Runner is a "hermaphrodite"

[AngryAmish]

The Sun is there:



"THE controversy over gender row champion runner Caster Semenya deepened today — after reports claimed sex swap tests have shown she is a HERMAPHRODITE.
South African gold-medallist Semenya, 18, has both male and female organs, it was claimed."

I am unfamiliar with the rules but I am inclined to let her keep her medals. She identifies female. The article is silent about the chromsomal situation.

Tough call.

[Swede]

1. I feel sorry for Semenya.

This is a very strange case,but I think she should keep her medals.

[supernova]

2. Yes, me too

And I feel bad for her that her medical situation was "outed" before she was ready to say, either way.

That's just bad.

[newcriminal]

3. I certainly feel sorry for her situation.

But I don't think it's fair for her to be competing with the females.

[AngryAmish]

4. How so?

I know that there are principled reasons on the other side, her testosterone level was within the limits allows for women.

[newcriminal]

6. In another article it said her testosterone levels are three times the level of a normal woman.

She is obviously much more muscular, she has no womb or ovaries. I'm not a doctor or even know much about hermaphrodites, and am not claiming to. I have however seen pictures of her and have read about how she is running much faster than the woman. I feel and this is just my belief, that it isn't fair to the other woman. I feel for her and understand that she thinks of herself as a woman, the facts are though, she is at least partially male as well.

[LeftyMom]

7. To compare, the average man produces 40-60 times as much as the average woman.

3x the average woman is still within the normal range, because levels vary that widely. In fact they vary so much that low-normal for a male and high-normal for a female overlap. Further, many common health conditions in women can result in high testosterone levels without being intersexed.

My best friend has PCOS, which is a very common cause of female infertility and when her first hormone panel was run her testosterone level would have been abnormally high even for a male, which would put them well above this runner's reported values. And she's definitely female, complete with a reproductive system that does it's job with a little pharmaceutical coaxing.

[newcriminal]

9. I'm sure there is more to it than testosterone levels.

Semenya is a hermaphrodite unlike your best friend.

[LeftyMom]

10. According to an unnamed source in a tabloid.

First off, by that standard she might well be shacking up with Bat Boy. Secondly, nobody who has a damned clue what they're talking about uses the term "hermaphrodite." She may be intersexed, but I don't think this article is evidence because the details are not credible. She's been examined before, so she'd have to have a fairly difficult-to-diagnose condition, not an obvious one resulting in internal testes and no uterus, both of which would have been obvious with even a cursory gynecological exam. That would also be inconsistent with the approximate hormone levels given- if she had testes her values would be somewhere in the range for males, not high but acceptable for a female.

Now if the article had said she had some ambiguous development, and gonadal streaks rather than fully formed ovaries or testes, I'd have believed that. But the description given doesn't match with the available evidence, and uses language that nobody even remotely familiar with intersexed people would use, because it's both inaccurate and horribly offensive.

[newcriminal]

11. Did you read these?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2009/09/10/2009-09-10_caster_semenya_.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1212562/Gender-row-runner-Caster-Semenya-hermaphrodite.html?ITO=1490

[LeftyMom]

12. Do you have any links to a credible source?

I mean really, the Daily Mail?

[AngryAmish]

13. The approbation with the word "hermaphrodite" is US centric

IAAF is truly an international organization. Whoever the leaker is may not be a US national, a native english speaker or even an english speaker - and the term "hermaphrodite" may just be from a translator which lacks the proper vocabulary for the correct medical terms.

And expecting everyone to know everything about intersexed or trangendered or other identifying people is a bit much.

[LeftyMom]

15. I just don't see a point in believing a leaked report which does not sound credible.

1. Source- unnamed

2. Press outlets- so far all of them have been extremely dodgy, no credible outlet has touched this "leak" as far as I can tell

3. Phrasing- does not indicate anybody with special knowledge of the case, or even slight familiarity with these sorts of issues

Nothing here adds up to a reliable report. I'd assume it's a rumor until something more credible comes out, with a firmer, more believable details and a reliable source in a credible press outlet.

[AngryAmish]

14. double post - I'm a jerk

[Captain Hilts]

5. Her testosterone numbers are three times the average. nt

[LeftyMom]

8. Which means they're still well below even a very low level in a normal adult male.

[joeybee12]

16. AP and MSNBC have picked it up.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/32785120/ns/sports-olympic_sports/

[mix]

17. gender theory folk must be loving this nt

[flvegan]

18. Let her keep the medals and compete.

Does she have an unfair advantage? Quite possibly. Seems she's an intersexed individual with a high test level for a woman, but she's a woman. No playing field is ever completely even.

[Taverner]

19. I have always wondered what is done if this were to happen

Let her keep her medals

Anything else would be unfair