Is It Racist To Get Pissed Off When The Person

[lligrd]

answering the support line is obviously from India? Or does that make me a patriot? I have mixed feelings about it but it does piss me off.

[ulysses]

1. it only annoys me

when he tries to convince me that his name is "Steve".

[lligrd]

2. LOL Just Tell Them Your Name Is Babu

What really gets me, besides the outsourced jobs, is that I have to keep repeating the same information because they can't understand me. ARGGGGGHHH.

[alphafemale]

8. And keep spelling it differently.

And do things like this.

My name is Amanda

A as in igloo
M as in phone
A as in zigzag
N as in warthog
D as in smallpox
A as in octagon

[QueenOfCalifornia]

11. Laugh my fuckin ass off!

You are making me spew stuff from my nose.

Bwaaaa Haaaaa! :rofl:

[lligrd]

13. Too Funny

God, I would hate to get you as a customer on the phone.

[petronius]

3. It depends - are you pissed off because the person is from India,

or are you pissed off that the person's language skills are not sufficient to provide the service you're looking for?

[XemaSab]

5. I will admit

That when I go into a store or restaurant and the person does not speak enough English to help me, I'm really annoyed. :P

[Iris]

27. Does this happen to you often?

[XemaSab]

44. Not often at all... maybe 3 or 4 times total?

But it's frustrating. :(

[Iris]

48. There's a lot more in day to day life to be frustrated by.

[XemaSab]

60. This is true

but when you want a burrito and the person doesn't speak enough English to figure it out even with "Un burrito, por favor, con vegetales, sin carne, sin tomates." :P

[Skittles]

62. it happens to me EVERY NIGHT I WORK

dealing with offshore folk who are reading scripts :puke:

[petronius]

40. Me too. I make every effort to meet a person half way, and I'll make allowances for

extenuating circumstances, but there is a point at which inability to communicate becomes a deal-breaker...

[Roon]

4. I am hearing impaired

and I have a hard time understanding folks with thick accents. So, yeah, it pisses me off too.

[lligrd]

17. You Bring Up An Important Point

It is not just India, I would feel the same way if it was anyone that I couldn't understand. Hmm, maybe I am an accent bigot.

[Chovexani]

6. Yes.

If you are pissed off solely due to the rep's nationality, that makes you racist. :shrug:

Hell, my job was outsourced to India, but I always try to be as respectful as possible to the person on the other end of the line, no matter where the other end of that line may be. Probably because before I got laid off at my old customer service job, the numbers of racist assholes who would sigh in relief and tell me "thank god I got someone who can actually speak English" made me want to pound my head into my desk.

[DarkTirade]

18. You also have to consider that some of them might not have been racist assholes... some might have

honestly had a problem understanding someone with a foreign accent. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure a good deal of them were racist assholes, just sayin' there's always that possibility that they weren't. :)

I think that's a problem more in america than elsewhere, for the same reason that americans don't learn as many foreign languages as people in most other countries. We aren't like europe, where they have people speaking a different language right across the street. We don't get exposed to as many accents or languages because they just aren't right near us. We've got our own few dialects here, plus some spanish influence from mexico and south america, plus a few dialects that filter in from the caribbean. (which most americans can't tell apart anyway. :P ) But we don't get much exposure to any really foreign ones.

I had that problem one year in college. We had a teacher whose accent was so thick that even I couldn't understand him. And I'm usually pretty good at deciphering accents and speech impediments. Thankfully it was a ridiculously easy class for me, (Intro to Computer Science. I've been programming since 3rd grade. No sweat... until Excel stopped working on my computer so I missed a few homework assignments, and then I got sick and missed a deadline. But that's another story. :P ) but still there were other kids who honestly had a problem following the lessons. And it had nothing to do with his race or culture or his ability to teach, just the accent itself.

[Chovexani]

19. There's a definite difference.

Either way, I think it's tacky...if you genuinely feel relief at having an English speaker, please keep it to yourself. As someone who's suffered long and hard at many a call center, it's just rude; we can't say anything bad about our colleagues overseas, nor should we, and those types of comments from customers just make things awkward.

I don't think that's necessarily racist though...what I was talking about were the people who would break out slurs and crap when referring to Indian reps. And there were a LOT. I had one guy in Texas tell me "thank god I got a red blooded American girl and not one of those damn ragheads". :wow:

Racists in general made me laugh at that job. I had one guy call up to dispute a charge on his account, and he proceeded to rail against "that ole black gal" that incorrectly ran the charge twice at the store. I sound very WASPy on the phone so I guess he assumed I was white and felt free to let loose.

I wonder what he would have thought had he discovered the chick who had all his sensitive credit card info in front of her, and the power to really fuck it up, was a "black gal". :rofl:

[DarkTirade]

20. Yeah, 'tis quite tacky. Which is another crime, but one not QUITE as bad as racism.

Although having lived through the 80s... I do say that tackyness comes in a close second... :)

I can't imagine having to deal with people like that on the phone though... I'd probably get fired my first time I had to. Screw the 'be nice to the customer' crap, I'm gonna say what I'm thinking. :evilgrin:

Which is probably why I've never gotten a job like that dealing with customers...

[GirlinContempt]

63. I had the same thing.

People would say "Thank god you're in America" blah blah blah.

I'd say "Actually, I'm in Canada"
Quite a few tried to lecture me about stealing 'their' jobs etc.

[yellowdogintexas]

28. I hate those callers too. We have a LOT of foreign nationals and bilingual persons

right here in our 6000+ call rep staff in California, Texas and Arizona. Many times a person could call in and think they were speaking to an outsourced rep when the person is right here in America.

I have a pronounced Southern Accent and when I get these calls that start out with "Thank God you are an American" or some such malarkey I get livid. Funny thing, these callers seem to think they are paying us a compliment...when they may be insulting the guy sitting right next to me who happens to be an American Citizen who was born in Pakistan and emigrated 15 years ago.

I too was outsourced to India from another company, and I was livid but I can't be mean to someone just because they are on the other side of the world. I can be frustrated if I can't get my problem solved due to language or other reason ...and angry about the problem in the first place. I have received excellent assistance from reps I knew were "over there" and lousy service from local persons.


So I agree it is only racist if you are mad because you are talking to a person from a particular location, or of a particular group. Chalk it up to frustration otherwise.

And again, my name is Yellowdogintexas, and we appreciate your business and the opportunity to assist you today

[Roon]

53. Yeah, I drive cab sometimes

and people would comment on how happy they were that their cab driver spoke english

[IndianaJones]

7. No, not racist...a bigot maybe. nt.

[lligrd]

15. Well That Is much Better, Thanks nt

[alphafemale]

9. If the help is good....I don't mind.

And my job IS phone customer service.


But when the English is hap-hazard? At best?

When they HAVEN'T a CLUE about how to resolve your issue.

That's when you fuck with them....

Start talking in Pig Latin or something.

[lligrd]

14. And When They Keep Transferring You To Another One

that asks you the same dang questions over and over. And when you can tell they are reading from a friggen guide and have no idea what they are talking about.

[Chovexani]

45. I've had every last one of those issues with American CS reps

A lot of my co-workers at my last job were too stupid to live much less work for a credit card company.

[DarkTirade]

10. Hey, why can't you be both? :P

Seriously though, if you're taking the time to ask yourself that question, you can probably figure it out yourself. If you're annoyed at this person just because it's a damn foreigner on the phone, then it's racist. If you're annoyed because of a valid problem, I.E., you're having trouble understanding the person on the other end, and you're fairly certain that because of this outsourcing it's cost jobs here, then that's just you being annoyed by something.

And you might even be feeling a little bit of both, but since you're willing to take the time to stop and ask, it means you're willing to examine yourself and fix it if you are having racist thoughts, which puts you ahead of a lot of people in this world.

[lligrd]

12. Ugh, That Is Exactly What Is Bothering Me

Although, I have no problem with the people form India that I work with. In fact I really like a lot of them. And although I hate what has happened to the IT industry here, I also recognize that it is not any of these individuals fault.

I shall try to focus my anger on the real cause and blame the corporations and politicians who are really responsible in the future.

[DarkTirade]

16. And now you've solved your dilemma. :)

Or at least gotten a good start on solving it.

[TheBaldyMan]

21. Not racist if you are caucasian, you are still a bigot anyroad.

[SteppingRazor]

22. If the Indian in question lacks the language skills to help an English-speaking customer...

on an English-speaking support line, then getting annoyed is certainly not bigotry or racism. Being annoyed at incompetence is natural. One expects that other people are able to do their jobs. That said, if that annoyance becomes race-based -- for example, thinking that the Indian isn't doing his job because he's Indian, and therefore stupid -- then you've got a problem.

[Deja Q]

35. THANK YOU!!!

It's nice to read a response that is actually accurate. The OP was not a bigot, nor a racist, as the problem (as I inferred it) was about his inability to hear the words right the first time. That is a linguistics issue, not a racial one.

The other person could be French, with thick accent, and still need to have to repeat things 20 times over if need be.

And corporations, who claim time is valuable yet offshore, really need to be conscious of the fact their customers are running on time too. We lost a lot so their profits can increase.

[DarkTirade]

37. Well yeah, but I thought it was okay to hate the french...

I mean they're just so... French...

[Deja Q]

38. Would you believe... Spanish?

How about a New Yorker? After all, ain't nobody been able to understand Norm Coleman yet...


:hide:

[DarkTirade]

39. The only thing I hate about some New York accents is that they don't pronounce the H at the

beginning of a word (same with the french actually). And since my name starts with an H... gets kind of annoying. Especially since with their accent and without the H, they just say 'You'.

I was always a goody-goody in elementary school, and the one time they made us sit alphabetically, which put me next to the biggest goof-off in the class, was when I had a teacher with that accent. She's point and say "You!" and I'd panic and think she was yelling at me.

[SecularMotion]

23. It would depend on where your anger is directed

If you're angry at the company for outsourcing American jobs and putting you in a situation where you're having difficulty communicating with a support person at a time when you need clear instructions to resolve your problem, yea it's okay to be pissed off.

If you're directing your anger at the person on the support line because they don't speak the language as well as you, then you're a racist.

[yellowdogintexas]

30. qualifier, isn't it the company's fault for hiring someone with less than adequate skills?

I have to say, our offshore reps and we do have a few...maybe 200 out of 6000+ total...have quite excellent English skills...their problem is with terminology and getting the point across when they have to transfer a call to us that involves something they have not been trained to do. In fact, some of those India folks are better grammatically than I could ever hope to be, and have quite lovely accents, some have quite polished British accents with a bit of a lilt (my favorite)

[Deja Q]

33. Especially when the company claims to hire highly qualified workers with excellent English skills...

boasts this claim to the world, and doesn't even bother to blush when the reality hits the customers in their faces.

Your situation must be comparatively unique; most people I know get tired of having to repeat things, asking to have things repeated back to them, dealing with cultural differences and arrogance, being told things will get done and nothing happens... reading articles whose use of English is so hackneyed and stilted, one has to read it thrice in order to make even rudimentary sense of it all...

It's a cockamamie joke. It hurts professional veneer as much as anything else; why should a $400 software product have dialogue boxes containing stilted phrases or, worse, words spelled like "cancelled"?! Premium software shouldn't look as if it was made by a bunch of elementary school dropouts... and yet it is. And yet the company that makes it still is looked up as being a professional entity. What's wrong with this picture??

Gee, Company X may be saving a few dollars - but what the frig about everyone else? Apart from the money we give Company X, for a product that they claim will save time and money, how come we're worth nothing more than the money we give to them; and what happens when we no longer have any money to give them? Oh dear, they go away too. (But that's okay, more walmarts and best buys are opening up in their neighborhoods so it's okay if we suffer for their benefit too.)



And then think of the American worker who didn't get an interview because the company would not accept even one typo on her resume. (I proof-read mine, but those who ask for solid skills should be putting out more than dilettante efforts. The difference is, any typos and mistakes I choose to leave in is because I post for free. It's not a $40 book I'm writing.)

[triguy46]

24. The bigger issue is that customer service sucks, and nationality has little to do with it.

I'm just as pissed being ignored in a store by a snobby clerk as when I face the language difficulties dealing offshore. In fact, I'm probably more tolerant of the offshore tech than the stupid US born "help" that views the customer as a problem or of lower status. Excuse me madam clerk?

[Deja Q]

34. I'm sorry your experiences have been so bad.

I try to be helpful to my clients; some of which are genuinely stupid, but it's not merely uncouth for a person to admonish their customers - it'd get the support person (e.g. me) fired.

The people you are admonishing must be coming from a very irresponsible company.

So excuse me.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

25. A lady my husband works with walked into a grocery store the other day...

Went to the checkout line with her milk and her bread, and the lady checking did not speak a word of English. Lady from work talked to the manager, and he basically told her to fuck off because a most of their customers speak Spanish, so it works out for them. So I guess he doesn't want anyone coming in who doesn't speak Spanish. I told Skip to find out what store it was and we'll stay out of it.
Duckie

[datasuspect]

46. i shop primarily in latino neighborhoods

and speak little to no spanish.

i frequent carnicerias, panaderia, licorerias, taquerias and have NEVER had any problem WHATSOEVER buying goods and services.

would you have stayed out of this store if all they spoke was yiddish?



or this one, if all they spoke was german?



it was VERY common for MANY immigrant groups to have their own enclaves and retain their folkways and languages in the US for several generations.

what SPECIFICALLY is the problem with having spanish speakers to serve a predominantly spanish-speaking clientele?

was the onus on these immigrants to SPEAK ENGLISH OR DIE?







no it wasn't. except those pesky nativists way back when who insisted that "no irish need apply" or "no irish or dogs are allowed" or the kind of people who railed against the kaiser and called germans "jerry" and "anti-american huns."

i laugh at the obvious ignorance of history that so many anti-spanish people display.

hating immigrants has a robust history in this country.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

50. I just think that people should speak English here.

I don't hate immigrants. Why does it always come around to that when someone says this? That's ridiculous. Fine, speak Spanish, but every other immigrant group from Irish to Germans to Russians learned the language when they came over here. Why should it be any different for the people who come here now? My great Great Grandfather came over here for the land run from Switzerland. He spoke French, but he learned English, and apparently was very proud to have done so. And here's the funny thing. He came here LEGALLY. :wow:
What a concept.
Duckie

[datasuspect]

51. when your great grandfather came here

all he had to do was get off the boat, go through a line and bingo! he's legal.

mexican/central american immigrants are not accorded this same "free access" your ancestors had.

funny thing about it, there are plenty of polish immigrants here in chicago that persist in speaking polish, true too with bosnians, armenians, nigerians, etc. etc.

and they have their own ethnic enclaves. and they speak their native tongues.

it has always been the case that first generation immigrants cling to the language and culture in a strange country as a way to feel safe.

the second generation acclimates and becomes part of the mainstream by default.

your swiss progenitor probably didn't come right off the boat and immediately become an english speaker.

i'd probably bet you a bag of peanuts that your ancestor lived in a swiss enclave or neighborhood and kept to his own kind until he got comfortable enough to negotiate the mainstream culture.

i grew up among many, many immigrants. my mother and grandmother immigrated to this country from the UK after wwII when she was a child. and THEY were allowed to simply pass through customs and have indefinite leave to remain in the US, get permanent residency, work, go to school, and otherwise be here legally.

immigration law has changed. the intent of the law is to punish. the intent of the law is to maintain a marginalized, voiceless class: an army of cheap labor that can be had on farms, restaurants, construction sites.

why should there be any push to grant latinos the same options that white europeans where granted?

someone who is living outside the law has a great incentive to be quiet and labor.

and i think MANY languages should be spoken.

i walk the ethnic neighborhoods and hear all kinds of languages being spoken, smell all kinds of foods being cooked, and see all kinds of signs in manifold languages.

and it excites me. it makes the scene more vibrant, less homogenized. and i find encouragement in it. not fear. not hatred.

and don't tell me these prior immigrants came here and became "yankee doodle" overnight.

they didn't. the verein movement in the US was one of the strongest vestiges of german nationalism and identity in this country through WW2.

in fact, german communities suffered during both world wars because many germans retained allegiance to der vaterland.

"swedetown," "jewtown," and "bohemian wall street" were all real places in chicago.

the lower east side was the bastion of european jewry well into the early parts of the 20th century.

no, they didn't dump their heritage just because they came to the united states.

just as you seem incensed because people jump to the "hatred of immigrants" argument, i get really let down by so many "english only" people openly displaying their historical ignorance.

what a concept.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

52. Not historical ignorance...

Yes, they lived in their enclaves, but they did so to make it easier to function in America. They learned English from the ones who were here before they were. The ones who were here first helped the new people find jobs and food. They spoke their languages to each other, sure, but they were proud to move to America and learn the language. No, they did not dump their heritage. No one asked them to. But they assimilated because they were proud to be here.
Do not tell me I don't know my history when I actually have looked into it a lot.
I do not understand how you can sit there and accuse me of these things. Number one, you don't know me, and b, just because I happen to believe that a common language brings countries together and promotes unity does not mean I hate immigrants. I just want to hold them to a higher standard.
Would you move to Germany or France and expect everyone to learn English? I happen to know for a fact you cannot emigrate to France without learning French and learning their history. I guess they just hate everyone so they don't want to let anyone in, is that it?
Duckie

[datasuspect]

56. english is the lingua franca of the eu

you know, i don't have a bad feeling toward you.

i think you are a good sort.

but it was the way you said what you said that made me react the way i did.

speaking in absolute terms like english should be mandated (or so it appeared - i might be mistaken).

please don't misunderstand me.

[GirlinContempt]

65. 'The' language?

The United States of America does not have a language.

[XemaSab]

69. Most Spanish-speaking people are willing to meet English speakers halfway

My 40 or so words of Spanish and their 40 or so words of English? We can work something out.

But sometimes it seems like they're just being racist and unwilling to deal with someone who isn't like them. Which ain't cool. :P

[alcibiades_mystery]

26. Being a racist and being a patriot are not mutually exclusive

:-)

[cuke]

29. You may want to learn how to understand accents

Our health care system employs many foreign born workers. Understanding what they say can be important.

[Deja Q]

31. And depending on who gets paid more, the health care system should be...

giving them English lessons too. They feel it's going to save them money, so it's the least they can do.

[GirlinContempt]

66. Giving them English lessons?

Since when is having an accent not speaking the language?
I mean, sure, those hard core southerners are incredibly hard to figure out sometimes, but sheesh, give them a break.

[ironflange]

32. Thanks for the thread. I just had an idea

I'm from a Ukrainian background, and while I never really learned the language, I was around enough relatives from the Old Country that I can put on an accent that makes me sound like I'm right off the boat. Next time "Dave" or "Kevin" with his thick accent calls me, I'll put on my own accent. Should be fun!

[graywarrior]

36. I get pissed off when I have to call the helpline, period.

I end up asking "what...what...what...what?" even if the person is American. I'd rather stick pins in my eyes than call a helpline.

[FloridaJudy]

41. I'm so blooming grateful

when I finally speak to an actual human being that I don't much care what gender/race/nationality he or she is. After going through the voice mail from hell ("if you want to purchase our product, press 2..."), and being put on hold for eternity ("your call is important to us. Please stay on the line"), it doesn't much matter whether I get Bruce or Kumar. Of course, I would get annoyed if the person had such an impenetrable accent that I couldn't figure out what he or she is saying, but so far that hasn't happened.

Instead I seem to get disconnected while wading through the electronic labyrinth.

[lligrd]

49. You Have A Point

Curses to the inventor of the automated phone system.

[porphyrian]

42. If you're blaming the person answering for a problem you have with US corporations simply because...

...they're Indian-sounding, yes.

[DS1]

43. I get pissed at the companies off-shoring

[datasuspect]

47. take heart

many of those jobs are coming back and going to places like east assfuck, kentucky and barefoot, mississippi.

it's actually getting cheaper to source these jobs in the rural us. can't wait for the dollar to achieve parity with the peso, though. we might get some of those sweatshop jobs here again.

[mentalsolstice]

54. Not pissed off, but uncomfortable

I really don't care about a person's skin color, or what country they're in while I'm talking to them, but if it's a company from which I can reasonably expect English-speaking customer service, then I don't want to talk to someone with such a thick accent that I need an interpreter. However, I don't really go all type-A about it. And I'm fine in ethnic restaurants where the wait-staff may be difficult to understand.

On the other hand, when it comes to my hair...about 1.5 years ago I went into a walk-in salon for a haircut (I was desperate), and the stylist they gave me was Vietnamese...she gave me a good haircut...but the stress of trying to communicate to her about what I wanted was too much! It WAS my HAIR goddammit!

[TheCentepedeShoes]

55. If I'm making the call

it's because I've tried everything and am desperate for help. I'll work with the person who answers. That being said, I've found I've sometimes had to make repeated calls when the reps are not as fluent in English as opposed to when they are. When we had AOL we had a problem that wasn't resolved after four calls to non-natives. Was finally taken care of by a rep operating from stateside.
If 'my name is Steve' calls me pushing some product, then I have a little fun. Had a call last July or so. Asked 'Steve' where he was calling from. He said 'Dallas.' Told him I heard it was verrrry cold there today, he agreed, it was verrrrrry cold.

[Inchworm]

57. Don't hate the player- hate the game

And channel your hate to try to fix it.

Policy is what brought that on.

:hi:

[Generic Brad]

58. Ever considered you may be wrong?

If someone is qualified to do the job, I have no problem hiring them - even if they are foreign nationals. Granted, I do not run a call center. My department looks more like the United Nations than Wichita, Kansas though. It just may be that you did reach a call center in America.

[GirlinContempt]

68. Not speaking about the OP

cause I'm not familiar enough with him, but I've noticed some people who bitch about people coming to America and riding the welfare train etc are the same people who bitch about people in the service industry with accents.
Guess what jobs are fairly easy to get when you first arrive in a country? :think:

[Danger Mouse]

59. I don't care where they're from as long as they can help me.

If their English-speaking skills are such that they are unable to properly communicate with me (I've had encounters support people that were perfectly understandable and easy to communicate with, and others who there was an obvious language barrier with)
It can be frustrating, and I despise outsourcing, so it tweaks me a bit.
I wouldn't call you bigoted, unless you're pissed off soley because of their nationality.

[Skittles]

61. I have the same quandary

I tell myself I simply resent the economic treason involved but sometimes I wonder - it irritates me SOOOOOO much

[edbermac]

64. I get pissed because I can't understand them.

Face to face I can, but over the phone I can't make out two words they're saying.

[IntravenousDemilo]

67. As a Canadian...

...sometimes I find I can't understand phone reps when I call the US, especially when the call centres are in the southern states, and this annoys me because English is supposed to be their first language. It also bugs me when they're obviously reading from a script instead of actually trying to communicate something to me.

Oh, and slightly off-topic, when I say "thank you", it really does infuriate me when they respond with "uh-huh" instead of "you're welcome." We don't do "uh-huh" up here. Is it just a generational thing, or a national thing?

As for the support staff being in India rather than in North America, well, the foreign accent doesn't really bug me, but I am perturbed by the unemployment that offshore outsourcing has caused here. I'd like the government to pass a law stating that all offshore employees of American and Canadian companies must be paid the same salary as domestic employees. You can bet that if they weren't able to take advantage of dirt-cheap labour overseas, the companies would start hiring locals.

[Kali]

70. ...

I got a rather heavily accented "Shane" the other day. I try to be respectful, but that caught me off guard and I laughed out loud. He said "you know, like the western movie" I said Yeah, right.

BTW Kali is my real name. Nobody has ever said anything though.

[Digit]

71. I have sarcastically thanked them for taking our jobs.

Hey, I am menopausal, and I am more vocal these days.