"The ideal woman (PERSON) is not a visual image,

[redqueen]

it is one that is independent, free thinking, and able to be a partner and a friend for life." That, IMO, is the crux of that thread. And that's what's caused so much discord in there... cause apparently the point flew right by some folks.

Is it possible that we could maybe stop defending the idea that it's impossible to be attracted to someone who is PHYSICALLY (and therefore superficially) unattractive?

I don't get the stigma and rejection of people who are physically unattractive. I have always found that to be the most repulsive of all stereotypes... that just because your face isn't symmetrical or pleasing to the eye you have to accept that pretty much no one will ever be attracted to you.

Attraction is about more than just LOOKS (or just WEIGHT, which is the tangent many seemed to prefer to go off on).

Yeah, I know... primitive instincts tell us to look for people that 'catch our eye'... well bollocks to primitive thinking. As for me, I look AT people who are superficially attractive... I look FOR a partner who is interesting, compassionate, intelligent, NICE, and easy to talk to. Maybe I'm a weirdo... I dunno... but holy smokin jackhammerin FUCK does it piss me off that that idea gets so much play... that you HAVE to be physically attractive to attract a partner. Actually it's probably just cause I think I'm ugly... but whatever. My point still stands. :P

[Left Is Write]

1. You may be a lot of things, redqueen, but "ugly" will never be one fo them.

[redqueen]

2. Well I was an ugly kid then.

So inside, I am on that team. I always will be.

[Left Is Write]

4. I can relate to that. Very, very, much.

Entirely, in fact.

:hug:

[WildEyedLiberal]

27. Wow, do I know how that feels.

I am NOT saying this in any sort of arrogant way, but I suppose objectively I'm a fairly attractive person right now. But god almighty was I an awkward looking geekazoid kid. It's really fun to hit puberty and start feeling all these funny "feelings" and see all your friends start dating and making out and fucking when no one will even look twice at you because you're the super awkward looking nerd girl. I dunno how "attractive" I am objectively but I know I look a lot less awkward than I did in high school, but you're totally right - the mentality is still there. I'll probably always be insecure about the way I look because I was an ugly duckling.

[Guava Jelly]

3. Makes me think of a verse from the song Desperado

Don't you draw the queen of diamonds, boy
She'll beat you if she's able
You know the queen of hearts is always your best bet

Now it seems to me, some fine things
Have been laid upon your table
But you only want the ones that you can't get


Some of the most beautiful ladies i know to the common man may seem average.
But the common man is a fool!!
Yes indeed!

[redqueen]

5. Thanks...

I'm glad I'm not all alone in thinking this way.

[Guava Jelly]

7. You are not alone for sure

And btw the pictures of you that i have seen are very attractive.
Plus you sound like a nice and very smart woman.In turn that makes you hot :)
So you got it going on in my book :D

[Erva]

6. Your point is valid

I think about it too. Perhaps it is the curse of those less lovely (not you, of course, speaking only for myself)

[redqueen]

8. Well like I said to LIW...

People may disagree, but to me, my face is not attractive.

[Oeditpus Rex]

9. Do the blind not love?

Sometimes I wish I could see through a blind man's eyes.

[redqueen]

11. Maybe they feel people's faces, and reject them if they're not a looker.

:shrug:

[Parche]

10. You are not ugly in my book

And I am still waiting at the bar...............:hi:

[redqueen]

12. Unless it's a sports bar that shows soccer matches,

I ain't goin! :P

[Parche]

13. I Got A Home run Once

When I was playing Soccer.............:rofl: :rofl: :hi:

As long as you dont kick MY balls...................:hi:

[Rising Phoenix]

14. most attractive thing to me

and the number one thing I look for....a good sense of humor

[redqueen]

16. I don't think I have a number one thing...

:shrug:

[SarahB]

15. My criteria is a good taste in films

and the ability to consume lots of beer and salsa.

:hide:

[redqueen]

17. I think I will be enjoying lots of beer tonight!

Yes, lots! (That means two! :P)

[SarahB]

22. That's probably more my criteria for men.

(Not really, but I'm teasing my husband as usual. ;))
I think my attraction to either gender has had more to do with a nice blend of cerebral and vulnerability. Yes, physical is part, but physical beauty comes in so many forms and without the other stuff, there's nothing that even the most beautiful person can do for me.

[SOteric]

18. I have a dear friend

who was hit by a car as a teenager, and skidded some distance on her face, leaving her permanently disfigured.

She's been married twice and has three children.

If that doesn't sum up what a waste it is to obsess about physical imperfections I don't know what does. People who think they can't find love because they've got a big nose, or a little acne are just fooling themselves.

[redqueen]

20. I was bitching about the assertion that physical attraction comes first.

Thanks for agreeing with me that it's bullshit!

[acmavm]

19. You are absolutely right. I've always though that Lyle Lovette is one of

the sexiest and entertaining men on the planet. His sense of humor comes through in his music loud and clear. He's sensitive. He seems to be gutsy and outgoing. I was never surprised when Julia Roberts married him. In fact,I wondered why he settled for her.

[redqueen]

21. Good example... personality shines through, doesn't it?

Thanks!

[TZ]

23. the person I am currently interested in....

I was powerfully attracted to this person before I even so much saw a picture of them. Funny, highly intelligent and very caring...I didn't much need a picture (although I find his face very handsome but he doesn't think he is good looking...)

[redqueen]

24. I'm in that same exact situation...

:hi:

[TZ]

25. *sigh*

not the exact same I hope--this person is half my age and lives about as far away from me as you can get..Logically, not a prayer of anything happen but a girl can dream...and in the meantime I have a wonderful friend to talk to......

[redqueen]

26. Check your PMs

:7

[DarkTirade]

28. I know I'm pretty... I don't care what other people think. :)

Seriously though, I've only dated one person because she was so ridiculously hot that it overrode my good judgement. And, big surprise, the 'relationship' didn't even last two weeks. And I've only chosen to not date someone once because of looks... and we ended up being very good friends. I just couldn't 'make' myself be attracted to her. (And in hindsight, I think I actually helped her self esteem quite a bit... she was at a point where she was willing to basically trade sex for companionship. And the fact that I didn't want anything from her, but rather just liked spending time with her helped her get over a few issues she was dealing with at the time. :) Not that it was my intention all along or anything, but it's nice to know that something good came out of it.)

Anyway, bottom line is that someone's visual image is, unfortunately part of them. Only a small part, but some people don't see it that way. Being as quirky and strange as I am, I can only date someone who is equally quirky and strange, so that's mainly what I look for. I also look for someone with close to my intelligence, and someone who is at a similar point in life as I am (which usually means close to my age, but not necessarily). Other people have different criteria. I can't fault them for theirs, even if their criteria is simply "is she thin and/or has big boobs". Although to them I usually mention the quirky, interesting girl I dated recently who had a natural DD cup... who would never date a guy like them. :evilgrin: (She also had a few other 'talents' that I won't mention to keep this from turning into a sex thread.)

BTW, I wasn't kidding about me being pretty... most women would kill to have cheekbones like mine. :)