Well, I was kicked out of the Unorganized Militia today....

[DoNotRefill]

I didn't do anything wrong or illegal, I just became a member of an exempted class today.

Now I'm left wondering if I have a Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms any more.

On the other hand, "tha G" is gonna send me a paycheck now... ;)

"Who are the Militia? They consist now of the whole people, except for a few public officers." George Mason

[goju]

1. Clarify please

What unorganized militia were you booted from?

What exempted class are you referring to?

Why is G gonna send you a check, and what does that have to do with the militia thing?

Yes, of course you still have a RKBA ;)

[DoNotRefill]

2. I was booted from the Federal Unorganized Militia....

as defined in Title 10, §311, IIRC.

"(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied
males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section
313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a
declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States
and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the
National Guard.
(b) The classes of the militia are -
(1) the organized militia, which consists of the National Guard
and the Naval Militia; and
(2) the unorganized militia, which consists of the members of
the militia who are not members of the National Guard or the
Naval Militia."

The exemptions are defined in § 312, and are:

"(a) The following persons are exempt from militia duty:
(1) The Vice President.
(2) The judicial and executive officers of the United States,
the several States and Territories, and Puerto Rico.
(3) Members of the armed forces, except members who are not on
active duty.
(4) Customhouse clerks.
(5) Persons employed by the United States in the transmission
of mail.
(6) Workmen employed in armories, arsenals, and naval shipyards
of the United States.
(7) Pilots on navigable waters.
(8) Mariners in the sea service of a citizen of, or a merchant
in, the United States.
(b) A person who claims exemption because of religious belief is
exempt from militia duty in a combatant capacity, if the
conscientious holding of that belief is established under such
regulations as the President may prescribe. However, such a person
is not exempt from militia duty that the President determines to be
noncombatant."

I don't want to say which class I joined, because I don't want the freepers freeping my boss about me, but it wasn't the Military, and I'm not a mailman or a sailor or a customhose clerk or the Vice President, and I don't work in the arms industry. "Tha G" is going to send me a check each month because I'm now working for them.

[NorthernSpy]

3. congratulations!

:toast:

I congratulate you on this accomplishment, whatever it may be!

[DoNotRefill]

8. Thanks!

I just wish we lived in a world where the freeper types wouldn't try to get somebody fired because we're a DUer.

BTW, this job I got...it ROCKS!!! :) And fortunately, it's non-political, at least in this State.

[goju]

9. Well

Id say congrats are in order on the new job. Still not sure why you were booted from the militia though. Im thinking you were part of some right wing neo nazi type thing and they found out you were a liberal ;)

Either that, or you are in fact the Vice President :shock:

[DoNotRefill]

14. Nah, it's not THAT type of militia...

I remember when the loonies in Michigan had that "Militia of Montana" (AKA "MoM", as in "Join MoM!", which I thought was BEYOND bizarre) and the unofficial state slogan was "Welcome to Montana: Where the cows are sane, it's the PEOPLE who are crazy!"

Under current Federal law, most everybody is a member of the "Unorganized Militia". That's the militia in question that I was referring to. And last time I checked, they didn't have meetings, much less being some kind of Neo-Nazi thing. I'm pretty sure that Neo Nazi militias don't allow people of color or non "Christian Identity religious freakery" to join. The Unorganized Militia covers the entire political and religious and ethnicity spectrum.

/does the Happy Dance!!! :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

[jody]

23. You wrote “’Unorganized Militia”. . . . they didn't have meetings,” but

that's not true in all states.

State members of the State Guard Association of the United States are part of the unorganized militia and in some states they receive minimal funding and do meet and train periodically.

[slackmaster]

California has neglected its militias since the 1930s

We were last called to help discourage immigrants from coming into the states during the Dust Bowl days.

We're still on the books, and the Governator could declare an emergency and call us up at any time.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=mvc&group=00001-01000&file=120-130

[slackmaster]

25. Double-click dupe

I hate it when I do that.

:dunce:

[RaggedClaws]

27. Actually...

Actually, the State Guards are the organized militias. The National Guard is an organized militia when it is operating under a particular governor's authority, and it is a federal armed force when a governor cedes control of it to the federal government (like when a state's National Guard gets sent to Iraq, etc, then it becomes part of the federal armed forces).

The unorganized militia is everyone else.

[jody]

28. Sorry but state guards that I referred to are not part of the

organized militia. See:

TITLE 10 > Subtitle A > PART I > CHAPTER 13 > § 311. Militia: composition and classes
QUOTE
(b) The classes of the militia are—
(1) the organized militia, which consists of the National Guard and the Naval Militia; and
(2) the unorganized militia, which consists of the members of the militia who are not members of the National Guard or the Naval Militia.
UNQUOTE

As I stated, members of the State Guard Association of the United States are part of the unorganized militia.

[RaggedClaws]

30. Good point, but...

Ah, good point. But I think there is some confusion somewhere (including in my head). Here's an excerpt from the New York Guard's web site (note: NOT the New York National Guard, but one of the state guards you were referring to):

"THE NEW YORK GUARD WILL EVOLVE INTO A WELL-RESOURCED, HIGHLY TRAINED, ALL-VOLUNTEER PROFESSIONAL COMPONENT OF THE ORGANIZED MILITIA OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK..." (emphasis my own)

http://www.dmna.state.ny.us/nyg/nyg.html

(Edited to add...)

OK, reading a little further down the page, it is finally explained:

"The New York Guard is one of four components of the State's Military Forces which are under the supervision of the Division of Military and Naval Affairs. The others are the New York Army National Guard, New York Air National Guard, and the Naval Military Forces."

So the state guards are actually under the same command as the State National Guards, hence they are part of the "organized" militia.

[Billy Ruffian]

31. But that isn't the Federal Organized Militia ..

and I think that's what the US Code is about

[RaggedClaws]

32. No such thing...

There's no such thing as a Federal militia. Militia's are by nature state-based. There are the Federal armed forces (in Founding-Fathers-speak that would be the country's "standing army") and then there is the militia. The organized militia is that part of the militia that is organized, or "regulated", by the various State governments. The Founding Fathers called this the "select" militia and debated whether it was enough to counter the power of a standing army, and ultimately decided that it was better to allow the people themselves the freedom to form militias, without barring the creation of select militias by the individual state governments.

The unorganized militia is generally everyone else who in time of crisis is able and willing to take up arms in defense of self, family, community, state, and nation. The FF were wary of the power of a "Posse Comitatus" and the vigilante justice that might ensue, but the thought process was that if the federal and state governments were doing their jobs and they had the consent of the people, there would only be the need for a self-appointed posse in the most extreme of circumstances.

The second amendment was ratified (and very easily I might add) because the FF believed in the people of the country. They trusted that the people in general were law-abiding and good. I think the criminal activity statistics bear this out. There are far far more law-abiding citizens than criminals, even given many of our unconstitutional (imho) and highly restrictive laws.

[jody]

34. Reply #33 responds to your comments, n/t

[jody]

33. The starting point is the US code to which I gave a link in #28.

SCOTUS accepts that definition which says the organized militia consists of the National Guard and the Naval Militia and the unorganized militia is everyone else with some exceptions like ministers, etc.

Part of the confusion occurs because members of the National Guard take two oaths, one at the state level and another at the federal level. That's the source of "National Guard" as opposed to "State Guard".

SCOTUS has given the president tremendous authority to activate and use the National Guard for purposes other than specific narrow authority granted by our Constitution to congress, e.g. put down insurrections and repel invasions.

Congress is derelict because it has not armed, organized, and trained the "unorganized militia" as required by our Constitution.

The founders of our country opposed a standing army but the National guard and an impotent unorganized militia have made our founders worst fears a nightmare come true.
:shrug:

[iverglas]

11. well then!

You've obviously completed the final step in the transgendering process.

Does the cheque that the gummint will be sending you (don't you folks do direct deposit??) come with a health care plan attached, I hope?

(Not a general instigation to comment about anybody's health care plan, I'm sure you'll know; a personal question asked out of appropriate solicitude.)

[DoNotRefill]

12. Ummm....transgenders can be in the militia......

And you'll notice that §311 and §312 says nothing about sexual orientation, so I'd think that gays can indeed be in the unorganizaed militia too.

and yes, it comes with a full benefits package, as only "tha G" can do. :)

[iverglas]

16. well yes, but

Ummm....transgenders can be in the militia......

(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard.

If you're female and not a member of the National Guard, you ain't, right?

Good to hear about the benefits.

[DoNotRefill]

18. actually....

it's illegal for federal legislation to discriminate based upon gender now. Rather than go back and correct all the outdated codes, they just leave gender out of the implementation now. So the code still says one thing which is no longer correct, but it's implemented in the correct way, or else it gets challenged, struck down, and they have to repass it.

[iverglas]

24. well that's a relief

Yup, if you were to read the Criminal Code of Canada without reading the annotations, you'd think it was still illegal to provide an abortion in Canada without the approval of a hospital committee. ;)

And then there's the Canada Elections Act, which still says that inmates in penitentiaries may not vote in federal elections ...

[petronius]

13. "Exempt" doesn't mean excluded, right?

If it's not age or the military, it sounds like you've earned a choice, not the boot. "Rainy outside? Nah, no militia for me today..." And in the guessing game spirit, I'm going to assume you joined the judiciary.

[DoNotRefill]

15. Nope, in my case...

I'm legally prohibited from being in the unorganized militia unless I resign my appointment (ie step down) first.

As for your (very perceptive) guess, "I can neither confirm nor deny...."

[petronius]

17. Congratulations on your new employment...

...I hope it's everything you want it to be (despite having to give up the long summer evenings around the militia-campfire)!

:toast:

[DoNotRefill]

19. thanks! i've never been to a militia campfire...

unless ROTC in the '80s counts. ;)

[Billy Ruffian]

20. ROTC in the 80s!?

Good heavens, you're a child! :silly:

[DoNotRefill]

21. Heh. Thank you!!!

you're almost as popular with me as the waitress at the restaurant that always cards me, so I keep tipping her outrageously. Nobody with as much grey in their hair as I have feels insulted to be called a child or carded for booze and cigarettes... ;)

[Billy Ruffian]

22. no problem

NROTC program, 78 ;-)

I'm so old I used the same diving rig you saw in "Men of Honor"

[slackmaster]

4. I'm going to take a wild guess and wish you a happy birthday!

:party:

[TX-RAT]

6. Thats what i was thinking.

[DoNotRefill]

7. Thanks, I guess....

but I'm both younger than 45 and I don't think the upper end of the age requirement is valid any more since age discrimination in federal legislation is now verboten.

[alwynsw]

5. Congratulations on your new career in the CIA!

[Wickerman]

10. A conscientious objector?

That is so nice, congrats, DNR! I had no idea you had such strong feelings about non-violence!

Or, rather, happy new employment!

[Township75]

26. CONGRATS!!!

We should celebrate at the range again someday...someday later...when it is warm, and dry, and not so damn windy!!!

Hope everything else is OK on your end.

[MrSandman]

29. Did they tear off your butttons and break your saber...

I still remember Chuck having his broken, "Knowing {he's} a Man."