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Dude, give it a rest: your car won't beat my bike

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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:23 AM
Original message
Dude, give it a rest: your car won't beat my bike
There's a basic truism. Maybe some of you also don't know this yet. Motorcycles out-accelerate cars pretty much all the way across the board. A fast car might catch a smaller-displacement or slower motorcycle in the long run, but the bike will take off faster and head toward that vanishing point with greater rapidity. A lot of it has to do with power-to-weight ratio but, generally, motorcycle engines are also higher-performance units, pound for pound.

If you didn't know that, I hope you remember it now, because underestimating the ability of even a small motorcycle to cover ground has resulted in many accidents thanks to car drivers pulling out in front of an incoming bike at (relatively) glacial speeds on those rare occasions when a car driver actually sees a motorcycle. Those things can move quickly, so please consider that when you're determining whether to make that turn or wait until the motorcycle's safely past.

But that's not my main reason for writing this. I basically am just equal parts amused and eyesrolling at the apparently not uncommon belief that a car or truck can outpace a motorcycle from a standing start at a stoplight. The antagonists are invariable male and often resemble either (a) extras from a Deliverance casting call or (b) extras from a street gang film's casting call. These yahoos appear to equate ability to take off quickly with sexual prowess, I can only imagine, though I am led to believe that most women value staying power over speed or acceleration.

Anyway, I don't recall having recently engaged such morons in vehicular combat, my brian cells being too well connected for such silliness in traffic, and -- to the best of my recent memory -- I usually just let them take off amidst a screech of tires and stench of burning rubber in hope that Smokey is hiding out just up the road. Not that I don't routinely leave cars way behind when the light turns green -- they're safer further away from me, basically -- I just don't play silly traffic games with doofi (who're all too often shortening their engine life by revving the hell out of their rides at a standstill while repeatedly looking at me, one of the less subtle signs that, indeed, said f***wit wants to race).

The reasons for their f***wittedness are obvious in the context of what I wrote at the outset: my bike (a Kawasaki ZX-11), and just about any bike, would probably leave them way behind if ridden to the max. In my particular case, my mount happens to be one that was -- for almost a whole decade -- the fastest production bike on the face of the planet.

The big Ninja's supremacy ended when Suzuki came up with a (larger displacement) new speed king a few years ago, though Kawasaki fought back with a new model that may or may not have reclaimed the crown that's been Kawasaki's most of the time since the first years of the '70s. I don't ride it like road testers ride it, but it'll do the standing quarter mile in 10.52 seconds or less and hit 132 mph or so on the way out. It'll go from 0-60 in 2.69 seconds. Heck, it'll easily hit 60 mph (even 100 mph) in second gear, with six gears available for your riding pleasure. Its top speed is at least 180 but may be higher and my bike -- modified quite a bit and with its overall weight reduced -- might well hit the 200-mph mark, or close enough to it.

I've never had my bike's speed higher than an indicated 130 mph -- it cruises beautifully all day at 100-110 mph but, once you get much higher than that, things suddenly start to feel serious and tunnel vision and acute paranoia quickly sets in. It scared me that the thing was still rapidly accelerating when I hit 130 mph -- actually, I probably went over but the last place my eyes wanted to fixate was on my instrument panel (I was more concerned with animals, cars, mountains, etc, coming out of the desert from the sides of my narrowing visual tunnel). To be honest, speed itself does not especially thrill me, and theres that point at which it becomes a distinct negative. Acceleration , though -- yeah, that's always been the most exciting part of riding a bike, when properly applied.

Actually, taking off with extreme swiftness and then settling down to something closer to the speed limit is how I usually ride from stoplight to stoplight and more than once I've been roared past by some doofus in a car, often one of those little souped-up things that typically look pretty ridiculous and that I believe are called 'ricers' (typically driven by clones of one Marshall Mathers), who was apparently under the mistaken impression that I gave a f*** about his ability to ride through town at highly dangerous speeds with judgement and reactions impaired by testosterone and possibly by other subtances. I see the look of triumph sometimes, as well as less subtle indicators that he (it's always a he) believes us to be racing. It's entirely misplaced because I owned his bony ass on takeoff and if he wants to go faster than me once I settle down to suggestive-of-almost-quasi-legal speed then good luck to him and to anyone who might pull out in front of him. They'll never 'get' it: (a) I'm not racing and (b) I beat him, anyway, and he's doing the equivalent of dramtically spiking a touchdown after the game's over and the stadium is empty. Ride a motorcycle long and, even more than as a car driver, you'll come to believe that most drivers should not be on the road and that many are also basically idiots or cursed with reaction times that an anaesthetized amoeba would be proud of. You'd be right, too.

Anyway, the beast moves. And I don't need to run it anywhere near redline to pull ahead of pretty much anything on the road (a nice safety feature, actually). But smaller and less sporty bikes I had before, nowhere near as swift or powerful, also left cars far in their wake. It's a fact: motorcycles accelerate faster than cars and many of the past two decades or so, especially anything of or over midsized engine displacement, will also hit higher top speeds than most cars on the road today.

Okay, so let's look to see what cars we can find that equal this kind of acceleration performance. Hmmm. Very few, indeed. This site (http://www.cars.com/go/crp/buyingGuides/articles/2005sportsQuickest.jsp), that professes to round up the quickest cars on the market, only offers up one candidate that would theoretically equal or best my ZX-11 (remember, there're slightly faster bikes about now): the Saleen S7, whatever that is, with a 0-60 mph figure of 2.9 seconds and a price tag of $395000. The next nearest competition is the Lamborghini Murciélago, that achieves the same 60 mph in a snail-like 3.8 seconds at price of merely $281400. The Porsche 911? Bahh...way down at 4 seconds, with the Corvette and a couple of Ferraris at 4.2 seconds. Pull over into the slow lane, dudes.

The thing is, though, that I've never been challenged to a duel by a Lamborghini or such (though I've been stuck behind a couple in traffic jams on the Vegas Strip, recently). A recent overt and obnoxious challenge came from some moron driving a Hyundai Accent. I found performance data for the 2001 model and, as I suspected, the prognosis for the car's supremacy was not good: the Accent does the standing quarter mile in 15.1 seconds, hitting 94.4 mph at the end of it and giving me enough time to have a cup of tea and a couple of scones before I get back on my bike to pass it again, and it accelerates 0-60 in 10.9 seconds.

But MANY of the most obnoxious would-be speed demons seem to be in big trucks, like the big Fords and so on. Yeah, they're got powerful engines, but they also weigh a ton (literally) and are...well..trucks. Not really built for blinding speed, just as my Ninja isn't too good at hauling bags of cement. But there they go, a-whoopin' and a hollerin' as they rev that ole' baby and commence to deliver to me a velocitary bootie-whuppin'. Duh. The Ford F250 does 0-60 in 9.25 seconds, covering the quarter mile in 16.83 seconds and coming out of it at a respectable (dude, it's a truck, not a drag racer) 83 mph. My bike can easily hit 100 mph in six seconds, though that'd not be the most prudent strategy between stoplights in an urban environment...not much of a contest, really.

So let's consider some smaller bikes, less famed for sheer speed. The baby Ninja and the middle-kid Ninja, at 250cc and 500cc respectively, are pretty good examples. The little Ninja does 0-60 in 5.5 seconds, meaning that it -- and this is a small bike with a small engine -- is bested in acceleration only by the likes of Ferraris, Porsches, and so on. In other words, it's proof that just about all the cars actually on the road, the ones driven by most people, will be out-accelerated by all but the very smallest of motorcycles, scooters, and mopeds. The little bike loses a bit on the quarter mile, because acceleration isn't the whole story (it tops out at 115 mph), but its 15.5 seconds on that measure is not bad compared with the Accent, with its vastly larger engine, and it beats the F250's substantial mass. The Ninja 500 is also not going to give faster bikes (including the much sportier 600 Ninja, a very quick little race-bred beast) any competition but, by covering the quarter-mile in 12.73 seconds and going 0-60 in 3.76 seconds, it places above most of the sports cars on that link above and is roughly equivalent to the fastest Lamborghini listed (it'd undoubtedly lose in the long run, with a top speed of just 140 mph, but it'd possibly gain ground again in the twisties).

But it's not just car drivers who underestimate what a motorcycle is capable of. Last night I was raced -- well, they gave it a try, anyway, but I didn't fully engage -- by two idiots on shiny new Harley Davidson Sportsters. I use the word 'idiot' advisedly because, well, they were: rode like idiots, dressed like idiots, and wore the useless little plastic beanie like idiots. I'll assume that these were the larger (larger than mine, for that matter) 1200 cc model of late. If so, they're capable of a quarter-mile acceleration of 13.47 seconds, coming out at 94.9 mph. Those twin engines DO have a lot of grunt low down but it slips away higher up...regardless, my bike and the 500-cc mild-manner Ninja, less than half the displacement, both accelerate more expeditiously. Still, these relatively quick and nimble Hardly-Ablesons do pretty well considering the Soviet-pattern tractor engines that power them. I couldn't find any data on 0-60 acceleration, probably because it takes several days -- for one, it can take a while to root around at the roadside, looking for parts that have fallen off.



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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. I won't read all that at this time. However
I love COnway Twitty - don't you?
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. I'd post a serious answer, but you'd say
it's only make believe. :P
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RummyTheDummy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. What about the Smokey and the Bandit car?
Would that beat your bike? I know the answer. just kiddin.
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Depends if Burt Reynolds was at the wheel
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:36 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Or Paul Newman?
Fast dude.
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:38 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Not fast enough to outrun this guy
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:02 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. What we have here is a failure to
Um...what was I saying?
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:35 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Ha!
Trick answer!

Nope, on paper, but I don't ride my bike in search of sub-three-second 0-60 times and so on, so Burt might well have a shot at it.

:-)

At least he'd be cool, not like the hazardous idiots that (in their own imaginations) race me between stoplights.
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RummyTheDummy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:37 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. According to Sports Illustrated......
An IRL (open wheel race car like at the Indy 500) will go 0-60 in about 2.4 seconds.
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:01 AM
Response to Reply #7
12. The 1200-cc Kawasaki ZX-12R (successor to my model) does 0-60 in
2.3 seconds. :-)



The 1300-cc Suzuki Hayabusa (aka 'Eye Abuser,' in reference to its unique, aerodynamic styling) may shave it to as little as 2.2 seconds.



And, unlike those Indy cars, they can be seen in traffic. :P

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Kenneth ken Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:43 AM
Response to Original message
9. you're messing up my theory
I have a theory that they give an IQ test to prospective buyers of cafe-racer type motorcycles. If you score above 70, you're not allowed to buy the bike. :)

I was at a stop light on a side street, waiting to turn left onto a major street one early Saturday morning. Light turned green, so I started to go, then heard a cafe bike going well over 100 coming from my left. With my big slow car I would never have been able to accelerate across his path, so I stopped and let him go, even though he missed the red light by a good 3 or 4 seconds. Had I not, I've little doubt he would have either ridden about half-way through my car or gone off the road and half-way through a building or something.

0-60 in 2.69 seconds is pretty good, but how quick do those bikes go from 60-0?

I've had several instances of idiots on bikes; I do appreciate how fast they are, but I do question how sane the riders often are.

:hi:

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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:15 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. You're right
It's largely an American phenomenon. In other countries, motorcycles are seen as legitimate means of transportation. Sure, they can be wridden hard and fast in those countries, but the riders tend to be more serious abotu it and often it's their only means of transport. Here, they're too often considered toys. Most people have both a car and a motorcycle and break out the bike when it's time to ahve fun with the toy. That's a damned dangerous point of view.

There're basically two types of idiots on bikes here. One is the young dude who considers himself invulnerable and who rides half-naked on sport bikes that he cannot control (either that or he's got good control over the bike but none over his brain, like the 'stunters' who do their impressive tricks in traffic, the idiots). These types seem to be called 'squids' here these days. Then there're the middle-age-crisis contingent who bought the Harley (or, maybe, if they actually value substance over style, a Japanese pseud-harley cruiser) and all the accessories to go along with it but who have little to no experience on a bike and jump in at the deep end to their (and others') detriment. These are usually men but I've also seen women fall for the same marketing, including quite young women who obviously do not know even the basics of handling their chromed behemoths.

A LOT of motorcyclists in the US are dangers to themselves and others. Helps mess things up for the rest of us (you'll know us: for one thing, apart from the dwindling contingent of old-time bikers who aren't decked out in matching Harley-logo outfits with the price tags still affixed, we tend to do things like wear full leathers even in desert heat and we very often wear full-face helmets, the only kind worth a damn). Again, it's not the same in otehr countries. The US tends to foster some messed-up attitudes and the notion of motorcycles as purely 'recreational' vehicles is one. Consider how one of my more shallow close acquaintances not only can't understand why I have no car but criticizes my wearing full protective gear on every ride as not being 'cool.' To bolster her case, she cites examples of people she saw riding around in shorts and sneakers, indicating that I should follow her lead and conform to the herd. The herd is composed of f***wits.

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Kenneth ken Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:38 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. hey, I have family
in that mid-life (Harley) crisis group; though actually the BIL did ride when he was young. :) They mostly ride only with lots of other riders at the weekend, but they surely have helped HDs profit margin over the past few years, making sure they're "properly attired" at all times, whether riding or not. :eyes:

I lived in FL for a while, and often saw insane riders in shorts and t-shirts, but with good helmets, since FL has helmet laws. IN CO, they get to skip the helmets altogether, so often one sees riders clad in the oh-so-protective shorts and tees.

You touched on one of the main reasons I'll never own a bike. They kind of appeal to me when I'm sitting in traffic and it's really hot; the idea of riding around half-nekkid would seem much cooler, though of course it's insane when some driver who doesn't see you cuts you off and you have to lay the bike down, so I wouldn't do that; vs the heat of full leathers, which makes sense, but impedes the riding-around-half-nekkid appeal.

Besides, I'm sure I'd die on a bike given that I have never ridden, would be paranoid as hell for years and so would probably do something stupid and ensure my fate. :D

I much prefer the mystery of not knowing how I'll die. :)





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uncle ray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-11-05 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #14
26. you missed one important group
the guys who buy a $30,000+ "custom" bike, the fugly big tired raked and stretched things you see on tv. you see them putting around town, trying damn hard to look bad-ass while secretly scared shitless to wreck the damn thing.

my humble ride is a 67 triumph tr6, bored to 750cc. it couldn't touch a cafe racer or big harley, but it still hauls better than most things on 4 wheels, and besides, i built it from scratch myself! i don't think you've really lived till you hit the highway on a machine you put together yourself from a pile of ancient parts.
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FLSurfer Donating Member (350 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #9
20. I was unfortunate enough to see
exactly that happen last week. Good thing you stopped.
I was passed by a motorcycle that was going at least 100mph
and a few seconds later, 5 or 6 blocks up the road I saw headlights
go every which way.
Turns out, the motorcycle broadsided a Chevy Blazer. Nearly cut it in half. turned the Blazer over onto its passenger side door. I wouldn't think a motorcycle could do that type damage to an SUV.
The occupants of the Blazer were both taken to the Emergency room
and the Bike rider was of course, unfortunately, dead.
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Kenneth ken Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. ick
not something I would want to see. :hug:
A motorcycle at high speed isn't really that much different than a missile. The combination of speed and weight create an awful lot of kinetic energy by themselves, and if it hits an object, that energy gets transferred to the struck object.


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FLSurfer Donating Member (350 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-11-05 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Definetly not a pretty sight.
I know of what you speak, as I ride myself.
An old, worn out zx-7 racer, bored and stroked to 907cc,
safety wire everywhere, fast as ****, loud as %#@#.

I have come off a few times but luckily never struck the proverbial immovable object.
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3lefts Donating Member (103 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:51 AM
Response to Original message
10. No doubt a bike will smoke a car....
just don't blame a car crashing into that bike while the car makes a legal lane change and clips the bike(s) that always seem to be weaving in and out of traffic at high rates of speed along the highway. Donor cycle anyone?
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:29 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. I wouldn't blame the car
There's a time and a place for using a bike's ability to duck and bob. I can state with confidence that most car-bike accidents are likely to be the car driver's fault, but not all of them are and too many are the result of idiots having access to motorcycles at all, let alone to motorcycles with performance beyond the performance of their brains. Look at various internet fora and you'll see that a LOT of (invariably, again, American) neophyte riders or wannabe riders intend to learn how to ride or to have as their first bike soemthing like a Hayabusa or 1200-cc Ninja, the fastest bikes around. Bigger is better. How American is that? Idiocy, pure and simple, and there's evil afoot, too, in that some bike shop staff recommend such bikes to beginners purely because of the up-front profit potential. Sick. Sure, a bozo's a bozo on a 400-cc bike, too, but everything increases an order or bozocity when you plonk some beginner or a brain-dead thrillseeker on a liter-plus superbike.

Given that bikes perform more impressively than cars, wouldn't it make sense that they require more energy and presence (not to mention the alertness warranted by increased vulnerability) than does driving a car? Driving a car (not a race car, but a normal car on a normal road) is a far more passive experience than riding a bike. For one, the act of riding is physically far more taxing -- a car's four wheels keep the thing self-balanced but a bike always needs the rider to provide the right balance point so that its inherently unstable two-wheeled verticality doesn't suddenly go hiorizontal.

A good rider, though, will make a far better car driver than someone who's never ridden, all else being equal. A good motorcycle rider looks far ahead AS WELL AS right in front of them, constantly anticipating potential trouble and always assessing road conditions (lots of stuff that a car just rolls over will drop a bike). I know for sure it did it for me. Drivers tend to look not much further than their front bumper and are more often than not nowhere near as alert, again a function of the less active involvement in travel...eight hours in a car, with AC, tunes, and cupholders all accessible from a comfy seat and the wind and road surface barely a factor that enters your consciousness, is FAR different than eight hours spent in the seat of a motorcycle.
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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:52 AM
Response to Original message
11. Impressive!
My son received a Yamaha 80 dirtbike from Santa this past Christmas. When I was moving it from the barn to the house--well, I cranked it, gassed it, and then picked my ass up off of the pasture grass about two seconds later. I never expected that little bike to be able to haul--and, subsequently, dump--ass so quickly.

Your bike has how many ccs? You'd have a hard time talking me to get on back. :D
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:39 AM
Response to Reply #11
17. Those dirtbikes are REALLY peppy!
All their power is down low, and it really can freak you out when you twist that throttle. I assume they're mostly still two-strokes, too, which is not as good in some ways but has traditionally been the standard for offroad bikes because of said peppiness. Hope your bottom's recovered!

Mine's 1100 cc. It's quick and fast but is relatively civilized, especially for a Kawasaki (Hondas tend to be the most polished of bikes...Kawasakis have always been about pure power and in the past they kind of neglected little touches like brakes and so on). Always wanted me a Ninja -- actually, something about Kawsakis attracted me a decade before the first Ninja appeared and shot to stardom on the road and in Top Gun (shoot, maybe it was just the name, Ka-wa-saki) -- and, though I've loved my other bikes, I'm still happy to have finally got one. It's perfect for me because it's best suited to taller riders and it's more of a sport-tourer (excels in covering vast distances very quickly...not as nimble or quick on the twisties as smaller bikes) than the typical large-displacement Ninja. Basically a 'gentleman's sportbike,' the more refined speed-freak bike that people who lusted after the Ninjas of the mid-'80s get when they near 40...exactly my story!
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Maddy McCall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 04:49 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Ok...think 1991...
My ex-husband had a Katana(?). I rode ONE TIME with him, and I have sworn since that I will never sit my ass on the back of a cafe racer, ever again.

Does Katana ring a bell with you? It was a beautiful bike, but when we hit the place where the bridge abuttment joins the bridge, I thought we were going to go flying. It terrified me.
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ForrestGump Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 05:23 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. Yep, Katanas are still one of the lines that Suzuki has, as far as I know
I was quite taken with some of them in the mid-'80s but my heart definitely belonged to the Kawasaki GPz Ninja line.

Here's a 600-cc Katana from somewhere in the late '80s or early '90s:



Here's a stock version of my bike -- mine looks quite a bit different (customized by the original owner -- lots of blingbling):

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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 07:10 AM
Response to Original message
21. Nonsense.


That's Ron Fruchey's Grand National on it's way to another sub 9 second quarter mile (by the shoe polish, he's dialed in at 8.70). Of course, the bike has him at the top end, in the turns, etc.

I'm just kidding. My response is just a sad excuse to post a GN pic. You are dead to rights. I've seen beater bikes that, judging by how small their taillight gets as it pulls away from me, will beat 99% of the 4 wheeled vehicles out there. I'd love a bike, yet I value my life enough to keep me from buying one (Tampa isn't the place to own one).

What continues to shock me is, as you've stated, the morans that buy these. I've seen too many of these future organ donors of America pulling wheelies down a busy road. Dude, you've seen too many Vin Diesel movies. I do some sick shit on my mountain bike (in the woods at under 10 mph), but I don't have to worry about Ms. Crabtree pulling out in front of me in her Oldsmobile.

There's one other rule with these bikes: a girl on one of these, especially if she's the pilot, makes my mouth water.
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Rabrrrrrr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 07:13 AM
Response to Original message
22. My Pacer could SO kick your bike's ass
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SOteric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-10-05 03:30 PM
Response to Original message
24. While you're looking out for fast, squirrely little motocycles,
it pays to be aware that an 18 wheeler truck moving at 55 mph is not going to stop, even suddenly, in a space any smaller than the length of a football field. So if you're going to cut in front of him and then slam on your brakes, you're pretty much going to get run over by a semi.

This has been a public service announcement.


There's nothing to see here, move along.
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