My cat's diabetic.

[TroglodyteScholar]

I found this out yesterday. The vet wants to change his diet AND put him on insulin on Monday. Seems to me, if you were going to change a cat's diet b/c of diabetes, you'd want to do that before you try to determine what the insulin dosage is going to be. Am I missing something?

So anyway, the bogeyman is carbohydrates. My cat's always been fed on dry food, which is apparently really bad. So the doc wants to put him on this prescription canned food. But from what I've read on the net, even the prescription Science Diet and Purina varieties aren't the lowest in carbs.

Anyone got any experience with this? What's a guy to do?

[ThatsMyBarack]

1. I'm so sorry....

For you and your kitty. :hug:

My BIL found out one of his cats was diabetic three months before he and his wife (my sis) had their first kid (my nephew). I couldn't help thinking wow, they're really gonna have their hands full!

[applegrove]

2. I've given shots to cats who were diabetic before. The cat was used to it so it was

no big deal. That's all I know.

[dmadhavi]

3. Some resources

I too have a diabetic cat and found some of these forums very helpful in the beginning.

www.yourdiabticcat.com
www.felinediabetes.com

There are other low carb canned food options for your cat...Fancy Feast has quite a few. Please check this site for carb content for 'as fed basis' and go with food with less than 10% carbs. www.geocities.com/jmpeerson/CanFoodOld.html

I am glad your vet is at least suggesting canned food (Purina DM I assume) and insulin, many don't! Since you cat was on only dry food, I am very hopeful that a low carb canned food diet may even make the cat go into remission without insulin. Please visit www.yourdiabticcat.com, you will see a number of cases where the diet change made all the difference!
Diabetes is very manageable in cats. Good luck to both of you.

[TroglodyteScholar]

15. Thanks for the resources

The vet did give us a can of Purina DM to try out...although he has always thrown up canned food immediately after eating it, he seems to tolerate the DM pretty well.

I came across that list of cat foods yesterday when I was doing research, but it seems like many of the good foods aren't available in my town. I don't have a problem getting food from the vet, I guess, but I still wonder if it's wise to begin administering insulin before I've changed over his diet...

But thanks again, I'll check out those sites....

[MsTryska]

4. feed him raw!!

that's what I do with my kitty. He does get soem extra-special high-grade Kibble from harry's for breakfast, but at night he gets raw meat.

He's been hyperthyroid for about 6 years now, my Vet said he is one of the best-looking hyper-t cats he's seen - keeps weight on, has a great coat is managing his muscle tone.

i get my food from www.hare-today.com

for one cat it's pretty reasonable and convenient - and they ship to GA.

[stuntcat]

7. I'm gonna check that out, ty

I give my oldest cat little bits of raw chicken sometimes, I don't even eat meat but I buy it special for Tonka.

[MsTryska]

11. I highly recommend it...

I was at my wits end with the problems both my kitties were experiencing, it was amazing when i changed them over to the food they were supposed to eat how many of their problems (coat issues, UTI issues, weight issues, behavioral issues) went away.

[stuntcat]

5. poor little guy

I hope the food change/injections starts up with no problems.

I don't know any advice. We inherited a kitty from my dad who had to have the shots every day and he was a pretty good sport about it.

[Maine-ah]

6. you can do at home testing.

it worked for us. This message board was so helpful, and full of kind and compassionate people. I eventually was able to control the diabetes with diet, home testing, and the occasional insulin shot.

http://felinediabetes.com/terms.htm

This message board does contain a TON of info, and can help you imensly.

For food I used was solid gold.

[TroglodyteScholar]

16. After the research I've done, I'm surprised that my vet didn't mention home testing

From all I've read, a hypoglycemic 'crash' can really threaten an animal's health, too...and immediately.

[Maine-ah]

20. heh, by the end of it all, I knew more about it than the vet did

I gave him the sites to check out so he could try to learn more, but I don't think he bothered. They gave me a load of crap for testing at home.

[Critters2]

30. I was the same way when I had a crf cat. I'd give info to the vet,

and after a while, she stopped even verifying what I said before changing his diet/treatment. She now tells me she has two cats on the treatment program I worked out for Ari.

[Lady President]

8. I had a diabetic cat

It really isn't that bad. The shots don't appear to hurt much because you just pull some lose skin on the back and give them the shot. I gave him shots for several years. My family and friends learned to do it too.

My cat refused to eat the prescription canned food. He only liked hard food. I switched him to a hard food for kittens because it was much lower in carbs. Also, cat snacks are high carbs, so for a treat I gave him a little piece of turkey or ham. The vet okayed this plan, but you might want to check with yours.

Also, it is tough to get a good sugar reading on an animal at home. The urine strips are so-so and spending the day at the vet stressed my little guy. I had to take him in for a blood draws frequent the first couple months until the appropriate amount of insulin was established, so switching foods and adding insulin at the same time should be fine for your cat. I just bought the insulin and needles at the pharmacy in the grocery store. The vet disposed of the used needles for me.

If you have any questions, let me know. Give your fluffy friend a pet for me. I promise this won't be a big deal in a couple weeks. :hug:

[Maine-ah]

22. I never used the urine strips

I used the same ones you would get at the pharmacy, using blood. Drew blood from the ear, and tested. Way more accurate.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

9. I had a diabetic cat..

Sadly, he passed away a couple of years ago, but not from anything related to diabetes. I gave him insulin shots twice a day, which didn't seem to bother him at all, and fed him the special food most of the time, or other low-carb food. He got along fine for about 7 years after he was diagnosed. My ex had a diabetic cat who lived (pretty normally) to be about 18.

[jobycom]

10. I've raised generations of cats on dry foods.

My mother has a twenty year old cat that still fights dogs and leaps onto the table--you'd never guess she was old.

I think the biggest problem is over-feeding and under-exercising, which makes the cats overweight, and that leads to diabetes. My mother's cat is an outdoor car, and has no weight issues. My indoor cats have all had obesity issues. A friend of ours was told by the vet to turn her cat into an outdoor cat, and she lost a lot of weight. She's well over ten, too, but no one knows how old. (I'm not recommending turning your cat out, just illustrating that part of the obesity issue in cats is like that with humans--easy food, no exercise).

One way we overcame the obesity issue was simple--we raised the cat food up on a table, so the cats had to jump up to get fed. This was almost impossible for one cat, who had the rough shape of a basketball, but after a few weeks, she had lost a lot of weight. She's sixteen, and while not as remarkable as my mother's cat, is pretty darned spry. The idea was not only that they'd get a little exercise getting to the food, but also that they'd only bother jumping up there if they were really hungry. Like humans, cats will eat themselves silly if they are near their food all day. We also limited the amount of food we fed them each day. They whined a lot, but now they even leave food. All three have become a normal healthy weight.

I've got two other cats I've tried to get thinner just by changing their diets, and neither has lost anything.

So, use your imagination and listen to your vet, but that's been my experience. Forcing a cat to become more active helps more than changing food.

It might be too late for your diabetic cat to make simple changes--I don't have experience with that. I'm just saying that dry food isn't the biggest part of the problem, and canned food may not be the only solution.

One last thing, though your vet will probably mention it. Cats, especially obese cats, can starve themselves into fatty liver syndrome, where the liver begins breaking down the cat's bodyfat too fast, and the cat stops eating, and goes into a vicious cycle where she can't eat because her liver things she's full because of all the fat it is digesting. One of my cats was put on a diet, and I thought it was working, but she was simply not eating anything. It costs thousands of dollars and a lot of work on my part force-feeding her to save her, and even then she barely made it. So just watch to make sure your cat does eat whatever new food you give her. They will starve themselves to death--I had always heard otherwise, but now know better. If she's finicky for a couple of days, that's not bad, but if she hasn't eaten substantially in three or four days, it can be an issue.

Hope that helps. I'm not a vet, so don't listen to me over a vet. I'm just a person with a lot of cats. :)

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

12. Hmmm. Maybe I should put my own food on the roof...

[jobycom]

13. You've heard of Simon Stylites?

Saint Simeon Stylites or Symeon the Stylite (c. 390 – 2 September 459) was an Arab<1> Christian ascetic saint who achieved fame because he lived for 37 years on a small platform on top of a pillar in Syria.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simeon_Stylites

-------------

I'm thinking of marketing the plan... :rofl:

[TroglodyteScholar]

17. Thanks for your input....

Mao Mao used to be a big on the heavy side, but never obese. It's his sudden weight loss that alerted us to his condition. He was ~14 lbs at the beginning of the year, and now he's under 11. :(

[nclib]

14. Yes, we just went through this

earlier this year. Our cat, Simon was very sick. He had ketones and spent time at the vet getting lots of insulin, glucose, and fluids. We did some of the iv fluids at home. We really didn't think he was going to make it. He wasn't eating much either. Like your cat he had been eating dry food.

To get him eating again, the vet said give him anything. So we fed him baby food (which he really liked) and fancy feast. The vet gave us some special food too, but like you, when I did the research it didn't seem to be as low in carbs as needed. I used the links from this site (http://www.felinediabetes.com/) to find sites with food charts containing which foods are high in protein and low in carbs.

We had a diabetes monitor (from my gestational diabetes) to test his blood sugar. We were supposed to give him 2 insulin shots per day. I would always test his blood sugar first before I gave him the insulin.

By feeding him a canned food diet, we got his diabetes completely under control and within a couple of weeks he no longer needed any insulin shots.

We have 2 other cats and one of them will only eat the hard stuff. I went to the pet store and read the ingredients on every bag until I found one that does not contain grains. From the reading I did when Simon was diabetic, grains are really bad for cats. Another bonus from feeding him an all wet food diet is he is no longer constipated. Simon also has mega colon and had to have occasional enemas, but that's not a problem anymore.

Good luck with your kitty.

[TroglodyteScholar]

19. I appreciate the info...

I actually didn't get to speak directly to the vet when Mao Mao was diagnosed on Friday. That kinda made me mad, considering I had been scheduled for 3 weeks. I get told my cat has diabetes, but I only get to talk to an assistant? Grr.

I guess I'd just feel a lot more comfortable getting his diet switched over and testing his glucose after he's been on the new diet for a week or two. I think I can afford the special food and the insulin (well, I hope I can)...but rather than dropping him off at the vet for his introduction to insulin on Monday, I may just call and find out if I can drop by to talk to the vet herself.

[Pavulon]

18. Yes

My wife is a doctor and we had a diabetic cat for years. The diabetic cat we had lived with us for 10 years. The trick is consistency. They will have food that your cat will eat. Be sure to feed the same food all the time. This all works together to make a pattern and sugar curve.

Next you will use a home tester to build a sugar curve. This shows your cats glucose levels through the day. We used theri ear for a drop of blood, feet pads work too, but ears are easy to get to.. You can test your cat every few hours for a 48 hours to get a baseline. You test a once or twice a day max normally.

If your cat acts odd test blood sugar. Low is potentially bad. Keep kayro syrup around.

Some cats will stop being diabetic once put on wet food and no longer need insulin.

There is a balance you will find and this it is not a big deal once you get in the routine.

Feel free to pm me if you have other questions. Basically it is not all that bad once you get used to it.

[TroglodyteScholar]

27. Thanks so much for the info

I guess I'm a bit nervous because I travel fairly frequently, and usually I'll just leave plenty of food out for Mao Mao. Now, if he's going to require canned food and daily (twice daily?) shots, I'll have to have him boarded every time I leave town. He really hates being boarded.

I suppose we'll adapt.

[MullenBank]

21. get a new cat?

n/t

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

23. Not funny. Not even slightly.

[TroglodyteScholar]

29. Methinks you should get a new sense of humor.

Really really funny to be flip about the illness of someone's much-loved pet.

[Betty88]

24. We have a Diabetic cat

We went through this with our cat Sam about two years ago. The change in Diet is very important but be careful about it. Change the cats food slowly, if he is like Sam he will not want the wet food or the raw. We have him on DM, dry we get it from the vet, he loves it and it has been very good for him. Mark sure whatever you do that you do not give the cat insulin if he is not eating. Put him on a strict diet and give him the shots at the same time everyday. We feed Sam at 5:30 am and 5:30 pm, he gets him shot while he is eating. This way we are sure he has something in his stomach when he gets his meds. Leaving food down all the time did not work for us his sugar and keytone levels did not level out till we had him on the two times a day schedule.

The biggest pain is testing the urine. We got a special cat box that lets the urine drain into a container so it makes testing simpler. Check out Smartcatbox.com.

After a month or two you and the cat will get into a routine and it will all be second nature. Just keep an eye on his sugar levels and Keytones and with luck he will even out and perhaps not need the shots forever. It is very possible that the cat will get better, Sam was off his meds for 6 months at one point, but you have to keep an eye out and watch for the signs, wet litter lots of drinking, and keep the carb's out of his diet as much as possible.

Oh about the diet and insulin change on Monday. If the cat is not really that sick you might be able to change the diet without the shots, BUT you will have to test his urine everyday and get ready to run to the vet. It is not easy to know when a cat is very sick, they hide it really well, he might look ok in the morning and be critical when you get home. Good luck I hope he feels better soon.

[TroglodyteScholar]

28. Yea, the last glucose test was really really high...

...so I guess that's why they want to change his diet and begin insulin ASAP.

I mean, he doesn't really seem sick, but he does lay around a lot--but from my experience, that's just what indoor cats do!

Nobody at the vet said the first thing about home testing...I guess I'll ask about it tomorrow.

[dmadhavi]

25. Home test blood glucose

You need to start testing blood glucose even before you start insulin. Urine testing does not help much if you want to really regulate the kitty. If you are changing over to canned only, then wait for 3-4 days ,test every day. As the carbs are reduced, the glucose level comes down on its own in most of the cases. If it is still above normal, you can start insulin. Please visit www.yourdiabeticcat.com ASAP. There is a ton of information and lots of people to help. The site was started by Dr. Hodgkins, one of the leading experts in feline diabetes.
You can also get a variety of low carb canned food online from petfooddirect.com, the price is quite reasonable.

[Lorien]

26. Here's some info that can help:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=243&topic_id=4388&mesg_id=4388

I switched my obese, nearly diabetic cat to grain free human grade pet foods, and he lost 13 pounds and started acting like a kitten again! Cats SHOULD be living into their 20s, but the crap put in feed grade pet foods limits their lifespans to only 15 or so, Diabetes, kidney disease, and cancer are all epidemics among both dogs and cats, and many vets (those not trained by Science Diet) now believe that poor quality diets are to blame.

[Madrone]

31. Mine's been getting shots for 4 years.

2x per day. It's EASY and nothing to be freaked out about. The cat doesn't mind at all.

As for food ... the vet prescribed stuff? Terrible, in my opinion. Mine is used to free-feed, as he's been fed that way his whole life. Now he gets grain-free, very low carb Innova Evo for his dry free feed, and raw meat or a couple of different brands of canned cat food in the evenings. He's doing excellent!

Also - getting pet sitters that will do the shots may not be as difficult as you'd think. Or I've been very lucky. Anyway - how I've handled that with everyone that's watched him for me while I've been away is to have them come over the the house and make them give him a shot. Usually the time they are available to stop by for the demo isn't during one of the regular shot times so I give them an empty needle and just make them stick him with it. Once they do it and see the cat doesn't so much as blink the fear of doing it goes away and it's a much less difficult task to be performed.

I know how you feel right now because I was in your position once. All I can tell you really is that it's not as bad as you think. Good luck to you and your kitty!

[grace0418]

32. I've had two diabetic cats. One was cured. So there is hope...

My vet specializes in diabetes so when my second cat was diagnosed he immediately tried a new treatment. Basically, they've discovered that diabetes can be reversed in cats because, unlike humans and dogs, cats are carnivores. The reason cats are getting diabetes in record numbers nowadays is because most cat food contains far more carbs than they should ever be eating (which you now know). They simply do not need to eat the carbs that omnivores need.

Vets then discovered that an insulin (Glargine aka Lantus) originally intended for humans can in many cases actually kick-start the pancreas in cats, allowing them not only to be weaned off insulin but effectively cured! I cannot describe how wonderful this is because I had two boy cats (brothers) and both developed diabetes. One developed it 7 years ago, before they knew about this treatment. I had to give him insulin shots twice a day, every day. Eventually, his kidneys gave out and he died, breaking my heart. The other was diagnosed about 3 years ago, got the glargine treatment, and within a few months he was off insulin and is now a robust 15 yr old. I do not feed him *any* dry food and monitor what wet food he eats very carefully. Even many wet foods have a lot of carbs.

Okay, here's the most important part to know before you go to the vet: the treatment is FAR more likely to be successful if it the first treatment attempted after diagnosis. For some reason, if the cat has already started on another kind of insulin, the Glargine is less likely to reverse the diabetes.

As far as food is concerned, there is a big table of recommended foods on this site: http://felinediabetes.com

Good luck!

[Quantess]

33. we have a diabetic cat that gets insulin shots 2x a day, and special food.

giving the shots is a snap. He realizes that the shot makes him feel better, so he welcomes needle time.

It is a real commitment, though. No more low-maintenance pet ownership. You have to be there for your cat when he needs his shot. If he misses too many shots it could be bad for his health, and it could mean another trip to the vet...

[Resuscitated Ethics]

34. Grain free foods for diabetes prone--

I recommend complete immersion in http://felinediabetes.com/ until you can plot your own glucose curves. Check out all the reports and the message board. Keep studying! I didn't home-test for a year, but once I started I didn't go back. Write down everything, keep a log and also record kittys meds and dosings faithfully. The vets like informed owners. Ask qustions.
I use the ear to test blood sugar on occasion-- my sugar kitty is on extended honeymoon.

EVO uses potato instead of corn, is grain free. Mouse in a can! http://www.naturapet.com/brands/evo.asp

I use Nature's Variety INSTINCT (chicken) exclusively http://www.naturesvariety.com/instinct_cat_kibble
(for the diabetes-prone member of cat family)

[TroglodyteScholar]

35. Thanks again to everyone for the great response

I went ahead and took Mao Mao to the vet today, and he'll be there at least until Wednesday...as long as it takes to determine what dose keeps him regulated in combination with his new food. I'm still a bit nervous about it all, but you guys have given me a lot of good info to consider. You guys rock :grouphug:

[Resuscitated Ethics]

36. There will be a number of "Aha! moments coming

But when your kittys eyes clear up and coat gets less dull (less dandruffy?) you will be proud of your active part. Maintaining a diabetic cat becomes second nature and you will still be able to plan your away times.

The first signs of diabetes: unusual interest in water (even camping by the water dish) and subsequent litter box filling fast or even sometimes out-of-box behavior. Lethargy (beyond the norm). Thirsty! Cats are typically discrete when they drink, a water-hole survival strategy(?), but the diabetic cat will be seen drinking noticeably more. The owners powers of observation become more acute

Oddly the Science Diet feline Diabetes Maintenance kibble ended up on the petfood recall list last year, somehow it ended up with Chinese wheat gluten http://www.hillspet.com/menu_foods/Menu_Foods_03302007_en_US.htm. That was solved pretty quickly but Sci-Di is suspect in my book. Weird times--even the prescription food wasn't safe. The Purina DM wasn't affected.

Some cats may get diabetes from years of free-feeding corn -based dry food, when they get fat. Watch out for health issues in a fat cat. Some fat cats may never have that problem. Some diabetic cats were never fat.

Here is the most awesome super lo carb grain free food I use for my one susceptible http://www.naturesvariety.com/instinct_cat_kibble_chicken

Best of luck and perseverance-- post an update!