Japanese Water-fueled Cars to be Mass Produced (video)

[Dover]

This is a press release from the company. No patent as of yet. Still many unanswered questions.


Water-fuel car unveiled in Japan

The car has an energy generator that extracts hydrogen from water that is poured into the car's tank. The generator then releases electrons that produce electric power to run the car. Genepax, the company that invented the technology, aims to collaborate with Japanese manufacturers to mass produce it.

http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_EN/20080613/153276/

Video - http://www.reuters.com/news/video?videoId=84561&videoChannel=74


We've seen plenty of promises about water-powered cars (among other things), but it looks like Japan's Genepax has now made some real progress on that front, with it recently taking the wraps off its Water Energy System fuel cell prototype. The key to that system, it seems, is its membrane electrode assembly (or MEA), which contains a material that's capable of breaking down water into hydrogen and oxygen through a chemical reaction..cont'd

http://www.engadget.com/2008/06/13/genepax-shows-off-water-powered-fuel-cell-vehicle/

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And some unrelated, related info:


Wikipedia -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water-fuelled_car



Suspicion surrounds water-fueled car and the death of its inventor.

http://waterpoweredcar.com/stanmeyer.html

http://inventorspot.com/articles/waterfueled_car_and_death_inventor_5684

[Kutjara]

1. Never mind all that. Why is...

...Jason Voorhees driving the car in the photo? :scared: I mean, just because it's Friday the 13th...

[ccharles000]

2. Cool.

[Speck Tater]

3. All it takes is freshman physics to know this is a hoax.

Too bad all those gullible investors will be taken for a bundle of money simply because they never took freshman physics.

And no, there are no exceptions to the physical laws I'm referring to, regardless of what "top secret process" they claim to have. It's bogus. Period. End of discussion. Don't agree? Then take freshman physics and get a clue.

on edit: Need more proof? If these water-powered motors actually worked then the entire world's electrical power problem could be solved by building power generating stations next to rivers, lakes, and oceans for an unlimited supply of water. No coal burning generation plants, no nuclear, no natural gas plants, no hydroelectric plants. Overnight, all of physics becomes obsolete and we live in a free-energy paradise. Bullshit!

[nebula]

4. Please

STFU.

Thanks.

[bahrbearian]

5. Truth hurt?

[nebula]

10. True or not

there are ways of making a point without sounding like a raving lunatic off your meds.

[Speck Tater]

11. Sorry, but I'm fed up with the level of scientific ILLITERACY in this country. NT

[Xithras]

6. Yep. These people are good at getting people to overlook one simple issue.

"Look, we just apply water to the electrode and get hydrogen! We burn the hydrogen and oxygen, get free energy, and have no pollutants out the tailpipe!"

Sounds good, but it plays on the fact that most laymen (including the media talking heads) don't know what an electrode is. An electrode is an electrical conductor. To make this hydrogen generator work, you have to feed it electricity. Basic physics says that you can't get more energy out of a device than you put into it, which means that you aren't really generating any more power from the hydrogen than you had already put into the batteries driving the electrodes. You're ALWAYS better off simply hooking those batteries directly to the motor.

[Mojorabbit]

7. I never took physics

but did try unsuccessfully to teach it to myself years ago. You have rained on my parade. I was hoping this was legit and would be the beginning of the end to the use of oil and perhaps further climate deterioration. sigh.

[kristopher]

14. I'm not saying you're wrong, but...

Your proofs leave a lot to be desired. Just for grins, let's pick at them. First, the fact that no one is using it isn't a proof of any kind. No one was using airplanes 130 years ago either. That hardly proved that airplanes were impossible according to the laws of physics.
Second is the claim you are making about the physical impossibility of the concept. What is in the story that counters that is their claim to be using a membrane similar to that used in fuel cells. There is no source of input power required to operate a fuel cell, so the refutation you are offering is somewhat lacking.

I'm with you on the assessment of it probably being a scam; I would certainly require a great deal of real evidence before I'd accept the claims they are making. However, you just haven't made you side of the argument convincing...yet.

[Zachstar]

8. Ok hold the phone.

Water... Great!

Small car... Great!

Jason?................ WHAT THE F***!!

[Zachstar]

9. Now that I have gotten over the fact that the driver is a scary man..

Obviously I have very little hope that this is actually real. And even if it is real it likely uses some kind of expensive chemical to weaken the bonds.

The reason I don't want to grave dance or take a dump on the concept that much is because I do not want to discourage inventors and other projects. We took a big hit as it is from the Cold Fusion fiasco (Even tho yes it works just not power positive) and we don't need it getting any worse.

However, if this is true and he actually lives to tell about it :P

This solves the energy crisis.... The problem is you have to take your seat behind other water fuel claims and burning saltwater and things like that.

If they mass produce the car and we actually get to see one rather than just seeing a clueless reporter on the news... Maybe

[eppur_se_muova]

12. Yawn.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1787786&mesg_id=1788066

[Zachstar]

13. Can we calm down on the hate and the crap please?

People in this topic just saying stuff without even considering this are not doing humanity any favors.

Are we paying for it? No... Last time I checked the US gov is not funding this.

Are we affected by it? No... If it is total bullshit Solar, Wind, and Fusion research will go on.


I have a problem with the hate like I have a problem with those saying we will never go faster than light relative to earth. Stop acting like you know more than mother nature. There are always ways around issues if you look deep enough. IE Folding space for FTL travel etc...

BTW you can run a car off of water if you have the right thing to separate the hydrogen first. Its just that usually these powders or whatever to weaken the bonds are made from extremely expensive metals and are not viable for normal travel.

So lets cut the crap please. Nobody is seriously falling for it and that is good enough for me. In the meantime I want research to continue.

[tinrobot]

15. Japanese Company Says Laws of Physics Don't Apply — to Cars

That's the title of a discussion about this same company that's going on over at Slashdot. Amongst the joking, there's actually some pretty good explanations as to why this can't work.

Essentially, it's a perpetual motion machine, because you start with water, convert it to hydrogen and then use a fuel cell to convert it back to -- water. Essentially a closed system. If that closed system produces more energy than it consumes, you have a perpetual motion machine, which is impossible.

Anyways... here's the link:

http://science.slashdot.org/science/08/06/14/1737231.shtml

[Zachstar]

16. We have no clue what is actually going on anyway.

I highly doubt water is the only thing going into the tank. More than likely some kind of thing that interacts with the water to break it down.

Regardless IF they have done so and the fluid or powder or whatever is not precious metals or highly corrosive materials then id say they got some kind of power extraction unit going.

But if this is a scam... arent they taking it a bit far when you got the car and the company (In japan not some pot filled basement in the US) Just saying if it is a scam it is going to be one hell of a whopper....

[tinrobot]

17. That's right, we have no clue.

The article is very vague. But the fact remains that water simply cannot be the sole fuel source for a hydrogen fueled vehicle. It's thermodynamically impossible. In order to crack water, you need to add energy, and where that energy comes from is not explained. The article seems to indicate that no additional energy is required, which raises my inner skeptic.

Perhaps there is some magic substance that they put in the tank to crack the water, but it would take energy to produce that substance as well as reclaim it. What is that substance, how is it made, and what's the energy cost for the entire process? If they can't be specific about that, then I'd wait skeptically until more is revealed.

[Zachstar]

18. The cool thing about these ideas is usually they add a piece of the puzzle.

For instance one guy said he can run his car all day after plugging it in to start HHO cracking. Well it didn't work obviously but the HHO generator design was better than most and ideas obviously spread around. Now you got this side industry of people combining HHO and Water vapour to sometimes double gas range on some old gas hogs.

Then the cold fusion fiasco which even tho it wont be power positive anytime soon designed a great test experiment and provided lots of tools for college level researchers.

What I am thinking is what if these guys found a material to crack the water that is made from crap materials? If it can be cheaply mined atleast we got another nonrenewable source.

Looking further into it, What is going to harm the market for it greatly in the future is cost. The reactor cost many thousands right now and if it corrodes in a year it is not going to be cost effective. Add on top of that the fact that it is not pumping out very much in the way of current so weight is going to play a serious role in range of this thing. Sure a 110 pound young driver alone may get 80 miles on a liter of water with a 1 dollar packet of cracking material. But what happens when My 240 Lb ass rides shotgun? My guess is the thing will not even be able to reach legal highway speeds without having to add a 2nd super expensive reactor.