Soooo....I'm thinking about going...to...church!!!

[bicentennial_baby]

:o

I'm a lifelong agnostic, but...lately with all of the turmoil in my life, I'm feeling a pull to get on a different level. I'm seriously considering going to our local UUC a couple Sundays from now. I've been reading their sermons online, and I think it could help me. I'm not about to get on the gawd train, or anything like that, but I think I could use some spiritual energy.

What say y'all? Be gentle!

:)

[GoneOffShore]

1. Try the Unitarians

Not so God heavy.

[bicentennial_baby]

4. That's the one I'm thinking of going to!

So far, I love what I'm reading. :)

[Shakespeare]

2. Sweetie, if it gives you any peace, then GO.

And the UCC is a good church, if you're going to go to one. Aside from any edification you might get from attending, you'll often find that a congregation can be a WONDERFUL support network when you're going through a tough time, almost like an extended family.

Give it a try--maybe you'll like it. :hug:

:loveya:

[bicentennial_baby]

9. I love our local one, they had a banner during the marriage equality fight

that said "People of Faith for Marriage Equality", huge, right over the church doors. :D

Yeah, I think it's the right idea for me. Might be me solo, as the SO is very religion averse (Catholic school, go figure)

Yeah, support network...I could use that. IRL. Good stuff.

:hug:

:loveya:

[KitchenWitch]

3. Part of being able to learn about yourself is being open to new ideas

If you do not feel comfortable in a UCC church you might want to try the UUC (Unitarian Universalist Church) - there are a lot of agnostics and even pagans that attend services at many Unitarian churches.

[bicentennial_baby]

13. Oops, I meant UUC!!

D'oh!

:hug: Yes, that's out local church, about 1.5 blocks away. I can see it from my porch.

:hug:

[KitchenWitch]

26. Go for it.

If nothing else, it may plug you into a supportive community.

[Sugar Smack]

5. *pfffft* Don't ever apologize...

I was going to ask you if you'd got a few minutes to yourself recently. :pals: To cope.

[bicentennial_baby]

18. If we had a Quaker meetinghouse nearby, that's where I'd go

That's the most peaceful place I've found in that context. In my long, strange existence, I've been to RCC, Protestant, UUC, Temple, and Quaker meetinghouse, and I am most at peace among the Quakers. But I can work in the UUC context. I need some spiritual feeling and some peace. Just don't think I can manage me on my own right now, know what I mean?

:hug:

[Sugar Smack]

22. Oh, I totally do.

For your purposes, the Quaker meeting might be good. When bro & I were kids, Dad took us to different churches once in a while, so we could see what it was about. From what I heard (Bro & I were gently moved outside) that's a good gathering for introspection. It's peaceful.

Take good care. :hug:

[Critters2]

33. A Quaker friend of mine moved to a place with no meetinghouse,

but found a Buddhist sangha that had a silent meditation hour each Sunday morning. She started going there, and found it met her needs as well as her meeting had. So, that might be an option.

[quakerboy]

43. What area are you in?

I find there are often quaker meetings in the oddest places.

[lost-in-nj]

6. try to find a

non-denominational church...

and one that flies the rainbow flag is better

my gay friend belongs to a presbyterian church with a gay minister who I secretly hope marries my daughter...
they went to talk to him the other day...

good luck in your search.....
it might bring you peace...
I hope you find a comfy home.....


lost

[bicentennial_baby]

19. Our local UUC flys the rainbow flag, see above

Thank you! :pals:

[greenbriar]

7. check out my church online...

www.newspring.org

[VenusRising]

8. I say....

Do what you have to do to take care of you, and fuck anyone that would say otherwise.

:hug::hug::hug:

[bicentennial_baby]

23. Thanks babe...

:hug:

Yeah, that's what it's about right now. Self-care isn't cutting it, and I need to work this all out. I'm willing to take a leap.

:)

[Pierre.Suave]

10. I understand that feeling completely

One of the reason I sail is that when I do, I feel a connection with my soul. Sailing for me IS spiritual, peaceful, and calming for me and my soul.

I can't explain it, but it happens.

The need to re-center myself grows proportionately with the stress and turmoil in my life. I don't know if you read my response in your other thread about de-stressing, but I do feel it is necessary to connect to your soul and calm it down a bit from time to time. You need to find out how to do that for you, and then do it. If the UCC church does it, great.

I hope you find what works for you so you can live in peace.

[bicentennial_baby]

24. Thanks, friend...

:hug:

I'll see what happens. But, something's gotta give. I'm about to snap from all the stress. I'm open though. :)

[Pierre.Suave]

57. You are welcome

:hug:

Hugs are always nice too, get sniffa to help you out with that. :P

[flvegan]

11. Nothing wrong with that, love.

I'm agnostic too. BUT, I think devoted folks that believe in a chunk of what I believe in is a very positive thing. You share some beliefs, differ in others. Like me going to Roanoke and having a fistfight with Ingrid Newkirk. Stupid. Embrace what you can, move forward.

[bicentennial_baby]

25. Exactly...and, my local church is marriage equality positive, and

I gotta love that. I just have to admit that it's what I want to do, instead of being stubborn. Oh, being raised by a RC and an Atheist. Jeebus!

:rofl:

[cuadrangular]

12. Which reminds me. I haven't been to church in 2 years

By the way, what is the difference between an agostic an atheist? I believe it's that agnostics simply wash their hands and don't want to get into the discussion of whether there is or there isn't a God, because according to them, it's impossible to prove. Am I right?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

20. Agnostics don't know...

Athiests say there is no God...

And...Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[Fenris]

14. UUC is very good

I was an agnostic until my junior year in college. I started reading a lot of Anglican/Episcopalian writings and it really made me feel better.

I was finally baptised last November (my mother was so proud - she so desperately wanted me to be a Catholic, but she'll take what she can get). For someone who was always hostile toward religion, I sure did take to it. I lead Wednesday evening prayer services at our parish and am also a lector. Don't know how it all happened, but I think my well-being has improved.

Good luck!:hi:

[SoxFan]

56. Epsicopalians=Diet Catholics

All the pagaentry, but with 50% less guilt!

[kentauros]

145. Yeah, that's about how it was in our Espiscopalian household :)

I didn't stick with it later in life (went for everything else, sometimes referred to as "new age") but it wasn't bad, either. I have heard nothing but good things about Unitarians, so that's probably the best choice of them all.

Although I suppose you could go with the Church of England (as told by Eddie Izzard) :P


7. Church of England Fundamentals

So the Pagan religion I don't know a huge amount about, but it was this earthy thing. Christianity had split into many different areas - Catholicism still has the fire and brimstone, ( beating drum ) "Row, you bastards!” You know... Original sin! What a hellish idea that is! People have to go,


"Father, bless me for I have sinned, I did an original sin… I poked a badger with a spoon."

"I've never heard of that one before! Five Hail Mary's and two Hello, Dolly's."

"Oh, all right..."

"Bless me, Father, for I have slept with my next door neighbor's wife."

"Heard it! I want an original sin."

"Oh, I'm terribly sorry!"


The Anglican faith doesn't have that. You'll never go,


"Vicar, I have done many bad things."

"Well, so have I."

"What shall I do?"

"Well, drink five Bloody Marys and you won't remember."

[johnnie]

15. I say go for it

I believe that a bit of spirituality in life can really be helpful. A small change in philosophy can make a big difference in living life.

[Haole Girl]

16. It's good to keep an open mind in life...

..about everything.

There was a minister, at a church I used to attend, who called it "weekly spiritual nourishment" to attend church each Sunday. Unfortunately, for me, I've drifted away from going.... and, to be honest with you, I feel it too.

Hope it all works out... whatever you decide.

[bicentennial_baby]

28. Thanks, I'm open to it, and what will be will be...

And at this point, Unitarians can't hurt! :rofl:

:pals:

[Taverner]

17. Why not just join a support group?

[bicentennial_baby]

21. Because there isnt' a support group for

people who have 2 parents that are dying of 2 different neurological diseases at different rates, and who are also fulltime students and newly married and trying to save their little brother from being destroyed from having to keep watch over his dying parents...get it? Big picture.

I know you're an Atheist, but maybe you can't understand my situation, ok?

[Taverner]

70. Sorry

:(

[littlebit]

27. I have never really been into going to church

but the local UUC here helped me a lot last year when girlfriend was in the ICU. I meet some really wonderful people. You should go and check it out.

[bicentennial_baby]

29. I'm definitely going to!

I can't go this weekend, b/c Sunday I'll be driving to RI for my darling niece's 4th birthday, which I cannot miss, but I plan to be there the following Sunday. :)

:pals:

[emilyg]

30. It won't hurt you. Listen to your inner voice.

[bicentennial_baby]

31. That's exactly my plan..

:pals: Thank you. :)

[Critters2]

32. With all the Rev. Wright shit lately, I'd like to take a break from it.

Either that, or a $1.6 million home. Whichever.

Hope you find a congregation that meets your needs :hi:

[TreasonousBastard]

34. Sure there's no Quakers around? Tried...

www.quakerfinder.org ?

I'm a member of a Quaker meeting in NJ (where the wife of the local UU minister used to come for peace on Sunday) but now that I'm stuck on Long Island with no fully active meetings I go to the UU church around the corner. Don't forget there could be Ethical Culturists, pagans, Baptists, Lutherans, Methodists, and others around that are not nearly as God-O-Centric as one would think, and it's usually more important to find the right people in the congregation than deal with some musty old doctrines.

You do whatcha gotta do, though, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise-- whatever helps bring you peace is good.

[bicentennial_baby]

35. Thank you for that! Bookmarked!

there is one abt. 7 miles from me. Nice. I'm very comfortable in the Quaker seervice, been in the meetinghouse many times in my life, probably more than RC/Protestant churches. That and temple.

Thanks so much! :pals:

[Initech]

36. Personally, I'd like to go to Rev. Winton Dupree's church:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EM4hp9kz_A4

:evilgrin:

[SeattleGirl]

37. Hon, whatever works for you.

I'm not big on organized religions, but I am a spiritual person. Sometimes I like going to church; it can give one a connection, even for a bit.

If you find some comfort there, so much the better.

[FloridaJudy]

38. UU, UCC and liberal Buddhist sanghas would work.

I'm lucky in that my UU congregation has both a Buddhist sangha and an active Pagan group. I also have liberal friends who attend various mainstream Protestant churches, and the Reformed Synagogue.

Check out several to find a good fit. A lot of churches are less into God-bothering than they are into helping others.

[Forkboy]

39. That's ok...you'll still be awesome.

:hi:

[bicentennial_baby]

41. Hehe...

:spank:

No worries homie, I won't get all Godly on your ass...

:P

PS Tchaikovsky's Nutcracker Suite is magnificent. FYI.

[Forkboy]

42. I'm against anything with Nutcracker in the title.

:P

Here's a true story...

I used to play a ton of hockey, and we had this one dude who always forgot to wear a cup (how anyone does that is beyond me...it's my first thought). Needless to say, he got hit in the nuts all the time, and you can guess the nickname he acquired.

Ho ho...us hockey players and our sense of humor. :)

BTW, really glad to hear your mother is doing better. To quote the Butthole Surfers, "It's all about lovin' your mum."

[Ptah]

40. The best part of church is the sense of community.

I hope it adds to your life.

[Midlodemocrat]

44. You know what they say

1. There are no atheists in foxholes

2. As long as there are math tests in school, there will be prayer in school.

I completely and totally understand and I think you will enjoy it. The sense of community is very profound when you find the right church.

:loveya:

[MonkeyFunk]

45. There are plenty of atheists in foxholes

the religious just like to believe that everybody reverts to their superstitions when times get tough, but it simply isn't true. It's a way to diminish atheism - it's meant to be insulting.

[Midlodemocrat]

46. It's a joke. Just like the prayer in school comment is a joke.

[elshiva]

99. IT IS INSULTING TO ATHEISTS! I hate that saying.

I think the prayer/math test is kind of cute. But the foxhole joke is offensive. Plenty of atheists are in foxholes. Atheists are everywhere.

[Phentex]

60. there aren't any christians in foxholes either...

what with the ole' Thou Shall Not Kill thing and all...



just a joke of course

[Midlodemocrat]

88. Actually, you are referencing the Old Testament

Christians are a product of the New.

Just so you know.

Not a joke, of course.

[YankeyMCC]

63. "They" being

people who aren't very thoughtful or aware I guess.

[Midlodemocrat]

89. Que?

Not sure what you are saying?

Bi_Baby and I have been friends for many years. She knows that I am a person of faith. I know that she was not until these circumstances.

Just a little humor.

[YankeyMCC]

93. Sorry but yes

very little humor.

I am sorry to bring this into the lounge but I'm not saying you said something potentially offensive to bi_baby but something offensive about atheists.

As I say I don't mean to bring this to the lounge but I wanted to at least give some response because I don't think it's appropriate to use such remarks in the guise of humor in the lounge either without some comment.

[Name removed]

98. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[YankeyMCC]

47. Ever hear of the "Ethical Society"

I'm atheist and although I'm not formally a member yet I often go to the Boston Ethical Society Sunday platforms in Cambridge.

http://www.bostonethical.org/

[Manifestor_of_Light]

48. The Unitarians are the only church I can handle.

The Unitarians take everybody and are not Christian. I've seen former members of all denominations there, Catholic, Protestant, and Jew, and also a large contingent of atheists, agnostics and pagans.

And it's ok to say "I'm confused. I don't have any answers, but I'm looking".

It's nice to go to a church where they cannot throw you out!! There is no creedal test.
There are lots of people who want to get their spiritual and community needs met without having to say an oath they don't believe, or don't want to do god-bothering, or don't think it's anyone's business whether or not they have been saved....when you need a community of friends, it's irrelevant.


And we tend to worship the giver of life....the Coffeepot.

[kwassa]

49. Most churches won't throw you out.

I've never seen a creedal test performed anywhere in any denomination I've been in.

Depends on what someone wants in a church. The Unitarians are less unique than they think they are, and I say this as having grown up Unitarian and seen other things since. It never seemed a spiritual place to me, with zero talk about God or anything greater than ourselves, but your mileage might vary. It is mostly a reactive institution, depending on newcomers in rebellion from dogmatic religious traditions to fill their churches. It tends not to hold on to families from generation to generation, though, because there is no cohesive viewpoint or tradition. I see it as primarily as a secular humanist society, (not that there is anything wrong with that.) Just not for what I look for.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

102. What about lying to yourself?

I have left protestant churches because we had to stand up and say the Apostles' Creed. I did not believe it and it bothered my conscience. I assume you wouldn't want me to say something I don't believe in. Since as you know, you stand up and say "I BELIEVE IN GOD THE FATHER, MAKER OF HEAVEN AND EARTH, AND IN JESUS CHRIST HIS ONLY SON OUR LORD....etc."??

I call that a creedal test. I'm not going to be a hypocrite and say the Apostles' Creed so I fit in.

I voted with my feet as I in good conscience could not recite the Apostles' Creed, or the Nicene Creed either.

[kwassa]

117. That's fine that you leave it for that reason.

Whatever floats your boat.

[Critters2]

139. My congregation never uses the Apostle's Creed for this reason,

but we do use the UCC Statement of Faith on occasion. It's a consensus statement, not a creed and not a test of faith. It's what most UCC believe, but no one has to.

Disciples of Christ use no creeds at all, and many are quite progressive.

[Critters2]

138. I once preached at a UU church, and was asked not to mention God.

I said that, if I was there in my role as clergy, I'd have to mention God in a sermon. The minister allowed it, but was worried. The reaction was surprisingly good--people assumed that talk of God had to be repressive and mean-spirited. It was good for them to see another point of view.

[Critters2]

137. Some UUs are Christians

It's actually the Unitarian Universalist Association, a merger of Unitarians and Universalists. Universalists were Christians who believed everyone is saved. They're a minority among UUs, but they're still there. My ex-husband was a Christian/Universalist UU. His congregation had been Universalist before the merger, so there were a lot of Christians there.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

50. go to it. for those who can belive it, church is very comforting.

[LanternWaste]

51. I don't think it could ever hurt to allow yourself...

I don't think it could ever hurt to allow yourself a few additional perspectives from other religions/philosophies.

(and for what it's worth, churches are a GREAT place to meet friends of all ages...)

I try to hit the services of at least two or three other denominations throughout the year.

[tjwmason]

52. Try it.

There's nothing else that can be said really.

It sounds like the U.U.s would be the sort of place you'd be looking for.

[Sanity Claws]

53. I hope you find what you're looking for

Good luck. I don't see how this can be bad for you. Keep your mind and your heart open.

[DS1]

54. oh no!

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SoxFan]

58. Real classy

Are these people stupid?

[mike_c]

74. actually, I would have preferred the term "insane" instead...

...of "stupid," because the former is an observation of truth while the latter is a disparaging value judgement, but I didn't make the graphic.

The OP asked for opinions. That's mine. The OP did not ask for support, or for opinions of only one stripe or another.

As for your question, substituting the word "insane" for "stupid," yes, I think all of the people you pictured suffered from a form of delusion. I consider that insanity-- high function notwithstanding. It's a common delusion, but that doesn't make it any less delusional. Belief in imaginary beings is pretty insane, don't you think? Living your life according to superstition is way delusional.

[SoxFan]

107. You, sir, are a blithering idiot

You clearly have no clue who Oscar Romero, Dorothy Day, and Caesar Chavez are, what they did, and what they stood for. You're as ignorant, obstinate, and bigoted as any fundy.

[Brigid]

59. Yeah, very funny.

Going to church doesn't mean checking your brain at the door, as you seem to think.

[mike_c]

75. it does mean checking rationality at the door....

Religion is belief in imaginary, supernatural beings. What's less rational than that? It's delusional.

The OP asked for opinions. That's mine. The OP did not ask for support, or for opinions of only one stripe or another, so I offered my actual opinion.

[bicentennial_baby]

Apparently you are unfamiliar with the Unitarian Church...

"Unitarian Universalism is a liberal religion that encompasses many faith traditions. Unitarian Universalists include people who identify as Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, Pagans, Atheists, Agnostics, Humanists, and others. As there is no official Unitarian Universalist creed, Unitarian Universalists are free to search for truth on many paths.

To quote the Rev. Marta Flanagan, "We uphold the free search for truth. We will not be bound by a statement of belief. We do not ask anyone to subscribe to a creed. We say ours is a non-creedal religion. Ours is a free faith."

Although we uphold shared principles, individual Unitarian Universalists have varied beliefs about everything from scripture to rituals to God."

[mike_c]

79. I'm sorry-- any organization that calls itself a religion has to deal with this....

Main Entry:
re·li·gion Listen to the pronunciation of religion
Pronunciation:
\ri-ˈli-jən\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English religioun, from Anglo-French religiun, Latin religion-, religio supernatural constraint, sanction, religious practice, perhaps from religare to restrain, tie back — more at rely
Date:
13th century

1 a: the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion> b (1): the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2): commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance2: a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices3archaic : scrupulous conformity : conscientiousness4: a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith


I mean, if they don't do any of the above, why don't they call themselves a bingo club, or something else?

You might have guessed by now, but I'm firmly in Dawkin's camp when it comes to religion.

[johnnie]

80. It's pretty obvious that the poster is unfamiliar with a lot of things

I completely respect the beliefs (and non-beliefs) of people when they are respectful of other's beliefs, but when they get on some half-assed high horse they deserve no respect. I've experienced enough to know that the poster has absolutely no idea what he is talking about and it's embarrassing to read his ravings.

[mike_c]

82. so do YOU believe in imaginary beings?

Before you call my opinions "ravings"-- and note that the OP solicited opinions-- let's establish our bona fides. I've clearly stated that I have little respect or use for belief in the supernatural, religious dogma, etc.

I'm also not being disrespectful to you, even though we clearly disagree.

[johnnie]

86. The OP said "What say y'all? Be gentle!"

Personally, I thought your "opinion" was about as gentle as shoving coral up someone's ass.

And yes, I do believe in the supernatural. I have no doubts whatsoever it exists and it's just not something to make me feel all squishy and warm inside. In fact, 90% of what I have experienced was/is not very fun at all. But I'm not here to prove anything to anybody, I really don't give a shit if people believe or not. That's their own bag.

[Shakespeare]

62. Wow. That's really beneath you.

She's going through an unspeakably difficult time right now, and if she finds peace in a liberal church, then she has my complete support. I would NEVER mock or demean someone for that.

[rockymountaindem]

66. It's not beneath him. He's posted this multiple times

Apparently oblivious to the fact that it's extremely offensive.

[mike_c]

76. well, as I said up thread, I'd prefer the word "insane..."

...rather than "stupid."

The OP asked for opinions. That's mine. The OP did not ask for support, or for opinions of only one stripe or another.

on edit-- the OP doesn't mention any "unspeakable difficulties." :shrug:

[Shakespeare]

81. I would think, given the poster's circumstances....

....that a person with even a shred of compassion would refrain from being rude in response to this thread.

But you go on with your bad, opinionated self--glad you can feel superior when being rude to somebody who could use a little sympathy and support.

[mike_c]

83. I'm sorry-- what circumstances?

I was only aware of the question posed in the OP about opinions regarding "going to church." I offered mine. It differs from yours, I presume.

[Shakespeare]

85. Both parents gravely ill, heavy stress with school...

...financial worries, etc. If you frequent the lounge at all, you're well aware of this. And if you aren't, perhaps some basic good manners would suit you better. Hiding behind the "gee, she asked for my opinion" is an extremely disingenuous excuse for behaving like a jerk.

If you insist on mocking other posters and find it utterly outside your capacity to avoid rudeness (where it CLEARLY is unwarranted in this thread), then my opinion is that you're a fucking asshole.

[mike_c]

92. I won't say anything further about the matter....

No, I was not aware of any backstory beyond this thread.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

129. Mike, you're better than this

The OP is going through a rough time. She asked for advice on finding a spiritual community. Most people on this thread have given her serious opinions.

This is not the time or the place to play, "I'm superior to you because I hate religion."

[Midlodemocrat]

112. .

:thumbsup:

:loveya:

[LanternWaste]

114. I don't think it's your opinion so much...

I don't think it's your opinion so much that people are having problems with, simply a perceived lack of tact on your part.

There are much more civil ways of putting forth your opinion which don't necessarily include words like "stupid" or "insane"; which, we both must admit are quite pejorative in nature if not context.

Just a heads up...

[Midlodemocrat]

91. Nor would I. I also would never mock or demean someone

who rejected their beliefs due to life circumstances.

Judging someone like that is beyond cruel, but it seems as though Christians are fair game on DU a lot of the time.

[YankeyMCC]

64. Maybe I'm being to serious for the lounge

but that was not an appropriate response for this thread at all.

She's not saying she's looking for an imaginary friend just a place and means of support in a difficult time. And even if she decided to look towards supernatural ideas for comfort it seems rather tasteless reply as you did at this time.

[mike_c]

77. see #74

eom

[elshiva]

100. I am stupid and insane. Seriously, I'm honest about it.

[Phentex]

61. My advice...

at least find one that offers donuts after the service. :)

[shaniqua6392]

65. Going to church can give you a sense of peace and strength.

It helps recharge me to battle the coming week. I hope you will find comfort in going. Definitely try it a few times to find out. It will not turn you into a "Jesus freak" or anything!! It just gives you a spiritual connection and prayer always helps me in times of trouble. Good luck.

[Arugula Latte]

67. Well, the title shocked me, but if it's the Unitarians, then I say, hey, knock yourself out!

You don't have to believe in the invisible hovering omnipotent deity to go there. :D

[WildEyedLiberal]

68. I think it's kinda sad that you have to qualify that you're not "getting on the gawd train"

So what if you did? If anyone here thought less of you for it, then they are small minded, petty people, period. I realize it's extremely trendy and kool to mock religion here at DU - especially churchgoing - but quite frankly, I think a little less of the people who do so. I have absolute respect for atheists, agnostics, and nonbelievers here and elsewhere, but then again, the vast majority of them have enough kindness and tact not to openly denigrate other people's beliefs.

I absolutely think you should go to church if it will bring you a sense of comfort and community. Hell, feel free to believe in "gawd" if it brings you peace and if you truly feel a stirring in your soul. Don't let the snarky professional cynics here make you feel *guilty* about it.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

69. No biggy!

People throughout recorded history have always had some kind of relationship with the Universe or Great Spirit or God or Jesus or whatever. :)
It's the only way to make things make sense, oftentimes.
Unitarians are very tolerant. I have a program of spirituality that was given to me through a 12 step program. Not much for the organized religion stuff myself but for others? Whatever works for ya! :toast:

[trof]

71. UUC won't hurt ya.

You might meet some cute guys.

[Parche]

72. WHY?

Dont do it, you can find spiritual things without church,

Church is a waste of time...


:hi:

[Midlodemocrat]

90. Church is very comforting. Especially the aspect of the community.

When my FIL passed away in his bed here, my 14yo son found him. My church was extremely comforting and reached out to him in a very special way.

Remember. The actual church community are comprised of flawed human beings; as are we all. It is empowering to remember that. That no one is 'closer to Heaven' than anyone else.

[Parche]

118. church

for the people element of it maybe, but i despise the evangelicals, the people on TV mostly
who pray (no pun intended) on the elderly, and brainwash the others.

I am spiritual, but do not need a church, or a religion to tell me what to eat, what day to pray, or what not to eat, or tell me how to live.....

I hear what you are saying, but I still dont like what they try to preach.

:hi:
:hug:

[Midlodemocrat]

127. Interesting.

I actually enjoy the rituals of the Church. I look forward to not eating meat on Fridays during Lent. I love the pomp of a High Mass for example. I also like the fact that every Catholic Church I enter anywhere will have the same 'pattern', so that I can participate.

Funny how different things click for different folks.

:hug: back

[Lydia Leftcoast]

130. Most of us wouldn't atttend a church that told what to eat, etc.

Sorry if your experiences were different.

And spiritual beliefs are enriched and enlarged through community, as when they inspire people to band together to do good.

[Fox Mulder]

96. Agreed.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

104. Unitarians are atheists and agnostics, in case you don't know it.

Dear Parche: They are not christians. They have no creedal test (like the Apostles' Creed or the Nicene Creed in protestant churches).

Unitarians accept secular humanists, atheists, agnostics, pagans, and anybody who's looking for meaning in their life.

They have two seminaries, Starr King School for the Ministry in Berkeley, California, and Meadville-Lombard Theological School in Chicago. Some U-U ministers go to other Universities for their Seminary training, such as Harvard University.

I understand what you are saying about "church" being sick, as Freud said. I agree with what Freud said about religious faith being an expression of neurosis.

However, Unitarians are not Christians or theists.

I do not like Christianity either. I am sick of hearing about Jesus and sick of listening to people who think everybody around them must believe exactly as they do. I know the Bible better than the people who argue with me about it. I took two religion courses at a Presbyterian university as part of my undergraduate requirements, from a man with a Ph.D. from Princeton Theological Seminary. As a result of those classes, I know far more about Bible history than these fundies do.

That's why I like Unitarian Universalists. You can ask questions. In fact, most everybody there is searching for spirituality, and nobody says "I have all the answers".

So if you want to slam christianity, fine. Knock yourself out. But don't lump UUs in the same category as christians.

www.uua.org

[FloridaJudy]

110. *Some* Unitarians are Christians

And some are Humanist, Pagan, Agnostic, Buddhist, what have you. We have a "shared ministry" in our congregation, a married couple. He's Buddhist, she's Sufi. It's "religious" in that we're looking for ways to connect with something greater than ourselves, but none of us claim to have the last and only word or what He/She/It is. And it's interesting to share our different views on what that might be.

We talk about Jesus in our services. But we also discuss Buddha, Lao Tze, Allah, Krishna, the Great Triple Goddess and the Great Spirit.

I suspect it would be rather uncomfortable to be a Republican there, being surrounded by all those anti-war activists and social progressives, but there's no doctrinal test for membership.

[applegrove]

73. Unitarians are great. You never know what the sermon is. It could be

on anything.

[LiberalEsto]

78. I've been a Unitarian for over 20 years

and I love it. The congregation we belong to is like an extended family.

A lot depends on the congregation, though. There are warm friendly congregations, and there are some that aren't very welcoming. We've been in 2 great congregations and two not-so-great ones.

[The Wielding Truth]

84. I know ---April Fools----. You got me.

[Ava]

87. I say go for it!

The unitarian churches are always great, no matter what your religion. i know personally for me, the belief that there is a higher power, whether it be a god(i'm a christian) or just sprituality, and something that connects us all is one of the things that keeps me optimistic about life and the world. ;)

:pals:

[Gormy Cuss]

94. Schweetie...

Go for it. The UUs are very accepting of seekers. I have Jewish friends married to Christians who find the UU church to be a perfect place for community and open exploration of matters of faith or higher purpose.

[qwertyMike]

95. Go where you find Peace and Fellowship

Forget the Dogma

[Generic Brad]

97. Do what you need to do

I hope you find what you are looking for.

[DeposeTheBoyKing]

101. I felt that way after Mom died

I went to a few churches, but none were for me. I also felt the need for some spiritual energy. I hope you find something that feels right for you.

[elshiva]

103. If you are a people person, go.

If you are not stay the heck away. I haven't been to church in months, too many people in a small space, it scares the crap out of me.

[bullwinkle428]

105. I was raised in a family practicing the faith of Reform Judaism, but have been

seriously considering attending some UU services to see what it might be like! I've become increasingly disenchanted with the ultra-pro-Israeli stance that many synagogues have taken in recent years, and am incredibly impressed with the philosophy expressed by UU churches I've looked into. The ones in my area are incredibly proactive in terms of real community activism...actually practicing what gets preached. They also seem to emphasize the concept of the "welcoming congregation":

"While we assumed that our congregation was already inclusive, we believed it important to formally welcome lesbian, bisexual, gay and transgendered people because so much of the justification for their mistreatment and oppression is "religiously" motivated. To assure an environment where people feel safe to "tell the truth of who they are and what they know," our Board of Directors in 1995 approved taking the congregation through the official steps of becoming a UUA "Welcoming Congregation." After completing that process, on Sunday, May 18, 1997 the congregation voted unanimously to become a "Welcoming Congregation," thus affirming all people and their ways of expressing their love for each other, and validating the richness of a diverse religious community."

[GreenPartyVoter]

106. Cool! Let me know what you think of it all, I've never been to a UU church myself. :^)

[Cant trust em]

108. The UUs are alright.

Good fit for a lifelong agnostic.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

109. John Calvin barbecued the first Unitarian at the stake in 1548.

Michael Servetus was from Transylvania. He was a Unitarian, believing in one god, and against infant baptism. This pissed off the establishment mightily. He had the Roman Catholic Inquisition, John Calvin and Martin Luther all after him.

He wrote to Calvin and this pissed off John Calvin. Calvin lured him to Geneva with the promise of a debate. He was recognized at a church service, hauled off to jail and burned at the stake with greenwood.

I've had people ask me when I say I am a Unitarian Universalist, "BUT ARE THEY KEE-RISSSTT-YUNNN??"

My answer is "No, ya gotta problem with that?".


Or they think I go to Unity which is airy-fairy stuff with a veneer of christianity over it, and no bad vibes or angry Jesus mentioned.

[LiberalEsto]

113. And Servetus was once Calvin's friend

Some friend.

Couple of other pieces of info about UUs for DUers

Unitarian Universalists can choose to believe in Christ if they want. They can also worship the Goddess, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, or nothing. The idea is to work on developing and building your own personal beliefs. In our small UU congregation, we have UUs who are also Moslem, Jewish, pagan, atheist, humanist, Buddhist and practitioners of Native American shamanism.

There are UU churches that are Christian-oriented, such as All Souls' in Washington DC, and in the Midwest.

And while Unity is definitely airy-fairy, it also requires members to tithe, which Unitarian Universalists definitely don't do.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

123. I have yet to meet a Unitarian who self-identified as Christian.

The most conservative UU church I ever went to had an "Ancient Reading" which was generally something out of the Bible. My friends and I from more liberal UU churches thought that was pretty damned conservative. Everybody who visited this church had the same reaction: "That's the coldest church I have ever been to. NOBODY even speaks to you."

I agreed.

[LiberalEsto]

128. I haven't met any either

I made a mistake in my earlier post. It wasn't All Souls, it was the Unitarian National Memorial Church in Washington DC that identifies itself as "a liberal Christian church in the heart of the city." I got the two DC churches mixed up.

Here's their web site: http://www.universalist.org/

They are affiliated with the Unitarian Universalist Association.

The Universalist and unitarian churches were separate until they merged in 1962. Some congregations lean more toward one tradition, some the other.

[raccoon]

131. I've been to a UU church like that myself.

"That's the coldest church I have ever been to. NOBODY even speaks to you."

It wasn't just me that thought so either. One of my co-workers did too. A DEPARTING MINISTER said from the PULPIT, something to the effect (but more tactfully, of course) that, what's wrong with this church? Why don't we attract many new people?

I liked some of the services and some of the religious education. After about a year and a half, I returned to a more traditional church.

And of course, cold churches can be of just about any denomination.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

141. This one was in west Houston, where the rich people live.

Every church and fellowship needs greeters that are EXTREMELY outgoing, and really are interested in visitors.

You've got one chance to make a person feel welcome. Don't make a visitor feel welcome and you've lost them.


I've also noticed that the Jewish synagogues I've visited are quite cold.

I visited one in New York City that was Reform and one in Houston that was Conservative.
One person at each synagogue talked to me. Would you like to guess what their agenda was?

They were JEWS FOR JESUS. Infiltrating their enemies. I thought about reporting it to the rabbi to let them know they were being co-opted by friendly people who were NOT working in the favor of Judaism.

[FloridaJudy]

120. I've also been mistaken for UCC

Which offends me not in the least: they're Good People too.

Now when people confuse me with a member of Unification.... :grr:

[Critters2]

135. Not the first Unitarian. There were already a good many Unitarians in

what is now the Czech Republic.

Actually, he'd been expelled from Geneva and told not to return. He returned of his own accord. Neither Servetus nor Calvin come out of the episode looking particularly good. But Calvin was the one with the power, and it was the 16th century, after all.

[tekisui]

111. Any Zen Centers, near you?

Zazen, sitting meditation, can be very helpful. Their is no dogma or necessary belief in god. All of the strength and power is found within yourself. And, this is true no matter what spiritual path one follows. Regardless of belief, the strength comes from within.

Even reading some great Zen writings can help a lot, whether you have looked into that before or not. They deal very candidly with impermanence and loss. They teach how to use moments of loss, suffering and pain as moments of the experience of life. As a way to understand YOURSELF more, and grow more confident in the comfort within.

I can recommend some books that helped me in times of pain. And, I never had to deal with the question of god.

[Deep13]

115. Church is a gawd train. That's its purpose.

If you think there is "spiritual energy," I submit that you are not really agnostic in the first place.

My own suggestion had you asked (I know you did not) is simply to talk to your friends and family about whatever is going on rather than hook your well-being to a train that is going nowhere.

[CottonBear]

116. Give the UUs a try. I really like my local UU church.

I'm a lapsed Presbyterian who has decided that the UUs are just right for me. :)

Godd luck! :)

[Tommy_Carcetti]

119. Go for it

Having a religious belief is a wonderful thing, so long as it is genuine and voluntary and you don't feel the need to push it on people who don't share your certain faith.

I don't know why going to church is considered such an awful thing by some people on this board.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

124. The awful churches are the fundy, pushy ones that have to SAVE everybody.

Whether they want to be saved or not.

Those are the churches I have a problem with, and they are large and get a lot of publicity. They are busy judging and finger-pointing, instead of doing something radical like, say, feeding the hungry, or helping people get jobs and things like that.

I don't have a problem with liberal christians who mind their own business, are accepting of minorities and gays, and actually do something to help the poor and unfortunate, instead of spending their energy being self-righteous.

Fortunately I was raised Presbyterian. They're educated.

[Beer Snob-50]

121. it cannot hurt!

never been to a uuc before but (fire retardent suit on) sometimes my catholic church does calm my mind when things are bothering me.

[The Night Owl]

122. Don't waste your time going to church. Watch the following video instead...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-869630813464694890

[bicentennial_baby]

126. Wow, you're equally rude in the Lounge as you are in GDP...

wow.

[The Night Owl]

133. Describing religion as being a waste of time is not being rude.

Religion, like any set of beliefs, is not above criticism. Because we, as a society, have been indoctrinated to believe that everyone, including unbelievers, should treat faith and religion with reverence, any criticism of faith or religion is taken as an insult.

If you watch the first part of The Four Horsemen video I provided a link to, you will see that the group discusses the tendency of religious people to decry any criticism of their religious beliefs as some sort of unfair attack or insult.

[Critters2]

136. If a fundie came here and did the same thing regarding UUs or others,

it would be considered rude.

Evangelical atheists are every bit as self-righteous and rude as Evangelical Christians.

[The Night Owl]

144. Offering an opinion, which is what I did here, is not evangelizing. {EOM}

[OmahaBlueDog]

125. Whatever Gets You Through the Night

I think John Lennon said it. It might have been the Pope, though.

Go to church. If you like it, keep going.

[raccoon]

132. John Lennon had a song by that title. nt

[TexasBushwhacker]

134. I attended UUC for years

Unitarian Universalist churches can vary a lot from church to church, so if there is more than one in your city/town, consider going to different ones to see which one is the best "fit". Also, try going to their adult "Sunday School" before the regular services. You can choose which class to go to and you get a chance to connect with other UU's on a more personal level.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

142. They vary an awful lot.

Some are rich and some are poor, some are suburban and some are inner city.

[TexasBushwhacker]

143. They vary in other ways too

Some are close to a Congregational Church. The say "Let us pray" rather than having a "moment of silence" or a "moment of meditation". Others are fellowships that don't have an official minister and have different speakers every week. Some are frankly, more political than others. Even though I may agree with the politics, I still don't think they belong in church, even a Unitarian church.

I will say, one of the things that I thought was really cool about the UU's when I was growing up was that we had sex education. You had to have your parents permission, but it was straightforward and factual, and covered the regular birds and bees stuff, but also masturbation, birth control, STD's and homosexuality. Our minister and his wife lead the classes, and it was cool to be able to talk to an adult about this stuff without the embarrassment of talking to your parents. I think the parents were relieved too! This was all in the early 70's!

[Shine]

140. Spiritual energy is always a good thing, in my book

however you choose to feed your soul is what makes it worthy. :thumbsup:

[4_Legs_Good]

146. I'm almost in the arena of "Recovering Catholic"

and that's a term that I really, really hated for a long time (and still do, I guess). I'd like to remain Catholic, but my parish has gotten too right wing, and the last several years have finally driven me far enough away that I don't think I'll go back.

But I also have a wife and 2 kids, and the wife still kinda wants to go somewhere, and I think the kids should have a spiritual side, if not necessarily a religious one.

So I don't know what to do. I'm thinking UUC might work, but I don't know enough about it. I'm not into the whole "church" scene, which is one reason I liked Catholicism, you could kinda remain anonymous. I wouldn't really consider going to any church that was at *LEAST* 99% in agreement with what I felt. If I'm going to roll my eyes and turn a blind eye to 1/2 of what I'm being lectured about, I might as well stay Catholic.

Any ideas?

David

[TomBall Democrat]

147. UUC - all the spirit - none of the religion 0

it'll be good.

works for me.

[redqueen]

148. I've flirted with that idea for forever...

but I'm somewhat phobic, so... I don't. :P

But if you do I hope you enjoy it!