Wave power prototype 'significant step' for sector

[FBaggins]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/8689095.stm



A new generation of prototype wave power machine has been unveiled by the first minister.

It is 180m long, weighs 1,500 tonnes and can produce 750Kw of electricity.

Manufactured in Leith, the Vagr Atferd generator will now be transported to Orkney, where it will tested for three years to prepare it for commercial use.

The Vagr Atferd was produced by the Leith-based firm Pelamis Wave Power (PWP) for the German energy giant E.On.

[kristopher]

1. Apology accepted

See also:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/highlands_and_islands/8564662.stm

[FBaggins]

2. "Apology" because a prototype is going in the water?

How long did the first prototype period last for the earlier model?

:rofl:

IF everything goes well, this is the start of a three-year prototype. There's no way that multiple commercially viable models are market ready and installed in commercial volume in five years.

Far more likely is that the first six months teaches them something else that needs to be changed and they start work on a new prototype.

[kristopher]

3. Riiiiight....

You're so used to the performance of the nuclear industry you've lost touch with how more mundane products are developed.

You are right about one thing - there is a lot, and I mean a huge passel, of confirmation for the bias I've developed after many years of academic study of noncarbon energy alternatives.

[FBaggins]

4. There's nothing "mundane" about something that's never worked before.

The pilot projects have to actually work before you can guess how long it will be before it can become commercial.

The timeline you keep posting is nothing but an industry pipedream... an attempt to obtain massive funding increases so that the industry can participate in 2020 plans. If the president set a goal for 2015, they would create a timeline that implied that they could be up and running as a major contributor by that point.

And of course they COULD if someone wanted to throw many billions of dollars at the companies doing research... but nobody is doing that, are they?


As with so many other things, you misunderstand confirmation bias. You're so far gone that even when a paper directly agrees with me, you assume that I must be wrong and therefore the paper (which you assume must be correct) MUST disagree with me. You're blind to the most obvious contradictions in your assumptions.

As I said a day or two ago, you could save yourself great embarrassment by actually reading what you cite and what you reply to... rather than assuming that you understand both.

Seriously.

[kristopher]

5. It's a three year demonstration project"to prepare it for commercial use"

"Manufactured in Leith, the Vagr Atferd generator will now be transported to Orkney, where it will tested for three years to prepare it for commercial use."

Since this article jives perfectly with the timeline, I'd suggest that your advice to me is a case of projection on your part.

[FBaggins]

6. Need to work on your reading comprehension.

If it takes fifteen years before there is a full scale wave "farm" of these units, the three year demonstration project would STILL be to "prepare it for commercial use"

and yet again, it has to WORK before a three year plan makes any sense. They thought they were three years away a couple years ago... Until the project only lasted a month and they realized that they had to modify the design. If this one is taken out in a storm three months from now (as with the competing design recently) they'll be talking about another three year plan two years from now.

[kristopher]

7. There are over 100 projects like this around the world...

[FBaggins]

8. Never one to let reality get in your way eh?

Why is it a milestone if there are over 100 "like this"?

[kristopher]

9. You are projecting again...

Wave Developers

The following table contains a list of the wave energy concepts known to EMEC. This list is alphabetical by company name and is not intended to infer any endorsement by EMEC of the concept or the companies concerned. The immature nature of the industry means that some of the categorisation of devices may not perfectly fit the simplified assessment made for this web site. If you have any additions or amendments, please contact us.

Note: details on the device type can be found at Wave Energy Devices
COMPANY TECHNOLOGY DEVICE TYPE COUNTRY BASE
Able Technologies L.L.C. Electric Generating Wave Pipe B USA
Applied Technologies Company Ltd Float Wave Electric Power Station B Russia
Aquamarine Power Oyster C UK
Atmocean Atmocean B USA
AW Energy Waveroller C Finland
AWS Ocean Energy Archimedes Wave Swing F UK
Balkee Tide and Wave Electricity Generator TWPEG B Mautitius
BioPower Systems Pty Ltd bioWave C Australia
Bourne Energy OceanStar ocean power system G USA
Brandl Motor Brandl Generator B Germany
Caley Ocean Systems Wave Plane UK/Denmark
Checkmate Seaenergy UK Ltd. Anaconda G UK
College of the North Atlantic Wave Powered Pump Canada
Columbia Power Technologies Direct Drive Permanent Magnet Linear Generator Buoy / Permanent Magnet Rack and Pinion Generator Buoy / Contact-less Force Transmission Generator Buoy B USA
C-Wave C-wave A UK
Daedalus Informatics Ltd Wave Energy Conversion Activator C Greece
Delbuoy Wave Powered Desalination B USA
DEXA Wave UK Ltd DEXA Wave Energy Converter A USA
Ecofys Wave Rotor G Netherlands
Ecole Centrale de Nantes SEAREV B France
Edinburgh University Sloped IBS Buoy A UK
ELGEN Wave Horizon Platform B USA
Embley Energy Sperboy D UK
Energias de Portugal Foz do Douro breakwater D Portugal
ETYMOL ETYMOL G Chile
Euro wave energy Floating absorber B Norway
Finevara Renewables Aqua Buoy B USA
Float Inc. Pneumatically Stabilized Platform B USA
Floating Power Plant ApS (F.P.P.) Poseidon's Organ C Denmark
Fobox AS FO3 B Norway
Fred Olsen & Co./Ghent University SEEWEC B Norway / EU
GEdwardCook Syphon Wave Generator F USA
GEdwardCook Floating Wave Generator A USA
Grays Harbor Ocean Energy Company Titan Platform D USA
Green Ocean Energy Ltd Ocean Treader WEC A UK
Greencat Renewables Wave Turbine A UK
GyroWaveGen GyroWaveGen G USA
Hydam Technology McCabe Wave Pump A Ireland
Hidroflot s.l. Multi cell platforms B Spain
Independent Natural Resources SEADOG B USA
Indian Wave Energy Device IWAVE B India
Ing Arvid Nesheim Oscillating Device B Norway
Instituto Superior Tecnico Pico OWC D Portugal
Interproject Service (IPS) AB IPS OWEC Buoy B Sweden
JAMSTEC Mighty Whale E Japan
Jospa Ltd Irish Tube Compressor (ITC) G/E Ireland
Joules Energy Efficiency Services Ltd TETRON B Ireland
Lancaster University PS Frog B England
Langlee Wave Power Langlee System C Norway
Leancon Wave Energy Multi Absorbing Wave Energy Converter (MAWEC) D Denmark
Manchester Bobber Manchester Bobber B UK
Martifer Energia FLOW A Portugal
Motor Wave Motor Wave B Hong Kong
Muroran Institute of Technology Pendulor Japan
Nautilus Wave Energy Convertor for near shore deployment. Buoy driven piston driving pressurised air to onshore energy convertor B Israel
Neptune Renewable Energy Ltd Triton C UK
Neptune Systems MHD Neptune G Netherlands
Norwegian University of Science and Technology CONWEC B Norway
Ocean Energy Ltd Ocean Energy Buoy D Ireland
Ocean Harvesting Technologies Ocean Harvester A Sweden
Ocean Motion International OMI Combined Energy System B USA
Ocean Navitas Aegir Dynamo B UK
Ocean Power Technologies Power Buoy B UK / USA
Ocean Wave and Wind Energy Norway
Ocean Wave Energy Company OWEC F USA
Ocean Wavemaster Ltd Wave Master G UK
Oceanic Power Seaheart Spain
Oceanlinx (formerly Energetech) Denniss-Auld Turbine D Australia
Oceantec Energías Marinas, S.L. Oceantech Energy Convertor A Spain
Offshore Islands Limited Wave Catcher G USA
Offshore Wave Energy Ltd OWEL Energy Converter UK
OWWE (Ocean Wave and Wind Energy) Wave Pump Rig B Norway
Pelagic Power AS PelagicPower B Norway
Pelamis Wave Power Pelamis A UK
Renewable Energy Holdings CETO B AUS / UK
Renewable Energy Pumps Wave Water Pump (WWP) D USA
Resolute Marine Energy, Inc Resolute WEC B USA
Rothman Energy Systems Rothman Energy Systems B USA
Sara Ltd MHD Wave Energy Conversion (MWEC) G USA
SDE S.D.E C Israel
Sea Power International AB Streamturbine Sweden
Seabased AB Linear generator (Islandsberg project) B Sweden
SeaNergy SeaNergy F Israel
SeaVolt Technologies Wave Rider B USA
Seawood Designs Inc SurfPower B Canada
SEEWEC Consortium FO3 device, previously as Buldra B UK
SeWave Ltd OWC D Faroe Islands
Sieber Energy Inc SieWave Canada
SRI International Generator utilizing patented electroactive polymer artificial muscle (EPAMT) technology USA
Straumekraft AS Winch operated buoy B Norway
Swell Fuel Lever Operated Pivoting Float B USA
Swell Fuel Swell Fuel A USA
SyncWave SyncWave B Canada
Trident Energy Ltd, Direct Thrust Designs Ltd The Linear Generator B UK
Union Electrica Fenosa of Spain OWC D Spain
University of Edinburgh Salter's Duck A N.A.
Vortex Oscillation Technology ltd Vortex oscillation A Russia
Wave Dragon Wave Dragon E Wales / Denmark
Wave Energy Seawave Slot-Cone Generator E Norway
Wave Energy Centre (WaVEC) Pico plant D Portugal
Wave Energy Technologies Inc. WET EnGen™ B Canada
Wave Energy Technology (WET-NZ) B New Zealand
Wave Power Group Salter Duck, Sloped IPS A UK
Wave Star Energy ApS Wave Star B Denmark
Waveberg Development Waveberg B Canada
WaveBob Limited Wave Bob B Ireland
Wavegen (Siemens) Limpet D UK
Wavemill Energy Wavemill Canada
WavePiston WavePiston A Denmark
WavePlane Production Wave Plane E Denmark
Wello OY A Finland
WindWavesAndSun WaveBlanket G USA

http://www.emec.org.uk/wave_energy_developers.asp

[FBaggins]

10. Wow... look at that lists...

...and how many of them have "projects like this" ?

You know... full scale second generation prototypes ready for testing in the real world?

Oh! Those are "concepts" ??? That's what I thought.

Let's take a look at the first few.

Able Technologies - Drawing board. No device.

Applied Technologies Company - Been around for about a decade, but still developing a demonstrator unit

Aquamarine Power - Plan to release a plan for a prototype this summer and have one in the water a year later.

Atmocean - Not even a power company. They're working on refreshing the ocean and dealing with carbon... they don't intend to generate power.

[FBaggins]

11. Let's start at the other end of the list, shall we?

WindWavesAndSun - No prototype.

Wello OY - Filed a patent a week or two ago... no product at all.

WavePlane - testing an early prototype. Not ready for production testing.

WavePiston - Hope to have a 1/3 scale model testing later this year.

Wavemill Energy - Intended to be a reverse osmosis desalination product... doesn't produce electricity.

Wavegen - One of my favorites. Their first model (in Scotland) has been going for about a decade now. Just passed 50,000 hours connected to the grid.

[FBaggins]

12. How well the article "jives" with your timeline.

A spokesman for E.ON told BusinessGreen.com that if testing proves successful, the system will then be deployed at the 50MW marine power zone off the west coast of Orkney that the energy giant secured as part of the recent Crown Estate marine energy licensing awards. "However, if more work needs to be done, then it could be a P3 or a P4 ," he added.

The 1,500-tonne P2 is 50 metres longer than the original Pelamis sea snake that was dogged by technical problems when deployed off the coast of Portugal.

http://www.businessgreen.com/business-green/news/2263327/wave-power-sector-rides

[skids]

13. I'd pick on a different vendor...

Pelamis is dead serious. The 1/3rd scale models had an issue that could have been fixed with a replacement coupling of some sort. They elected to upscale because they were satisfied with the performance otherwise.

My favorite design, too. Though I still think they should paint huge puppy eyes on them.

[FBaggins]

14. Pelamis has had more problems than that.

Though they have one of the furthest advanced designs.

Remember that full-scale models of P1 were installed off Portugal a couple years ago. They lasted for about a month or two.

[skids]

15. The problems with the portugal farm were primarily financial.

The project backer went belly up in the market crash, so they are sitting in dock waiting to be tweaked and sent back out.

The project was originally conceived by the Portuguese renewable energy company, Enersis, which developed and financed the project and which was subsequently bought by the Australian infrastructure company Babcock & Brown for €490m in December 2005. Since the last quarter of 2008 Babcock & Brown had its shares suspended and has been in a managed process of selling its assets, including the Agucadoura project. In March 2009 Babcock & Brown went into voluntary administration.<11>

In November 2008 the Pelamis machines were brought back into harbor at Leixões due to a technical problem with some of the bearings for which a solution has been found. However the machines are likely to remain offline until a new partner is found to take over Babcock & Brown’s 77% share in the project.<10>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelamis_Wave_Energy_Converter