money - by having the nerve to expect to be paid back

It was my sister. She was in dire straits - I felt very bad for her (she's disabled, on a fixed income).

I lent her 300 bucks even though I was out of work on a surgical leave at the time and really couldn't afford it.

She told me she'd pay me back the following month and I told her no, to pay me back 50 or 100 bucks a month so she didn't get in the hole again.

After four months of no payment, I called and asked nicely about it and she sent me 100.

Another 6 months went by and I called again - she promised to mail something. Didn't.

After 2 more months, I was finally fed up. Honestly, it wasn't so much the not being paid back as it was the fact that she wasn't even really acknowledging the debt - I'd told her more than once that even 10 bucks a month would be fine - just to let me know she hadn't forgotten me. Nothing, not even a note saying 'sorry, can't send anything.'

So I wrote her a rather pissy letter telling her not to bother paying me the rest of the money but don't EVER ask me for another red cent and she hasn't spoken to me since. Apparently, I'm at fault here.

Whatever.

[BikeWriter]

34. Whoa! Yep, I had the same response from a kid the other day...

I'd given his girl friend (a friend's grand daughter) money for braces for her teeth and bought her class ring, but I insisted he pay back money I loaned him for a fine. I'm not into enabling crimes. He acted so insulted the other night he'd better come up with some cash, or I'll make him wish he had!

[tjdee]

32. I don't expect the money back, so no.

When I give people money, I don't expect to ever see it again. I don't want to become a collections agency with people I care enough about to give money to. If I can't afford to give it, I don't.

[BikeWriter]

35. Smart move, Pard. I'm going to have to do that myself.

[tjdee]

38. Well, you have the right to expect your money back, too...

I'm a pushover, and after I realized people sometimes weren't giving the money back, I went...well....that's okay....

But if you had an agreement that they'd pay it back, I can see how things would get ugly on both sides.

[BikeWriter]

43. Yep, things like $1,000 on a pretty girl's braces, and her class ring...

when she's made all A's, I can afford to call a gift. $200 for her B/F's speeding ticket to prevent breaking probation on drug charges HAS to be paid back. You know what I mean?

[all.of.me]

44. after reading this thread, i see that you are a really generous man

i think that's great. my kids' dad is like that, too (except when it comes to child support - lol), but helping people out makes you feel good and brings good things around to you. so good for you!

[BikeWriter]

45. Thank you, Ma'am. My child support was always paid up, and...

I've ridden hundreds of miles on my Harley when I couldn't afford a car to take the ex a roll of hundreds for their Christmas presents. My kids have always known I loved them. :)

[all.of.me]

46. he gives the kids money, but not me

then when i say there is no money for food, he says the kids have money! ack! i am finally going to the state. he can talk to the state. i am tired of dealing with him. it's been 7 years and they are almost grown up!

good for you for being a good daddy. that is inspiring.

[BikeWriter]

47. Thank you, Ma'am. Yep, they'll pick him up and he'll pay or rot in jail...

I've heard kids can even sue for back child support now.

[all.of.me]

48. why is money so evil?

[BikeWriter]

50. Money does wonders every day. It's hard to come by sometimes...

I always had to work for mine. You would not believe the thousands of wild parties I've had to leave to go to work to make money, and that's just the ones at my house!

[all.of.me]

68. that's funny!

money is a wonderful thing, and it is just energy we spread around. but by evil, i guess i meant that people get attitudes about it. someone can ask to borrow your canoe, and you say sure. someone can ask to borrow some money, and suddenly everyone is uptight (not always, but i think you know what i mean). money puts weird vibes into some people, not all. and as we've seen in this thread, several of us have lost friends over it. did you ever lose a friend over a canoe?

money is grand! i don't have alot, but it sure is nice to make it and spend it. especially for a woman, it is very empowering to have money, to be independent. so i guess money isn't evil, it's people's attitudes about it. there. i clarified it for myself!

[BikeWriter]

69. ROFL! Yes'm, you're right all the way around. Someone is not likely...

to refuse to give you your canoe back, though, and if they offer to give your canoe back a piece each week for a month or so you've got grounds for a law suit. :)

[all.of.me]

70. do you ever sleep?!

i did not expect to see you this early!

canoe payments. very funny idea! you'd be sunk. :rofl:

[BikeWriter]

72. Oh, I usually nap for a while most mornings, Genevat. Yep, I liked...

the canoe payment idea! :)

[EST]

96. You know what's really funny?

We (humanity) have known and taught this very same lesson for thousands of years. You've just paraphrased a caution from a book written over two thousand years ago - the lust for money is the root of all evil - that wasn't exactly news, then.
Makes one wonder: Just how the hell can any message of value be transmitted to a person such that it will be heard, understood, and learned?

[BikeWriter]

101. We just keep making the same mistakes. :-(

[all.of.me]

119. what book was that?

i don't have an answer to your question. it makes me wonder, though, what is it about money that is so attractive? why do we (our society) strive to earn more and more and more, and hoard it away so we look good? my parents were wealthy, but i never bought into that lifestyle. i rebelled against it in the 60s (i am SO grateful i grew up in the times that i did), so the whole i-gotta-have-more-and-you-can't-have-any mindset makes no sense to me.

when my dad died, and money became an issue, i saw a side of my brother i'd never seen before! i never want to see him again! i was blown away with his 'gimme' attitude and how he tried to manipulate the estate so i didn't get my share (which actually blew up in his face, because everything went to my mother - we don't get anything until she dies, which i thought was great karma for him).

money is just energy, no different that happiness, sadness, compassion, etc. if everyone could adopt that kind of thinking, life would be very different on the planet. we should be so greedy with other energies! people should be screaming, 'give me more compassion! give me more happiness! give me more human emotions!' but no, they scream, 'give me more money!' it sounds so stupid, but it's true! that's the sad part.

ugh. the whole money thing REALLY pushes my buttons. can you tell? ;)

[NashVegas]

106. Great Way to Look At It

I've been broke most of my life, so no one's ever asked me for real amounts of money. When it comes to the small amounts I've lent (we're talking $20 or less) or borrowed, my experience is that it does come back, just more often in non-cash form.

Now that I'm doing better, I'll heed your post if/when I get hit up for larger amounts.

[fortyfeetunder]

52. No great loss

First folks...they were in town temporarily, and they couldn't mail their packages before they left, so I held them and mailed them back. Sent them the bill...never heard from them since...Which was weird because they knew I had just got a job, just bought a house, barely furnished....oh well.

The other guy was a college classmate who said he was in med school. Every few months he'd hit me up for $50. Until I told him I had new financial obligations and couldn't help him any more.

The last one was a sibling who mistakenly thought I had access to our parents' money. His kid had totaled a car, and the car needed repairs. Even if I had the money, I wouldn't have given them one red cent. brother was livid, and he left a string of threatening messages on the telephone. We were estranged for years but eventually made up.

[BikeWriter]

57. Aww hell, the worst money disagreements are with kin folks...

Most of the ones I've helped this last year are family of an old friend. I'm generous to her to a fault, but she repays that in getting me out of my big cluttered house.

[LiberallyInclined]

54. nope.

it ususally happens when people loan me money tho...

[BikeWriter]

58. LOL! When people loan you money? Why, are they disagreeable?

[LiberallyInclined]

61. what they don't understand- is that I DO intend to pay it back...

in fact- I'd rather owe it to them for the rest of my life, rather than cheat them out of it...

[BikeWriter]

63. The latter part of that sounds very familiar... Have I loaned you money?

[cestpaspossible]

55. Not when I loaned it, but when they didn't pay it back.

Although 'enemy' is too strong a word.

[BikeWriter]

59. Yep, but there have been disagreements then?

[cestpaspossible]

62. I don't understand your question.

[BikeWriter]

65. Oh, nothing important. From your post I thought you may have been...

stiffed on loans a few times.

[hfojvt]

60. not enough no answers

there is "No I have not because I never lend money" and there is "no I have not because I always get paid back" and there is "no I have not because I do not sweat it if I do not get paid back".
I have lent money to two or three siblings (and started my dad doing it) and they always pay me back. I have lent money many times to half a dozen quasi-friends. Most of the time I got paid back. A few times I did not expect to get paid back. In another case, I guy I had hardly met asked to borrow a couple bucks, which I lent to him. He never paid me back, but I did not consider him an enemy, but the next time has asked to borrow money, I told him I did not have any.

[BikeWriter]

64. You have probably had a better than average experience with loans...

I wish I had been as careful or lucky as you. :-)

[Skittles]

66. no

I never lend money I cannot afford to lose or really care about. And I've never really had anyone screw me over money-wise either.

[BikeWriter]

67. That was probably because they knew you'd kick their ass.

[Skittles]

78. lol BikeWriter

I think from growing up as a GI brat I size people up very well and very accurately - I seem to know who I can trust, always have and let me tell you, it has sadly not been too many people.

[BikeWriter]

85. I can believe that Skittles, considering the number of people...

I have had go back on their word to me about debts. They can be so convincing when they want something from you. :(

[Skittles]

113. see, if you're a kind-hearted soul it is much worse

you're probably like me - you can't stand to see someone in distress

[BikeWriter]

114. That's true. Like so many though, I'm on a fixed income, so if I'm...

going to continue to help people over those speed bumps in life some of it must be repaid.

[China_cat]

71. Yes, my sister.

Who told me, when asked to repay the loan, that I didn't 'deserve' to get my money back.

Of course, she also borrowed money from our other sister but gave a diamond ring as collateral. When called on no repayment and the sister with the ring threatened to sell it for the money owed, this one said she'd just report the ring stolen and have C arrested.

Real piece of work, that one.

So, I don't lend 2 things...money or books.

[BikeWriter]

73. Oh my Dog! That's terrible she'd do that! :-(

[Mutley]

74. I don't borrow money from people for this reason.

And I'm always happy to lend friends $20 or $30 if they need it. But I rarely have more than that to lend.

[BikeWriter]

86. I know the feeling. They seem to act like I'm the handy dandy cash...

machine. The only problem with that is I'm the only one putting any cash back in.

[Shell Beau]

75. It is best just to give money if you want to help out a pal.

That way there is no expectation to see that money again and no arguments or disagreements about the repayment. I think a friend would feel inferior by being indebted to a friend.

[BikeWriter]

90. That's a great way to be, but I have so many asking for help...

I can't afford to give it to them. Some are just casual friends. Perhaps I should run in different circles of society.

[Trigger Hippie]

76. I have one close friend

who lives a very different lifestyle than I do. Husband, kids, mortgage, spends a LOT of money. She is always behind on her bills and has asked me to lend her money. I do it because I am a frugal person and always have extra to lend. She always pays me back though, even though I think she's had to borrow from her parents to do so. So, we're cool. :)

[BikeWriter]

89. That's good she always repays you, but sad she has to rely on...

your good sense in handling money to make ends meet. :(

[Lannes]

77. No but...

I have ended friendships with people I have really helped out in a time of need who are unwilling to do the same in mine.Its very rare that I ask a friend to help me out but if Ive been there for them,I expect them to be there for me if Im not making an unreasonable request.

[BikeWriter]

97. Yep, a quid pro quo, or something for something would be nice...

Favors, especially monetary ones, are so seldom returned.

[Hugin]

79. More often it has been fixing something for free.

Work is usually "not good enough" if it's free. To
the point I always charge something now.

[BikeWriter]

98. I have a mechanic friend who works out of his garage at home...

His wife is constantly on him about not getting paid for his work.

[redqueen]

81. Nope... I always assume I'll never get it back.

Never a borrower or a lender be, right? I'm either a giver or a taker. :)

[Hugin]

82. Yeeeup!

I do ask that someway, someday they do something nice
for someone.

[progmom]

91. that's how i feel too

[BikeWriter]

99. LOL! That's a realistic way to look at it. :-)

[bikebloke]

84. Borrowed, then the bloke disappeared

Years later, I ran into him and got his contact info. After I got home,I immediately put the money in an envelope to repay him. Then he vanished again. After the internet came around, I tried hunting him down. Still try every year.

[BikeWriter]

100. Wow, a conscientious borrower! You're a rare person. :-)

[SarahB]

103. Nope, because I'm a cheap bastard.

I never loan anyone money. :7

[BikeWriter]

104. Hee hee hee! Good thinking. That's one way to prevent being robbed!

[sendero]

105. "Enemies"..

.... is a stretch, but for sure, I will think long and hard before I ever loan a family member money again. :(

[BikeWriter]

109. It can sure cause hard feelings, can't it? :-(

[sendero]

111. Yes it can......

.... once I loaned sibling a pretty good chunk of change (over $1000), she claimed dire need.

A couple weeks later, her husband bought a "new" truck. "He deserved it" she said. Well perhaps he did, but I felt like my loan was being abused. At that point, I could certainly have used a new truck.

A year later I had to ask to get any of it back. I eventually got most of it, but it was very uncomfortable.

Another sibling used to take advantage of me too, but then I read him the riot act. Now, I've helped him pay off his house and he is paying me back as we planned.

So it doens't always not work, but when it doesn't it sure sucks. I don't want to be angry with a family member over money. :(

[BikeWriter]

112. Yes, it's not worth the hassle in most cases. I'm going to have to...

learn to say no.

[distantearlywarning]

107. My husband loaned an aquaintance $300 once.

The guy lived in another state and wrote us an email saying he was having problems and that he would pay it back in a few months.

Six months later, we were having a tough time financially too, so my husband wrote him a letter asking about the money. The guy wrote back and said, "Thanks for the loan and I'll send you the money in a money order via mail tomorrow"

Three weeks goes by and nothing comes in the mail. My husband thinks it might have been lost, so writes the guy again. This time the guy says, "Oh yeah, I forgot to mail it, etc..."

To make a long story short, many emails were exchanged. This guy told us no less than 4 different times that the check must have been lost in the mail (he should have been buying lottery tickets instead of money orders because the chances of that happening are astronomical). Finally, my husband just gave up and stopped writing. We never heard from the guy again.

What was really sad is that all this guy had to say was that he didn't have the money. We weren't actually worried overmuch about $300. But the lame lies about money orders and the post office cost him our friendship and respect. A mutual friend told us later that this was standard operating procedure for this guy and that he had done this exact thing to several people previously.

I think if I were in the habit of sacrificing friendships for money, I'd try to get more than $300 out of people. But I guess we knew what our relationship was worth, huh? :shrug:

So, I guess I'd have to say that loaning friends money isn't always such a good idea.

[BikeWriter]

108. One acquaintance who took me to the cleaners probably left...

a hundred debts behind him when he died. The jerk knew how to work people for sure.

[sniffa]

110. no

i have more important things to worry about than making enemies.

[BikeWriter]

115. Here's wishing you continued success in avoiding it then.

[sniffa]

117. thanks

if i don't get money back, i'LL be upset.. but not enough to make an enemy. that takes effort.

[coyote]

116. I´ve given my brother thousands.....

for dental school and god knows what else. He cannot handle his money at all. However, I give it to him freely because I love him to death and never expect to get it back.

On the other hand, I have had friends ask me for money and always have said no. I have seen to many people falling out because of money.

[BikeWriter]

118. Here's hoping your Brother will learn to handle his... your money...

better. There's always hope. :)