Humphrey Bogart vs Clint Eastwood

[Pryderi]

I leave the parameters of the debate up to you.

[Pryderi]

1. Eastwood.

[Zomby Woof]

2. Eastwood

An amazing body of work as both an actor and director for damn near 50 years. Most people would have thought he had peaked by the 80's, and would be facing down a long decline. Instead, he grew artistically, taking chances both in front of and behind the camera. Sure, there are a few clunkers in there ("The Rookie" with Charlie Sheen for example, or the wretched "Bridges of Madison County"), but acting is a job first, and those kinds of movies helped finance genuine art like "Bird" and "Unforgiven".

I'll give Bogart credit for having better taste in women, lol. Lauren Bacall vs. Sondra Locke? No contest! Bacall still commands a room with class and grace. As for Locke, I just shudder when I see her muck up otherwise enjoyable films like "The Outlaw Josey Wales". :o :D

[Pryderi]

3. Agreed. I sometimes wonder if Bogie

had lived longer if he would've done more or rested on his laurels.

[Zomby Woof]

5. Funny thing about Bogart

He was usually not the studio's first choice for a lot of his signature roles. It was only later in his career that it began to warm up to his style. Trivia: Ronald Reagan was originally slated for 'Casablanca', but thank jebus it went to Bogart! There is no way in hell that movie would have its classic status today if that bonehead got the role.

[old mark]

12. Think on this: Dirty Harry was originally meant to be played by

Frank Sinatra.

Clint was about #4-the only reason he got the job was that he had recently completed a pic with the director, Don Siegel (Coogan's Bluff). "Harry" was supposed to be set in NYC - Eastwood suggested SF.

Sinatra had been doing several cop/detective roles "Tony Rome", etc, and felt he could not do "Harry" because he had broken his wrist and could not handle the famous .44 Magnum. Several others - including John Wayne- were considered before Clint was cast.

It would have been really terrible with Sinatra in New York.....

I am a fan, but I'd vote for Bogart.
mark

[Bucky]

21. That's one I never heard of.

I don't think it'd be a terrible movie with Sinatra, but it wouldn't have been so, I dunno, ironic. Dirty Harry is a very ironic movie. Think about how bright and sunny so many of the scenes are. If it'd been Sinatra in NYC, it would have been darker, more scenes in back alleys and in ghettos. Probably more night scenes. Thus it wouldn't have been so iconic, either, just another early 70s bitter cop movie. No sequels.

Also, less talking. Eastwood gives that "Well, do you feel lucky? Do ya, punk?" speech such bite. If Sinatra thought he might've run out of bullets, he'd just toss the gun aside and quietly beat the killer with a tire iron... and only then closed off with an "A-ring a-ding doo, baby."

[old mark]

24. Sinatra made 3 detective movies in '67 and '68 - "Tony Rome",

"The Detevctive" and "Lady In Cement". To me they seem pretty much of one piece - they all shared the same director, and two were from the same series of crime novels (The novel immediately after "Cement" was filmed 20 some years later, with some changes, and titled "Die Hard".

I just don't care much for Sinatra and I agree it would have been a totally different movie.
Much of "Harry"s final character came from Eastwood's
suggestions to director Don Siegel, who was teaching Clint to direct at the same time as making this film.
Siegel was a real period director and a lot of his influence can be seen in Clint's "Play Misty For Me".


mark


mark

[Bucky]

20. It would've been different, but honestly I think he'd have given it an interesting spin

Reagan was all B movie, of course, so his mere presence may have halted Ingrid Bergman's career. But his characters were all shallow tough guys. He never played a pained part. So Rick Blaine would have been not so world wearied, but a guy taking a rest between wars. "Once I save up enough bucks, Sam, we're heading back to Ethiopia to finish off them Fascists."

[Recovered Repug]

26. That little piece of trivia about Reagan is false.

http://snopes.com/movies/films/reagan.asp

Popular, but false.

[Zomby Woof]

30. Who verifies Snopes?

They aren't the be-all and end-all of 'truth'.

[rcrush]

35. Thank you.

Just because Snopes says they are the official word on everything doesn't mean its true. Who the hell are they?

[Recovered Repug]

39. Ok, then there's this.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0034583/trivia

[Fire Walk With Me]

4. "I leave the parameters of the debate up to you."

But...that means I'll have to THINK.


wah.....

[MiddleFingerMom]

6. Eastwood, but...

.
...I had to think about it for a long time.
.

[Ohio Joe]

7. Bogart

Sorry, Clint's not bad, he has some classics but the bulk of his work is shit.

[RandomThoughts]

9. There can be much skill in pinching off a good loaf, not to mention satisfaction.

He had some great films, I am a bit bias since my name is Eastwood also. He does have a few less then great films, but he has some really good ones also.

So I vote for Clint in this poll.

Ever see this movie

The Gauntlet.
http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi848101657


And he defined the western.

He even did a musical, paint your wagon.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZ0DP2CeKfA

I still see Elisa
She keeps on returning
As breathless, young as ever

I still see Elisa
And still feel the yearning
To hold her against me again

Her heart was made of holidays
Her smile was made of dawn
Her laughter was an April song
That echoes on and on

Since I saw Elisa
The shadows are falling
And winter is calling above
But I still see Elisa

Whenever I dream of love

[RandomThoughts]

18. After hearing the Elisa song I googled the name and found this singer.

Elisa- Heaven out of Hell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcd7ucSfgLo

Elisa- Rainbow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qtmx4KQYf8

Elisa- Time For Dancing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JtNXXnwJ_o4

[Shell Beau]

8. I probably don't know enough about Bogart to vote fairly.

Eastwood, however, is awesome.

[Broken_Hero]

10. Eastwood,

I never understood the facisination with Bogey.


Kelly's Heroes, Unforgiven, Outlaw Josey Wales, Gran Torino, Good, Bad and the Ugly, Dirty Harry, The Gauntlet, Magnum Force, Million Dollar Baby, Pale Rider, Absolute Power, Every which way but loose/can, High Plains Drifter, For a Few Dollars More...to name a few, :)

[Zomby Woof]

17. ...and add...

"Bird", "Play Misty For Me", "Tightrope", "The Beguiled", "Thunderbolt & Lightfoot", "Invictus", "Space Cowboys", "In The Line of Fire", "Honkytonk Man", and even "Bronco Billy".

The comical 'Bullitt' tribute in "The Dead Pool" sent Dirty Harry off in style. :D

[Auggie]

11. Bogart has won the Academy Award for Best Actor

Bogart had much greater range than Eastwood despite having to act under the confines of studio contracts. He could do it all -- tough guy, good guy, crazy guy, funny guy, troubled guy.

BOGART BY A LANDSLIDE

[old mark]

13. Bogart. Just by a little. This is maybe the hardest poll I have seen here.

Both men are very talented and go way beyond their scripts on occasion. Eastwood has more depth because he writes, produces and directs. Bogart is a slightly better actor, IMO.

I love both.

mark

[johnnie]

14. Eastwood

Hands down (imo)

[lunatica]

15. I would vote twice which I can't so I won't

There is nothing to compare between the two. They are apples and oranges and I wouldn't give one up for the other.

[Arctic Dave]

16. "Paint Your Wagon Red"

Bogart never did a musical.

[Bucky]

19. Bogey taught me how to be man. Clint taught me how to be a better man.

and then shoot people.

[Robeson]

22. Bogey could act. He was a method actor before they called them method actors...

...but Eastwood is an excellent director, so take nothing from him.

[elshiva]

23. I love Bogart.

:loveya:

2HB
(Bryan Ferry)

Oh I was moved by your screen dream
Celluloid pictures of living
Your death could not kill our love for you
Take two people - romantic
Smoky nightclub situation
Your cigarette traces a ladder
Here's looking at you kid
Celebrate years
Here's looking at you kid
Wipe away tears
Long time, since we're together
Now I hope it's forever
Ideal love flies away now
White jacket, mmmn, black tie wings too
You gave her away to the hero
Words don't express my meaning
Notes could not spell out the score
But finding not keeping's the lesson
Here's looking at you kid
Hard to forget
Here's looking at you kid
At least not yet
Your memory stays
It lingers ever
Will fade away never

© E.G. Music Ltd 1972
http://www.roxyrama.com/classic/lyrics/roxy_music/2hb.shtml

He's the man.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_zAoyoHwC5IQ/Sd0pjbh98jI/AAAAAAAACpc/2rlpMmikBSA/s400/Ingrid+Bergman+and+Humphrey+Bogart.jpg

[CrawlingChaos]

25. BOGART - by 10 million light years

Bogart was an incredible screen presence who brought depth and nuance to every role.

Clint EastWOOD (as in wooden) just scowls. He's the same in every movie (and so many of his films are utter shit).

Plus he's a right-wing prick!

[LostInAnomie]

27. Eastwood could act circles around Bogart.

In the whole history of Hollywood it would be hard to think of a more over-rated actor than Bogart. I dare anyone to watch Casablanca in an objective light and tell me that he is not absolutely wooden or that it couldn't have been better performed by almost any of his contemporaries.

Eastwood is much more talented.

[mitchum]

31. Gregory Peck was even more wooden than Bogart; he could have played Pinocchio

Eastwood is the better actor

[tXr]

28. Bogart.

Casablanca, the Maltese Falcon, the Treasure of the Sierra Madre, the African Queen... vs. a bunch of spaghetti westerns and Dirty Harry movies.

No contest.

[Zomby Woof]

29. Wow

You know nothing about Eastwood's film career.

That was stunningly narrow and ignorant.

[graywarrior]

32. Bogey

He's hot.

[CrawlingChaos]

33. So you Eastwood fans are not bothered by his politics?

I mean, damn, even if Ronald Reagan were a great actor, I could never watch him without vomiting.

I'll certainly never be able to stomach the sight of Jon Voight in anything ever again.

Not only am I no longer willing to watch Eastwood as an actor, I'm also determined to avoid his directing efforts, which are most revealing of his true nature.

Just one example - here's what John Pilger had to say about Eastwood's latest film, Invictus:

"My Oscar for the worst of the current nominees goes to Invictus, Clint Eastwood’s unctuous insult to the struggle against apartheid in South Africa. Taken from a hagiography of Nelson Mandela by a British journalist, John Carlin, the film might have been a product of apartheid propaganda. In promoting the racist, thuggish rugby culture as a panacea of the “rainbow nation”, Eastwood gives barely a hint that many black South Africans were deeply embarrassed and hurt by Mandela’s embrace of the hated Springbok symbol of their suffering. He airbrushes white violence – but not black violence, which is ever present as a threat. As for the Boer racists, they have hearts of gold, because “we didn’t really know”. The subliminal theme is all too familiar: colonialism deserves forgiveness and accommodation, never justice.

At first I thought Invictus could not be taken seriously, then I looked around the cinema at young people and others for whom the horrors of apartheid have no reference, and I understood the damage such a slick travesty does to our memory and its moral lessons. Imagine Eastwood making a happy-Sambo equivalent in the American Deep South. He would not dare."

You may disagree, but I don't think right-wing assholes like Eastwood should be celebrated or supported in any way, and fortunately in this case, I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything by avoiding his work.

[RandomThoughts]

34. Never saw that movie,

I heard he supported Clinton in 2008, but do think he is more likely a Republican.

however politics aside, his movies offer much thought, although they do also have both good and bad, like all things.

His portrayal of himself in his films as less then the good guy, also for me, seems to be both a bit of humility, and an admittance of the lack of perfection in people.

The concepts of lack of justice in some of the dirty hairy films, or justice at the end of a gun in many of the westerns, is a bit far from the ideas of justice and peace I think on, but there is thought in the films, and they do get you to think on things.

[CrawlingChaos]

37. He's a staunch Republican who supported McCain

Although, if I'm not mistaken, I think he made some statements where he claimed to sympathize with Clinton and wanted her to keep fighting Obama to the bitter end, even when her prospects were looking pretty grim.

I personally think his best films are the spaghetti westerns, but as I said, knowing what I know about him, I find him distasteful to watch.

[proteus_lives]

42. He's not a right-wing asshole, so why would I be bothered by his politics?

And trust me, you're missing out on some great work.

[SoxFan]

36. Cagney.

[quickesst]

38. I'd vote both...

...if it was an option. Kind of an apples to oranges scenario. Bogart could never do Eastwood, and Eastwood could never do Bogart. I believe the poll, which at this time is running pretty much dead even confirms my personal, I repeat, personal opinion. Thanks.
quickesst

[Blue_Tires]

40. Well Eastwood did steal that top-secret jet from the Soviets, but I got to go with

Newman....

[proteus_lives]

41. Eastwood is the fucking man.