Thinking of taking the plunge: Can I start a family AND do PhD work...

[Writer]

without losing my sanity? I'm thinking of applying for the Fall of 07... time to have one at least with initial nursing/bonding. But am I being realistic?

[Xithras]

1. NO!

Take this from a college professor AND a parent of three. I have seen MANY students try, and it NEVER works. My own wife had our second child while she was still in school, and the stress was so great that she ended up taking a two year break. The first year of a child's life typically consumes the mother, and in every single case where I've seen a woman try this, she ends up taking time off from school. Far too often, they never come back (I'd say that maybe half come back and eventually finish...the other half just live with their masters).

You're looking at what, four years for a PhD program? Finish that first, THEN have the kid.

[Writer]

3. Wow.

I'm glad I asked.

[cobalt1999]

2. for comparison

I used to be an avid golfer. I played 2-3 times a week. 2 children later and I've played 7 times in the past 11 years. Now, I didn't suddenly stop loving to play, this wasn't a conscious decision, I am still trying just as hard to get a couple of hours to go.

No, you are not being realistic.

[Writer]

4. I understand.

Being a woman today is horrible. My head and my womb don't get along. :(

Thanks for the input, though. :)

[jobycom]

5. My daughter killed my PhD.

Not that I'd say it that way to her. My wife had her while I was working on my MA, and I took care of her, worked part time, did housework, and worked on the MA. Not too hard for the first nine months. Afterwards it got tougher, until finally I couldn't handle all of it. You can drop out of school, you can't drop your kid.

I've known a few women who have done it, though. It's very tough. They were all single moms, and I think that helped. My wife was as much a drain on me as my daughter. And spouses--they say they will help, but they won't!

[politicat]

6. My sister says yes, with reservations....

She says she can do two of the four things on her plate: raise her son, go to school, work and restore a house. She's doing 1 & 2, and avoiding 3 and getting a little bit of 4 done. (My BIL wanted a 1920s fixer upper, then he promptly got put on travel, and has been home less than a month in the last 18. Of course, my sister was far more willing to take a newer, smaller, more efficient house, but...)

So I'd be looking at what else you have on your plate: do you live in a house that always needs something? Got laundry machines? Got a trustworthy caretaker who won't bleed you dry? Do you have to work, too?

I did grad school plus working plus freelance, but I was young and didn't need to sleep. I'd never have tried it with a kid, so it's a good thing I don't have 'em.

[Midlodemocrat]

7. I got my PhD prior to having children.

I was a practicing clinical psychologist, but the hours were not conducive to raising my children and that was my first priority.

I don't really have advice regarding do the two at the same time. I didn't have a huge problem getting my PhD, (but did have a major time defending my dissertation :eyes:) so I can't give you any advice in that arena.

Good luck in whatever you choose.

[Writer]

18. How old were you when you finished your PhD? n/t

[Midlodemocrat]

20. 28

[Writer]

27. I'm 31. I wish I were 28, or the decision would be a bit easier...

to make.

[pitohui]

8. it doesn't sound very realistic

also keep in mind that you are not guaranteed to have a nice tractable easy to control baby

any plan that is predicted on the perfect behavior of someone you've never met and can't control is a very, very, very bad plan

there are the babies who are autistic, babies who have colic, babies w. the chronic ear infections ... a lot of babies for whatever reason spend the first three years of their life pretty much constantly screaming -- you don't just place your order and magically get the perfect baby, plenty of nice people get perfectly shitty babies, it's sort of what babies do until they've been socialized for several years

nursing/bonding? what a joke! you may even find out, as many women do, that you CAN'T nurse

if you want the PhD go after the PhD, but to deliberately go after a baby at the same time tells me one of two things -- you don't really want the PhD but feel you need an acceptable "excuse" for failing OR you have only a fantasy image of what a baby really is and you are not ready to be a mother at this time

in either case my answer is nooooooo, what a terrible idea!

sorry, but you did ask...and that is what i think

honestly, if you want the PhD get it, if you don't don't -- but don't set up a baby to be yet another child who has to hear about "all the things i could have done if not for you"

[TrogL]

19. easy to control baby?

Control? You've got to be kidding. Placate? Maybe.

[pitohui]

33. re read my post again, trogl -- it zipped over your head :-)

i do not believe she will be able to control baby

[nosillies]

32. This is such a good point. You'll never know the temperament of

your future baby.

My friend has a child so sweet and quiet that she could easily get around to curing cancer and creating world peace while taking care of him and cooking dinner, if she felt like it.

My child is so high maintenance that many days he had me in a full nervous breakdown by 9:00 AM. The older he gets, the more manageable (although that's relative!) he becomes.

I say wait to see what your child's needs are before committing yourself.

[pitohui]

34. i myself screamed nonstop for pretty much the first 5 yrs

then i had an extended run w. scarlet fever

i pity my poor mother

[liontamer]

9. it depends on how good your support system is

I know lots who've done it. You'll probably be insanely busy, but it's not undoable if you don't have unrealistic expectations.

[Bill McBlueState]

22. that's very true

Several of the women grad students in my department have had babies, but they all come from cultures where the grandmother will move in and take care of the baby while the mother is in class or doing research. That makes it much easier.

[petronius]

10. I have a couple of friends who swear grad school was the perfect time

However, they all had husbands who were faculty of fellow grad students, so there was a lot of flexibility in each parent's schedules...

[StellaBlue]

12. a former prof gave me this advice when I was talking with her

about getting a PhD

Honestly, I would be more concerned with employability than anything else.

[Arkansas Granny]

11. My advice would be to get your PhD first and then think about

starting a family. It would be very hard to do both at the same time without one or the other suffering for it. You owe it to yourself, your career and your baby to concentrate on one at a time.

[barb162]

14. That is terrific advice.

Running yourself ragged is not the way.

[LSK]

13. no you cant

What is the hurry?

[Viking12]

15. Been there done that. Wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

Keep your sanity, protect your relationship, do one at a time. We had our first the second year of my program, our second shortly after the third year. Things eventually worked out, but it took six years to finish my dissertation with a great deal of stress in the meantime.

[gkdmaths]

16. Im so glad you asked this question

I'll be starting an MD/PhD program in 2007 and only recently have I begun to contemplate the demise of my relationship, even without children. Many of my former faculty would tell horror stories of trying to survive a rigorous graduate program while maintaining established relationships to no avail.

Perhaps Im a dick, but it seems to me like my relationship comes second to my progress as a scientist and as a person.

Im trying to develop a strategy for overcoming this, and I'll let you know how it works in about 10 years (OMG that is a long time) and Im spending so much time perfecting my flamenco technique anyway.

Only in hindsight do I realize that I should have waited to commit to a perfect parnter until the last semester or so of my clinicals.

[Writer]

17. Actually my husband was instrumental to helping me complete my MA...

he wants me to do a PhD. He thinks there truly is no other place for me at the moment. But we both want kids. I suppose he thinks he can be a catch-all for four or more years. I think he's also being unrealistic.

[Gormy Cuss]

21. I have a friend who did that (with twins).

She didn't have the twins until her coursework was done and she had a nanny come in two days a week when they were infants, and enrolled them in daycare part time when they were 18 months old. She defended her dis when the twins were 3 as I recall. I have another friend who had one child during the last term of her coursework and her second child when she was defending. Again, nanny or au pair help.

I must say that both these women were on the extreme side of self discipline and focus. One of them had a spouse who was established in his career, the other's spouse was not.

I also have friends who bagged the PhD once they had a baby.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

23. I would NOT think so.

Oh my, you'd have to be fucking insane in the first place. Why would anyone WANT to?

:wow:

:crazy:

[Orangepeel]

24. it depends on what do you want to do with your doctorate

it will be easier to have a baby in grad school than it will be to have a baby as an assistant professor.

[GalleryGod]

25. In a word........

NOPE.:shrug:

[JackDragna]

26. Are you crazy?

As a former grad student, you will soon find out being in a PhD program is incompatible with the following:

1. Sleep
2. Eating something that doesn't come out of a drive-through window or package
3. Fun of any kind
4. Combing your hair
5. Bathing (learn to stand outside on rainy days while reading journal articles)
6. Mailing things. Learn to attach messages to trained pigeons that will light at your office window as you work.
7. Driving. Live in a cardboard box near where you do your work, otherwise your major professor will think you're slacking.

I hope this helps.

[Burma Jones]

28. It Depends

Your Dissertation Topic, your Advisor and your area of expertise will all determine whether you have the time.

[naturalselection]

29. I guess I will be one of the few that says

it is possible. My wife did it. She has a Ph.D. in Biology.
She did her field work before/during the pregnancy (in South TX no less, looking for ocelots, an endangered cat) and collected all her data during that time.

She then had our son and took one spring semester off. Then she would work around my schedule (mostly evenings) while I was home. She did breastfeed for the semester, then pumped so while she was working in the evenings I would feed our son.

For our schedule it worked out great! And she is now a professor.

[Writer]

36. Well this IS something to consider...

mine would be in communication. It doesn't require field work, but perhaps a lot of library research/interviews. Not sure what else. My husband works full time, however, and I wonder if it would be too much on his back. Was it for you?

[NewWaveChick1981]

30. In my career in college/university financial aid, I have counseled

a lot of people on a lot of issues, not just financial aid. The people who had the roughest personal problems were usually the doctoral candidates who were trying to pursue their studies and a family at the same time. While it is definitely your choice, and all I did with the candidates was offer advice, I'd reconsider. I saw too many good people have nervous breakdowns over the whole thing because they took on too much at one time.

I am concerned for your well-being. Perhaps it would be better to wait if you can. :hug:

[LaraMN]

31. Can you be the kind of parent your child deserves, while you

are that necessarily embroiled in your studies?:shrug:

No one wants to come up short as a student, due to being overextended; but shortchanging your children... that would be the stuff lifelong regrets are made of...

[Writer]

35. Lara... that's what I told my husband last night when we were talking...

about this. Would it be fair to a child? If I only had a job...