Ladies:Your reaction to the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Edition

[entanglement]

:popcorn:

[Nicole]

1. What swimsuit issue?

:hide:

[cyberpj]

2. - is to post this photo:

[entanglement]

3. ...

[LeftyMom]

4. I really couldn't care less

It does me no harm and I'd much rather focus on sexism in the workplace than a magazine full of well paid women in bathing suits if we're discussing problematic treatment of women in our society.

[Flaxbee]

5. well said, LeftyMom.

Men like to look at women, women like to look at men (though I think the visual aspect isnt' as strong for/important to women). No biggie. These models are well paid and know what they're doing.

Now, discrimination in the workplace, sex tourism involving children, other forms of domination and exploitation, etc. - that's something to be angry about.

[Divameow77]

6. I agree

It's a magazine for guys, the models are being paid well, and hey, if you got it flaunt it.
There are much bigger sexism issues to worry about.

[laheina]

26. You don't think that those two things are connected? nt

[LeftyMom]

29. Primarily by capitalism

Corporations sell photos of airbrushed women standing on midwinter beaches in skimpy swimsuits because people will buy them. They pay women less because they can, certainly they don't go out of thier way to pay men what they're worth, either.

I'm just saying focusing on minor shit doesn't win the major battles and it marginalizes feminism as being about stifling sexuality instead of beign about equal rights.

[laheina]

36. Stifling sexuality,

I've never heard it put that way before. Owning our own sexuality, without social stigma, might be a better way.

I've never allied myself with feminism, but a really good book on this topic is Naomi Wolfe's "The Beauty Myth: How Images of Beauty Are Used Against Women."

[tjdee]

7. I think it's gross, and I think it is a symptom of a larger problem.

I do agree with LeftyMom that hey, let's work on discrimination in the workplace, etc. But.

I think this issue is a symptom of the larger problem, and as such, it bothers me. Am I going to start a website advocating boycotting SI? Of course not. But I think it's interesting that in this day and age we still allow women to be treated like objects. Everyone likes sexy, but I don't know, I really think it goes beyond the pale with women. If a respected mainstream woman's magazine has an entire issue devoted to men's bare buttocks, then we can talk.

[LeftyMom]

10. See, that's why I can't complain

If there were a magazine devoted to men with nice shoulders (my current odd body part obsession) wearing no shirts, I'd buy a lifetime subscription. There isn't (that I know of, who knows with niche marketed stuff these days) but knowing that about myself I can't complain about men who want to look at breasts.

A certain amount of healthy attention to sexuality isn't harmful, IMO.

[tjdee]

14. Well sure, but your health magazine (or sports magazine or cooking mag)

wouldn't devote an entire issue to mens' shoulders. That's what so irritating, about this particular issue, to me. If a guy wants to order a nudie mag, cool. But the fact that this issue is in a legit sports magazine ...the fact that I hear about this issue on CNN as if they're talking about a new soda coming out...
when really what it comes down to is that straight men like breasts and will pay to see them any way they can. It's like bam, here are some more breasts and ass for all of you to look at, again, like you see in every movie, magazine, etc. And, by the way, this is what beautiful woman look like, in case all you women were wondering. This size, this color hair, etc.

I don't think there is a comparable "sexy man" anything. If there were, I may feel differently.

I dunno, I'm not being clear, and I'm all over the place. I think I need some pie. :silly:

[LeftyMom]

16. Don't get me wrong,

I think it's tacky as hell and marketed to men who are too chickenshit to just go buy a skin mag like they really want to. I think it's a damn shame how it's full of airbrushed, made up, boob jobbed women who don't look like any woman a guy will ever actually meet.

It's a shame really, if they wanted to focus on sex appeal but in a realistic and healthy way, why not just do shots of female athletes? :shrug:

[entanglement]

18. I'm sorry you feel so strongly about this

I apologize if you're offended, I didn't intend this thread to be serious

:spank: self

[LeftyMom]

20. Oh no, I'm not offended

I just tend to phrase things really strongly. I'm told I can be a bit overbearing at times.

My apologies for the misunderstanding.

[tjdee]

30. Yes, now that I'd be okay with.

I mean, how far removed from sports can you get, Heidi Klum for goodness sake, LOL!

[XemaSab]

41. Hear, hear

Looking at the height/weight stats of many of the athletes competing at the olympics made me feel better about myself.

5'6" and 140? Works for me! :D

[Hardrada]

42. What kind?

I am partial to pecan myself. I am an older chap who is getting to be as much interested in food as in sex. Actually when I was younger and stoned I think food actually obsessed me more. And, yes, I have to dust off the exercise bicycle.

[entanglement]

11. Hmmm, two points here

When you say 'allow women to be treated like objects',you portray the women in SI as essentially passive and lacking a say in the matter. I disagree with that, they are exercising their choice to appear in SI (and are getting paid good money for it , besides)

The other issue might just have to do with guys being more visual than women.

[tjdee]

12. Objectified women get paid the most!

Now, prostitutes with pimps don't get paid the most, LOL. But if you are a woman with "good" body parts, and you capitalize on those body parts, you get paid much more than if you have a good BRAIN.

How messed up is that?

There are various ins and outs of it, to be sure, and there are plenty of good looking men who have careers just because they're attractive.

:shrug:

[laheina]

27. And this fact makes it harder for women with brains

to be taken seriously.

[sendero]

24. Women are treated like objects..

... no more than men are - albeit men as objects with a different purpose.

People like looking at attractive people. Trying to make is a big political/social issue is absurd.

[rbnyc]

8. Well...

...I actually think the women are beautiful and I like looking at them. But I understand surrounding issues, and would like to see more types.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

9. I'm a lesbian and I don't mind admitting that I do find it kind of sexy.

[LynzM]

13. I think it's awful cookie-cutter....

But I agree, it's their choice, they're paid well... I just wish they weren't all size 4-8, curvy, white (or close to, in appearance) women. But that's what sells. I dunno. On one hand, I feel like it perpetuates an unreal stereotype that makes most women feel worse about themselves, and on the other hand, I don't feel like it's that big a deal. As with many things, it probably depends when you ask me :)

[entanglement]

23. I never really understood WHY such things make

women feel worse about themselves. I mean, I don't look at WWE wrestlers or Brad Pitt and feel bad about it (and neither do most of the guys I know)

[laheina]

28. That's a little like comparing apples to oranges.

It has to do with women's traditional role in society, as well as old stereotypes and attitudes that refuse to die. These lead to women making less in the work place, etc.

[LynzM]

32. I'm going to go with socialization on this one...

I think women are socialized to compete more physically in terms of appearance, and men in terms of 'prowess' or 'skill' or 'strength' or whatever you want to call it... hence the fact that more women feel bad and compare themselves to supermodels (or whomever) and more men play competitive, often violent sports. JMHO, of course :)

[Left Is Write]

33. Because women are constantly being fed the idea that beauty = worth.

In every magazine, commercial, television show...women and girls are bombarded with the message that their value is in their looks. That beautiful women get the advantages. That less attractive women have less value. On top of that, even the beautiful women pitched to us as the ideals we should strive for aren't even good enough: hence all the airbrushing and artificial retouching of photos. If THOSE women aren't good enough the way they are, what hope does the average woman have?

Popular culture in this society doesn't promote the idea that our worth is in who we are but rather what we look like. It's so deeply ingrained into so many of us that we can't disentangle ourselves from the idea emotionally even when we want to intellectually.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

38. It's not just in magazines...

I've been thin (anorexic) and I've been fat (obese) and I had more workplace respect when I weighed less than 100 pounds than I did at 250.

[Left Is Write]

31. I can guarantee...

those models aren't size 4-8.

[LeftyMom]

34. Definitely not.

I'm a 6 and they make me look really fat by comparison.

[LynzM]

35. Well, ok, whatever size they *are*

:) I don't mean that to sound bitchy! Just that they all look SO much the same, yk? Is there really only one look that men find sexy? (obvious 'no', just sayin') I guess they are playing to a particular crowd, and that's what does it...

[friesianrider]

15. Most of the girls are gorgeous...

Except for a few who just don't do it for me (yes, I am a straight girl). Doesn't bother me at all - they're adults, and I can appreciate beautiful women the same as beautiful men.

[cfield]

17. It's hot!!!

And, I wish I looked like that.

[Ellen Forradalom]

37. Christy Brinkley in 1981 was very hot

And I wish I looked like that :-)

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

19. Harmless entertainment...Doesn't bother me in the least. nt

[Nikia]

21. What I don't like about it and didn't understand as a child

Is that Sports Illustrated is a sports magazine. Although they focus mostly on men's professional sports, women are also athletes and there are some sports stories involving women's sports. By having an issue devoted to women in bikini's but not to women's sports, they seem to be saying that the women in bikini's are more important than female athletes. Some men already see female athletes primarily in terms of their bodies. Having an issue devoted to female bodies seems to help reinforce this train of thinking.

[entanglement]

22. The swimsuit issue is separate and optional

I don't think they claim it's a 'sports magazine'(the swimsuit edition, that is), they just use the name 'Sports Illustrated'

[Yavin4]

25. Ah Yes, Nothing Better Than Sanctimony

The usual commments, "SI is objectifying women". "Women are not as visual as men". "No magazines for women." Blah, blah, blah.

First, there are plenty of mags that show half naked men and fully naked men. Go to the Men's Fitness section or Playgirl.

Second, women are every bit as visual as men are. EVERY BIT. A guy that looks like George Clooney or Brad Pitt has a much, much easier time with women than a guy who looks like Emo Phillips.

As for SI, heck, today there's sooo much soft core and hard core porn around, that a swimsuit issue doesn't really even get men going.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

49. You nailed it.

[mitchum]

39. "Pornography for Cowards"

I'm a grown man, and can buy the real thing
Why in the hell would I buy that?
And yes, I do realize the irony of using "the real thing" in reference to pornography.

[AlienGirl]

40. "If I'd been born beautiful I could afford health care and maybe even...

...buy a house someday, or make enough money to retire when I'm old."

Tucker

[leftofthedial]

46. but you were born beautiful

[Hardrada]

43. It is sexual fascism!

As a man who is jumping unwisely in here and a hetero too, it just occurred to me that there are a lot of gays and lesbians in sports and why can't they have a special issue too? Inquiring minds want to know.

[leftofthedial]

44. I am tired of the MAN keeping us DOWN!

filthy mysoginistic sexist men looking at those awful pictures of those horrid scantily clad freakishly beautiful half naked gorgeous impossibly thin and buxom nubile soaking wet supermodels

BAD! BAD!

:spank: :spank: :spank: :spank: :spank: :spank:
:patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot: :patriot:

[LaurenG]

45. I think the girls are beautiful

I don't look like that in or out of a swimsuit, I don't have to. It's not my job but it is theirs so they had better look good (they are supposed to be eye candy). The way I look at it is; my job is to love people for who they are not how they look. In the scheme of things it's no big deal. I'm pretty sure that those who buy the mag aren't going to be asking to have one more look at the nekkid girls before their last breath, I'm sure they'll be asking to see the real loves in their lives. Men are visual, stuff like that gives them a happy heart or at least a happy something even if momentarily.

:loveya:

[Mojambo]

47. I work at a magazine stand

And I'm already tired of the morally uppity types turning the covers over in an effort to hide the boobies.

I really got into it with some lady today. It's gonna be a rough next few weeks.

[lakemonster11]

48. I don't mind that it exists,

but I hate the fact that it's considered an issue of Sports Illustrated. I mean, pictures of models in swimsuits have nothing to do with sports. If guys want a pin-up magazine, they should just go buy one. If Sports Illustrated is going to have a swimsuit issue (which makes no sense to begin with :eyes:), they should have photos that cater to both genders.

I feel the same way about cheerleaders/dance teams at sporting events. What do half-naked women jiggling, gyrating, and bouncing around have to do with football or basketball? If guys want to see that, they should go to a strip club (or just watch MTV). If they're going to have women dancing around in skimpy clothes, they should have male cheerleaders, too. And those cheerleaders should be equally chosen for how hot they look in their underwear and should be wearing equally-revealing clothing.

Now this is the point in my argument where my brother always looks disgusted and says that that would never happen because men wouldn't like that. Well, guess what? Maybe women don't like the way things are now. I like basketball and football a lot, but I don't enjoy going to the games like I do with baseball, and it has everything to do with the anti-woman atmosphere the teams promote by having sexist entertainments at the games. I just don't feel welcome.

I don't have a problem with pin-up magazines or dancing girls, I just think that they should be separate from sports, which are community events during which both sexes should feel comfortable.

(end of rant...as a female sports fan, this is just something I feel strongly about)