So we know Bush is the anti-Christ. Who are the others?

[EstimatedProphet]

Cheney is of course Satan incarnate. I figure Rumsfled for the Pale Horseman, Rice for the Red Horsewoman, but who is Famine?

[KitchenWitch]

1. Karl Rove

[EstimatedProphet]

4. Actually I think Rove is the Whore of Babylon

[KitchenWitch]

6. I stand corrected - you are right!`

:hi:

[ZombieNixon]

2. Then Brownie must be pestilence.

[peekaloo]

3. Chertoff is famine.

or famished? :shrug:

[RevCheesehead]

5. Condi, of course.

[EstimatedProphet]

7. I thought that too at first but now I think Rice is War

She's doing so much FOR war, after all...

[RevCheesehead]

8. Then let's bestow her an honorary title..

"Condi of Troi" - or somethin' like that. :evilgrin:

[EstimatedProphet]

12. That's a good one

[KitchenWitch]

9. Can members of the press play?

I choose O'Reilly to be famine

[EstimatedProphet]

10. He'd make a good Famine

Famine is also known as Unfair Trade, or Unfair Labor, according to some interpretations.

[EstimatedProphet]

11. Alberto Gonzales would be a good Herod

[jmowreader]

13. Reagan is the Antichrist. Bush is the Horseman of Famine.

Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
--Revelation 13:18

Ronald = six letters
Wilson = six letters
Reagan = six letters

I keep hearing all this stuff about how Bush is the Antichrist because if you spell his last name Busche you can get 666, or if you stick the "Jr" behind his name you can get 666...no, that can't be right. Any Antichrist worth his salt would use a name you can get 666 out of without altering or manipulating it. Bush doesn't meet that test; Reagan does.

Besides, Reagan hooked up the Iranians, hooked up the Iraqis, hooked up Osama, gave Hezbollah instant street cred by presenting them with a fat juicy target called the Marine Barracks in Beirut...all Bush does is ignore his country's laws and invade oil-producing nations that threaten to sell oil for euros. On a ten-point scale of evil where Reagan is a ten, Bush is about a five and a half. (Okay, Bush destroyed this nation's economy for the benefit of his rich friends, which is kinda evil. Reagan did the same thing, so that spoils Bush's claim to unique rottenness on this one. Just because Bush fucked it up worse is no reason to give him special credit for doing it.)

Revelation 6:5-6 (introducing the Horseman of Famine) describes Bush to a tee...

6:5: And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand.

6:6: And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.

Think back a few years ago to the night before Bush invaded Iraq. He went on television to announce that he was doing it. He assured the United States that this was a necessary action to keep Saddam from using his evil weapons of mass destruction against us. Then he turned to the Iraqi people, and the first words out of his mouth were "don't destroy the oil wells."

Or, in Biblical grammar, "see thou hurt not the oil."

The Horseman of Conquest is Cheney; the Horseman of War is Rumsfeld. The Horseman of Death seems to be Poppy Bush.

[EstimatedProphet]

14. OK, but

The AntiChrist is generally held to be the White Rider. He represents false religion. I can't think of a better character than Bush-look how many people think he is God's messenger on Earth. Even Reagan didn't get that.

I wouldn't agree that Reagan was so much more evil than Bush either, not by a long shot.

Otherwise I can see your analysis.

[jmowreader]

15. By who is the White Rider held to be Antichrist?

I found this on newadvent.org:

Nearly all commentators find Antichrist mentioned in the Apocalypse, but they do not agree as to the particular chapter of the Book in which the mention occurs. Some point to the "beast" of 11:7, others to the "red dragon" of Chapter 12, others again to the beast "having seven heads and ten horns" of 13, sqq., while many scholars identify Antichrist with the beast which had "two horns, like a lamb" and spoke "as a dragon" (13:11, sqq.), or with the scarlet-coloured beast "having seven heads and ten horns" (17), or, finally, with Satan "loosed out of his prison," and seducing the nations (20:7, sqq.). A detailed discussion of the reasons for and against each of these opinions would be out of place here.

Notice that Antichrist, according to newadvent.org, comes into the Book of Revelation many chapters after the horsemen.

It looks like there's a hierarchy here:

Satan is at the top of the foodchain of evil, as God is in charge of all that is good. He hangs out in hell, as God hangs out in heaven. They can't leave their domains. (This puts the lie to the "God can do anything" meme--the one thing he cannot do is leave heaven.)

Antichrist: As Jesus was God in human form, Antichrist is Satan in human form. This requires that Antichrist be as evil as Satan himself--Bush is too fucking stupid to be that evil.

The Horsemen: These are Antichrist's disciples--or, more appropriately, henchmen--and given that the number seven is used repeatedly in Revelation I don't know why there aren't seven horsemen. But we've got four so we'll have to live with it. These guys have a limited sphere of influence.

Now let's look at Bush: they don't let him say anything that isn't written down and that he hasn't practiced. They don't let him do anything he hasn't rehearsed seven or eight times. Look at the shit he tried to pull in China, where he tried to run away from a press conference that was going badly for him through a locked door. If he speaks off-the-cuff or acts on the spur of the moment he always fucks it up. He is the most stage-managed president in history. The antichrist needs to be able to work completely independently, and he needs leadership skills. Bush can't do either. He doesn't have the skill set to be the antichrist.

Besides, doesn't he just look like a guy who's destined to work as an assistant all his life?

[EstimatedProphet]

18. This is from Wikipedia

White Horse

Opinions differ on whether the first horseman, riding the white horse, represents Christ, the Antichrist, or the False Prophet, but the general consensus of conservative biblical scholars is that he is the Antichrist. One argument against this horseman representing Christ is that each horseman is released due to the opening of a seal, and the seals represent God's curses upon the world, it is unlikely that the author would consider Christ's return as a curse. (However, it could be conceived as a curse by those who oppose Christ.) Moreover, interpreting this seal judgment as Christ's return is at variance with the unambiguous description of his return in Revelation 19:11-16.

Liberal Christian scholarship does not interpret this figure as either Christ or Antichrist. M. Eugene Boring's commentary on Revelation suggests that the image is drawn from the current events of the first century which the Christians in the Roman Empire would have recognized. In 62 AD the Parthians had beaten a Roman army in the Tigris valley and people throughout the empire viewed them with the same unrealistic dread as westerners in modern times had for the yellow peril. The Parthians were the only mounted archers of the 1st century and white horses were their mount of choice. The passage can thus be interpreted as 'conquest from without' without assigning any specific identity to the rider.

Now, personally, I don't believe that the Book of Revelations is meant to be prophesy. I believe it was a letter to the Christians in Rome to not give up hope.

[terrya]

16. Falwell or Robertson

[Ally McLesbian]

17. Mel Gibson

and to be fair, Jerry Springer on the Democratic side.