LTTE “Obama and civil liberties”, what lies ahead if BO is our candidate

[jody]

Obama and civil liberties

In Barack Obama's speeches, he proclaims that the youth "have never had a reason to participate until now." He spews rhetoric that young people are voting because he is the first candidate friendly to the concerns of young Americans.

I am a 25-year-old voter and, alongside all young Americans, I have had a reason to vote since my 18th birthday. One important reason for a young person to vote is to protect our civil liberties granted in the Second Amendment.

Obama has supported legislation that erodes our right to bear arms throughout his entire political career. He built a reputation as a politician friendly to gun-control advocates during his tenure in the Illinois State Senate. When he was elected to the U.S. Senate, he continued to be a politician unfriendly to gun owners.

Young Americans have had several reasons to partake in political participation before Obama began his tenure on Capitol Hill. Every young American has a reason to be concerned about presidential candidates that support legislation that erodes civil liberties.

[thunder rising]

1. Notice there are no references...just accusations. A typical Republican hit piece.

[jody]

6. Agree re "no references" but that's why it's published on the Opinion Page. A rebuttal LTTE is

needed but what can one write since BO has said he wants to ban handguns?

Note handguns are the most effective, efficient tool for self-defense, the choice of 850,000 sworn law enforcement officers as well as law-abiding citizens exercising their natural, inherent, inalienable/unalienable right to keep and bear arms for defense of self.

[papau]

2. Of all the reasons to vote against Obama - in the primary & in the general - this is the least valid

[jody]

8. Agree papau for some but many independents are influenced by a candidates position on RKBA. n/t

[papau]

12. agree - but control doesn't step on right to bear arms - IMHO

[jody]

14. I agree with "control" in general but not "control" meaning "ban". n/t

[mrcheerful]

3. Civil liberties? What does this moron know about Civil liberties?

Oh nooooooooooo they are coming to take my gun away how will I be able to fight back when the goberment comes for me. Yeah got that right republican hit piece back to fear smear and queer yet again. Yet the same "person" can't see that he has lost more civil liberties in the last 8 years under the puke dictator ship he helped put in power because he doesn't want to wait 3 days to buy a gun. The same asshole will then turn around and sprout some BS about criminals having guns or the crime rate or some other right wing fear shit.

[jody]

7. I assume you know that RKBA is a civil right. n/t

[mrcheerful]

11. So is the right to be secure in your home and the right not to have your phone taped by the feds.

Where are the brave defenders of gun ownership on those 2 issues? I don't see them taking their guns to Washington to over throw a power hungry goberment do you?

[jody]

16. IMO those who support RKBA also support "the right to be secure in your home and the right not to

have your phone taped by the feds."

You imply that's not true, so please provide a credible source to support your assertion.

[mrcheerful]

18. What ya been living in a cave the last 8 years or longer?

A police officer can enter your home and search it if someone walks by your window and see's you smoking what they presume is weed. As far as wire taping, again you must have been in a cave until today, remember FISA?

[jody]

20. I said you imply those who support RKBA do not support "the right to be secure in your home and the

right not to have your phone taped by the feds."

Please provide a credible source to support your assertion.

[beevul]

22. Where are the brave defenders of gun ownership on those 2 issues?

I'll tell you where they are.

They are busy concentrating on the issue of the attacks on legal firearm ownership...they are entrenched in a battle over thier rights...a battle that has raged for over a decade...the other side of which wishes to ban by government fiat private property which they legally own and/or prevent others from ever legally owning.

And prominent leaders of this bunch of gun-grabbing monkeys such as Brady and Helmke, are republicans whom are leading authoritarian Democrats into making poor choices when it comes to winning electinons.


Asking "Where are the brave defenders of gun ownership on those 2 issues" would be highly disingenuous of you IF you were one of those attacking legal firearm ownership, or supporting it.


Are you ? Do you?

[SteveM]

24. Do you personally know of ANYONE who is defending the 4A?

The Fourth Amendment has suffered grotesquely because of the War on Drugs, which has been carried out vigorously by both Bushes and by Clinton.

Why do you think that activists for 2A don't make strong defenses for all the BOR; anymore than, say, you?

By the way, I helped organize and participated in two (2) marijuana legalization marches right up Congress Avenue in Austin, TX. Have you done that? Why not?

[sergeiAK]

29. Yes, the ACLU

I'm a member. I'm also an NRA member. If the ACLU would support the 2nd Amendment like they do the rest, I'd be very pleased. I vote. I write to my legislators. Some of us do support the other civil liberties. So put away the broad brush, get to know some of us. We're people like you. And voting to take our rights means we vote for people that aren't Democrats.

[Turbo Teg]

26. I'm sure no one likes

Their phone bieng tapped and such, republican or democrat, but no, gun owners are not going to go overthrow the government over it. Doing something like that is a last resort, a reset button if you will.

[krispos42]

21. Some republicans have a major blind spot in that area

That does not change the fact that voting for McCain is voting for somebody that shits on a lot of civil rights, and that voting for Clinton or Obama is voting for somebody that shits on a few civil rights.

The question is, "why can't we have a candidates that doesn't shit on our rights at all?"

[SteveM]

23. On another note: Obama & Hillary both brought up the "gun issue" in last week.

Don't you think this would indicate that each campaign's operatives see something you don't? I mean, they both brought the subject up without prompting from anyone around here or in the GOP. "republican hit piece back to fear smear and queer..."? I don't know about that last verb, but surely you see the potential of the Second Amendment, not only in the General election but in the primaries.

[Recursion]

4. Fortunately John Mccain shares with Obama an "F" from the NRA

However, for those of us who support gun rights, this is only relatively good news.

I was surprised and glad that Obama is on record recently as saying that the 2nd Amendment guarantees an individual's right to keep and bear arms; I hope that reflects an actual change of heart.

His platforms in the past have included banning civilian ownership of semi-automatic weapons. However warm and fuzzy that may make non-gun-owning DU'ers feel, this is such a non-starter on a national level as to be almost laughable.

[jody]

9. But BO also said he wants to ban handguns. He can't have it both ways. n/t

[Turbo Teg]

27. I'm a dem

At heart but vote republican everytime because of the RKBA. Unfortunatly that's the only thing that I identify with the Republican party, but I'm a single issue voter. This election, is up in the air for me as John Mcshitstain is no friend to gun owners.

[Recursion]

28. The GOP hasn't *actually* been gun-friendly since Nixon

Nixon, Reagan, and GHWB all shepherded some pretty strict gun control measures through (actually I think Nixon's was pretty reasonable). It was Reagan who closed the NFA registry. And I guarantee that if Congress had passed another AWB, * would have signed it.

[enid602]

5. if true

If true, this is the first Obama stance that resonates with me.

[theredpen]

10. Of all the civil liberties that are threatened, the RKBA is the healthiest

That's no reason to be lackadaisical about it, but after more years of Republican rule, the other freedoms that help support the RKBA may be gone. It will be a lot easier to take people's guns away if they lose their 4th and 5th Amendment rights, which is happening right now.

[mrcheerful]

13. Odd isn't it? Don't worry about the rights you lost, as long as you have the 2nd you

are safe from gobernment take overs.

[Recursion]

15. "No fly - no buy" is a pretty serious threat to the RKBA

The government could, with no due process or even explanation, put you on a secret list that prevents you from buying firearms.

It's in committee now, hopefully being quietly strangled. If that's not a threat to the RKBA I don't know what is.

[theredpen]

19. Yikes! I hadn't heard about that one.

Wow... something I can write my (Texas) Senators about that they might actually act on.

[jody]

17. If SCOTUS rules in favor of an individual's RKBA, in D.C. v. Heller, that will take it off the table

in elections and we can really focus on protecting all enumerated and unenumerated rights which government is supposed to protect.

[SteveM]

25. You should read "The End of America" by Naomi Wolf...

She seems to indicate that this is the one right the Feds have not been able to usurp; instead, BushCo has been letting huge contracts for Black Water, etc., to provide for a "private army."

Wolf has a hazy understanding of 2A. When I spoke with her earlier this month she was unaware of the gun confiscation fiat issued in New Orleans just after Katrina, and unaware of Sen. Lautenberg's support of the "No fly, No buy" legislation, drawn up by Alberto Gonzalez. In any case, 2A remains intact except on the prohibitionist coasts and in Chicago. But post Kennedy Democrats and the far right are firm believers in prohibitionism, and they share a concern that there is an armed populace of American citizens out there.

War on Drugs = severe damage to 4A and 5A

War on Guns = severe damage to 2A (aim is to DISARM the civilian population)