Some Nissan Leaf owners report getting stranded

[n2doc]

By Justin Hyde

updated 3/21/2011 9:20:52 AM ET


Now that electric-powered Nissan Leafs have been driven by the first owners for several weeks, Nissan's claimed 100-mile range is being tested in reality. The result? Reports of Leafs running out of juice and stranding drivers with little warning.

Although the details in the complaints on the MyNissanLeaf forum differ, the common thread in each is the Leaf suddenly paring back the estimates of its range in the middle of a trip, ending in a brief "turtle" mode — marked by an orange turtle icon on the Leaf's dash — followed by the car shutting down to prevent battery damage.

The Leaf's software is supposed to give drivers gradual warnings as they discharge the 24 kWh battery pack, with several visual and verbal notices including a "--" on the miles-to-empty indicator before the turtle icon switches on. But that wasn't the experience of a Leaf owner from San Diego last month, who was the first to report a shut-down:

Complaints differ, but the common thread is the Leaf suddenly paring back the estimates of its range in the middle of a trip, ending in a brief "turtle" mode — marked by an orange turtle icon on the Leaf's dash — followed by the car shutting down to prevent battery damage.
"Went from 17 to -- to turtle to dead in about 5 miles. 2.3 miles from dealer. 4.2 miles from home. Part of me is amused that I may go down in history as the first dumbass to drive the car into submission. But I am slightly shaky and upset as I thought there should have been no problem getting home."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42133379/ns/technology_and_science-tech_and_gadgets/

[leveymg]

1. Guess you could always tow around a gas-powered electrical generator.

http://common1.csnimages.com/lf/1/hash/1310/266710/1/20+kW+Industrial+Standby+Towable+Generator.jpg

[WatsonT]

4. Or a gas powered scooter

[leveymg]

6. Or some running shoes . . .

[WatsonT]

7. For that matter, why not save about 40 grande

and just get a bike?

[leveymg]

8. Added bonus: the bicycle has more range.

[WatsonT]

9. And is far better for the environment and your own health.

Easier to park too in most places.

[still_one]

2. Both the leaf and the volt are not cost effective vehicles, however, the volt doesn't have this

problem because the gas engine would take over.

Still, at 40 thousand dollars for the volt, it is hard for most people to justify

[leveymg]

3. Nor does every other hybrid on the road. Unless you run the gas tank dry, too.

I really don't understand some people's apparent inability to understand and deal with their cars - gas, electric, or other.

One of the first things owners of a new car should do is to see where Empty is really empty as indicated on the gas guage. That way, no rude surprises. Just carry a full gas can when you try it and don't do this on a stretch of road without safe pull-offs.

New owners of electric vehicles can do the same thing with a portable gas-powered generator in the trunk.

Cars aren't refrigerators. You can't just plug them in and ignore how they operate.

[wtmusic]

14. +1

You run out of "gas" in an electric car exactly once. Been there, done that.

Although the overhyped range is going to bite Nissan in the ass.

[still_one]

15. That is an excellent point. When the gauge indicates empty or recharge one should heed to warning

[WatsonT]

5. So why not get a hybrid

or small well made diesel car for a fraction of the price?

[kristopher]

10. OOOH, OOOH! Can I answer that?

One group is identified as "early adopters" who have disposable income and place a high value on having the newest of XXX.

The other more important group is/will be a large number of corporations that can use them as company vehicles in a manner that allows them to get double duty out of the vehicle's batteries batteries by using them as firming power for their (the company's internal electrical system). It is called vehicle to grid (V2G) and has a value of about $3K/year/car.

[WatsonT]

11. Exactly

it's a status symbol. Like having people carry you around town in carriage.

[kristopher]

12. The other group is far more important.

[WatsonT]

13. I really doubt corporations are going to rely on these to provide power for them

a generator would be far cheaper.

[kristopher]

17. Several already are. No, a generator isn't cheaper for the application I'm talking about.

Using the batteries would be less expensive even than grid provided electricity.

I'm betting you aren't aware that utilities sell different "kinds" of electricity. What applies to V2G at this point is called "firming power" or "regulating power".

This might help.

http://ideas.repec.org/p/hhs/gunwpe/0441.html
Renewable Energy Expansion and the Value of Balance Regulation Power

Abstract

To achieve a stable and reliable electricity supply, efficient provision of reserve capacity or, more generally, ancillary services is crucial. Because of the expansion of wind power with random variation in supply, and expected environmental restrictions in hydropower operation causing reductions in regulated hydropower capacity, the balancing power and system reliability issues have become topical in Scandinavia. Moreover, there seems to be a wide-spread opinion that increase in wind-power generation will lead to increased demand for regulating power, much higher prices for reserves and a much higher value of regulated hydro power. Thus, this chapter deals with the value of balance regulation power, or electricity reserves, in the Nordic electricity market, and we will address the issue of the future value of electricity reserves, hydro capacity in particular, that could be used either for energy production or to balance power production, and more generally discuss the value of balancing power in the Nordic electricity system. In the first, theoretical, part of this study we will apply a simple dynamic electricity generation model, involving hydropower, thermal power and wind power to derive the value of the water in a dam of a hydropower plant. In the second, more empirically oriented, part we will address a number of issues related to balance regulation and the value of balancing power with focus on the Nordic electricity market and against the background of an expanding generation capacity of intermittent renewable electricity, especially wind power.



It is also valuable in today's market. It's a high value, low volume commodity.

[WatsonT]

21. The Honda company has come out against this practice

saying it will damage their batteries and is not advisable.

[GKirk]

16. Can you explain...

...'firming power' and 'vehicle to grid'?

[kristopher]

20. Not today, sorry. Too much apologetics from the nuclear industry.

For V2G google the term and KEmpton or Greenblat or Letender

That should explain it all.

[Marblehead]

18. air power

[thereismore]

19. I got stranded when I ran out of gas once. nt