NYPD must release stop and frisk data. Any stats on # criminals convicted & # guns removed?

[jody]

Court Compels NYPD to Release 10 Years of Stop and Frisk Data to CCR for Racial Profiling Class Action

The program is touted as removing guns from the streets so a logical question is how many guns removed and how many people serving time for illegally possessing a gun?

[tburnsten]

1. Bet it's a trivial number

Compared to what is portrayed in movies and on tv, I am willing to bet that people are fairly rarely caught or convicted because of carrying a gun they shouldn't have in a place they shouldn't be.

[joshcryer]

2. How much time do you get for possessing an illegal firearm in NY?

Does anyone know?

[jody]

3. Don't know but a related question. Is that time served concurrently with time for another offense?

If so the penalty for using a firearm while committing a crime is essentially nothing.

If that's the way our judicial system works, it's even more reason to oppose more gun-control laws because criminals using firearms are not always charged with possession under current laws and when charged, prosecuted and convicted the punishment is effectively zero.

[MicaelS]

4. A few years ago in Texas

There were all sorts of ads about Project Safe Neighborhoods http://www.psn.gov/about/thelaw.html with the rhetoric of "Gun crimes equal hard time", or something to that effect. Haven't seen one of those ads in a long time. So I assume like many other "getting tough on crime" programs, it just faded away.

[jody]

5. Thanks, fighting crime is a 24/7 job and we don't have enough LEO to do that job. I laugh when a

person with good intentions resting on a foundation of gross ignorance demands we pass more laws preventing law-abiding citizens from keeping and bearing handguns for self-defense not realizing that existing laws are not aggressively enforced and convicted criminals are allowed to serve sentences for possessing a firearm concurrently with other sentences.

Obama either is beginning to understand the problem or he is paying lip-service to the RKBA for self-defense issue.

I hope he will listen more closely to the pro-RKBA community because what works in Cheyenne with a homicide rate of about 3.5/100k might work in Chicago with a homicide rate over 15/100k.

Obama's recent shift to open support of the Second Amendment acknowledges that any presidential candidate who is perceived as a gun-grabber will probably lose in swing-states.

That means when he wins, he will be in debt to we pro-RKBA Democrats and millions of other pro-RKBA supporters.

The gun-grabber community with their Ostrich Syndrome can bury their heads in the sand until they see themselves as they are.

[pipoman]

6. This should be on a bumper sticker

tshirts, and should be the motto of pro-2nd Dems everywhere.

"...what works in Cheyenne with a homicide rate of about 3.5/100k might work in Chicago with a homicide rate over 15/100k."

Mind if I use it as my new sig line?

[jody]

7. Be my guest and continue to fight the good fight.

:pals: :hi:

[old mark]

8. In Philadelphia, Illegal Posession of Firearms charges

are almost routinely dropped as part of any plea bargain.
Last spring, a Philadelphia police officer was shot and killed by several convicted felons who had been granted early release from long sentences for violent crimes. Each had previously faced illegal gun charges, and had those charges dropped in plea bargains. None of these guys was legally entitled to own a firearm. They engaged in a bank robbery using stolen guns and a stolen car instead of reporting to their parole officers. In the course of that robbery, they killed a cop. Had they not been given early release, they all would have been in prison at the time and not able to do any of these crimes.

Violent criminals routinely get early release/parole because of overcrowding in the prisons, so we should make more gun laws for them to disregard.

Makes no sense at all, really.

mark

[joshcryer]

9. I know of a thug who got out on bond on an illegal firearm charge here in Colorado.

Ironically the guy who had drugs on him was the one they kept in jail. That thung ass guy really got me thinking about going for a conceal carry license. He brandished his weapon as I walked into the apartment building, asking about a "party" that was going on. I said I didn't know (though I had an idea who he was looking for, the guys across from me in another apartmnet who had loud obnoxious parties every weekend). I only wish now that I filed charges for him brandishing (I think that's clearly a threatening gesture), but I wonder if it would have done any good.

I know he got out on bond because I saw him wandering around the complex a few days later trying to be tough. And I know he got busted with the gun because the cops came to the apartment with the party after he tried banging the door down, he ran off, and they caught him down the street. It's possible that no one filed gun charges on the guy, but still. The police blotter said he had an illegal firearm. And he had clearly seen time, had been bragging about it before. Definitely a case of throw away the key for a few years.

If I moved out of this shithole and on to some land I'm buying I really wouldn't feel a need for a CCL.

[spin]

10. If gun control was directed at criminals...

you would never have a need for a carry permit.

[joshcryer]

13. I'm glad my state has it as an option, though.

But you're pretty much right on target.

[one-eyed fat man]

12. rap sheets and more info

Deceitful politicians calling for more gun laws that crooks won't obey and they won't enforce to deflect attention from "catch and release" law enforcement policies.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=7085645&mesg_id=7092082

[spin]

14. I CHALLENGE THE ANTI-GUN POSTERS TO READ THIS POST...

Just follow the link to the other post http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=7085645&mesg_id=7092082 and read the rap sheets of three individuals. You probably missed the link or perhaps ignored it.

Please explain how more restrictive laws against honest citizens will control criminals with extensive records who carry firearms as a tool of their trade. These bad guys can get caught carrying illegal weapons and receive no punishment for that crime. There should be NO plea bargaining allowed for the crime of illegally packing a weapon.

Eventually a tragedy will occur and the anti-gun group will post the details to prove why we need more gun control. What we need in reality is more criminal control.

I'll make it easy, I'll repost the links:

http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/cain-howard-court-summary.pdf

http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/cain-howard-court-summary.pdf

http://www.snowflakesinhell.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/cain-howard-court-summary.pdf

Just note the number of times the documents contain charges like:

CARRYING FIREARMS WITHOUT LICENSE .... Nolle Prossed


Nolle processed means:


Verb 1. nolle pros - drop prosecution of by entering a nolle prosequi in the court records; "They nolle prossed the charge"
nol.pros., nolle prosequi
knock off, drop - stop pursuing or acting; "drop a lawsuit"; "knock it off!"
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Nolle+prossed


Wouldn't we all be better off if we sent people to jail for illegally carrying a firearm? True, we might have to build more jails but these very dangerous people would be off the streets while they served time. We would live in a more peaceful and less dangerous society.

We can agree to truly reasonable gun laws and hold our politicians' feet to the fire until that they go after the crime element who chose to carry and misuse weapons.

[joshcryer]

15. There's a *reason* reinstatement laws exist.

You *can* be reformed, but the fact remains that there's no *incentive* to be reformed because the punishment is *nonexistant*.

Tell me that the DUI programs would have worked if people who got DUI weren't *forced by law* to go into a program. DUI killed 60%+ 30 years ago, it's half that now. And *only* because the laws for DUI (thanks to great programs like MAAD) were *enforced*.

[spin]

17. So maybe we need a group like MADD...

to combat illegal guns on the street.

Maybe Mothers Against Criminals (MAC). I know that's pretty lame, but it's all I could come with with a moments thought.

I know that before MADD came along drunk drivers were everywhere. I used to drive to work at 11 Pm for the graveyard shift. I usually would see several drivers so intoxicated that they were weaving half way into the other lane. But after MADD, it was rare to see one driver a week who was that drunk.

An idea like this could work because it would pressure the politicians, both local and national, to crack down on the criminal misuse of firearms.

Years ago, when the police stopped you and you had merely had a few drinks, they often warned you and told you to be careful on your way home. (Of course, if you were falling down drunk they would arrest you.) Today you are in real big trouble if you exceed the blood alcohol limit. This effort reduced the number of drunk drivers by a very significant margin.

The same thing could happen to criminals who illegally carry weapons. It just takes an organization like MADD to pop up.

That's real gun control. Fewer armed criminals on the street would mean a lower crime rate. People wouldn't feel the need to buy a firearm for self defense.

[LN3]

11. +1

[Flyboy_451]

16. If you think it upsets you guys....

Imagine how those of us in uniform feel when we make such an arrest, only to see charges dropped or plea bargained away, and then arrest the same person on similar charges a short time later! I keep a relational data base of all people that I come into contact with on duty. This data base is compiled from everything from scene reports to interview notes that I take. You would be amazed at how many times I enter additional information relating to the same people. You would also be amazed by the number of criminals that have "professional" dealings with one another.

JW