This is just wrong (rant)

[reyd reid reed]

#2 son stopped by his job last night to pick up the jacket that he'd left there on Sunday (the boy loses an average of two jackets a year, leaving them wherever...and I'd just bought this jacket for him on Friday so it was brand-new and, smart young man that he is, he realized that he'd never, EVER hear the end of it if he lost it two days later. It would take on mythic proportions, along the lines of the 'Tootsie Roll Incident' which will haunt him until the day he dies. Or I die. Nah...he dies. I'll make sure that enough people are aware of the Tootsie Roll Incident for it to live longer than I do). When he walked in, another employee says, "You should probably check your schedule, but brace yourself." So he does.

He's scheduled to work this coming weekend and then, after Sunday, they'd written "Terminated".

The boy has never missed a shift, never called in sick, he's altered plans to come in when he wasn't scheduled because someone else was sick and needed to go home or couldn't make it in. He's gotten raises and commendations and he hasn't gotten in trouble or written up. He had NO CLUE that there was a problem.

And, rather than talk to him, they POSTED IT ON THE SCHEDULE.

What the FUCK???

The kid was crushed...he came home so humiliated and upset and hurt and confused. And this is a good kid. He follows the rules, does what he's supposed to do and doesn't act out. He's calm and level-headed (most of the time -- he *is* 17) and responsible.

I swear, I want to go down there and blow sky-high. But I know that'll just make it worse and embarrass him. Still...

:nuke::mad::nuke::mad::nuke:

[petronius]

1. This may be a dumb question, but is he sure the boss wrote it, and not

some prank-playing employee?

[reyd reid reed]

3. That's what I asked him...

told him not to make any assumptions....yet. He seems to feel that it was the assistant manager, though. He's going to make a call today and find out what's going on, though.

[Bassic]

25. Keep us posted on their reasoning,

because as you describe it, that just seems wrong.

[reyd reid reed]

29. I really am hoping

that it's nothing...that maybe they've transferred him to another store or that it was someone's sick idea of a joke.

I'll let you know as soon as I know.

[Bassic]

33. In the meantime

Here's hoping all is well.

[reyd reid reed]

34. Thank you.

:hug:

[Bassic]

46. Self delete

[Whoa_Nelly]

2. He has a right to know the "WHY"

Damn! You are right, RRR! This is SO wrong! :grr:

[reyd reid reed]

5. He does have that right...

and, if he has done something so egregious that they're going to terminate him for it, he should be terminated face-to-face and NOT HAVE IT POSTED ON THE BULLETIN BOARD.

There's something called 'professionalism'.

I'm just FUMING here.

Grrrrrrrrr.....

[skygazer]

4. Did he speak to anyone about it?

Find out why? I would advise him to speak privately with his superior and find out 1. why he's been terminated and 2. why they did not simply call him in and inform him. And I would let him take care of it - I know the first reaction is to take it on yourself but he's a big boy now.

That sucks though. Very cold.

[Whoa_Nelly]

6. Also, what's wrong with this is the public posting

Seems that in itself is wrong, in that it shows discrimination.

[skygazer]

9. If that's standard procedure, it's not discrimination

At my job, which is union, employees are sometimes transferred with almost no notice and management doesn't have to inform them in any other way than posting it on the schedule. That seems incredibly cold and rotten to me but since it applies to everyone, it's not considered discriminatory. However, I've never seen anyone terminated that way. Just basic professionalism and common courtesy would dictate that you'd deliver news like that personally.

[reyd reid reed]

10. What is shows is

1. Unprofessionalism.
2. Disrespect.
3. Tackiness.
4. Stupidity.
5. Discrimination (he's the only male that works there...and they've been giving him shit for the past few months and he's felt that they wanted to get him out of there. They joke about how cool it would be to have an 'all girl' store)

I could go on and on. What it boils down to is that it's just Wrong.

[Whoa_Nelly]

16. If it does turn out it's about gender discrimination

They are in deep trouble.

http://research.lawyers.com/Colorado/Employment-Law-in-Colorado.html

and

http://employment.findlaw.com/employment/employment-employee-job-loss/employment-employee-wrongful-termination.html

[idgiehkt]

44. I think he should get a camera

go down there, take a picture of it and make sure the district manager gets a copy of it. If it's not company policy maybe someone will get chewed out for it.

edit: wow, I am cracking up...the federal laws about gender discrimination and creating a hostile work environment apply to every one...they don't apply to just females, at least that is not how they are worded. It sounds like these folks have broken the law and you need to have him sit down and have him write everything out about the comments they have made so you have documentation. I know what I would be tempted to do is go down there and wave that documentation in the district manager's face and threaten to sue them unless your son isn't reinstated immediately. Hell, it kind of sounds like one for the ACLU. Maybe he might not want to work there after this, but just to scare the hell out of the higher ups and make them fire the underling who did this would be worth it. Kids get together and pull this crap and play these games and don't realize they are breaking laws. The cinema chain in my town got sued BIG TIME because some teenagers picked up the phone when someone called for an employment reference on a girl that had worked there that they apparently did not like. So they gave her a bad reference and the chain got sued for slander, and they won their case. Roflmao. You don't have to take this crap and neither does your son. I live in a 'right to work' state, which makes these things kind of sticky...especially if your state isn't right to work they may have a protocol for terminating employees.

[reyd reid reed]

8. Yup....heh

the last thing he needs is for Mommy to come down there and go off on their sorry asses...so I won't. I did advise him to do just that...there wasn't a manager in last night when he stopped so he's going to call her to see what he could find out today. He's got school and that's when the manager's in -- during school hours. What I can't figure out is why would they schedule him and then write 'terminated'. You don't fire someone by telling them, "We need you to work this weekend but then you're out of here." That's why I told him to not jump to any conclusions...

But regardless...it sucks. If it was a prank, it was cruel, if it's something else...I don't know what...it was still unprofessional.

I'm not going to go down there, but damn...I wanna just explode.

[BarenakedLady]

7. That's awful

I hope he gets an explaination.

[reyd reid reed]

13. I hope he does, too

And I won't see him tonight because he's got rehearsal right after school (tomorrow is opening night for his school's production of Grease).

[wildhorses]

11. good grief!!

:wtf:


love and light headed in your son's direction :hug:

[reyd reid reed]

14. Thank you.

:hug:

[Haole Girl]

12. People who don't have the balls to fire people in person are...

...idiotic asshole "morans" who will live as cock roaches, through eternity, in their next lives.

Even if they did intend to inform your son in person, at a later date, writing it on a schedule for all of his co-workers to see first was un-called for and humiliating. WTF is wrong with some people?

I guess you know how I feel about that subject.

Some hugs for you and your son (don't let the idiots get you down)...

[reyd reid reed]

17. Thanks.

That's kinda the way I see it.

And I'll be sure to deliver the hug...this is such a good kid and it really sucks that they'd treat him this way. I'm trying to be as encouraging as I can, but it about broke my heart last night.

[Lethe]

15. can you get unemployment check at 17?

if your boss fires you suddenly and never indicates there is a problem, you have a good right to collect unemployment.

[reyd reid reed]

18. Probably not at 17

and as a part-time employee. I think that the part-time thing that really kills the unemployment.

[LaraMN]

19. Ohhh... I'm fuming for him, too!

That is completely unprofessional, indecent, and let's face it, fucked-up!

People wonder why those in low-wage jobs don't "appreciate" their employment. It's because of shit like this. Blind, relentless devotion is expected of anyone "blessed" enough to have a job, and in return people get treated without a fragment of decency.

I really hope he gets some answers.

:mad:

[reyd reid reed]

20. Exactly.

He deserves answers...and I'm telling you, they'd fuckin' better be good or the corporate offices are going to get a letter. And that I WILL write.

[Rosie1223]

21. But more importantly....

Did he get his jacket? :)

Seriously, that's too bad for your son. I hope he gets a reasonable explaination. Hopefully he can get another job somewhere -- seasonal help, maybe.

[reyd reid reed]

22. Yup...

he got the jacket. What'll you bet it'll be lost for good before Christmas vacation, though?

He will...he'll be fine. He's a good kid and a hard worker. He's discouraged and frustrated and embarrassed and hurt and angry, though. Last night he just didn't understand...he's seventeen and I could see him trying not to cry.

It really, really sucks.

[Kali]

55. well god dammit now that made me cry

Mine just lost a job in a similar way - not as rudely but very unexpected as he too is a good concientious worker. Not sure what the reason really was, but he has chosen not to persue it (aaarrrggg - I am like you and find it hard not to storm down there and demand an explanation for why they did that to may BABY)

[Pithlet]

23. That's terrible!

WTF is wrong with people?! Poor kid. I'm sorry :hug:

[reyd reid reed]

24. I really don't know...

Just when you think you've seen everything...something new pops up.

Thanks. I'll tell him.

:hug:

[buddhamama]

26. If it were me, I would demand to know why

that is terrible and just plain wrong. I am sorry for your son. Keep us posted. :hug:

[reyd reid reed]

30. I will...

He's supposed to call and find out today. If I haven't heard from him before the kids start coming home from school (he's got rehearsal right after school so he won't be home until late), I'll call him and kinda 'gently remind' him.

This is just....wrong. On every level, it's wrong.

[Lars39]

27. If after talking with management, he truly is 'terminated',

please advise him to quit ASAP. It'll be better for his mental health.

[reyd reid reed]

31. Yup. I think so.

This week's going to be hard enough on him, with school, rehearsals and then the performances and then work on top of it all. If they're firing him, he does NOT need to work those last two shifts. And it'd be shitty for them to expect him to.

[6000eliot]

28. Blowing up about it probably won't do any good,

but still you have a right to know why you have been fired from a job, so I would find out. What a tacky way of letting the kid know, though.

[reyd reid reed]

32. He's not the type to blow up...

he'll call and talk to them, trying to be reasonable. He's level-headed. I'm angrier than he is...he's more hurt and confused and humiliated.

[speedoo]

35. Wow.

That truly sucks.

I really hope you find a way to sue the nasty fuckers.

They deserve to be put out of business.:puke:

[reyd reid reed]

36. It's a fairly large chain...

so I'm thinking that, if it turns out that they did fire him and chose this way to handle it, a letter to the corporate offices might not be out of line. A rather formal, scathing letter that mentions the possibility of making certain that these practices are stopped one way or another.

Of course, being a large chain, odds are that's as far as it'll go, but...

I can be nasty when I'm pushed. And I've been pushed a lot this year. This is a good kid who does NOT deserve to be shit on like this. National chain or not.

:mad:

[China_cat]

37. If it's a big chain

a LOT of letters (like from us here) about these practices can make a difference. Especially if it starts looking like they're going to make national NEGATIVE news.

[reyd reid reed]

38. It might help so that this doesn't happen to anyone else...

or it might encourage a management change in this particular store. Which, considering the way they've treated him so far, wouldn't be out of line. In my opinion.

[meegbear]

39. Some emails to us DUers, who email it to our friends, who mail it to their friends ...

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[ThomCat]

40. Damn. That's rude and unprofessional.

A termination should ALWAYS be handled privately, and the person being terminated should always be told why.
:grr:

[reyd reid reed]

41. Yup.

What a way for a kid to learn that sometimes people suck. This would suck, no matter who they treated like this.

It's just...

:nuke:

GAH!!

[Deep13]

42. He's just a kid and you're his mother.

You are within your rights to go down there and blow sky high.

[reyd reid reed]

48. True...and I'd love to...

but he's seventeen and that would just add to the humiliation to have a parent down there, raising hell. He knows that I'm behind him and that I'm here if he needs me. We all are -- even his sister (and that's saying something).

Plus it's better for him to stand up for himself on his own like the young man he is -- or at least be given the chance. Next year he goes to college and I won't be there if someone tries to shit on him. Let them know that he expects to be treated fairly and like an adult. And, more importantly, let him know that he can deal with this.

[idgiehkt]

43. I'm so sorry, RRR

It's not fair at all and I wouldn't blame you if you went down there and blew up at them. He's still young enough to need help understanding things sometimes. There may have been some possible maneuvering going on behind the scenes that he wasn't aware of, maybe some lies told; if so that's slander and you have legal grounds...it might be worth going down there and scaring the bejesus out of them to make sure they don't do this to another kid. Were I him I wouldn't work another day there...I'd quit now, so they can't 'terminate' him. When you fire someone, you don't 'fire them in advance'. That is so wrong.

[reyd reid reed]

49. Yeah...he didn't get to talk to the manager today...

(I spoke to him but only for about two minutes -- he had his cell turned off at rehearsal and he called me back when I was already at work and the phones were ringing) but I think he's decided that he's not going to work this weekend unless this is a big misunderstanding of some kind. And if this is some other employee's idea of a prank -- that needs to be addressed.

Immediately.

[av8rdave]

45. That's beyond ridiculous

Here's hoping it was just a bad joke.

[reyd reid reed]

50. Me too

but if it was...whoever pulled this crap better get called on it.

[Bassic]

47. Did you get any news yet? nt

[reyd reid reed]

51. Not really

He keeps his phone turned off when he's in class, obviously, and he had it turned off through rehearsal this afternoon, too -- which doesn't surprise me. And then when he called me back, I was already at work at the phones were ringing so I just had a chance to ask if he'd talked to the manager, "No, she was with a customer when I called at lunch" and "I'm probably not going to work this weekend unless this is a mistake. I'll call her first thing in the morning."

So we wait.

Again.

[Bassic]

52. This is such a rotten way of doing it.

Where I live, such practice is illegal.

[reyd reid reed]

53. If it isn't here,

it should be. I've never in my LIFE heard of anyone being fired like this. It's...unfathomable. Unconsionable and I hope...

well...

being a lady I can't say...

*ahem*

[Bassic]

54. You don't need to,

I understand :hug:

[Redstone]

56. Yet another argument for self-employment.

Redstone

[reyd reid reed]

58. True...

but self-employment has its drawbacks, too. Heh...he was probably better off when he was babysitting and doing yard work, though. Kid across the street from us has the yard work in the neighborhood locked up, though...and makes a fortune doing it.

[RoyGBiv]

57. I hate suggesting this ...

I do so only because you've suggested some sort of formal complaint process, which I would certainly recommend. Whether what they did was illegal would depend on your local laws, but at the very least this is unprofessional and should be addressed in such a way so as to cause the biggest annoyance level possible for the company.

The suggestion: The first inclination when informed of an impending termination in the future, even by a reasonable process, is simply not to show up for any days one is scheduled to work between the time of the notification and the official separation from employment. That's natural, even reasonable. Why bother? The reason to bother is simple. If he doesn't show up for scheduled shifts, he wasn't terminated. By not showing up, he quit, and employers much prefer unwanted employees to quit rather than be terminated, for all kinds of reasons. (I suspect that trying to force him to quit may have been one of the reasons for the method, if any kind of rational thought process was taking place at all.) High among them is that if he quits, any official remedies to the situation are, in most cases, rendered moot. And note I say this working with the assumption you're in a "hire/fire at will" state. That works in a lot of ways that aren't obvious. Without a contract that states otherwise(*), an employer can dismiss an employee for any reason, at any time, with no notice as long as those reasons aren't illegal, e.g. discrimination of some sort. It also means the employee can quit for any reason at any time with no notice. (The "two week" thing is just a courtesy in such situations and is only really necessary if the person wants to leave a good impression with an employer that can be communicated to future, prospective employers. Employers in hire at will states often like to pretend notice is required, but it's not, and they can't give a bad reference because of it.) And what *that* means is that if you stop showing up for work without giving a reason beforehand, you've quit.

That doesn't mean he has to be a model employee when he shows up, and in no way should he try to convince them to keep him. If he can break through the emotional wall that's surrounding him right now, he might even use the time to advertise to other employees that he was terminated and by what process it was accomplished. Management will end up paying for a stunt like this eventually, and that process will be aided by making sure others know exactly what kind of management the place has. Hell, I might even tell a few customers, which might get him fired on the spot, but it would still accomplish the primary goal. Whatever the reasoning and whatever is actually going on here, your son should not continue working for this place, but if possible, he should try as much as possible to turn this situation to his advantage, or against the employers advantage.

(*) Contracts: In some states a policy guide for employees serves as a contract unless specifically stated otherwise. If you live in such a state, and if he had a policy guide that detailed a process that would lead to termination, you need to consult it and determine whether what they did conformed to the guide. As a part-timer, he might not even be subject to such procedures, but it's worth at least investigating.

Disclaimer: I am no lawyer. I've simply dealt with such situations both as management and as an employee who was "constructively dismissed" (which means I quit after they made life hell for me in retaliation) after formally complaining about discrimination in the workplace against an openly gay employee. I should not have allowed myself to be "constructively dismissed," but I lost my cool eventually and did, and it made the process of filing a complaint against the company afterward much more difficult.

On a more personal level, that manager, or whoever did this, is an idiot, which you already know, but it bears repeating. I suspect s/he dislikes confrontation, i.e. is incompetent. I could think of any number of ways to dismiss an employee, even a good one, that are reasonable. Part-timers unfortunately face this a lot as they are the first to be cut loose when budgets are being worked out by bean-counters who don't understand, on any level, what good employees really are. They just see numbers. But anyway ... my best to you and your son. Don't take any of this as gospel. I just like seeing companies that treat employees badly take heat for it, and for that to happen, sometimes unpleasant things need to be done.

[reyd reid reed]

59. Thank you...and there's some common sense there.

The schedule indicates that he's terminated after his shift on Sunday, so maybe he should go in there on those two days. Take his MP3 player and a book and when a customer isn't actively needing something, just relax.

I don't know if he's capable of standing around all day doing nothing, though...

[Kali]

60. I didn't do a search but will kick this out of curiosity. Any news?

[reyd reid reed]

61. Not yet...

he said he was going to try calling her again first thing this morning, but since he's at school with his phone turned off, I have no way of knowing what he found out. Or if he found out. His play opens tonight so he's probably got that on his mind and if that trumps this mess, I'm glad.

After the performance I'll see what I can find out. I'll keep you updated.

Thanks for thinking of him.

:hug::hug:

[leftofthedial]

62. unfortunately, Colorado is a "right to work" state

which really means a "right to be fired for no reason" state

[lildreamer316]

63. I hate right to work states.

For every reason posted above.
Sorry he is going through this.:hug:

[cwydro]

64. This is amazing

but doesn't surprise me...I've seen some absolutely incredible management practices in my life. Please keep us posted.

[puerco-bellies]

65. Management is full of themselves.

There is no excuse for that kind of callousness. A professional would never inform an employee of a termination in that manner. The reason he was terminated may likely be some idiotic capricious act, and for them to have informed him in such an unprofessional way is inline with the "why" of it all.