|
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend Bookmark this thread |
This topic is archived. |
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Environment/Energy |
rfkrfk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:42 PM Original message |
Why do environmentalists oppose the electric car? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Rick Myers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:45 PM Response to Original message |
1. I don't know that electric cars are the answer |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
msongs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:47 PM Response to Original message |
2. because the electricity used to run them comes from |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
ladjf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:53 PM Response to Reply #2 |
5. Charge the batteries with solar power. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
mom cat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:01 PM Response to Reply #5 |
13. i think that would take a huge array of solar panels per car. We need |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
ladjf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:27 PM Response to Reply #13 |
22. I'm not an engineer so I can't rebut your comment. However, |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:22 PM Response to Reply #5 |
21. Most cars need 50KW at the wheels |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
ladjf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:31 PM Response to Reply #21 |
27. I"m not an engineer so I don't know the exact numbers here. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:40 PM Response to Reply #27 |
29. An an array of that size... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
ladjf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:45 PM Response to Reply #29 |
31. $30K array will serve a medium size house. Do the car batteries |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:55 PM Response to Reply #31 |
32. Oh yes... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
JohnWxy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 08:14 PM Response to Reply #29 |
78. The cheapest way to produce the electric power for this or any |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 08:20 PM Response to Reply #78 |
79. Home wind power !? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 10:52 AM Response to Reply #21 |
60. The GEM Car that we are looking at requires 7.2 KW to charge. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 05:07 PM Response to Reply #60 |
61. Sounds a bit more reasonable... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 05:58 PM Response to Reply #61 |
63. It gets even cheaper and easier when you factor |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 06:12 PM Response to Reply #63 |
65. That's pretty damn good! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 06:19 PM Response to Reply #65 |
66. Yes..... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 06:25 PM Response to Reply #66 |
67. Sounds like you've got it all sorted... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 11:09 AM Response to Reply #60 |
70. Do you expect this car to be "street legal?" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 01:45 PM Response to Reply #70 |
71. Well, you wouldn't want to hit the interstate in it... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 02:53 PM Response to Reply #70 |
72. It goes under 25 in order t o be street legal. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 03:08 PM Response to Reply #72 |
73. I see your point. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 03:50 PM Response to Reply #73 |
74. Yes, we do live in an urban area. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 03:55 PM Response to Reply #74 |
75. Personally, I think urban life is the wave of the future. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 04:04 PM Response to Reply #75 |
76. We shall see, access to food will be a big issue in the cities. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 04:34 PM Response to Reply #76 |
77. I especially agree with your last sentence. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
rfkrfk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:11 PM Response to Reply #2 |
16. regional pollution is better than ... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Rabrrrrrr (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:50 PM Response to Original message |
3. Electricity generation, outside nuclear, is a dirty, polluting process |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Berry Cool (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:51 PM Response to Reply #3 |
4. * is totally against electric cars, you know. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
MrModerate (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:55 PM Response to Reply #3 |
8. Well, we're clearly screwed, then . . . |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Rabrrrrrr (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:58 PM Response to Reply #8 |
12. Yeah, nuclear really is the only good option. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Lorien (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:54 PM Response to Original message |
6. Not against them myself |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:55 PM Response to Original message |
7. I reject the premise. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
papau (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:29 PM Response to Reply #7 |
24. I agree - much better mileage for the amount of pollution - and for the |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Viking12 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Feb-03-06 08:28 AM Response to Reply #7 |
53. ...but strawmen are good fuel for flame wars... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
bemildred (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Feb-04-06 09:46 AM Response to Reply #53 |
56. Yes, a good trap requires bait. nt |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
acmejack (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:55 PM Response to Original message |
9. Batteries are hazardous waste. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
democracyindanger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:55 PM Response to Original message |
10. Armada of blue-smoker motorcycles? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
PaganPreacher (653 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 09:58 PM Response to Original message |
11. Two reasons: |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
cdsilv (883 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:19 PM Response to Reply #11 |
18. ...actually we need a return to the days of the 'Stanley Steamers'.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
PaganPreacher (653 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:31 PM Response to Reply #18 |
26. Steam would be great! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
midnight armadillo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 01:11 PM Response to Reply #18 |
38. There are MUCH better steam designs than the Stanley |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:20 PM Response to Reply #11 |
19. There are alternative to lead-acid |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
punpirate (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:06 PM Response to Original message |
14. Could you provide a source for the statement... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
rfkrfk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:29 PM Response to Reply #14 |
25. try this link |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
punpirate (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 11:32 PM Response to Reply #25 |
34. Well, this doesn't say that Honda is... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
yurbud (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:11 PM Response to Original message |
15. the advantage of electric cars is that you can hook them up to the grid |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:19 PM Response to Original message |
17. Beats me |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
cdsilv (883 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:21 PM Response to Reply #17 |
20. Can't they also use braking to generate power - flywheels? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:45 PM Response to Reply #20 |
30. They can indeed |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
happyslug (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 09:16 AM Response to Reply #30 |
69. 20% efficiency for Lead Acid |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:28 PM Response to Original message |
23. I don't have a problem with electric cars if... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
rfkrfk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:58 PM Response to Reply #23 |
33. an electric car has Real regen braking... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
skids (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 01:47 AM Response to Reply #33 |
35. The regen limit on the Prius is the battery C. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 02:38 AM Response to Reply #35 |
36. With that in mind... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
amandabeech (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 03:20 AM Response to Reply #23 |
37. The idea is to charge overnight and on the weekends, at least |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 05:22 PM Response to Reply #37 |
39. I agree in concept, but practice may prove more difficult. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
htuttle (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 06:19 PM Response to Reply #39 |
40. Since peak loading is only going to become more of an issue in the future |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 06:31 PM Response to Reply #40 |
41. They do in the UK and NZ |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 06:51 PM Response to Reply #41 |
43. However they do not use many electric cars in the UK or NZ. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 07:07 PM Response to Reply #43 |
44. No, but if we did have |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 07:39 PM Response to Reply #44 |
45. Most kinds of plants are most economical when they run continuously. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 09:04 PM Response to Reply #45 |
46. Agreed... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 09:56 PM Response to Reply #46 |
48. Of course, aluminum is an excellent battery... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 10:04 PM Response to Reply #48 |
49. OK, my chem isn't up to that... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 10:18 PM Response to Reply #49 |
50. You would need to generate sodium hydroxide by the electrolysis of NaCl |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 10:23 PM Response to Reply #50 |
51. Certainly not... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Feb-03-06 09:12 AM Response to Reply #51 |
54. I neglected to mention solar power. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 06:35 PM Response to Reply #40 |
42. I think the main reason is the capital cost of hundreds of millions of |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
GumboYaYa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 06:05 PM Response to Reply #42 |
64. Ding, ding, ding...you are corect sir. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
amandabeech (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Feb-02-06 09:39 PM Response to Reply #39 |
47. One could control summer afternoon charging by use of exhorbitant |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Feb-04-06 06:36 AM Response to Reply #47 |
55. I'm sorry Amanda, I didn't see your question from a few days ago. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
amandabeech (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Feb-04-06 07:38 PM Response to Reply #55 |
57. I agree with you on the population issue, NNadir. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
skids (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Feb-01-06 10:35 PM Response to Original message |
28. PHEVs are for all intents and purposes are electric cars. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
IrateCitizen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Feb-03-06 07:43 AM Response to Original message |
52. Cars are a piss-poor transportation choice for cities |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
rfkrfk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Feb-04-06 08:34 PM Response to Reply #52 |
58. electric powered mass transit is opposed by environmentalists |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
NNadir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Feb-04-06 10:47 PM Response to Reply #58 |
59. I don't think so. Most environmentalists understand efficiency. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Dead_Parrot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 05:15 PM Response to Reply #58 |
62. err, no it isn't. nt |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
IrateCitizen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Feb-06-06 10:50 PM Response to Reply #58 |
68. Citation, please? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
JohnWxy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Feb-07-06 08:48 PM Response to Original message |
80. I think there are some concerns about batteries and pollution in |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) | Thu Apr 18th 2024, 01:41 AM Response to Original message |
Advertisements [?] |
Top |
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Environment/Energy |
Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators
Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.
Home | Discussion Forums | Journals | Store | Donate
About DU | Contact Us | Privacy Policy
Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.
© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC