OK, I know this is heresy to some, but I think Frank Sinatra's voice is one of the blandest,

[Flaxbee]

most boring singing voices I've ever heard. I know the songs are classics, but his delivery just does NOT appeal to me in the slightest.

Tell me, what am I missing?

OK - fire away! :nuke: :hide:

[Droopy]

1. Get high or drunk and then listen to him

There's something in that voice that can only be discerned by the intoxicated brain.

[Flaxbee]

5. well, I've never been high, and I don't like feeling drunk, so

I guess I'll just have to sit this one out. :)

[Fox Mulder]

2. You're missing nothing.

Everyone has their own tastes. If you don't like his voice, so be it. You don't like it. There's nothing wrong with that. :)

FYI, I couldn't really care less about his singing.

[Flaxbee]

6. thanks

:)

I just never really understood what all the dither and fuss was about. :shrug:

[Parche]

3. OK Flaxee

I will "Start spreading The news"

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

:hug: :hi:

[Flaxbee]

7. hiya, Parche!

How're you doing? :hi:

:hug:

[Dangerously Amused]

4. His voice has no nuance. And it's flat, like he never got the hang of vibrato.

Where he should have vibrato he just increases the volume to compensate.

[Flaxbee]

8. yeah, that's it. Flat

and without nuance is the best way to describe it. Sure, he can holler and stay on key, but so what? For me, his voice is like nails on a chalkboard.

[Deep13]

9. He doesn't have much range. nt

[Flaxbee]

15. then why is he considered to be such a god?

:shrug:

[Deep13]

20. Unkown.

I have lately been wondering that about someone else.

[Flaxbee]

25. Who?

...would love to know, if you're willing to tell. I often don't really understand the hype of a lot of artists.

[grace0418]

10. That's so weird! On Saturday I was in a bookstore that was playing a Frank Sinatra

greatest hits album and I said to my husband "I just realized that I like most of these songs but only when someone else sings them. Frank Sinatra actually has a rather weird voice."

[Flaxbee]

16. I heard him this weekend, too, and

it dawned on me that I just *really* did not like his voice or singing. I mean, there is no active dislike going on here, but I realized that I had no idea why he appealed to so many people.

[grace0418]

37. Agreed. It's flat and has no charm (for me anyway). I like plenty of singers who

don't have traditionally "good" voices but they have something charming, heartfelt, full of character that makes them enjoyable for me. If I were to listen to Frank Sinatra without any advance knowledge or context of his voice or his fame, I would be very surprised to find out he made as big as he did.

[Shine]

11. No flames here. I totally disagree, but everyone is entittled to their own opinion

"Live and let live", I say. It's all good.

Thank goodness for differences, otherwise we'd be bored as shit. :D

[Flaxbee]

18. Oh, I agree with you completely, Shine - to each his/her own,

absolutely.

But I'm curious - what is it about him that appeals to you? Do you like his voice? The way he delivers the lyrics?

Some singers just give me goosebumps, I love their voices so much. Sinatra makes me want to leave the room. But I'd love to know what a Sinatra fan likes about him - in the spirit of true, honest, genuine, respectful curiosity.

[Shine]

33. I think his voice was smooth and his persona was hip.

also, for some weird reason, I happen to know he has the same b'day as MrShine (12/12), so I feel a bit biased towards him. Funny, but true. :D Yeah for Sagg's!

[CBHagman]

12. Actually, I agree with you.

I'll join you behind the barricades. I like some of the early Sinatra, things like "All or Nothing at All" or "I'm a Fool to Want You," but generally his phrasing and his voice in general leave me with that meh feeling. I don't hate him; I'd just take nearly any big band, jazz, cabaret, and/or musical theater singer over him. Bring on Ella! Bring on Alfred Drake! Bring on Joe Williams and Nat King Cole and Lou Rawls and Dinah Washington!

[Flaxbee]

19. ....and Etta James and Nina Simone and Koko Taylor and Ruth Brown

and BB King and Ray Charles and .... Peter Gabriel and Bonnie Raitt and Leonard Cohen (and on and on). There is soul in those voices.

[mitchum]

13. Ya know ya gonna get whacked for that , sweetheart

I agree with you about his voice
I prefer his acting to his singing

[Flaxbee]

21. .

:D

Yes, his presence on-screen could be riveting. Just don't sing, please, Mr. Sinatra.

[MissMillie]

14. Bennet was so much better

I'm w/ you.

[Flaxbee]

22. :)

:hi: MissMillie!

[timtom]

17. Early Sinatra ca. 1937 - 1945

is tops.

After that, he is just a faded dream.

[Flaxbee]

23. what happened?

did his voice not age well? Too much debauchery with the Rat Pack?

Hm. I'll try to make a point to listen to some of his earlier work, see if I can "get" his appeal. Thanks for letting me know what to look/listen for.

[CBHagman]

53. I seem to recall...

...he did a recording of "All or Nothing at All" with Harry James early on. You should be able to locate a download and/or sample online somewhere.

[Zavulon]

24. In my view, nothing.

I always thought that only the Beatles were more overrated than Sinatra, and I'm surprised you haven't gotten it worse because of your post. I've taken some real heat for writing anti-Beatles posts here.

[Flaxbee]

26. me, too

I was expecting to get scorched! :D

I like the Beatles in small doses - their voices don't grate on me the way Sinatra's does, but they get old real fast.

[Zavulon]

28. I would rather

watch George Bush at a spelling bee than listen to even five seconds of the Beatles. :puke:

[Flaxbee]

31. lol!

What is it about the Beatles?

Every time I see your DU name I think of Warren Zevon...

[Zavulon]

35. I wish I could explain it.

The Beatles are to me like nails on a chalkboard to others - perhaps because of the carpet bombing of our ears by DJs playing Beatles songs 2-4 times an hour on the radio during my childhood. Perhaps it's my utter bewilderment that anyone considers them to be anything more than a bubblegum band of extremely limited talent that was in the right place at the right time. It could be because I haven't heard a single song I like from them. Or, perhaps, it's a combination of all of these annoyances.

As for my screen name, it comes from these two movies:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0403358/ (The quote in my sig line can be found here: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0403358/quotes)

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0409904/

:hi:

[timtom]

57. I know what you mean about the Beatles

Overexposure drained their work of any power.

A couple of years ago, however, I relistened to their stuff and was surprised at how musically satisfying it all is. It's hard, I know, to get beyond the familiarity of it and hear it anew.

[Zavulon]

70. That would indicate, however, that

you liked the songs to begin with. I never did.

I freely admit that I have the narrowest taste in music of anyone you'll ever meet or speak to. If it's any softer than 70's Foghat, Rush or anything in Iron Maiden's Dickonson-era catalogue, the chances of me liking it are very slim. The Beatles, to me, are as bubblegum as The Monkees.

[woofless]

27. I think what you describe as "bland" and "boring" is kinda

what I like about Sinatra. His style is more "conversational" or something. It's more like he is speaking instead of singing. He's clear, he enunciates and he is obviously doing what he loves. "My Way" is over the top but songs like "Last Dance" or "One For The Road" are way cool. One old rocker's opinion.

Woof

[Flaxbee]

30. I think that's what my brother in law likes about him -

that there seems to be a conversation going on.

I don't have a problem with the songs, they are usually interesting, so much as his voice. It just doesn't move me in any way. I do very much appreciate that I can understand what the hell he's saying (I feel like such an old fart with so much current music, or like I have a hearing disability, because I can never really distinguish the lyrics).

Thanks for your input! :hi:

[grasswire]

29. you honestly don't know?

Somewhere around 1950, Frank suffered a vocal cord hemmorhage and lost his voice. He never regained its full power or timbre.

Prior to that time, his voice was just amazing. Go to you tube and listen to some of those earlier recordings.

After that time, he retained the exquisite phrasing and breath control, but the beauty was gone. He got a lot of mileage from simply being ultra cool.

One of his wives called him "the Mercedes of men." Count me as a Sinatra fan.

[Flaxbee]

34. no, I had no idea.

That makes sense; I'll got check out some earlier recordings. Any song in particular you'd recommend - an earlier title or recording or something so I can make sure I hear him pre-hemmorhage?

I know he was uber-cool, he had a lot of charisma, I just never understood the appeal of his voice. Perhaps all I've heard is crappy 'best of' compilations that only offer his post-trauma recordings.

Thanks for telling me!

[grasswire]

32. Honestly, Mel Torme is the best singer of that era.

He had everything. Phrasing, a voice like an angel, incredible range....just unbelievable. If you want to hear a treat, check it out on youtube.

[Flaxbee]

44. I should listen to Mel, too. Reminds me of Night Court -

didn't Harry *loooooooove* Mel?

[SacredCow]

64. Very much agree....

Torme was (and is) sadly under-appreciated. I suppose it was at least partially because he didn't have Frank's looks.

[Pierre.Suave]

36. I think the only reason I like him over some others

Is that I enjoy singing along with him while dancing or snuggling with my Fiancee...

And that is all the reason I need.

[Flaxbee]

45. my sister and brother in law like him for that reason, too --

they can connect with it while being together.

[Bake]

38. Hey, I don't care for his voice.

It's pretty thin, no range whatsoever, and very much sounds like a "chest" voice rather than a "diaphragm" voice. I've never been impressed with his delivery. He couldn't carry Tony Bennett's mic case!

But having said that, the dude was cool.

Bake

[Flaxbee]

46. Yep, cool and charismatic.

Another good way to describe it - chest vs. diaphragm. And Tony has/d a lovely voice, with a lot of feeling.

[Guava Jelly]

39. Blasphemy

http://youtube.com/watch?v=x3y28-5NPVc
Frank Sinatra - In The Wee Small Hours of the Morning
http://youtube.com/watch?v=X9OE60jdRaM
frank sinatra - all the way
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YZMQ07NBWp0
Frank Sinatra-Softly as I leave you
I just love him.
I don't expect everyone to get it.
If we all had the same taste life would be bland

[latebloomer]

41. Oh God, I adore him too!

His voice and his impeccable phrasing were romantic, passionate, emotionally astute. He sang some of the best songs ever written, though he did make a few mistakes tryin to be hip in the 60s and 70s.

I disagree about his voice being gone after 1960-- the Capitol years in the 60s were the absolute best, as he matured as a singer and as a man.

In the early 80s I saw him perform in Atlantic City-- by then his voice WAS pretty much gone but he could still convey the emotional essence of the song. And what style, what charisma still!

He has a special meaning in my life-partly because he was of my father's generation and he reminds me of him. And I just love the old standards that he performed so well.

[Flaxbee]

48. I can certainly understand the memory connection -

-- just disagree with the voice part. To me, no richness to it.

But as has been said many times in this thread, to each his/her own. Diversity is what it's all about. :)

[Flaxbee]

43. lol

:D I am a blasphemer, it's true.

I know many who do really love him, I've just never gotten it. And as soon as I get dinner fixed, I'll come back and pay attention to the links you've posted. Thanks, GoPsUx, and happy birthday! :party:

[Guava Jelly]

47. You are welcome

:D And thank you.
I do agree that Frank did record a few stinkers
Bad bad leroy brown was pretty bad and George Harrison's.. Something.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

40. I don't like crooners at all.

No range, no emotions expressed. Just flat.

OTOH, I think Judy Garland was great!! She poured her heart into her singing.


Nota Bene: I have many years of classical training on two instruments and voice, and grew up listening to 60s British Invasion rock & folk, which I consider to be high quality music.


My old music teacher thought Johnny Mathis was an excellent singer.

[Flaxbee]

42. my mother loves / loved Johnny Mathis --

My mom has perfect pitch, which she did NOT pass along to me X(

As for Frank, it just never seemed to me that his voice changed, no inflection, just *there* and tepid. Oh well.

[grasswire]

49. Frank Sinatra, 1947

His manner is a bit like David A.'s (American Idol runnerup). Very young, a bit shy. No wonder the bobby soxers swooned and screamed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlujPZ64ZvI

[grasswire]

50. early Mel Torme

Check this out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWWVGyxvSCk

[Flaxbee]

51. thank you, grasswire --

you and GoPsUx gave me some youtube videos to watch/listen to -- I need to finish a few things around the house, and as soon as I have a moment to myself, I'm going to listen carefully.

I appreciate it! :hi:

[My Good Babushka]

52. I like bad voices

It makes it easier for me to sing along. I don't have to feel like I'm ruining it.

[porcelain_doll]

54. Yucky.

:)

[grannylib]

55. I'm not a big Frank fan either. For crooners, give me Dean Martin

any day. We have a couple of his Christmas albums and I don't mind Dean at all.

[raccoon]

59. For crooners, give me Eddie Fisher. nt

[Skittles]

56. I absolutely agree

and I was never impressed by his acting skills either

[raccoon]

58. I totally agree, and I think he looks like a little weasel. I don't see

how he ever got popular. Oh, wait, Mario Puzo told us about that.

[raccoon]

65. Hmm, nobody responded to that. Remember in "The Godfather," the character

Johnny Fontane? He was said to have been modeled after Frank Sinatra.

Edited for grammar.

[graywarrior]

60. I like Dean Martin better.

[Left Is Write]

62. As do I.

But it's still heresy.

[graywarrior]

63. Yes, it is.

And I wondered if you'd respond to my post.

:rofl:

[Left Is Write]

61. You're right.

That's heresy.

[MonkeyFunk]

66. His "delivery"

was everything. He's one of my all-time favorite singers, and one of the few male singers I really love to listen to.

But, to each his own, I guess. I've heard people say they didn't like Ella Fitzgerald. :shrug:

[TreasonousBastard]

67. I never liked him either-- just another club crooner, but...

he has something that appeals to some people. Crooners don't appeal to me much, and even the best, like Bennet, Torme, Crosby... don't do anything I would pay for. Don't dislike 'em, just don't care much.

Dean Martin, though. He had an edge snd a sense of humor. Great baritone voice and he didn't seem to take himself, or the whole star thing, too seriously. I might pay for some Dean Martin.

I seem to remember my mother saying something about picking up a few bucks way back when by being one of the paid screamers at Sinatra's early appearances. She didn't think much of him either, but some extra cash was needed back then. (And it was a free concert.)

[Flaxbee]

68. So, I listened to the youtube links provided by GoPsUx and grasswire --

and while I can understand the appeal - especially because those clips seem to have been recorded before he had his vocal cord hemmorhage - he just doesn't do it for me. The songs are lovely, poignant, even, but his voice doesn't grab my heart the way others do.

:shrug: To each his/her own.

Mel Torme's voice (comparison songs provided by grasswire upthread), on the other hand, sounded much more melodic to me.

[mvd]

69. I love his voice

I'm a fan of the smooth crooning - maybe you just aren't. :hi:

[latebloomer]

71. I once had a dream

that my hand got cut off and Frank Sinatra was a surgeon and sewed it back on.

I decided that this meant I FINALLY had to take singing lessons- I love his type of music so much and it fulfills me to sing it- not singing meant a crucial part of myself was missing.

So I did take lessons for a couple of years, and found it fun, empowering but difficult.

I wish I could tell you I'm now a cabaret singer, but I'd be lying. I just wasn't that good.

:(