How do I deal with this Republican that came to me to convert to Democrat?

[Booberdawg]

I pulled this off another thread that is getting no traction and thought I could get more attention with the appropriate title on this post.

I went out last night with some folks I got laid off with a year ago and I intentionally wore my Democratic Underground shirt because this is Republican territory. It was noticed, and I was asked about it. I responded that I have become a pain in the ass liberal/Democrat. The responses were that is was no surprise I was a pain in the ass. ;)

A lady I worked with came home with me and visited for a couple hours. She is a registered Republican but wants nothing to do with bush* anymore and wanted to talk to me about Democratic alternatives. She is going to change her affiliation from Republican to Democratic because of the 87 Billion extra funds bush* asked for. That was her turning point. For sure, she is not going to vote Republican in the next election. She is looking to me for alternatives and wants to switch her voter registration to Democratic before the primary.

BUT Yikes! I love Jan dearly, but she is prejudiced as hell! She hates Affirmative Action and is indignant as hell about gays suggesting they are entitled to equal rights. *sigh* I was incredulous with her talk about gay rights and kept asking her WHY and she brought up the BIBLE! I got up and walked away and said don’t EVEN bring the Bible into this conversation. She GOT my message. We still love each other.

She is obviously a Republican that wants to convert but her mindset is revolting. She indicates an interest to go to the Iowa caucuses with me too. She wants to go to the Iowa caucuses with me. I am trying to organize a DU meetup in Des Moines for the Iowa primary, but frankly, I’m scared to death to take someone like her with me!

What am I going to do with a potential convert at a DU meetup that is against Affirmative Action, actually she sounds god damned prejudiced when it comes to anything that pertains to Blacks in general, and she is indignant about gays having the same rights as everyone else when it comes to marriage and legal rights? She does not hear “diversity” in Affirmative Action; she only hears special privileges for “undeserving” Blacks. Oh my god in Heaven – what AM I going to do with her?? We love each other, and she respects me, so I feel like I should try. I’m just so flabbergasted at such prejudice and stupidity that I don’t know where to begin without sounding condescending.

I was just incredulous talking to her. You think you know a person??? It's not the same when you meet a person you think highly of face to face. She knows I strongly disagree with her and she backed off. To be honest, I was getting a bit hinky with her hyperbole, and she could sense my discomfort. But she wants to switch her Party affiliation to Democratic because she can't tolerate bush* anymore.

What am I to do?
HELP!!!

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. Let her

she may be waking up but now is dealing with the betrayal

Now ease her slowly into what Affirmative action truly is, remember
she has been force fed much propaganda

Also start where she is coming which is fiscal responsbility

THat is where you start

[Bertha Venation]

2. This won't help, but -- you were so excited about going out w/ five guys

and came home with a woman. ;)

I wish I had an answer for you. Consider: this conversion may be too much for you to take on?

[Booberdawg]

20. I didn't know quite how to respond to this. YES! I can't handle this!

That's why I must ask for HEEEEELP!

I can handle the conversion. I just don't think I've ever had to deal with anything so obnoxious!

But - she came to me??? :shrug: So, I'll try.

So, I just need some guidance. :shrug:

Oh, Gawd! I'm just .... offended???? BUT! I'll keep a straight face and TRY! She is asking. *sigh* I'm just not sure I was cut out for this .....

I'm a smart ass. But, she likes that. Maybe i can work with that .....

Oh, about the 5 guys ... yes ... good karma and hugs and kisses. I was an hour late. Oops! Long story. I forgot what day it was today and got a phone call. There were about a dozen of us that showed up. GOOD TIME! We are doing lunch later. That's for another thread .....

[hyphenate]

24. Well, I haven't read

to the bottom of the thread yet, but there are a couple of things you might want to do: give her a few books to read, like Noam Chomksy, Tom Paine, Gilbraith, or any one of a dozen others that discuss liberalism.

Get her to realize that McCarthy was the biggest bigot ever born in many respects, and get her to look at the records of the different leaders, and show which ones were actually good and which ones were horrendous.

I think sending her to http://www.politicalcompass.org and seeing what her beliefs tally up to would be an eye opener as well, and they also have lists of books for people to read, including some of those I mention above.

I can't think of anything more frustrating than trying to show someone the "error of their ways" but my best friend is a fundie, and has put my name in to Pat Robertson's prayer circle, at the very thought of makes me cringe unbearably. I have tried to bring her back to sanity, but she loves her bible now, and I love her without a doubt and only hope she's going through a passing phase. :\

Regardless, good luck--you will need it.



Edited to correct boo-boo in link.

[La_Serpiente]

3. oh dear

I don't know if there is a candidate on the Democratic ticket for her. I guess Buchanan would be a good choice for her since he is isolationalist and anti-affirmative action, anti-gay rights.

I have no clue though :shrug:

[Booberdawg]

8. She likes Edwards

:shrug:

[absyntheNsugar]

22. Makes sense to me

Edwards is a Christian, and a centrist.

The two are not mututally exclusive. Some Christians beleive that they can sense when another is saved - perhaps she sees that in him?

[bleedingheart]

4. You assume that all Democrats are all the same

which is wrong...
There are a lot...and I mean a lot of Democrats whose views on race, homosexuality, and many other issues that are pretty much stuck in the 1880's...but they are democrats and they vote straight ticket.

I have an uncle (by marriage) who is an anti-semite, anti-gay, anti-woman kind of guy but he is also anti-corporation...and that is what makes him vote for the Dems all the time...

[LoZoccolo]

5. Maybe she'll come around by exposing herself more to the DNC line.

You gotta start somewhere. People don't like to be inconsistent, and maybe she'll start moving her views over little by little as she's exposed to a more liberal viewpoint. I don't think shunning her would work as well - it might, by shaming her, but it might also get her all defensive and it just seems to me this would be more effective. 'twas the idea behind the "guys with Confederate flags" thing to those of us who were looking at it clearly.

[Obamarama]

6. Why not start a customized Twelve Step Program for her....

Then when more and more disillusioned Republicans start jumping ship like drowning rats, you can martket it and make lots of money....

Seriously, though....even though she is espousing Republicanesque ideals in other areas, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Maybe she can be salvaged and made to see the error of her ways....
If she's gone this far, you might be able to win her over and show her the light.

[stopbush]

7. The best thing you could possibly do

would be to spend tons of time with her. Adopt her, as it were.

Is she prejudiced? Possibly. But she didn't get there on her own. It's years of being a repig, toeing the party line, the wink and a nod when code words like "quotas" are used, the legitimizing of the dark side of human nature, etc. This is what the repigs have been feeding the world for 40 years. Can you imagine what it's like for their followers? It won't happen overnight, but as you reveal the good news of the Dem party to her (that there is another, truly inclusive party out there), those prejudices will lose their luster and she'll probably feel even a bit ashamed.

Look, there is nothing - and I mean nothing - more impressive than a convert, especially to the group she just left. You have an opportunity through this person to make real inroads into your local repug establishment. She wants to re-register as a Dem, she wants to attend the Iowa caucuses with you. THIS WOMAN IS HUNGRY FOR THE TRUTH!! The $87 Billion put her over the edge with bush? Imagine how over the edge she'll be as more and more of the truth is revealed to her - the fascism, the attack on our rights, the selling off of our nation. Hell, she doesn't know the half of it - yet!

Carpe diem, my friend, carpe diem.

[bratcatinok]

11. I agree with you!

Don't shame her about her prejudices. There will be time for you to slowly bring her along. I would even go so far as to adopt her and take her with you to the Iowa caucus if she's the type who won't blurt out her views in front of people she doesn't know. Let her take it all in and get excited about becoming a democrat.

Show her the tolerance and caring of the democratic party that we're famous for. Acceptance can win hearts.

[Booberdawg]

16. If she wants to go with me I can't deny her.

She is a lady with class and would not embarrass me. I told her that I would be going with PARTISAN Democrats interested in a LIBERAL Meet-Up. She likes Edwards and I did not ask her why or where she fell on the issues. I have not selected a candidate myself and will advocate for any candidate that wins the Democratic nomination.

[Booberdawg]

12. That was the kind of response I was looking for. Thank you.

[tigereye]

13. I often think it is important to give people information

for them to chew on... and see if that will change their thinking. For some people a change of view is lightning fast ( bolt out of the blue) and for others it is a lengthy process, since it probably took them a long time to develop the attitudes they already have. Also I think a lot of people never bother to question their attitudes, but rather take them for granted. I couldn't help but think, too, that there is a lot of tolerant language in the Bible, not just intolerant. Maybe a good Christian humanist thinker might be the ticket. I also find it funny that Bush et al are able to get away with their "cut taxes and spend" philosphy with the fiscal conservatives... they now justify much of the spending they used to flog we Dems about as Republican thinking. It would be funny if it weren't so disturbing. I hope that that 87 Billion is going to haunt Bush.

[Bobby Digital]

9. let me see if I can help you

When dealing with people who think differently than you in many ways, it often seems like a hopeless project to even get them to try to understand you. I've found that often the best way to make progress is to instead try to understand the other person. I think the first thing you ought to do is abandon any sort of judgment of her intelligence (ie, don't label her beliefs "stupid"), and also try to suspend moral judgement of her beliefs. Try to see what it might be like to think like her--imagine how her beliefs are interrelated and form an entire understanding of the reality that she lives in, the same way your beliefs do. Then ask yourself what is different about you that makes your way of seeing the world so completely different. For example, the Bible is important to her as a tool for understanding the world, whereas you see it as virtually useless. This may be a fundamental stopping point for where you are able to understand each other, but it may not be. Ask her why she puts so much trust in the Bible, and really try to understand how that fits into her entire system, and her intellectual history. I think you will find yourself understanding her a lot better if you probe her beliefs in this way, rather than simply dismiss them or argue against them. I suspect at some point you may both discover that you are reasoning from different premises, and this, at least temporarily, may lead you to a sort of intellectual impass in which you simply cannot agree. If this happens, rather than condemn these differences and attribute them to her ignorance, appreciate them, and try to be thankful that even people with such fundamental differences can feel united towards a common cause.

[Booberdawg]

14. Very helpful. I'll try, but it sounds hard.

[NashVegas]

10. Send Her to the Libertarians

:)

[Iris]

15. Something that woke me up when I was in college

was a one semester stint as a transient student at a traditionally black college. The whole thing was a learning experience, including a few instances of reverse prejudice. I can't even begin to go into the whole experience, but I do remember going to see some guest lecturers who talked specifically about problems that face the black community. The first time, I went for credit, but after that I went because it was really eye-opening for me.

But that's the thing. When I went to college, I was open to learning not just book stuff but about the world andother people. I saw my semester at this college as an experience that really enlightened me and made me see the world from a different point of view. I just don't know how you can convince people who prefer to be close-minded how to open their minds in this way.

I also taught at a predominately black high school for 3 years. Perhaps you could get this friend to volunteer with children of another race. I mean, it's really hard to hate kids, even teenagers, when they are receptive to your help and attention. Maybe that would help her see the "others" in a more personal light.

[Elidor]

17. Oh, I could have some BIG, BIG fun with her!

"First, we have to convert you and your children to the gay lifestyle. Then we'll sign you up for some classes in godless communism at the community college. Then we'll get you signed up for welfare and then we'll get you about half a dozen voter registrations...hello? Where'd you go?"
:evilgrin:

[Booberdawg]

19. LOL! I seriously doubt you are going to convert her to all THAT!

[Buns_of_Fire]

25. I agree. Especially since he didn't mention the "free toaster" offer!

Or is it a microwave this year? Where DID I put that darned premium catalog? :-)

[trof]

18. Confuscious says:

"Journey of one thousand miles begins with but a single step."
We'll take converts when we can, where we can, however we can.
I don't for a minute believe that everybody who votes Dem loves gays and blacks and hates guns.
We bring them along as much as we can, at THEIR pace.
Count your blessings.
:-)

[absyntheNsugar]

21. As an Ex-College Republican

I can only tell you the steps that converted me.

I used to be really into Rush Limbaugh, but more into William F Buckley.

I was in the College Republicans my Freshman and Sophmore years in college, mainly coming from a Republican home.

Anyway, it was issue per issue for me. I beleived in racial equality, but not affirmative action. I was shown the numbers, and given the question "Do you beleive these numbers really mean that blacks are inferior?" My answer: "No." "Then why do Blacks have higher unemployment - you argue for this 'level playing field', isn't affirmative action essentially the levelling of the playing field?"

On gay rights, the question was given to me "Could you stop being sexually turned on by women if you felt you had to?" My answer: "No." "Then we can agree this is beyond their control...now, how as a gay man or woman, simply being a gay man or woman - personally harmed you?" And you can see where it went from here.


Of course in the 12+ years since then, I still beleive in gun rights, but that's just because I fear Freepers - I know how they think.

[Padraig18]

23. "A journey of 1000 leagues begins with a single step"

You've got to get her into the church, so to speak, before you can perfect her cathecism. :)

[SOteric]

26. Baby steps, ...baby steps,

No need to swallow the whole feast in a single gulp.

Start with some small issues she's already at least half-way in agreement with and give her time to acclimate to the bigger leaps.

It's easier to pursuade someone to your way of thinking if you offer them praise and respect for the elements of their makeup that you can.

You know the fiscal issues are a hot button with her, I suggest you get her focused on some of the more progressive approaches to the economy, employment, taxation, health care and social security.

[Booberdawg]

28. Fiscal issues! HER issues. Apparently.

That was a HUGE help, SO. That is very reasonable, and very sound advice.

Oh, you are so wise. *smooch*

[kaitykaity]

27. Her mindset is too narrow.

This woman sounds like a classic case study in
how the Rethuglicans use wedge issues to siphon off
centrist voters. Gay rights and affirmative action are
important, but like abortion they are hot button issues
based more on emotion rather than analysis.

Get her out of the 'social liberalism' box and start
talking about "Clear Skies" and "Healthy Forests"
and "Leave No Child Behind".

Hey, at least she seems like she's willing to listen.
That's a good place to start. Lucky you.

[camero]

29. God loves the supposed sinner as well as the saint

And gave them equal rights. Not the government. Tell her that.

[Spirochete]

30. Turn her on to some literature

and sources of information about progressive issues that aren't straight from the Limbaugh's mouth. That might help her to get a different point of view right there.

[Booberdawg]

31. I gave her the DU website and asked her to read and just look around

and gave her my Booberdawg handle, FWIW.

God forbid she should register and see this message.

[beawr]

32. One from Column A, One from Column B

We are not all the same by a long shot. The issues you talk about, affirmative action and gay rights, are indeed wedge issues. I think there's propaganda that Democrats want to put people in reeducation camps and destroy the white race and turn your children into Homosexuals.

Frankly, I have friends that vote Democratic and are absolutely apathetic to these issues. Perhaps you should show your friend that these issues are not all that important when your overlords are selling your nation out. Maybe that will get her.

[jimbo fett]

33. Is gunplay out of the question? ;-)

[Booberdawg]

35. You want me to shoot her??

:eyes:

[jimbo fett]

36. Just thinking out-loud. ;-)

[Missy Vixen]

34. Suggestion

Get her a copy of "Stupid White Men".

There are many here who violently disagree with Michael Moore, but he addresses fiscal responsibility in his book. She may respond to this, laugh at the jokes, and it may dawn on her that no, he's not Satan.

Another great book for her would be "It's Still The Economy, Stupid," by Paul Begala. Begala can explain complex economic theory to anyone. I seriously thought about buying the book for our friends' 13-year-old son -- we're getting him off on the right foot, y'know. :evilgrin:

I would also introduce her to the highest-on-the-food-chain Democrat in your state you can possibly find; a phone call in advance explaining your situation might help. He or she may be able to help with getting the lady set up with some other Dems who may know how to counter the propaganda as well.

Good luck, you're doing the work of the angels!

Julie
who recently told a Republican trying to talk me into switching parties, "I'll switch when you do."

[Booberdawg]

37. I have all of "the books"

and she would be welcome to read any of them I have.

We are going to lunch later this month, and I'll make a connection with her again at that time.

Thanks everyone.

[Rhiannon12866]

38. Democrats have a pretty big tent and we need all the votes we can get

As for taking her with you, I would be uncomfortable, as well. On the other hand, it may be good for her to be exposed to new alternatives and she could change her thinking. The fact that she is reaching out to you is a good sign. Just take it slow. I believe that no one is irretrievably lost in Freeper-land except the Bush* cabal and my mother.:shrug:

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

39. Hell, she should be fine with Edwards, Lieberman or Gephardt

Let her at 'em.

[Fridays Child]

40. Baby steps, Booberdawg, baby steps.

Get her converted to the Democratic side now, and then work on the other issues a little bit at a time.