Can I get some cat advice from you feline experts?

[Westegg]

My wife and I live with our two cats in a NYC apartment. One male, one female. May be brother and sister. They're pretty feral animals---she rescued them from Central Park about seven years ago, where they'd been abandonned as kittens. Fred and Daisy are good cats and we love them, but they are VERY afraid of humans. They won't let us pick them up, and are very skittish about most physical touching---though they'll allow us to pet them if we get them in the right mood. And they sleep on our bed at night. They hide UNDER the bed whenever anyone visits, when they hear the doorbell, etc. Getting them to the vet in a cat-carrier? Forget it.

My question is this: I currently work out of our apartment, and so I would really like to get another kitten---one who is friendly and not afraid of people. One I could raise to be not nearly as neurotic as Fred and Daisy are. But how would our cats react to a new kitten in the house? Would they freak out? Attack it? Be upset? Would they manage to teach a new cat to be as afraid of people as they are? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I'd love to have a cat I can actually interact with, etc. But I don't want to consign some poor kitten to a life of misery because of the situation here. THANKS!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

1. you know in my opinion and i am an avid cat person

cats who like humans a LOT dont like other cats so much...and cats who are afraid of humans do like other cats more...so i think you can get a kitten...

[skooooo]

3. Mmm..I think they tend to be more territorial...

...Guess you could give it a try if there's a place to take the kitty back if it doesn't work out. But that's not really too nice either...Just my opinion.

[Westegg]

6. I DO trust your opinion. Thanks for the feedback

[Westegg]

7. Since we'd probably be getting a cat from a shelter...

...I can't imagine doing that and then having to take it back. Thanks for your feedback.

[skooooo]

2. I would discourage you ....

...from bringing another cat into that situation. These two guys could really gang up on the newcomer and make his life (and yours) hell. I know it's tempting to want a nicer kitty, but hold off.

I adopted a feral cat and it took a few years (like 3) until he was friendly enough with just me to allow me pet him and pick him up, so it is possible to change their natures a little bit. Have you had no luck at all with getting them to setlle down?

[Westegg]

10. Not really. My wife's had them for 7 years...

...which is longer than she's had me! In recent months, the female has two or three times jumped into my wife's lap when she's sitting at the computer. But she'll jump off after 30 seconds or so, and the male will actually attack her after he's seen her being held by my wife. I honestly don't think these cats are gonna change. They're at least 7 years old. It's sad. They must have had some BAD experiences with people in their early lives.

[demnan]

4. Cats that live together

can have different personalities. It might liven them up to have another cat around. What's better is you need a loving pet. Make sure it is a very young kitten - just properly weaned from a home with humans. The animal will be more easily accepted by the others and more likely to interact closely with you.

[Westegg]

That's very positive thinking, and I truly thank you.

Again, I won't take on a new cat if I fear that it won't be good for the cat, for us, or for our two cats. But you do give me hope!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

5. i think you should definetely try it...just be home incase there is

kitty violence

[shanti]

8. it doesn't sound like a good idea

you have a male and a female cat, that is ideal. your new cat will be one of the two obviously, but it's not good to force two cats of the same sex together. this is what i've been told and also my own experience.

personally, i wouldn't have a cat i couldn't pet. :shrug:

[Caromill]

12. If they are neutered there shouldn't be a problem

We have two males and four females, and they all get along fine. No territorial problems, or any other kind at all. They are all either spayed or neutered, which I think takes care of any kind of trouble along those lines.

[Westegg]

16. Our cats ARE neutered, and the new one would be, too. Thanx!

[Caromill]

9. I would try getting a kitten

We have six cats -- five were feral when we got them as kittens, and one from the Humane Society. We had two of them for eight years before various circumstances caused us to end up with four more kittens, three all at once and one later.

Reaction of the older cats was a mixed bag. After a few weeks, one of the older cats just decided to get along with the young ones, and has been fine with them in the three years since all this happened. The other old cat doesn't like any of the young ones, avoids them, and growls whenever they come near her.

The old ones have always been pretty friendly with humans, and two of the younger feral ones are very friendly -- with humans and other cats. The other two younger feral ones are still scared of everything. One of them is even afraid of the other cats -- she has to live in a room by herself most of the time. Those two are just now, after three years, letting us pet them a little bit.

So you just won't know what will happen until you try it. There's a good chance that the older cats will accept a kitten just fine, and it's definitely worth the effort. And if you get a young enough kitten -- not older than 8 weeks, and 6 would be better -- it will bond with you and you will have the sweet kitty you want. We got our youngest cat when she was abandoned at about 4 weeks old, and we had to feed her with a bottle and wean her ourselves. She is absolutely the most affectionate cat that ever lived, having bonded with humans so young. (And interestingly enough, although she is the youngest and smallest of our 6 cats, she is the dominant cat in the house. Go figure.)

[Westegg]

17. Good advice. Eye Thank Yew!

[hyphenate]

11. From my own experience....

My current clowder of cats are not really wild anymore, but they don't like anyone but myself. They will do anything I ask, and they never hide around me, but the minute a stranger comes in the door, I suddenly don't have any cats any longer.

I had talked with a behaviorist about this, and it's mostly because they were never socialized around people. The sole contact they've had has been myself, and because of this, they get rattled by other people. I had brought my Jessica to a cat show when she was still very young, and she wouldn't behave--spitting and hissing at the others in the show until I finally had to withdraw her. One of the judges suggested I put her in a pillowcase or backpack or some other carryying case and bring her to the mall. Not to let her out or anything, but merely to get her acquainted to a lot of other people.

Most cats who are sociable have become that way because they've literally been exposed to noise, people yelling and talking, and all the other kinds of environmental noise and smells that make up a household. In short terms, socialized cats are somewhat shell-shocked into becoming friendly.

If your apartment has always been quiet, but now suddenly you are going to be having more people coming and going around it, the older cats will adjust to it, though it will be slowly. At first, I suggest you close them in another room for a while when you have clients, but gradually, start leaving the door open with one of those kiddy fences between them and the rest of the world. After they get use to that arrangement, it might still be awhile, but they will eventually begin to come out and see people. If, however, the amount of traffic in and out of the apartment isn't consistent, it's going to take longer to make their senses "dull enough" to accept more humans on an ongoing basis.

I don't see too much problem introducing another cat to the household, but I wouldn't recommend a kitten. For one thing, if there still isn't a great hubbub of activity around its surroundings, he or she will end up in the same position as the other two. However, if you can adopt an adult or older cat that you know has been around a family or a more social environment, that cat will automatically be more social to start with.

Introduce a new cat after you have been running the business for awhile. Introducing a new cat at the same time will merely exacerbate the stressors in the other cats' lives, and they will need to adjust to one situation before tackling another one.

As far as introducing a new cat, your best bet is the time-honored one of keeping the new pet secluded from the others in a room with closed doors, finally putting a screen between them, and then slowly increase the amount of time they spend together until they are all used to each other. Make sure that they are all spayed or neutered, because an intact cat, especially a male, will spray to mark its territory. They will sometimes do that after they've been neutered as well, but it mainly happens in those who were neutered when they were out of kittenhood.

Good luck. I currently have 5, but I lost two of the loves of my life last year, and I'm still heartbroken over it.

[Caromill]

14. That's all very good advice

and obviously you know what you're talking about.

But if you don't want to go to all that trouble, you might just try my method. We caught three of our four feral kittens over a couple of weeks in the alley behind our office building downtown. As we got them, we had them spayed or neutered, got their shots, and then just turned them loose in our house. It all worked out fine. The older cats adjusted, and the new ones all got along fine. They even all used the litter boxes from day one, which was a very good thing!

[Westegg]

20. You say "No kitten"; others say "Yes kitten"...

Obviously, opinions differ, and my wife and I will need to sort this out. But you are clearly a wise one when it comes to cats, and I REALLY appreciate the time you spent responding to me. Your post is full of good advice, which I will continue to study for some time.

[Florida_Geek]

13. Deep Fried is Best

:evilgrin:

[Caromill]

15. You should join the NCAA --

No Cats Anywhere in America

:spank:

[Westegg]

19. Oh, you kid!

But seriously, you eat cats? How do they taste? Let me guess: "like chicken."

[Florida_Geek]

23. Cat the other White Meat

[WilliamPitt]

18. It'll be a battle royale no matter what you do

but if you're set on the idea, get a kitten. An older cat will incite total war.

[Westegg]

21. Thank you, Lord Pitt...

And yeah, I'm kinda set on the idea. My wife ain't, but I think she secretly is...And my initial impulse was to get a very young kitten. I have the time now (since I work from home) to administer to its needs, and I'm kinda jazzed by the idea.

Appreciate your feedback.

[TEXASYANKEE]

22. It can be good, it can be bad.

With cats, just like humans, you just never know. My advice (for what it's worth, I've got 4 female cats of varying ages) is to get a kitten. Keep it completely seperated from the older cats for at least 2 days. Let them get used to each others' smells and adjust to the fact that a new cat is in the apartment. When you feel they're ready, put them together for a time. This might mean the kitten and one cat, holding the kitten or holding the cat, or holding the kitten and letting both cats approach it. You'll know how best to do the introductions.

But don't get a kitten and just throw it in the mix. First impressions are usually lasting on a kitten. If you introduce them immediately and the older cats hate the kitten and act aggressively towards it, you will have a real hard time getting any of them to socialize. Do it slowly and let them adjust to each other. But I do think that bringing a kitten into the mix shouldn't be a problem.

[Westegg]

24. Thanks for your smart advice, TEXASYANKEE.