Clark Leads Dems in National Newsweek Poll

[Bread and Circus]

http://www.msnbc.com/news/969441.asp

Three Things:

1.) This was a scientific telephone poll (not an online poll).
2.) Clark also does best vs Bush (though marginally better than Kerry)
3.) Dean does very poor vs. Bush

Not bad for a few days campaigning, eh?

Clark is a top tier candidate and has generated a lot of
buzz in the media. When discipline, message, and policy
tightens up, he will have a hell of a chance at this.

I hope all of you will consider Clark as the best Democratic
Candidate. I know I do.

Good luck.

[joeybee12]

1. Sorry, I don't consider him the best candidate

I'm not bashing him, and I know you will react that way.

He's had a lousy two days.

He's in danger of blowing it very soon.

Holy Joe has led in national polls, so this doesn't really mean much--name recognition is what this poll is based on.

[renie408]

5. Me either

He has already had several issues pop up that have worried me from a trust standpoint. He is the Flavor of the Week. He is getting a lot of press right now and therefore has the best name recognition.

Time will tell, but his candidacy worries me deeply. I really worry that we will be screwed if he ends up winning the nomination.

[Bread and Circus]

7. That's wierd....

because I believe Wesley Clark's name recognition
is a lot less than Dean and Kerry's. You are not bashing,
you are debating, which is respectable. But Lieberman
originally did lead the polls because of name recognition,
that I will admit. However, that has nothing to do with
Clark's showing here, wouldn't you agree?

[goobergunch]

2. dupe

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=124500

Usually I don't mind cross-forum dupes, but P/C has been clogged up enough already and the LBN thread was posted an hour ago.

[Bread and Circus]

8. Sorry, but for every dupe of a Pro-Clark link/thought...

there seems to be about 4 to 6 outright hostile
dups bashing Clark based on sketchy sources,
wouldn't you agree?

[goobergunch]

12. I'm not as concerned about GD->P/C dupes as I am about LBN->P/C dupes

I've already posted comments in the LBN thread...I don't feel like reposting.

[MoonRiver]

3. Awesome, and just what I would have predicted.

Thanks for the link :thumbsup:

[FireHeart]

4. I'm rooting for Clark all the way.

He's the only candidate for me. Others milage may vary.

[GOPFighter]

6. Uh, I've got this thing about voting for candidates based on...

...what they believe in, not how well they do in polls. Clark may well turn out to be a dynamite candidate and I may even become one of his supporters (hey, I like what little I've seen of him), but I don't know squat about his true policies are and how dedicated he is to those policies. Let's wait and see.

[Bread and Circus]

11. That's a fair open minded response.

Try this....

http://video.c-span.org:8080/ramgen/kdrive/c04061703_newdemocrat.rm

The link has been posted elsewhere but it is an excellent
speech made by Clark before he joined the campaign.

Enjoy, and thanks for keeping an open mind.

[EagleEye]

9. DUPE

[EagleEye]

10. When discipline, message, and policy ...

Did you really say this?

[Bread and Circus]

13. Yes, I did....

Clark's campaign is in its infancy and is under
hot-bright lights. There has been a little
stumbling out of the blocks and details on domestic
policy have not been yet laid out. I am not too obtuse
to admit that.

Nor am I too obtuse to fail to see you are here just to
stir trouble and bait me. I assume you are afraid that Clark
is going to detract from your "candidate of choice".

If you don't like Clark, fine -- at least have the decency
and intelligence to post something worth reading.

I like Clark, I think he is good for our party and he is good
for America. Sorry if you don't think so.

[EagleEye]

16. How did you get that out of what I wrote?

[Code_Name_D]

21. This amuses me.

Clark is in the campaign, and is already in the lead? This is not a positive sign, but a red flag in my book. I agree with the consensus, he is the flavor of the week.

But he is also clearly the DLC's latest golden boy. I already heard NPR mention the funds that he raised by NOT running, pledged by the draft Clark campaign. An impressive figure, I will admit. But is Clark getting this money from Joe Average, or CEO Joe Millionaire? If Clark is the latest Golden Boy, than expect to seem corporate dollars rolling into his coffers. Each dollar will represent a promise he will have to keep later on.

The Skeletons jumping out of the closest also dose not bode well. These "stumbling blocks" as you call them are going to be huge liabilities in the future. They made up stuff for Gore to lie about, if Clark should have actually lied, the Repugs will hang him for it, just like they hung Clinton when he was caught in a real lie. But if he is a secrete war supporter, than he can not beat Bush any more than Leabermen or Kerry can, for cheerleading the man they are suppose to challenge in the General election.

I am also not impressed by Clark's "special credentials." His former military status is worth zero points in my book. You have Collen Power to thank for that one, who was ALSO a respected military General, who then later turned out to be another shill for the right wing. History also tells us that good military leaders, often make poor civil leaders, as they try to order the public around like they use to order the troops around. A civil leader has to lead the public by example, and thus far, Clark has offered nothing that hasn't already been sold to us by way of retail politics for the past 20 years.

In fact, he hasn't offered us much of any thing at all. He is mostly a blank slate, by which you your self admits; "...and details on domestic policy have not been yet laid out. I am not too obtuse to admit that." I then must ask you, by which do you base YOUR opinions of Clark? I trust you are not basing them on nothing, but I have nothing to work with.

Let me make my opinion plane. I have three Democratic names on my "never in hell will I ever vote for them" list. They are Kerry, Leabermen, and Gepheardt. Kerry earned this place because of his continued suport of the war in Iraq, and has even expressed the need for its expansion. Gepheardt earned his place on my list because he chose to stand with the Resident in the rose garden in support of the war. He stabbed his own party in the back, for a god damped photo op. And Leabermen has a better Republican voting record than some right wing republicans, and worked with Lynn Chenny on a project to purge US universities of any professors or students who spoke out against the Afghanistan War.

Clark has yet to make that list. But with his recently exposed statements, both in support of the war in Iraq, his "admiration" for the PNAC cabal is making it hard not to put him on that list.

My problem with Clark is the same problems I have with the other three. The "any one but Bush" crowed has it wrong. Bush is just a figure head, a disposable figure head at that. Defeating Bush in the General election dose NOT automatically mean PNAC has been derailed. I remind you that Clinton beat Sr. Bush, but yet here we are, right back in Iraq where Sr. Bush left us. Almost as if the past 8 years never happened. This is because Clinton did nothing to challenge the power of the GOP, and even went along with it on many occasions. If Clark is the same way, if he will only agree to compromise with the GOP, or at best, be neutral like a good little centrist Democrat, than the GOP is still in charge.

Will Clark challenge the Black Box voting conspiracy?
Will Clark prosecute Bush for war crimes?
Will Clark surrender power in Iraq to the UN, including the oil fields?
Will Clark brake up the corporate power block in Congress?
Will Clark go after the Enron CEO's?
Will Clark dethrone the oil power lording over America?
Will Clark brake up the ogopolies in the media?
Will Clark remove the vial of secrecy over the Bush presidency?

Or will he do what Clinton did. Do just enough to appease his base, while not actually doing any thing to threaten the real powers that control the US government? To me, letting the Bush cabal walk away from the white house, retaining all of their honors and accolades will do MORE damage to America than retaining Bush for another four years. Because letting them walk away, gives them the opportunity to walk right back in again, just as Gorge W. has done to avenge the defeat of Herbert Walker. Who will avenge the defeat of Gorge W?

[bread_and_roses]

30. I agree

with your analysis: "Bush is just a figure head, a disposable figure head at that. Defeating Bush in the General election dose NOT automatically mean PNAC has been derailed. I remind you that Clinton beat Sr. Bush, but yet here we are, right back in Iraq where Sr. Bush left us. Almost as if the past 8 years never happened. This is because Clinton did nothing to challenge the power of the GOP, and even went along with it on many occasions. If Clark is the same way, if he will only agree to compromise with the GOP, or at best, be neutral like a good little centrist Democrat, than the GOP is still in charge...

...Or will he do what Clinton did. Do just enough to appease his base, while not actually doing any thing to threaten the real powers that control the US government?"

This is why I support Kucinich: regardless of his chances to win the nomination, I can only hope that the support he generates will help shift the dialogue.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

48. You have mischaracterized

Kerry's position. "Kerry earned this place because of his continued suport of the war in Iraq, and has even expressed the need for its expansion."

That's just not true:

Senator Kerry: End US Occupation of Iraq
Agence France-Presse

Wednesday 16 July 2003

Washington, DC - US Senator and Democratic presidential hopeful John Kerry called for an end to the US occupation of Iraq and criticized the administration's use of now discredited intelligence as a basis for launching the war. "I fought in Vietnam, and half the wall -- half the (Vietnam Veterans Memorial) wall -- is filled with the names of people who were there because leaders were filled with pride and wouldn't make the right decisions," Kerry told NBC television.

"We need to get the sense of American occupation over with. We need to protect our troops. And that means that pride should not prevent this administration from going to the United Nations and doing what they should have done in the first place," he declared.
http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/071803A.shtml

[Code_Name_D]

50. Oh please.

The man is still under the impreshion that WMD will be found. He was one of the biggest hauks on the hill. He voted for the Iraq War Resolution, and to my knowlage, still backs that desision, without appoligy.

Being critical of how the war on terror is being exicuted, dose not translate into being against the war.

[liberalnurse]

14. I'm sticking with the good

Dr. Dean......

[neuvocat]

15. Clark's comments on the Iraq war are getting badly needed

press-considering that they are in opposition to them. Unfortunately no one else is getting recognition for the same.

Its very powerful to consider.

[RevolutionStartsNow]

17. Sharpton gaining on Gep!

7% to Gep's 8%! Statistically, he could be beating Gephardt...

Too funny.

Anyone have the last Newsweek poll around? Looks like Clark is going to wipe out Lieberman's support. Look for Joe to come out swinging against Wesley in the debate.

[CMT]

18. Now the good news for Dean

The last Newsweek Princeton Poll also had Dean at 12%--he is 12% in this current poll. This indicates that his support is holding steady despite the heavy publicity which accompanied Clark's entrance into the race. In fact since the last Newsweek/Princeton poll in July, Dean has now moved up from third place to second place and really a statistical deadhead with the General.

Here are the rankings in the last Newsweek poll:
Gephardt: 14%
Lieberman 13%
Dean 12%
Kerry 10%
Graham 7%
Sharpton 6%
Edwards 6%
Braun 3% Kucinich 2%
Don't Know 23%

This is the ranking for the current poll:
Clark: 14%
Dean 12%
Lieberman 12%
Kerry 10%
Gep: 8%
Sharpton 7%
Edwards 6%
Braun 2%
Kucinich 2%
Don't Know 19%

The real loser is Gephardt who moved from first to fifth place going from 14% in July to 8% now--nearly half of his support. Dean, Kery, Edwards, and even Lieberman held steady. Graham also lost a little support while Sharpton gained a point.

Anyway, to Clark supporters--Congrats!! he made a fast start and will be in the thick of things. I think it is going to be a very competitive fight for the nomination.

p.s.
now as to the 52-38 lead Bush has over Dean. Don't sweat it. At this time and thru the Democratic convention in 2000, Bush had a 15-20 point lead over Al Gore, who was much better known than Howard Dean is. Also, in 1992, Clinton trailed then president George HW Bush up until the democratic convention even coming in third to Bush and Perot in one poll.

[EagleEye]

19. Gephardt's Support Soft

So Gep's support was soft? I wonder if the unioners like the General?

[EagleEye]

20. Where's Graham/

[Code_Name_D]

22. I think Clark ate Gephardt's suport, not Deans.

I think the Clark suporters have only jumps from one loser, to the next.

[Rose Siding]

23. Worth noting

If pollingreports.com is to be believed, the reporting on
the newsweek article was a bit misleading.

The democratic candidates poll had a sample size
of 377 people with a MoE = 6%.

http://www.pollingreport.com/wh04dem.htm

The presidential approval poll also discussed
in the article had a sample size of 1001 people
and a MoE = 3%.

http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm

[Kanola]

33. With a six percent margin of error??

That is big for accurate statistical polling purposes. I do not even take this seriously if that is true. A good margin of error (but not always accurate) is two to three percentage points.

[janx]

37. Or even four. But not six.

.

[janx]

35. 377 people? That's all?

That's not a very large sample.

[Bread and Circus]

36. The Princeton poll quoted...

had different components which had different MOE
and numbers polled.

Post edited to correct my factual error and parlay
the sense of complexity of the polling.

[janx]

34. Thanks for the objective analysis, CMT. Do you know

when that last Newsweek poll was taken?

[jerryster]

24. Clark

Only caught a couple of minutes of an interview on CNN. I have to say he was uninspired and uninspiring. And what is your opinion of him skipping a debate? My first thoughtis that it"s a bad move.

[jayson23]

28. he's in the debate

It's hard to judge General Clark's performance at such an early point in his campaign, but I'm definitely glad he's decided to join the debate. As to "uninspired and uninspiring," well, that's an opinion you're free to express, but personally I think he's electric! I haven't been this driven to support a candidate since Jesse Jackson in 1988.
Wesley Clark will be a president that can actually bring this country back together, someone we can all respect, who will be a real leader. He's the first candidate whose campaign I've ever contributed to financially, and that was before he even decided to run. I'm behind him 100%.

[jerryster]

54. Clark

Glad to hear he's in the debate. That is, I believe, the right move. As far as his being "electric", I'll wait and see. I know he brings a lot to the table and defuses many of the typical repugnicant attacks about patriotism, blah blah blah. Come to think of it, if he is the candidate it may give Bush's campaign pause when they think about running ads with him in his flight suit. They'll know Clark can run ads in uniform with a lot more honesty. Be prepared, however, because now the scrutiny starts and we'll see how he does. Also, the press will look closely at him. Why? Because the press is aware that people are looking at them - correctly - as not doing their job vis a vis Bush. So they'll "do their job" where Clark is concerned, tell themselves they've redeemed themselves and breathe a sigh of relief that they still get to ride on Air Force One. What a pathetic bunch of cowards. Sorry. Off on a little tangent there. Anyway, the best of luck to Clark and all the Dems. Remember, the most important thing is to get this guy out after one term. Jobless recovery. Only the repugnicants could brag about that.

[Vikingking66]

25. 5 points worse than Clark with a 3 point margin

does not make for very poor.

[Rose Siding]

27. 6 point MOE

see post 23. The article is misleading.

[Bread and Circus]

31. If is so misleading or meaningless, then why can you link to it....

from Dean's main website (as of 9/20 7:15pm est).???

Just go to deanforamerica, deanpollwatch, US, and click


I am sorry but all the crying and naysaying here is not
useful. Why can't some of you just give Clark some props,
he deserves a little respect because he may very well be
representing you in ousting Bush.

I will give Dean props, he has run and excellent campaign
and has earned his front runner status thus far. He seems
to make a lot of gaffes and flip-flips (way more than Clark
has) but on the whole, I like a lot of his message, and his
two-fisted style. I also like how Dean shook up the party
and helped put some spine back in it. That's great.

However, some DU'ers have been so irrational and hateful toward
Clark it is beyond the pale of rational discourse.

Most of what people are going on is anger, fear, radical right
wing or radical left wing talking points. If we are going to
win the general election, we need to get some sense and win
with rationality, whether it is Clark, Dean, or whomever.

:nuke:

[Rose Siding]

38. The msnbc article you posted

doesn't explain the Newsweek poll clearly. I posted links right to the polls posted at PollingReport.com

And get the chip off your shoulder. You'll have to look farther than me for a critic of Clark, even though you include an unsubstantiated shot at Dean in your post.

[Bread and Circus]

40. Hey Party_Line

You are right, the poll has different
components. The MOE does overlap in the
Dem vs. Dem poll. Good point.

Ultimately, though, you have to admit, Clark
has an appeal. It is undeniable.

[Rose Siding]

44. The appeal

is that of the unknown. Prince Charming at a distance is easy to dream about.

I know my Democratic candidate and what is more important, I know his allegiance will not be to corporations or the ultra rich or the power brokers of either party.

[Bread and Circus]

45. Who is your candidate...

I am honestly curious.

[Rose Siding]

46. Dean

Average campaign donation: less than a hundred bucks

[Bread and Circus]

49. Thanks, I appreciate that.

I think it's great that he has figured out
how to get money like he has. It is great.
His movement and the draft Clark movement are
examples of how the internet has helped
re-democratize elections.

[blm]

51. Except YOUR candidate likes deregulation...

including deregulating electricity. I guess since you know your candidate so well, you find that acceptable.

Of course, I have to laugh at your contention that he is not pro-corporation. HAHAHAHAHAHA...He's one of the most procorporate Democrats in the party. What do you THINK being a centrist means?

[Edmundo]

39. Because...

"I am sorry but all the crying and naysaying here is not
useful. Why can't some of you just give Clark some props,
he deserves a little respect because he may very well be
representing you in ousting Bush."

Clark might be too good of a candidate and a threat to their candidate. They giving him props is suicide. Instead of looking for positives or wait to see what Clark is really all about they prefer to paint him as a Republican left wing nut.

Pretty soon he is going to be worse than Bush. :-)

[janx]

42. party_line said that the *article* is misleading. It is.

It makes it sound as if the results were from a Newsweek poll and comprised both the Dems and the Bush stats in one poll.

I know I was confused when I read the article and tried to reconcile what was said to the poll numbers...I knew something was wrong, but I didn't know what.

It's not that the polls are unimportant--it's just that the reporter screwed up in his or her interpretation.

[Rose Siding]

47. All the papers are reporting it this way.

Three I've seen quote all the results with only the 3 pt MOE and 1001 respondants. Not a huge deal but I suspect they like to report the bigger story sans accuracy.

[janx]

52. Yep. It's gotten to the point at which you can't really trust them.

Thanks for providing those links to the source.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

26. Give me the New Hampshire/Iowa poll numbers.

Then I'll pay attention.

[Bread and Circus]

32. You are obviously already paying attention...

and you seem a little nervous.

I don't blame you. But I will admit, Dean is
leading in those polls. Dean will be tough to beat.
He is a strong fighter and a contender.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

55. Not nervous at all.

When Clark takes the lead in NH, IA or SC, I'll start getting nervous. I'm not saying he can't or won't. Just that he isn't. The same goes for any other candidate.

[jayson23]

29. Amazing!

He's only been in the race for a couple of days, and he's already jumped to the top of the pack. The more the public gets to know this man, the higher his numbers will go.
Already we're seeing the right-wing attack dogs foaming at the mouth to go after the General, so you know he's doing something right.
I was a Dean supporter at the beginning, and I still think he's a good man. I also like Kerry, although he never really lit a fire in me the way Clark has managed to. I think a Clark / Kerry ticket would be a very strong one in '04. I'll support the nominee 100%, whoever it is, but I can't even begin to express how much I want it to be General Wesley K. Clark.
In my family, Clark has brought together my Jewish grandmother, my right-wing marine veteran father, and my apolitical cousin. I never thought we'd all agree on a candidate, but whaddya know...

[Code_Name_D]

43. I don't think time is on Clark's side.

I think more than just procrastination was at work here invalving Clarks timming to anounce. For one thing, Clark has actualy been in the race for some time now. And Clark's name came up in the halls of the DLC even before then.

And I might remind you that it the Repugs attack every one. Not unless you are going to convice me that the Dixie Chicks have presdenchal ambitions as well. But its clear attacks are comming from the left as well, with acusaitons that Clark is too cozy with the GOP & PNAC groupe.

I do beleive that things will only get worse for Clark from here. And some of his suporters are already fuming about the recent FAIR articel, calling it a smear campain. Some one even tried to convice me that FIAR was part of the CIA.

Clearly, Clark hoped to avoid all of the scruteny by anouncing his intentnions late in the game. Like a marathon runner who jumps out at of the crowd a few hundred yards away from the finish line. Up until recently, Clark had even said he had no intentions of attending one of the Democratic primary debates, until the DLC anonced to the contrary. Clearly, they thought that he could just step over the debates. But the FAIR articel has signifcantly damaged his standing, and he is now a mere mortal.

Clark early lead will prove to be no more real than Gephardt's early lead in the polls.

[sungkathak]

41. A tool to weaken Howard Dean

I think W. Clark is a tool used by insider group to weaken Howard Dean. This insider group controls US ploitics. They have a road map to control Islamic countries. They need more war in Mid-east. Bush is their favorite. To make sure their road map can be carried out, they make Lieberman their favourable candidate in Democratic Party. So either Party wins, their foreign policy will remain unchanged. But American people realize the war policy is not for the interest of US. They go for Howard Dean whom opposes the war. As Howard Dean leads over other Candidates, the group worried and use such tactic to divert Dean's support. At last make their favorite win the primary.

[Classical_Liberal]

53. The same poll places Lieberman in the top three

Newsweek seems to have kind of a neocon audience like the New Republican.

[burr]

56. Thank the Dean supporters for their goddamned loyalty...

these people would not hesistate to back Clark or Kerry if they were nominated, but if Dean was nominated the turncoat Clark and Kerry cutthroats would seek vengeance against our party by voting for shrub.

What was it that one Kerry backer recently posted?..."I would not vote for Dean under any circumstances, especially if nominated!"

Maybe it is time for all Democrats to have this mentality.

[Name removed]

57. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[burr]

58. That quote did not come from me, but from an "idiotic" Kerry poster...

is that specific enough for you? :shrug:

My we are touchy this morning!!!

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jerryster]

60. Clark

Hi again. In my previous post I mentioned that scrutiny would start and it would be important to see how Clark handles it. Well, the first shot has been fired (no bad taste pun intended) by Robert Novak. Now I'm no fan of Novak and am very happy when he makes the DU Top 10 idiot list. However, that is not the point here. Don't know if you get Novak where you are. Today's (9/22) Chicago Sun-Times had a column from Novak titled "The trouble with Wes Clark". Specifically, Novak states that Clark met and exchanged gifts with the notorious (Novak's word) Bosnian Serb commander and indicted war criminal, Gen. Ratko Mladic. Novak goes on to say that US diplomats warned Clark against the meeting, that Richard Holbrooke had a "Clark Rule". The rule was that Clark was never to be alone with a Serb, Croat, or Muslim. Now it may appear that I am negative here about Clark. I am not, though I haven't decided on who my ultimate preference is among the Dems and Clark is absolutely a consideration. My questions are, are you aware of Novak's column? Did Clark respond to it and do you think the repugnicants would use it? I think they would, which leads me (long way around, I admit) to my question in my earlier post: How will he handle the scrutiny?

[Bread and Circus]

61. I believe today he said it was a culture war....

and indicated what we already know, it is a culture
war of lying liars and us. The lying liars are afraid
of Clark and he pointed it out today.

I am acutely aware of Novak. He's another service-dodging
chicken hawk lying piece of belligerant bombastic thievery.

Clark did exchange the hat and there is a picture of him with
it, I saw it. As a Clark supporter, it makes me cringe to think
what people might think. However, in context this was at a time
when he was negotiating for a peaceful resolution, and I think
he was trying to engage the opposition at a personal level.
Obviously it looksembarrassing.
However, the people he freed from ethnic cleansing
seem to love him, so if they can forgive him that indiscretion,
so can I.

Additionally, there is a nice video of Rummy shaking hands with
Saddam in the 80's and I am sure that wouldn't go over too well
if we plastered that everywhere.

What will Clark do now, I don't know. I hope he gets his message
and spirit across. He was Valedictorian at West Point, a Rhodes
Scholar, and taught Economics at West Point. People who know him
think he is razor sharp. I think he will be able to handle himself,
he just needs to put his best foot forward.

[jerryster]

63. Clark

As always, your response was informed and intelligently written. I was not aware of the picture of Rummy and Saddam. I guess my thought on it is it would be a great response if the repugnicants use the Mladic thing. I would use it ONLY as a response. I will continue to look for your posts. They are among the best on DU!

[ModerateMiddle]

62. Congrats to the General

I am frankly fascinated by his candidacy. At this point, I am still firmly in the John Kerry camp, because I honestly believe he will be the best President of the choices.

But this immediate front runner status has me fascinated! It will be very interesting to see what happens over the next several weeks/months!

[Nicholas_J]

64. Thats why Clark was sent in

To draw votes from what in the hallowed halls of the DLC is being called a Dean disaster. In EVERY poll taken since January, Dean falls behind all of the other major candidates in ability to beeat Bush. IN no poll does he come close to Kerry, and now Clark. THe DLC does not want to run the candidates who has the LEAST chanvce of beating Bush of any candidate. They want to put in their best shot at it, not their worse. Not a bad strategy, to put in the person most likely to beat the opposition, than to send in a rookie. The idea is to win the White House, not to win a popularity contest. Deans campaaign is basically a slick madison avenue deodorant commercial.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

65. The meaninglessness of this poll will become apparent

henceforth. Enjoy.

[Nicholas_J]

66. Clark is now WAY head in a CNN Gallop Poll Today

22 percent to Deans 23, Kerry's 12, MoE 5 percent

[RevolutionStartsNow]

67. ha ha that's a good typo Nic...Clark 22 % to Deans 23!

You have Dean ahead...LOL

Think I'll save this post...