OMG, Just Went To Kerry's Website

[Closer]

and my mouth just DROPPED! His campaign has copied EVERYTHING Dean's campaign is doing!! I mean EVERYTHING folks! I just can't believe how blatant they are in following Dean.

It would be HYSTERICAL if it weren't so PATHETIC!


Dean folks, go have a look for yourselves. Try not to :puke:

[Zynx]

1. Not precisely, but pretty close.

It's part of the Dean obsession.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

2. Umm, they're both campaigning for President

what do you think the other candidate's websites should do? Not talk about issues, try to raise money, provide newsclips, blogs, etc.?

Next you'll complain because Kerry has the audacity to run TV ads.

:eyes:

[Bread and Circus]

40. Spot on...exactly, WTF are the candidates supposed to do?

This is a great thread :eyes:

[NewYorkerfromMass]

45. Also , there aren't many ways to design a good website

but I chalk the Dean self-congratulatory attitude up to low self -esteem.

[Kahuna]

3. Why? Because they both have the standard campaign website..

staples? Give it a rest, Closer. You're hyperventillating over nothing.

[onehandle]

4. That's pretty petty of you...

And there are finite logical ways to set up a campaign website. Look at other campaigns. Even Bush

What a meaningful attack. :eyes:

[xultar]

5. I'm not seeing it, They are all campaigning for President so

they are all going to have the same stuff basically.

Can you be more specific on the what you are talking about?

[LuminousX]

6. Uh... Dude

If something is working for one person, expect others to pick it up. That is called life and if others don't pick it up, they are stupid.

When it comes to campaigning, there are very few original ideas. Do you really think the Dean campaign is 100% innovative? They pulled a lot of their ideas from the McCain campaign and the Jerry Brown campaign.

All that matters is the differences in the policy. If they use the same means to deliver their message, that is great.

[Closer]

10. Uh DUDE,

I guess Dean copied the "Help Dean win Iowa and NH in these FOUR EASY STEPS" from another campaign before Kerry stole it :eyes:

I guess Dean copied his EXACT format and layout from another camp before Kerry stole it, too :eyes:


Anybody who's followed these sites, can see who the true trail blazer is and WHY he is the frontrunner. Isn't that usually how it works out?

[LuminousX]

12. No, it doesn't.

Yes, the four point plan has most likely been used before. And again, if it is working for Dean, why shouldn't Kerry adopt it?

If Coca-Cola comes out with Orange Coke and it sells well, you can expect Pepsi-Cola to come out with an Orange Pepsi.

[Bread and Circus]

41. Yeah, and I am sure Dean programmed his website...

give it a rest. Dean aint the brains behind his website.

If Dean never copied anyone, then why did he start out in
Iowa and NH?

[Clovis Sangrail]

23. more than similar

There IS a finite number of ways one can lay out a campaign site... but there is also a finite number of candidates, and the number of candidates is far less than the number of possible layouts.

I don't think Kerry has 'plagerized' Dean's website, though there are some things that seem to come close.

Dean is not %100 inovative, but he was the first candidate to successsully use the net as a campaigning tool.
Dean is the candidate who first started using a blog.
Dean is the candidate who first started using meetup.com
Dean is the candidate who first started organizing 'house parties' online.
etc. etc. etc.


I'm pretty sure Dean's site predates all of the other 2004 candidate sites., and if you've been watching from the start it seems pretty obvious Kerry used Dean's site as a template.

Edwards, Sharpton, Leiberman, Clark, Braun, and Kucinich all incorporated some of the ideas first found on the Dean site, but they all seemed to come up with reasonably unique sites.

[George_Bonanza]

28. Other candidates used blogs and internet fund raising, Dean wasn't the 1st

I believe John McCain had a successful net-based fund-raising campaign before being stomped by W. Bush. And I believe candidates like Hart also had blogs that helped their campaign. And there were hundreds of unofficial but important blogs in the 2000 elections. The issue of internet money-raising and blogging is a familiar concept these days, even before Dean.

If you're so convinced that Kerry is going to be nothing but a copycat simply because of a site, many could easily counter that Dean is nothing but a Kerry copycat on issues like energy and foreign policy. Which would you rather have, if both accusations were true? A campaigning copycat or an issues copycat?

[elcondor]

7. Could you be a little more specific?

I went to both and, like others have said, they both look pretty standard to me. :shrug:

[Kahuna]

11. Didn't you know. DEAN invented campaign websites...

:eyes:

[xultar]

18. No Dean invented Blogging n/t

[Feanorcurufinwe]

21. Actually, it was Dean, not Gore who invented the Internet

[Bread and Circus]

42. Yeah and Dean invented dissent.

[Cocoa]

8. not only that, but have you seen Kerry?

ever notice how he looks French? :wow:

[blm]

9. You're pleased that Dean copied Kerry on his foreign policy and enviro

speeches. Did you ever even BOTHER to comapre Kerry's speeches that he gave outlining his foreign policy and environmental policies, and then read Dean's later ones?

Dean practically cribbed Kerry's. It's not like Dean has worked actively on both these issues for over 30 years like Kerry has.

[flpeach]

15. C'Mon Guys . . . . .

Let's not fight over who is better . . . .

Join the ABB Club!!!!

Anybody But Bush!

Either one of them would be good candidates, and either will get my vote!!

[XanaDUer]

22. LOL!

Good one, blm.

[_NorCal_D_]

13. What?

The sites have no similarities whatsoever. Just because they address the same issues doesn’t mean that they are copying one another.

[NNadir]

14. Repetition is the sincerest form of flattery.

Kerry is a good man. I hope he and Dean will be friendlier some time in the future, each acknowledging the other's strengths.

The nice thing that Kerry is doing, is focusing his attacks on Bush rather than on his fellow Democrat. I recently saw some Kerry literature that didn't even mention Dean's name, the first of that nature I've seen in a long time.

One thing that Howard Dean is doing, the thing that solidified my support for him, is enunciating very loudly and proudly the anti-Bush position. If Kerry adds his voice in this way, so much the merrier.

Kerry's was once my first choice; and for a long time my second choice. I'm glad to see him moving in the only direction in which he can succeed.

[blm]

17. Funny, in 2002 many of us here were debating if Gore or Kerry

was attacking Bush the hardest. Nice how the media only focused on Dean and his attacks which came much later. But, I guess his attacks on the other Democrats were much more fun for the press.

Kerry Shows Courage In Challenging Bush
Thursday, August 8, 2002 By: Joe Conason

New York Observer

>>>>>>>
But it was John Kerry who delivered the most interesting, substantive and challenging message. His subject was George W. Bush's shortcomings as a world leader.

The New York Times reported that Mr. Kerry "offered a long attack on Mr. Bush's foreign policy," although the paper gave short shrift to the details in the Senator''s speech. What he began to articulate was a Democratic critique of this administration''s blunt and myopic unilateralism, and a vision that restores international alliances to the center of American diplomacy.

He agrees with the objective of removing Saddam Hussein, but objected to the vague plans for what will replace the Iraqi dictatorship. He called the latest arms treaty with Russia a "cosmetic" one that inadequately safeguards decommissioned weapons. He denounced the "Cold War" approach to North Korea that has undone the progress achieved by the Clinton administration. He expressed scorn for the administration''s disengagement from the Middle East crisis before Sept. 11.

>>>>>>>>
Mr. Kerry is staking out a politically perilous position at a time when conventional wisdom declares foreign and military issues to be the exclusive province of the President. As a Senator from Massachusetts--whose last Presidential nominee suffered humiliating defeat by a candidate named Bush--he risks highlighting negative assumptions about his own viability on a national ticket.
 
According to the scientific measurements made by political consultants, Mr. Kerry''s chosen path is marked "dead end." The safer domestic route is crowded with competitors who talk only about corporate responsibility, prescription drugs and Social Security. The boldest among them now criticize the lopsided tax cut that shouldn't have passed last year.

>>>>>>>

There is, however, at least one benefit for Mr. Kerry in speaking out on those faraway places and problems. While his rivals sound as if they''re campaigning for the offices they already occupy, he sounds as if he is running for President.

[NNadir]

29. That was in the idyllic days before Kerry's war vote.

The war WAS wrong though, and many of us were not deceived by claims to the contrary, about 600,000 of us stood in the streets of New York on the bitterest coldest day of the month to say we understood exactly what the war was about. That was a powerful and committed constituency that Kerry lost when he voted in favor of Bush's greatest disasters.

Kerry's still a good man, but making that vote was a political decision that cost him. I remember full well that opposition to the war was then considered political suicide, and it forced some of us into the few campaigns that had the courage to oppose the war even though the war was still "popular." Kerry lost my support then, and I determined to join the (then) quixotic campaign for Howard Dean. This in turn gave me an opening to learn, speaking only for myself, that Dean was more far impressive and far more focused than I at first thought I could suspect.

[blm]

33. If Dean was "quixotic" about the war then Kucinich was Christ himself.

Dean wasn't against the war. He was FOR use of force under an IWR with the Biden-Lugar amendment. That's it. Kerry was pushing or that, too, until Gep made that final deal.

It's absolutely simplistic to refer to Kerry as prowar and Dean as antiwar when neither are accurate.

Kucinich was the one speaking to those antiwar crowds. Dean just collected the liberal antiwar $$$$ with the attention that the media gave him that they refused to give DK, the real antiwar candidate.

[NNadir]

35. I was at the winter and spring war protests in NY and didn't see anyone

related to the Kucinich campaign. Danny Glover spoke at the winter protests in New York (exceedingly well, I might add) but he was not with Kucinich then.

I met several times with Dean people working the crowd. Maybe that's why Dean is going somewhere.

In any case, with the exception of opposing the war, Kucinich has nothing to recommend him.

[sandnsea]

16. If you've never been there, how do you know?

Why would you just assume Dean had everything on his site first?

[Closer]

37. When did I say I'd never been to Kerry's site before?

:shrug:

[sandnsea]

39. It's been that way for months

It's changed 3 times since the beginning. You didn't seem to know that. And it looks like a normal web site. Top header, links down the left side, main news in the middle, and miscellaneous info down the right side. Standard web design actually.

[w4rma]

19. No puking here. Dean has a fantastic campaign. I expect it to be copied

by today's candidates and more and more candidates in the future.

[acmavm]

20. This constant sniping about who's copying who does democrats

absolutely NO GOOD AT ALL. The issues are the issues. They are not going to vary from one candidate to another. This is self-defeating and pointless.

[mitchum]

24. Yep, and pretty soon John is gonna have some bone length removed...

from his legs because he wants to be Dean's height.
Good god man, give it a freaking rest

[blm]

34. ROTF.

.

[dsc]

25. For the record

I haven't been to Kerry's website in a while so I have no idea the extent to which they are simliar. That said, so what. I really don't care. These things aren't patented.

[LuminousX]

26. Website originality is the ONLY ISSUE I vote on

Screw things like energy policy and foreign policy. Website design - that's where it is at.

[Clovis Sangrail]

27. single issue?

I think it's more than reasonable to include a lack of website originality when evaluating candidates.

I agree, it would be silly to make it a dealbreaker, but to not to use all the available data to evaluate a candidate is equally silly.

[caledesi]

30. Shows that Dean is a leader....

Dean - FIRST to mention Bill Clinton...the others followed
Dean - FIRST to talk about about how bad Bush is for this country in blatant terms
Dean - FIRST to talk about gay rights
Dean - FIRST to talk about * and the race-baiting with the "quota" used wrongly in reference to the U of Michigan
Dean - FIRST to talk about the South and how we need the old Dems that are now Repugs to come back to the party

[dsc]

32. First to mention Bill Clinton?

I give Dean an awful lot of credit but that is going a wee bit far.

[caledesi]

43. No, it isn't. Dean was the first candidate to ever mention The Big Dog

The others followed promptly.

[blm]

44. Right...That's why Dean backed up Bush instead of Gore and Kerry

back in July, 2002 on MTP.

Kerry and Gore were speaking out throughout 2002, and Kerry was hitting Bush before 9-11, too for dumping the Kyoto Accord and pushing the energy bill. The media would barely mention the substance of their criticisms because they hurt Bush too much.

By the time Dean came along, he started getting the attention because he was the FIRST to attack the other Democratic candidates.

You just accepted the media version of the primary. Why do you think they're called mediawhores?

[Cocoa]

31. Kerry's site has an ad responding to Bush's ad

Dean's site has a plea for money to produce such an ad.

So they're not exactly the same.

[DemDogs]

36. Actually I think Kerry's is better

And I have seen on blogs (other than the politicians own blogs) that there is some agreement about this.

[RetroLounge]

38. Marsha Marsha Marsha

'nuff said...

[Sully]

46. The sites are similar

for many of the reasons noted above. But yes, Kerry supporters are organizing actively on the web and come in 2nd to Dean in blog comments:

http://www.bopnews.com/archives/000024.html#000024

Now by looking at the bar chart you will see that Kerry's mentions are about 1/3 of Dean's but considering that Joe Trippi did such a fantastic job with the net and early (yes I admit it), I still think that's a pretty good showing.

[rabidhamster]

47. OMG Kerry's is better!

Can you believe it? Kerry's site is actually better than Howards'! Even more amazing, the people there actually discuss issues in an intelligent manner! OMG!

[George_Bonanza]

48. Hey Rabidhamster

I appreciate your support for John Kerry but your inflammatory style will not help our underdog cause here. What will most likely happen is that Kerry opposers will use you to discredit the Kerry support at DU.