This evening: question about social etiquette... your opinion requested

[crim son]

I'm not sure what to do with this. When I go out on Friday nights I often run into a particular woman who I'll call Joan. Joan is always alone. The last three weekends I've gone out, she has joined me and my friends at the bar/table wherever we are, which is fine. As the evening wears on, Joan follows us wherever we go, or better said, she hops in the car and accompanies us, because she has no wheels. All well and good. However! Joan comes with no money whatsoever. She cannot pay for cover or drinks, and if it cost ten cents to use the loo, I'd have to give it to her or she'd be forced to pee outside. You get the picture. So, despite my recent poverty, I have been paying for her drinks while another friend has paid her cover when necessary. To top it off, Joan just really dislikes other women and spends much of the night criticizing every one that catches her eyes. It's a little sad. SO, this weekend I decided to go somewhere where we mayn't meet her, because I've got fifteen bucks total and my friend has very little more and we really need a break from the negativity. Alas, she just called and left a message on my machine (got my number?? how??) because she wants a ride to the bar where we usually meet. I JUST DON'T WANNA? Is this bad? I'm feeling guilty! What should I do? Suggestions?

On edit: WOW, a consensus!

2nd Edit: THANKS. I know what to do. Now I'm going to get dressed and get the heck out of here. Have an excellent night -L

[matcom]

1. don't call her back - go to a different bar

you didn't get the message until LATE tonight (if she asks)

[crim son]

9. I'm afraid I might meet up with her. If I do, I will tell her what

you suggest. Thanks.

[MrCoffee]

12. I'm confused...why do you owe her an explanation?

did you invite her out? did you give her your phone number? did you make plans to meet?

so why again do you have to explain anything to her except that she's taking complete advantage of you and your friends' generosity, and that it's no longer acceptable?

[crim son]

14. You're absolutely right, of course.

I should know that.

[MrCoffee]

sorry, i don't mean to sound harsh, but your name is crim son,

not door mat.

[crim son]

17. Actually, my name's Lisa

and I've been doing the doormat thing a lot for many years. But I'm making changes!

[MrCoffee]

23. A pleasure to meet you, Lisa...now,

go out with your actual friends tonight, have a great time, and don't give this moocher a second thought.

:hi:

[crim son]

25. Okay,

good MrCoffee. I will do exactly that! Good night. :hug:

edited for higging instead of hugging.

[Gormy Cuss]

2. Ignore her.

Don't reply. If she shows up where you and your friend are, don't buy her drinks. If you don't mind giving her a ride home, do it. Just don't lay out any cash for her.

[crim son]

10. It's a plan! n/t

[MrCoffee]

3. miss free ride can mooch off someone else for the evening. n/t

[crim son]

11. That's Ms. Free Mooch to you, MrCoffee.

No, you're right. I'm persuaded. :)

[Book Lover]

4. You have no reason to feel guilty, but she is doing a good job of

loading it onto your back, eh? You need to find a way of being comfortable with calling her back and saying, "Hi Joan, it's crim son. Gee, how'd you get this number? I never give it out, and those I do give it to are told not to distribute it. Anyway, I've got plans this weekend, so thanks for your offer to hang out, but it's just not in the cards. Bye." When she stalks you two to wherever you go, you will also have to find a comfortable way to say, "Gee, Joan, I just don't have it," when she asks you for money to pay for drinks.

She is not owed any explanations. Do not give her any. She is not owed happiness from you. Do not feel guilty because you do not want to give her something to which she is not entitled; or if you do feel guilty anyway, please do not act on it in a way that means Joan gets her way.

Good luck.

[crim son]

13. I'll need it. It sounds good, what you say.

And I can say it, with a couple of drinks under my belt.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

5. Don't call her back & go to a different bar.

No need to feel guilty.

[crim son]

15. Right now that's what I plan on doing.

No, it's what I'm going to do! Nobody here seems to think otherwise and you're a compassionate bunch. :rofl:

[grace0418]

6. People like that will take whatever you give and never do anything

in return. Go somewhere else tonight if you must but don't let her drive you away from your usual place. All you have to do is say "Sorry, Joan, I only have enough cash for me. Besides, you've rung up quite a tab, how about buying a round for all of us sometime?"

You have to be blunt. People that clueless never get subtlety.

[crim son]

16. You know, she always says she'll pay me back, but I begin

to realize that's malarky.

[caty]

7. Ditto on all the above advice.

It's very uncomfortable to keep running into someone like that.

[crim son]

18. True.

The thing is, she's a fixture at my favorite drinking spot. The more reason to cut her off now rather than later. Thanks.

[caty]

36. Sometimes it's best to be honest, even if it hurts

her feelings. Tell her you just can't afford to keep doing this. I'm betting it won't be the first time someone has told her that.

[Truthiness Inspector]

38. If she's a fixture

she probably is known to do this mooch thing. If you are a regular and know the bartender(s), and they recognize the situation you could always just ask him/her to say, "Joan, is this round on you?" next time an order is put in.

Don't leave your favorite spot because of a mooch. Mooches like that are unwelcome in bars, and the bartenders and owners rely on paying customers and would be miffed to know the mooch was driving away business, in this case you and your friends.

[Maine-ah]

8. my guess is that this is how this woman works.

you are most likely not the only people she has done this too. She most likely gets "dumped" and just moves on to the next group of people who are willing to put up with it, until it happens again. I say, be straight forward and tell her the truth.

[crim son]

19. I'm going to, Maine-ah.

Even if it weren't a money issue, she tends to suck all the fun out of a night...

[judaspriestess]

20. Tell her

its out of your way or your on a tight schedule. Also tell her, you are limited on funds and you cannot pay for her anymore. Tell her your sorry for her situation but thats the way it is. As rude as she is, if someone doesn't tell her then she's going to keep leeching off of you cause thats what leeches do, they have no conscience.

I remember those days, what me and my friend would do is buy alcohol and keep it in the car and run outside to drink it. We would nurse the one inside. It was the cheap way to have a good time

[crim son]

24. I remember those days too!

The parties involved in this juvenile scenario are in their forties! Otherwise I'd bring a flask and sip from it in the ladies' room. Hey, not a bad idea...

[ScreamingMeemie]

21. "While I have enjoyed our time as acquaintances I, myself, am

on limited funds and cannot always see to your good time...I'm really sorry." *click*

[crim son]

26. OOOH you're harsh.

But I'm going to have to do it, and probably in person. yay!

[ScreamingMeemie]

29. Easier for me to tell others what to say than to say it myself!

:hug: May the force be with you!

[crim son]

33. I don't know about the Force, but his cousin, Farce,

rarely leaves my side.

I bet you're really tough IRL! I can see it in your eyes, lol.

[ScreamingMeemie]

35. Heheehe...

Well... I was one bad assed Mama with my daughter's bus driver today. She's a bitch who is constantly lording her "bus driver powers" over the kids and gave WannaB a dentention for...get this...singing today. :grr:

[crim son]

44. Bus drivers come in two varieties:

wonderful, fun and child-oriented; and angry, backward and strange. Most seem to fall into the latter category. What an idiot. I'm sorry WannaB has to deal with her. Grrrrr.

[ScreamingMeemie]

46. It's very sad because the bus driver they had before was awesome.

When she was a freshman he drove them all to Homecoming...even dressing up like a chauffer and decorating the bus. The "head bus driver" (there are two of them for North and South runs) didn't like that the kids really liked him so she fired him and hired a woman who would do exactly what she asked her to do.

[Broken_Hero]

22. No, don't feel guilty...

I have had more than my fair share of "fair weather friends" like this in my life. It usually takes a few times for me to realize I'm becoming "petersond, the friendly doormat." You shouldn't feel guilty at all...all of my friends, we buy stuff for one another all the time...sometimes, I'm short, and my buds buy me drinks, but when I got the $ I'm pretty free with it when it comes to going out and getting the drink/pary on...:) Its give and take....and it sounds like your "Joan" is doing all the taking...and I expect to hear guilt trips accusations next from her, when you start leaving her out of the party loop.

[crim son]

28. That's the way I do it with my friends too.

I guess this woman isn't really a friend because there has been no reciprocity whatsoever.

[Broken_Hero]

31. Yep, thats my take also...

a friend wouldn't be doing that....:)

[Haole Girl]

27. Do not feel guilty

I didn't read the other posts yet, and I'll quickly edit this if I am wrong, but nobody likes a moocher! There is a reason she's always alone. If she can't afford to go out, then she shouldn't...period.

[crim son]

30. So far, everybody agrees with you.

Which is nice :)

[Haole Girl]

32. I noticed that...

...it's great when we're not the only ones, eh? ;-) :hi:

[crim son]

34. Yep, we're all a bunch

of tightwad assholes! :rofl:

[OllieLotte]

37. You have a heart of gold and people like you are priceless.

There are some people in this world who don't deserve a friend like you. Put this woman behind you and move on. Might just as well spend time and money with people that really appreciate you. Good luck.

[crim son]

43. That is so very dear of you to say.

Thank you. :hug:

[CBHagman]

39. It's amazing how this woman operates and gets away with it.

What stopped me cold was your mentioning the fact that she puts down other people. And yet she's obviously very good at getting things out of them. There's more than one "Joan" in the world, and it's remarkable how people get guilt-tripped into taking care of them.

Good luck and have fun!

[mark414]

40. DO call her, and tell her what's what

[ruiner4u]

41. I have a question of eti-quette

Stop him, hes pissing on the 'edge! <-name that obscure movie from an obscure quote

[crim son]

42. I'm terrible at movies.

You tell me.

[begin_within]

45. Joan is a freeloader and she will never change. Get rid of her somehow.

[crim son]

47. We are rid of her. It was sort of awful.

We arrived late, hoping to miss her but instead she passed us going out. She was clearly drunk and hanging onto the arm of a man I didn't recognize. And she gave us a terrible look, just dreadful & pissed off, but said nothing. So it's been settled: Joan won't be joining us any more. Of course I feel like crap, but relieved too.

[begin_within]

49. It's for the better for you. She'll move on to her next target and forget

all about you guys.

[crim son]

50. Whereas I will never now forget

the calm and complacent look on that grey tabby's face. He looks like he's about to give me a solid piece of advice, or wants to help me with my investments or something. Cute!

[Dangerously Amused]

52. It's settled? Hah. Don't count on it, dearie.

Joan will be back just as soon as she sobers up after Mr. One Night Stand dumps her.



Couple of things to think about:


She rips on other women behind their back? Then I'm gonna guess she ripped on you and your friends before you started buying her stuff, and she'll rip on you again when you stop. Yeah, no need to continue that relationship.


How did she get by before you and your friends became responsible for her entertainment? She found a way then, she will again. You've been good to her, remember that. It's somebody else's turn now.


If you have a hard time being blunt the next time you encounter her, maybe try: "I'm sorry Joan, but I've had to rebudget and I have less spending money on the weekends now. Can we take turns buying each other drinks?" If she says she can't afford it, I'd go with, "Oh. Okay, well... what can you afford?" She will get the message that her free ride is over. And no matter what she says she can or can't afford, the response is, "Oh shoot. I don't think my budget can cover that. I'm sorry. Do you want to just sit and have a water with us?" She will for a little while, to save face. Then when the wait staff comes back to take drink orders it's (politely), "Joan? Another water?" Or if you go up to the bar, "Joan, can I get you another water while I'm up?" After a few hours of sitting there drinking water, she'll wander off and make some new friends.

[crim son]

53. "Joan, can I get you another water?"

:rofl:

I bet you're right about her snarking about me behind my back. I never thought about it before!

[Withywindle]

48. I'm sorry your generosity got taken advantage of

But she's the demon from Etiquette Hell, not you.

[I Have A Dream]

51. Nobody else is going to take care of you so you need to take care...

of yourself. I'm not saying be rude to her, but she's really taking advantage of all of you. If she asks, explain it to her in simple terms. (After all, she did ask.)

(On edit: I just read what happened last night. At least it's over.)