Darn, someone beat me to it. Website: 'Atheists for Jesus'.

[chaska]

http://www.atheists-for-jesus.com/

I thought I was the only one.

I think Jesus is an A-okay dude. I consider him to be a radical proto-socialist philosopher, a definite bleeding heart liberal. Am I wrong?

Why can't these christo-pugs see what I see in the man (the MAN, I don't believe in no fairy stories), and therefore the error of their ways?

[dad]

1. Well, he was a cult leader

I can't forgive him for that. Look at all the damage his cult followers have caused the world over the past two millenia.

[chaska]

2. Well, of course. But that's not HIS fault....

Like how I did that HIS thing? :)

[dad]

3. He started the cult!

How can you say it's not his fault? It was HIS cult!

[chaska]

4. No. He, to the extent I know the man, advocated some really great things....

His followers preverted it and started the whole cult/religion thing. He didn't say 'worship me and do terrible things in my name.'

But if you want to believe that, I'm fine with it. Better you than them.

But I still think he wanted good things for the world, and can't be held totally responsible (if responsible at all) for what was done after his death. Jesus was a victim of some powermad proto-pug types that figured out that religion was a great way to control people. A damn shame really.

[dad]

8. for the Jesus apologists

The birth of Jesus was heralded with "Peace on Earth," yet Jesus said, "Think not that I am come to send peace: I came not to send peace but a sword." (Matthew 10:34) "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." (Luke 22:36) "But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me." (Luke 19:27. In a parable, but spoken of favorably.)

The burning of unbelievers during the Inquisition was based on the words of Jesus: "If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned." (John 15:6)

Plenty more here
http://ffrf.org/nontracts/jesus.php

[Ariana Celeste]

9. When I first became an Atheist,

I used to point out those verses too. But you know, those verses can be interpreted in many ways, not just literally.

I've found that I get along with Christians a lot better when I acknowledge the good in Jesus. I tell them I don't personally believe he was the Son of God but he had good things to say that I strive for, too (sans belief). You can point out verses like these, but that doesn't negate the good things he supposedly said.

And as has been mentioned, you can't blame Jesus for the nasty, perverted interpretations by people who needed a religious excuse to do horrible things with the approval of the people.

[zingaro]

10. ...I am going to tiptoe in very quietly here...

There are a lot of textual scholars who'd question any statement that begins with "Jesus said in <insert bible verse here>...". Tons of information on the manipulation of canonized text is available. If you're actually interested, I would recomment starting with Misquoting Jesus: The Story Behind Who Changed The Bible And Why by Bart D. Ehrman. There are many other textual scholars out there.

Of course, if you're not interested in this subject, I beg your forgiveness for the intrusion.

Peace. Or Merry Christmas even. ;)

[chaska]

13. Ooooh, 34 posts and you step into a discussion on religion....

You're wise to tiptoe. Methinks you have felt the wrath of DU that is too often directed at newbies.

Welcome, zingaro.

I am interested. But not enough to read a book on the subject (hey, just bein' real). I don't suppose you can recommend a website, or would provide us with a bit more info here about what you've read.

[zingaro]

14. Thanks.

And I've yet to feel any wrath but I know that newbies have little credibility anywhere, thus the tiptoeing.

Religion and religious studies are one of my favorite subjects. That might make me a geek (and gosh, at only 34 posts I'm self-labeling!) but that's OK with me lol

I wouldn't really expect a "normal" person to read Ehrman but he's got a lot of interesting things to say. I'll poke around for a link or two but I'd be doing him an injustice to try condensing his years of work into anything too easily digestible. As brief a summary as I could give might be that when one follows the trail of scriptural works backwards, one finds that translations were changed to suit the translator, in error, or in misreading. That is a giant oversimplification but he has source upon source upon source in support of his theories.

And that's just the one book.

Thanks again, chaska.

[Tyo]

5. Well he might have been kind of a nusance

But he didn't go around starting wars and beating up on the poor and condemning sexual minorities. His later "followers" do all that and much more and I don't think He would approve.

[chaska]

6. Watch this:

...Amen.

:rofl:

[Ariana Celeste]

7. I'm cool with Jesus

I don't think evidence backs up his existence, but if he did in fact exist, he was an alright dude.

[Aristus]

11. Well, there is little question that he existed. What is open to question

is whether or not he was divine.

I don't question it, since I'm a Christian, but I'm perfectly okay with anyone else questioning it. It's only the right-wingers who have hissy fits if you deny the idea of the divinity of Jesus. I'm cool with it; my beliefs are my beliefs, and yours are yours. B-)

[Ariana Celeste]

12. Can you suggest any reading material?

I don't debate or argue religion anymore ( I do discuss it sometimes) but I am always interested in reading about it. (Unless of course it's Dobson/Falwell/Robertson stuff lol)