Vegeterian DUers: I'm considering it, need some advice.

[liberalhistorian]

I've known in the abstract, and for a long time now, the horrendous conditions of the meat slaughtering and packing industry, the dangers, the toll on the environment, the terribly inhumane treatment of the animals before and during slaughter, etc., etc. I've known in the abstract, and for some time, how much healthier it is for humans not to eat meat and how much better off you are. All these things I've known, but pushed to the back of my mind because I enjoyed meat too much.

But today I read a Counterpunch article that another DUer was kind enough to post, and that was the last straw. I could no longer keep what I had long known in the back of my mind and forget it so I could enjoy meat like I have my whole life. I had already stopped eating any kind of fast food last year after I bought my son a copy of Fast Food Nation and he read to me some of the more disgusting pages.

But now, after reading that article (and I'm telling you, I wanted to vomit afterwards, it read just like the description of the slaughterhouse and sausage-making process from Upton Sinclair's novel The Jungle, guess we haven't come very far in a century, now, have we), and after the e. coli infections and mad cow disease incident, caused mostly by the practices of the meat industry itself, (such as allowing the slaughtering and packaging for consumption of "downers", or cows too sick to enter the slaughterhouse unassisted) which only cares about profit, and not the animals, their workers, or the health of citizens, I don't think I can ever eat meat again. Feces-contaminated meat (from slaughterhouses not allowing workers adequate time to wash their hands), meat with pus from abcesses and tumors that weren't totally cut out of the meat during slaughter, workers treated like slaves, etc., etc., makes me physically ill to even think about.

But my problem is that I come from a meat-eating family, and I've always eaten meat and meat products, as my family continues to do. I also, frankly, don't like many vegetables, and most veggie meals I've seen include a lot of the vegetables I can't stand. I like beans and peanut butter and cheese and things like that, though. So what do you suggest, how should I begin doing this? I'm thinking it would be best to give up red meat and pork first, then wean myself from other meats like turkey and chicken. I don't think I can go, pardon the pun, cold turkey all at once. But I know there are plenty of recipes and vegetarian meals nowadays, especially since more and more people are becoming vegetarians or at least drastically cutting back on the consumption of meat and meat products.

So, do you have any suggestions or ideas? Any feedback at all would be appreciated.

[Indiana_Dem]

1. I'm in the same spot as you

and my family won't switch with me so this will be difficult. I come from a meat and potatoes midwestern family. Rice and potatoes and cheese and peanut butter and peanuts, fruit, salads, what else?

[liberalhistorian]

3. I know what you mean, I don't think

my parents and son (I live with them) will switch with me, either. Well, maybe my son will, gradually, since he's only 12, but my parents are in their sixties and they ain't never gonna change a lifetime of meat-eating.

But I know there's a lot more to vegetarianism than just veggies, salads, beans, cheese, peanut butter and rice, I just don't know how to get started and the best way to go about it.

[kayleybeth]

2. good for you, LH!

I am going on six years as a vegetarian and I believe it is one of the best decisions I've ever made.

If you're not wild about veggies, there's always rice, nuts, etc. And there are lots of great fake "meat" products on the market. Morningstar Farms makes great soy bacon. Boca makes great fake burgers and soy sausages. Just be sure to take multivitamins to make up for the nutrients you miss by skipping vegetables.

You can phase out meat slowly or all at once, whatever works for you. I will tell you though, that the first few weeks after I gave up meat (I went cold turkey), I felt terrible. Your body will need to "detox" and adjust to the change if you give up meat all at once. After the initial adjustment I felt great and I am healthier now than I have ever been in my life. I haven't had so much as a cold in more than 3 years.

Good luck!

Kayeleigh

[liberalhistorian]

4. So, should I do it gradually, then,

to lessen the effect on my body? I have no doubt at all that you feel and are healthier, I'm sure it's a much healthier way to eat. And I didn't know that about the "fake meat" products, that will really help also.

[Indiana_Dem]

6. Maybe I'll start out with eliminating beef for awhile

then cut out pork. I may stay with just chicken and seafood but I only eat shrimp or orange roughy just because i don't know how to cook anything else so it tastes good. Some of my best meals are with ham and beef!!

[liberalhistorian]

11. I don't really like seafood that much, anyway,

though, so giving up that part of it won't be a problem. I can see where it would be hard for you, though.

[CanuckAmok]

13. Do you guys get "Yves" products in the US?

They're a Vancouver-based meat substitute manufacturer. Great stuff, from breakfast links to hamburger patties to ground round which all tastes exactly like beef.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1059476126172&call_pageid=970599119419

http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m4PRN/2001_June_11/75428727/p1/article.jhtml

Even McDonalds are marketing a veggie burger, and they are using Yves 'meat'.

Bon Apetit!

[liberalhistorian]

16. I don't know, but I'll

look for it, thanks!

[kayleybeth]

19. They do market their products here

but they are difficult to find (at least in my area). The health food store in the next town from mine carries their fake deli meats but that is about all I've been able to find. The fake deli turkey is really good!

[cliss]

5. Welcome to a very big family, the vegetarians.

Our numbers are growing every year, which is good because more and more outrageously delicious food is being made. We've come a long way from just Gardenburgers and tofu!!!

1st, I'd like to suggest that you go to your library. Go to the cookbook section. You will find a reasonably large section on 'vegetarian cooking'. Try out some recipes.

Next, go to your food store. Check out the frozen foods, there should be a frozen food section with meat substitutes (unless you live in the deep south, I don't know about that). You'll see Gardenburgers, Boca Burgers, Morningstar Farms meat substitutes. There should be frozen entrees like vegetarian lasagna, vegan hot dogs, Chick Nuggets and Chick patties (much better than chicken patties).

If there is a Trader Joes specialty store near you, try going there. They specialize in vegetarian cuisine.

I came from a heavy meat-eating Swedish family which has chewed on meat for centuries. Imagine their surprise and criticism when I decided 10 years ago to give up on meat.

The fact is, we live like kings now. We eat superbly, and I do not miss the meat-eating days. I DO eat dairy products and occasionally fish and rarely turkey.

I'm sure there are many, many web sites where you can get lots of information, too.

Here's the best reason why I'm glad to be a vegetarian: my sister called me last week, and she was worried sick that she had eaten tainted meat from Washington. She couldn't sleep. I told her not to worry because she would probably be OK.

I sleep well at night, because I don't worry.

[liberalhistorian]

9. Thanks for the advice!

I'll certainly look for those products at my grocery, which is huge and has a section for just about any kind of food imaginable, so I don't think I'll have trouble finding them. And I love to cook and try different recipes, so getting cookbooks won't be a problem. What about alcohol? I don't drink much, but I do enjoy a glass of wine a few times a week.

[NightTrain]

7. You might try to find a good vegetarian cookbook

Alternately, I have some friends who are excellent vegetarian cooks. If you're looking for some recipes, I'd be happy to pass your request on to them.

Let me know, and I'll hook ya up! :hi:

[liberalhistorian]

12. Hi, Dean!

Sorry I didn't get a chance to call you tonight. I'll PM my number to you and you can try me tomorrow. It's my birthday though (YIKES, 39!), so I'll be in and out during the day and at night my best friend is taking me to dinner and a movie. Just leave a message if I'm not there.

BTW, I'm really enjoying those CD's you sent!

[NightTrain]

14. Would Sunday be a better time to call?

n/t

[liberalhistorian]

17. Normally, it would be,

but this Sunday we have to go to Toledo for my stepdad's family's Christmas gathering since that's the only time everyone was able to get together.

[CanuckAmok]

8. I quit eating animals after the Service...

but I found that I was developing a protein deficiency, so I have reintroduced poultry and seafood into my diet.

I know there are non-meat sources for protein, but the reality is that I wasn't taking the time to source them out, and as most of my meals are prepared by a catering service (at my worksite), I'm not in a position to dictate what is prepared for me.

Mrs. Amok is a strict vegetarian, but not a vegan. She still consumes eggs, cheese, etc.

My mom STILL doesn't get that I don't eat red meat. She still makes meat pies, roast beef dinners, etc. But she's nuts, so that's a whole other story.

Once you quit red meat, don't go back. Your body will stop producing the digestive enzymes required to break meat down, and it's very uncomfortable to digest if it's not a regular part of your diet.

Good luck to you--society is becoming more vegetarian-friendly, but it's still a difficult path.

Also, if you're hardcore cruelty-free, good luck. Even things like chewing gum have animal byproducts (such as beef tallow) in them. It's very difficult eliminating all animal cruelty from your diet.

[liberalhistorian]

15. You're kidding me, even

GUM has animal byproducts? What the hell for? Hell, I'm learning more and more about this whole industry and I don't like it at all!

And thanks for the advice about not going back to meat, I had no idea that the body would stop producing the necessary digestive enzymes. I guess that would, indeed, be a bit uncomfortable.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

20. Gum...

marshmallows and jello (hooves -- bleck!) and all sorts of foods have hidden meat products in them. You'll get used to what to look for.

They have veggie Jello now, and you can still make Rice Krispie treats with marshmallow creme. :) There's all sorts of ways around things.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

10. Look for dishes...

and cuisines that are naturally vegetarian friendly, like Italian, Chinese and Mediterranean. That is an easy way to at least cut back on meat while you are making the change. Say eat some sort of meat just every three or four days, with veggie dishes in between.

I would probably start with eliminating red meat and then go from there -- that's what I did, and it was a pretty natural move to eliminating the others.

Also, there are loads of pretty good meat substitutes for ground beef, hot dogs, hamburgers, baloney, etc. You an also use those as you move away from meat. This way you can still use favorite receipes with the fake meats. (Favorites are Boca Burgers Chef Max All American Grillers, Wild Dogs, Morningstar Farms bacon (<in a BLT>, Yves baloney, and there's a stick pepperoni that is tasty as heck -- I just can't remember the name.) You can also make recipes for your family like spaghetti, lasgana etc and use the basics to make a portion for you (without meat or with fakes) and a portion for you family (with meat). Cooking for a family that eats meat when you don't doesn't have to be that hard -- my sister did it for years.

I am also a veggie who dislikes veggies, and it requires you to be even more creative. I eat a lot of grains -- you can make great salads with grains like cous cous and brown rice. A nice grain dish with a salad and fruit really makes a nice meal. I do notice I need to eat a little more often during the day -- kind of "grazing" to keep full, but it's not too difficult. It's been 14+ years since I ate meat and I'm doing pretty good. :) And I also came from a BIG meat eating family from the midwest. Some families may never get used to members who go veggie, but you can't let them get you down. It took YEARS of remonding my Mom "I don't eat that!" before it really sunk in. But she's getting it, and now even makes an effort to read labels for things like gelatin.

Check out the Vegetarian Times Magazine (available online) for great receiped and health information for veggies -- I read this the first half of my life as a veggie and found it VERY helpful.

[aquaman]

18. Vegetarians are better lovers........

I have not eaten meat in over four years. It is easier for me though because there is not one vegetable that I dislike. Regardless, even if I didn't like many vegetables, with a clear mind and conscience I could not eat meat. They say that the average vegetarian saves over 80 animals each year, that's good enough for me. By the way, I came from a meat and potatoes family also. Good luck.

[liberalhistorian]

22. Yes, that's another

factor in my decision, the saving of animals each year, and the terrible environmental effects of meat-eating.

[Cassandra]

43. You may save 80 animals you're not eating but...

you're still killing thousands of animals that die when the fields for growing your veggies are being cleared and plowed. Moles, voles, mice, rats and other small animals die in the thousands in each field. You just don't see them.

[aquaman]

52. Okay....

Well maybe I will just begin to pick grass out of my front yard and make a nice grass stew. Look, we all have a negative impact on the environment around us. I try to lessen that by only buying organic produce from responsible farmers. What do you eat?

[Cassandra]

59. I buy organic when I can

but they still plow under small furries. I particularly prefer organic for root vegetables after reading about potato farmers who keep an organic plot for their families. That was a wake-up call.
Personally, I'm pretty carniverous. I just like to point out to vegetarians who think they're not killing animals that, actually, they are; even when they're trying not to.

[aquaman]

60. Thank you so much for your concern.....

And to point out to vegetarians that even though our motives are good, we still destroy, I guess we all should just say screw it and not care. Thanks again.

[Cassandra]

71. The Moles and Voles Union of America

has expressed their appreciation of my support. The rats, however, are still pissed off about their bad press and the mice could not be reached for comment. ;-)

[curse10]

63. we appreciate you pointing out the obvious

:eyes:

the point is, that for many of us, not adding to the killing and torture of animals is what's important. Telling me that my corn killed a field mouse isn't going to get me to eat meat-- because that steak you just ate was fed with that corn (more corn than I eat). So you killed more field mice and the cow. I'll save the cow anyday.

[aquaman]

66. Thank you, a voice of reason.

.

[hedgetrimmer]

21. hey, there are alternatives... how about organic

you can easily eat organic meat... the process for feeding and slaughter are different... do a google search... further, i have been on again off again vegetarian for 16 years... it is important if you decide to go vegetarian completely to check your levels of nutrition (protien, amino acids, vitamins and iron ...etc) make sure you are getting what you need... in the early part of my vegi-ness i encountered a rather intense mal-nutrition and after six months i had to resume eating meat and meat (animal by-products) to regain a healthy state, the condition arose out of my ignorance for nutrition...

for every living thing to survive it must consume... what it consumes becomes a part of it... consume what you want to be a part of you, the entireness of it, from the origins of it's conception to the process of it's arrival on your dinner table....

i am a semi-vegetarian now... i eat organic everything... i do not eat any red meat or pork i do eat poultry and dairy... i eat a variety of soy products but really try to limit my intake of processed foods...

good luck and fortunate education in your journey into the world of food, nutrition and consumption...

one last side note... my wife eats red meat, in fact just about everything but she too eats organic however, my brothers and their families eat everything non-organic and think i am foolish... eating organic is very expensive, i believe this too weighs heavily on my brothers families decission... you can ask me whatever you want, about this issue.

[Flaxbee]

30. I quit meat (incl. fish) years ago...

and feel fine, but it was a relatively gradual weaning. I went "cold turkey" on red meat, never ate much pork, then weaned off chicken and turkey and fish (oceans are WAAAAYYYY overfished). The commercialization of meat just disgusts me, but meat-eating in principle does not. I used to think that if the slaughter (horrid word) were humane, I might be able to enjoy a burger now and then, but after years of being a veggie I don't know if that's even true anymore. I still eat cheese and eggs, but only free-roaming hen eggs, and I loooove Italian, Mexican, and Indian foods that use lots of spices to perk up pasta, rice, etc. The way I combatted the urge to eat more was to get intensely flavor- rich foods, like gorgonzola cheese (spring greens, gorgonzola, walnuts and a red-wine vinaigrette is one of the best salads in the world, with lots of flavor!) or a few olives, or tabasco/cheddar/brown rice/black bean casseroles... just spice things up and you won't feel the need to overeat.

Then of course, for me, followed the quandary about leather. Hard for a shoe-fiend to overcome, but I'm even phasing that out of my wardrobe. Humans can be such barbarians, there is no need for the fear and inhumane treatment but the faster they're killed, the quicker the profit. Gotta have profit!!!! Right?

[liberalhistorian]

45. I hadn't thought of that, that

organic meat would be much more humane and cleaner. I've been trying to eat a lot more organic food lately, but you're right, it's very expensive and I don't have a whole lot of money to work with.

[curse10]

54. malnutrition is easily avoided

I've been a veggie since I was in highschool (with a brief break in college) and I've never had a problem.

It's like any other diet- you have to be balanced. If all you eat are carrots and celery sticks you are going to have issues. But eat your leafy greens, get some beans, and through in some grains and you've got a good start.

[jpgray]

23. Dated a vegetarian--Gardenburgers do *not* taste like meat!

Here ends my advice.

:)

[deek]

34. Try Boca Burgers or Mornigstar Grillers (the best)!

Report back, pease :)

Also, saute in a bit of olive oil instead of nuking them.
very ymmmmmmmmmy taste and textrue!

[Kathleen04]

37. I love Morningstar

stuff, especially the Grillers. I like to eat them with A1 sauce..it reminds me of steak. :)

[jpgray]

67. I always liked Portobello burgers--but too expensive!

(and yes, I know Gardenburgers aren't *meant* to taste like meat, but I thought I would pass on what little knowledge I had :))

[curse10]

55. they aren't supposed to

garden burgers are vegetable patties. Boca are supposed to taste like meat.

[tinrobot]

24. The one thing I noticed...

...about a lot of my friends who went vegetarian is that they gained weight. They tended to compensate for the lack of meat by filling up on bread and starch.

Remember, just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you automatically get a free pass on things like bread and chips. Junk food is junk food regardless... Be sure to watch your starch intake and get enough protein and fat. If you eat a balanced diet get your proteins, you won't miss meat at all.

[jobycom]

31. Yes

ANd the healthy your food is, the better off you will be. Your body craves a ton of potato chips because it is trying to get what it needs out of the little bit in each chip. So you eat a lot of empty carbs and fat on the way to getting your nutrients. On the other hand, if you eat a salad with a variety of veggies and beans, you'll find you want to eat less, because you are getting what you need in a lot less food.

Juicing and multi vitamins help, if you don't want to eat perfectly. But avoid basing diet on junk, even more than when you eat meat. Meat gives you concentrated proteins, though not in the most usable form for your body. You will try to eat a lot of pasta or empty starches to make up for the change in energy source you will go through, unless you watch it.

[Pobeka]

25. Try some east indian food

If you don't mind eating dairy products, some of the sauces they make with the vegetarian dishes are fantastic.

Also check out lentils. The brown ones can have an almost meaty taste.

I will pass along some lentil recipies if you are interested.

[liberalhistorian]

44. I very much enjoy dairy products.

And yes, I would be interested in some lentil recipes, thanks.

[Pobeka]

56. lentil (and other vegie) recipies

Red lentil soup (from memory)

1/2 onion, medium diced
1 clove garlic, minced
1/2 stick butter
1 tsp turmeric
1 tsp cumin seeds
1 small tomatoe, diced (and seeded if you prefer), canned works too.

1/2 C red lentils (try a health food store if your regular grocery doesn't have them -- usually in the bulk food section). Be sure to pick through the lentils and throw out any non-lentil seeds or debris.
Cayenne pepper, or jalepeno pepper.

Melt butter over medium high heat in a 1 quart pot, saute turmeric, cumin seeds, garlic and onions until translucent. While that is going on rinse the lentils until the water runs clear. Throw the lentils in immediately after rinsing, because they tend to clump together. You can break them apart with a spoon in the pot -- this is not rocket science, just get them in the pan and mostly separated.

Add the tomatoe, and about 2 cups of water, stir it around a bit to help break up the lentils. Then add water to near the top of the pot.

Toss in a little cayenne or minced jalepeno for heat, if you like it.

Simmer the whole thing for about 20 - 30 minutes, until the lentils are completely cooked through -- they turn a yellow color and will fall apart quite a bit.

Tastey stuff with a side of bread!

--
Quinoa Cracked Wheat Salad

1/2 Cup cracked (bulgar) wheat.
2 Cups boiling water

Combine in heat proof bowl and let set covered for about 1 hour.

1 1/2 Cups quinoa.

Rinse completely, until water is clear (the cloudy residue is
from the outside of the quinoa, and is very bitter). Usually just
rinsing in a pitcher, stirring, pouring off water several times works.

Add quinoa and 2 cups of water to a pan, bring to a boil, then simmer, covered for about 20 minutes until all the water is absorbed (be careful not to let it burn to the bottom of the pan).

In the meantime, dice up some vegies in about 1/4" size chunks, onion, zuchini, carrots, green beans, anything you have laying or growing around. Saute those with butter on a very high heat for only a
minute or a minute and a half (really just trying to get the onions from being, well you know, oniony)

Take the quinoa off the stove, and put it in the fridge to cool it off.

If it's been an hour, then drain the cracked wheat. I put it in a colander and push on the top to squeeze as much water out as possible.

Now for the vinegrate.
3/4 C olive oil
1 garlic clove, minced
1 tsp grey poupon mustard
a little salt
a little pepper
3 tablespoons red wine vinegar

Mix all those up.

Now take the wheat, the quinoa, the vegies and put them in your serving bowl, toss everything so it's well mixed. Pour all the vinegrate over the salad and mix well.

You can mix 1 cup of feta cheese directly in the salad, but we like to sprinkle it over each serving
like a garnish.

--
Greek salad

1 C Cucumber (we like the English, the seeds are small)
1 C Red Pepper
1 C Tomatoes

1/2 C White Onion (or a Walla walla)

Cut everything into large chunks, about 1".

Splash on about 1/8th cup balsamic vinegar.
Stir in about 1/4 C extra virgin olive oil.
Stir in about 1/2 C feta cheese.

[Pobeka]

57. Humus!

This is really easy to make!

Humus

1 1/2 C garbanzo beans, soaked in water overnight

2 large garlic cloves

1 tsp ground coriander, or 1/2 tsp ground cumin

1/2 tsp salt to taste

1/2 tsp pepper

5 tbsp olive oil



Blend all of the above, adding water if it's too thick. Top with paprika & olive oil

Dip pieces of pita bread in it, or even chips.

[Smarmie Doofus]

26. Vegetarianism : you can move gradually

As they say in AA, one day at a time. I'm a former vegetarian... now a about a 3/4 vegetarian. I avoid meat but I don't avoid it entirely.

Yes, all you say about the moral and ethical implications of meat eating are true. No meat at all is best; complete non-cooperation with the meat industry is the ideal.

However, REDUCING your consumption of meat is also very useful. I'd avoid setting up a big all-or-nothing dichotomy that may result in failure and despair. If you feel you can't make the break entirely than simply reduce your intake. I find that it's really difficult to find good substitutes, especially when I'm eating out. ( I live in the Bronx, NY; veggie restaurants are nonexistent here.) Hence I've had to comprimise in the last year or so... but in principle I remain vegetarian.

Eat a lot of cheese; cheese in salads are particularly good for me. Tofu can be made tasty if you grill it and season it. (No, it will never be as good as chicken.) Tofu can also be used in sauces for pasta. It's relative tastelessness is disguised by the sauce and it is MUCH more nutritious than meat. In restaurants, if you must order meat, order something with a small amount of meat ( i.e. a BLT instead of a hamburger, etc.).

Remember... reducing your intake is better than nothing. So don't feel too bad if you have to occassionally indulge.


Good luck.
Paul

[msanger]

27. I'm a veggie 96% of the time

I eat turkey at Thanksgiving and Christmas, since that is when my brother in law makes a huge deal out of barbequeing one -- and it actually tastes good.

And I eat meat when it seems kinder to do so - tonight I was at a friends house who made spaghetti with meat sauce. He didn't realize I was a veggie, and I didn't see any need to make him feel uncomfortable with it.

So my suggestion is find food that works for you, but try not to make yourself or anybody else crazy in the process.

As somebody else once said, it isn't so important what goes into your mouth, as what comes out of it.

On the other hand, try telling that to a cow.

[ronzo]

28. Simple Hearty Vegetarian Chili

Simple Hearty Vegetarian Chili

I swear I'm not shilling for anybody here...

2 cans Bush's chili magic (blue)
2 14.5 oz cans diced tomatoes (onion and peppers)
2 pouches Boca fake meat crumbles
hot sauce to taste

Cincinnati style:
add a dash of cinnamon to the pot (recommended anyway)...
serve over pasta with onions, shredded cheddar, fresh tomatoes, all that other good stuff.

Try it, you'll like it

[Indiana_Dem]

32. Thanks for the recipe! n/t

[flamingyouth]

46. Bush's chili magic?

what an unfortunate name for such a great product! :evilgrin:

This is a great recipe, BTW, I use a variation of it myself.

[jobycom]

29. Read a couple of books, not just cookbooks, and don't fixate on fake meats

Fake "meats" don't taste like meat, so if you try to susbstitute them for meat, you'll just want more meat. Also, some fake meats are not protein laden, so they don't help. They are good once you get them for themselves, and not to fulfill a meat craving. Although, there is a product called Quorn which has an amazing chicken likeness (tastes just like chicken, in other words).

But don't rely on gimic foods. Get a couple of books that describe vegetarianism, especially ones written by common-sense doctors, that focus on the diet and nutrition, not on the evils of the meat industry, etc. There are a lot of vegetarian diets that are just as bad as these fad weight loss diets, which will eventually deprive you of proteins and irons, and make you go back to meats. Read a couple to get an idea of what happens with your body to avoid a few traps. You can tell the difference between a medical approach and a sales approach.

The two hardest things about first becoming a vegetarian is protein, and iron. If you don't get enough, two things will happen. First, you get weak, and probably will crave meat, for legitimate nutritional reasons. Second, you'll get fatter, because you will eat too much trying to get the energy you need. So check out food combining, alternate protein sources, and complete amino acid references.

A quick note on food combining: Some older books believed you had to combine certain foods in each meal to make a complete amino acid, but that's wrong. Basically, certain foods like grains and beans have only partial proteins, and you must combine them to get a complete protein. But not at the same meal. If you eat beans for lunch and whole wheat bread for dinner, your body will still combine the proteins. Some foods, especially soy, have complete proteins. Look for ways to work soy, soymilk, and tofu (and yes, you can cook it a thousand ways that don't taste like mushy paste). You need a lot less protein than you believe, and you'll discover that once you give up meat.

Someone above said they felt horrible for the first few weeks of being veg. I didn't. I felt like someone had cleaned me. I could see better, my, um, you know, responded better, my mind was sharper. For about three weeks. Then I hit a wall, and wound up eating meat to get me over it. I did this for years. I gave up cooking meat (I cook in our family), but ate it at restuarants, until one day I no longer wanted it (there was a traumatic event that made me averse to it at that time, also). The point is, people are different, and react differently, and have different needs based upon different problems, so read what you will ultimately need to survive, and adjust for yourself. It's not religion, you can do what you want. So do what you want.

And most imporantly, don't listen to any non-vegetarian telling you what you cannot get from vegetarianism. You can get everything you need without much more work than meat eaters perform to get what they need. I've even seen doctors who claim that you can't heal properly without meat. None of it is true. You may have to seek out an alternate source of what you need, but it is out there.

Start where you feel comfortable. I was the reverse of must. I don't like chicken or fish, so I gave up red meat last. And I didn't gradually weed out meats, I gave them up, then went back, then gave them up, until finally it felt right. I can't emphasize enough that it is your body, and not to let anybody or any label tell you what your comfort level is. You will do what is right for you.

And all that stuff about reading up and preparing sounds like you need to be sure before you get started. Don't worry about it. If you want to stop eating meat now, and figure out what you should be doing as you go along, don't hesitate. Meat is bad for you in the quantities most people eat it, so giving it up and living off cheese pizza or baked potatoes is not any more likely to hurt you than eating pounds of meat each day. But do learn what you need to know, and remember that your body is different, so don't hesitate to adjust what you learn.

Get a subscription to Vegetarian Times or one of the other magazines, too. Good recipes, nice support system, and it keeps you motivated. Especially if the rest of your family is not with you, as is the case with mine.

Damn, enough rambling. Sorry.

On edit: I focussed to much on the cautious side of the diet. The benefits are that you will feel stronger, lighter, clearer-headed, and younger, and after a few months, you will begin to think that you were sick while eating meat, and you are now better.

[liberalhistorian]

47. Thanks!

No, you weren't rambling, you were making perfect sense to me. My main concern is nutrition, making sure I get enough of everything I need if I'm not eating meat.

[gmoney]

33. Hasn't "Big Food" screwed up non-meat products, too?

I know the meat industry is an inhumane mess, but isn't all the "non-meat" food messed up as well? Overprocessed, mystery ingredients, additives, etc. Even if you buy fresh fruits and vegetables, do you know what you're getting as far as chemical fertilizers, pesticides, sprays, water and soil pollutants, varnishes, not to mention genetic mutilation.

The Bush FDA has even distorted the definition of "organic" to the point where it's meaningless, too.

Unless you have your own organic truck farm that's been in the family for a couple generations, seems to me there's no way to really know what you're eating, sad to say.

And more people got wiped out by the green onions at Chi-Chi's than have come down with Mad Cow in the US...

If you wanna go veggie, more power to you -- sadly, it may not make you a safer or more informed "consumer."

Plus, once established as a vegetarian, you get the bonus of getting tremendously sick when you accidentally eat something with meat snuck into it.

[Piperay]

35. WELCOME

to our World. :-) I'm what I call a "junk food" vegetarian so I am not a good one to give advice, but I'm always glad to see another meat eater come over to our side. :bounce:

[Kathleen04]

36. You've gotten some great advice..

When I went vegetarian (almost 6 years ago), I went cold-turkey and never really felt like going back, but I'm sure the weening-off meat process is a good idea.

One thing I'd like to add is that alot of the meals that you eat now..you can just take the meat out and it will pretty much be the same, ie: sandwich w/o meat, tacos w/o meat, lasanga w/o meat, etc.

Also things to avoid: gelatin (found in alot of yogurt, jello, marshmellows, gummie candies, some sour cream), rennet (found in some cheeses..an enzyme that comes from the stomachs of cows).

And, Caesar salad dressing and Worchester sauce have anchovies in them...I was actually upset when I realized this (ok, I was 12), but I'm letting you know. :)

Best of luck.

[RebelOne]

38. I've been a vegetarian for 8 years now.

And it really wasn't difficult. I quit cold turkey. I was having an on-line argument with a hunter about the cruelties of hunting. And he said to me, "You eat meat, don't you." And I said, "Not any longer." I love pasta and eat a lot of that.

Occasionally, I eat fish, but am trying to wean myself off that. But I love shrimp and not sure if I will ever be able to stop eating it. I eat dairy foods, though. For burgers, I prefer Morningstar. They have a good variety. And their breakfast sausage patties are delicious. Also, Gardenburger has a barbequed baby back rib dish. Almost tastes like the real thing.

There are lots of good vegetarian recipes. Search the Web and you will find sites with some really good recipes.

Also, don't forget to take vitamin supplements. Especially lots of vitamin B-12 for protein.

Good luck and I hope you can do it.

[mikita]

39. good on ya...

Hope it goes well for you! I've been off meat and fish for 12 years+ and been able to convince others to do the same, all "cold turkey". My suggestion about "weaning off" or "cold turkey" would be follow your own instincts, and don't feel guilty whatever you do.

One source of recipes that I prefer over Vegetarian Times is Bon Appetit magazine, which has recipes indexed by Meatless, and Vegetables, Side Dishes. If you don't have the mag, most of their recipes (along with Gourmet mag) can be found on www.epicurious.com. Hundreds of vegetarian dishes, and user comments about them, which are quite useful. I've found Veg Times recipes to be sometimes good and sometimes very disappointing. Just my 2 cents.

Good luck with a great decision. The animals and the environment will love you!

:hi:

[prolesunited]

40. I've only been a vegetarian

for a couple of years, but it is one of the BEST decisions I've ever made. I can't tell you how much better I feel and I also was able to reduce my cholesterol by nearly 100 points without drugs. I actually lost weight when I quit smoking. I have more energy and don't have that gut rot feeling anymore. And frankly, I don't miss meat in the very least. There are so many delicious options out there.

Every time we have a meat recall, e. coli in beef, salmonella in chicken, PCBs in fish, I'm so glad I don't have to worry. As for people saying you can't control all of your food supply, why bother. I would rather reduce as many risks as possible. If you wash your fruits and vegetables thoroughly, you can certain get rid of most of the pesticides or simply buy organic and find a good health food store.

First of all, you have to decide what kind of vegetarian you want to be:
Different Types of Vegetarians

Vegan
They consume no animal flesh and avoid all foods (and products like leather and wool) of animal origin.

Lacto
They consume no animal flesh but include dairy products in their diets.

Ovo
They consume no animal flesh but include eggs in their diets.

Lacto-Ovo
They consume no animal flesh but include dairy products & eggs in their diets.

Pesco
They include fish, eggs, and dairy products in their diets.
Please Note: Due to all the negative responses we receive by listing Pesco, we would like to express our feelings. We do not consider Pesco as a true vegetarian, as they still are consuming flesh, but we feel they are on the right path to becoming a true vegetarian all they have to do is just give it a little more thought.

http://www.jtcwd.com/vegie/types.html

I'm lacto-ovo, but limit my consumption to eggs and dairy to three or four meals a week. It's much less limiting than being a vegan, provides easier protein options, and makes dining out more accessible. Perhaps that's what you would want to start out with.

One think you have to keep in mind is not to overcompensate with carbs. I did and my triglycerides skyrocketed as a result. I also only buy whole grain pastas, rice and breads. I do a lot of athletic training so I find soy-based protein bars and shakes help me get the extra protein I need, but that's probably not an issue for you. I also take a high-potency multivitamin daily to make sure I'm completely covered.

Here's some links to get you started:
This site has a good section on making the transition
http://www.vegetarianstarterkit.com/

Tons of information and recipes. Answers many questions
http://www.vrg.org/

You can read archived articles and find recipes
http://www.vegetariantimes.com/

Lots of recipes here
http://vegetarian.about.com/cs/reccoll/a/top10of2003.htm

I think you should simply do it and set a timetable for the transition. One thing I was NOT prepared for was the reaction from people around me. Both family and co-workers took great pleasure in taunting and harassing me when I first became a vegetarian. I could understand it better if I ever hounded them about what they eat, but I didn't.

Now that it's been awhile and they see that I'm not about to change, they have become much more accepting.

Don't think of it as making a commitment for life — that was way too scary for me to contemplate. Just tell yourself you're trying an experiment to see if you like it. The first month was the hardest, not that I missed the meat but because I had so many physical symptoms as all of the toxins were leaving my system. My skin broke out like a teenager, my digestive system had to adjust to the increase in fiber, etc. But after that, it all settled down.

Good luck! There's a lot of vegetarians much more knowledgeable and practiced than me here at DU that you can turn to for advice and support.

[liberalhistorian]

48. Wow, I had no idea

there were different kinds of vegeterians. Guess I have a lot of learning to go yet on this subject, this is a totally new journey for me. But I'm looking forward to it.

[NicoleM]

41. I was a vegetarian and now I'm not.

I quit eating beef at 14 and all other meats at 15. I started eating fish and poultry again about seven years later. I just feel better with a little meat in my diet. But not much, and my beef/pork consumption consists of a hot dog on the 4th of July.

I was a terrible vegetarian for a long time--I lived on spaghetti and potatoes and bread. I gained a bunch of weight. Eventually I started eating more tofu and vegetables, and then I lost some of the weight.

You might want to consider cutting back on your meat consumption but switching to stuff like free-range chicken. It's easier to eat healthy, IMO, if you don't focus on what you "can't" have. You don't have to be hardcore about it. But you probably should find some vegetables you like and find different ways to add them to stuff. One thing I did when I was a vegetarian was add broccoli and cauliflower to almost everything I ate--scrambled eggs, ramen noodles, pasta. (Actually, I still do that.)

And a snack tip--if you like apples and carrots, you can make peanut butter dip for them. You just mix some peanut butter with a little water until it has the consistency of a dip rather than a spread. I used to take that and a bag of baby carrots to work with me. It was good for snacking during the day. If you're not eating meat, you'll probably be hungry more often. It doesn't take as long to digest fruits, vegetables and starches as it does to digest meat.

[Nikia]

42. I've thought about it

One of my biggest deterrents is that I dislike everything soy and all meat substitutes that I have tried. I do like most vegtables though and nuts. I am not that crazy about beans. I think that I would need dairy, but I don't like cottage cheese at all and most other cheeses only in small amounts. I've liked most of the different grains that I've tried. Is it possible to be a healthy lacto-vegetarian without soy products or beans or supplements? I generally start feeling weak after a few days of no meat.

[flamingyouth]

49. A vegetarian diet can help with estrogen issues

I know we discussed endometriosis, etc., once here before. Anyway, cutting out a lot of animal proteins can help with hot flashes and other problems.

I eat meat, but I have cut down my consumption greatly. I found that doing it gradually really was helpful, but others go cold turkey. It's really up to how you feel. If you have chronic illnesses like I do, I would recommend making any dietary change slowly.

There are great veggie-fed eggs on the market. They are quite a bit more expensive, but I think they are worth it. Not only are they more humanely grown, but they taste way better. It's good to find a nice range of protein sources to choose from.

Try gluten, if you like Asian stir fries. It comes in cans, either spiced or not. Companion from Taiwan is a good brand. There are lots of ways to get your protein without meat.

I think this is a very exciting change for you! I have lots of good vegetarian recipes, if you are interested. PM me anytime! :hi:

[bleedingheart]

50. You must learn to eat right if you are going to go vegetarian.

I am not a vegetarian but I have plenty of friends who are vegetarians and they range from the ones who eat right and are very healthy to those who eat very limited diets and have gotten vitamin deficiencies because of their poor diet.

[Bushfire]

51. Welcome to the club

as someone who has sworn off meat for 10 yrs, just call if you need any support.

[curse10]

53. Weening yourself of meat is a good idea

it will lessen the cravings you might get. Start with the easy stuff- red meat and pork. Go with chicken and other fowl next. Then finally fish.

Don't rush it- it can take people a year to phase it out, and that's okay.

I am also the only veggie in my family. For the most part they are understanding and are willing to try new things- so I wouldn't worry too much about that :-)

As for not liking veggies, I suspect you just haven't had some of the awesome veggie delights out there! I don't like a few of the "staple" vegetarian veggies either-- I think eggplant and broccoli are freakin' disgusting. But, that hasn't stopped me from making great squash dishes, mushroom extravaganzas, and peppers stuffed with deliciousness :-)

I would recommend getting a subscription to veggie times. That way each month you have a whole new set of really good recipes to go through. I've yet to try a bad recipe from them.

And, if you still jones for some meat, go with the fake stuff. Although tofurky is rather disgusting, morning star farms has an excellent line of fake meats. Their sausages are awesome. Boca makes great burgers and italian sausage. Yves has the best veggie dogs. And there are tons of convenience items now too. Amy's line has great soups and frozen meals.

There really are so many easy ways to do this. I hope it works out!

and on edit: there are lots of gloom and doom stories about malnutrition out there. Plenty of meat eaters suffer this as well. And don't worry about protein too much. Read the labels, you'd be surprised how much protein you are actually consuming. Your body should tell you what you need. I always know when I've been a bad girl and haven't been watching my protein intake- I crave beans like a freak!

[absyntheNsugar]

58. I Dated a Woman Back in College who went off meat...

I'm an avowed carnivore, but the way she did it (and she's still Veg 12+ years later) was

- Go off Beef, Pork and Lamb right away. You can go off these without significant side effects. Red meat is bad for you anyway.

- Go to a gym. Eat vegetable protein with EVERY meal. Make sure you get at least 10-20 grams of protein from soy, beans, wheat, etc... in every meal.

- One month off beef, slowly stop eating chicken and turkey. Eat it twice a week, then once the week after, then none at all. Replace those foods with another 10-20 grams of protein from soy. Eat fish as your only meat.

- Gradually cut out fish from your diet. If you don't like fish, youre already there.

BTW...going vegetarian is not a queue to stop eating protein. YOU NEED PROTEIN. Going veg requires you to keep on top of your diet, making sure you get enough amino acids.

The biggest pitfall vegetarians go through is they stop eating meat, replace that food with carbs and GET OBESE!!!! A carb heavy diet WILL KILL YOU!!!!! All those grains will turn to sugar and will make you diabetic. SO DO NOT INCREASE THE CARBS!!!!!!! Make sure you eat equal amounts of plant based protein.

Soy is an excellent source, as is whey, milk, eggs. If you are going vegan you REALLY have to watch this.

P.S. In all honesty, vegetarianism can be very healthy...but veganism is dangerous. Sorry, Nutritionist speaking here.

[curse10]

62. 10-20 grams of protein at every meal can be excessive

that's for a high calorie intake. For some people it's just not necessary-- it all depends on your activity level and your caloric intake. And veganism is not dangerous. I'm a perfectly healthy vegan. I'm very aware of what I put into my body and what is needed so I stay healthy.

[absyntheNsugar]

64. Huh????

you need AT least your body weight in protein PER DAY to maintain your muscle. Less if you want to lose muscle, but for those wishing to lose weight muscle helps burn fat.

I've read the flawed research that the average American consumes way too much protein - and also know the nutritionist who did that study ended up with diabetes later.

[dawn]

61. All the advice above is great. Also...

n.b. I am not a total vegetarian yet, either. I still eat fish. Sushi is the hardest thing for me to give up. As well as shrimp dishes. I hope to do that one day, though.

Are there any Indian restaurants nearby? They have wonderful vegetarian dishes on their menus. Perhaps you could try them and see if you like them. If so, you could get an Indian vegetarian cookbook to add to your other cookbooks. Some speciality stores like Trader Joe's have pre-packaged Indian vegetarian good, too. That's helped me quite a bit.

[absyntheNsugar]

65. Isn't there a soy-crabmeat product out there?

I saw it at Whole Foods I think....

Could at least do CaliRolls with those.

[CalebHayes]

68. Sorry, I can't help you... I have been a vegie since I was 5 y/o

It was easy for me... I just could not eat it.

[Piperay]

70. Same here...

I have been a vegetarian since I was six or seven, I just found meat repulsive and couldn't eat it.:puke: Anyway the only meat I ever ate before the age of six or seven was an infrequent hamburger or hotdog, I never ate steaks, chops or any slab of meat (never even tasted them) to begin with.

[mlawson]

69. Depending on where you are, restaurants can be very problematic.

I live in Asheville, where around 1/3 or more residents are vegetarians of some degree (eat fish or not), so any restaurant here who wants to stay in business, had better feature several veg dishes. But we know, once we travel away from here, we can be in trouble. And the poor vegans have to carry their food along with them!

For instance, just a few miles from here, in repuke East TN, vegetarians are considered something close to Communists, and the menus there show it; if you don't gobble up a pound of meat per meal, they think you are 'weird', and that is not good.

Last week, I was in Orlando (which you might think would be progressive). We ate lunch in a Vietnamese restaurant. Of the (numbered) 52 items on their menu, only TWO were vegetarian, the rest containing meat or poultry stock. Our Vietnamese cafe here in AVL, in comparison, has about one HALF their dishes veg!!

In general, you will have to ask the server whether a dish has meat or poultry stock in it, and try to discern if you are being told the truth. Good luck.

[Cleita]

72. If you really need to eat meat, try to find

some ranchers out in the surrounding countryside who grow and butcher their own animals humanely. They are around and it may cost you extra food dollars, but if you keep your meat eating down to once a week it should be affordable and healthier for you.

I am vegetarian myself and I know that it is hard for meat lovers to give it up. One of the biggest mistakes I found for myself was to attempt to replicate meat with plant food. Nothing tasted that good, so instead I got together recipes for vegetables that I enjoyed as side dishes.

You need a balanced mixture of grains, legumes, green and yellow vegetables and other vegetables like root vegetables. You also need sweet tastes like fruit at every meal. Most people don't realize it but meat is actually sweet tasting and they miss that when they go veggie, so mixing fruit tastes in casseroles and such makes up for that. You can also enjoy desserts more because you are consuming fewer calories with a plant based diet.