5,700 attend Richmond Gun Show (VA)

[davepc]

Sales of ammunition were so brisk Saturday on the first day of the Richmond Gun Show that Terry Coffman said he didn't have much left to sell yesterday.

"Everybody's scared to death," said Coffman, a salesman for Georgia Arms in Villa Rica, Ga., adding that sales for the business have skyrocketed in the past two weeks. "I appreciate the Democrats completely, because they sell more guns and ammo than anyone else has for us."

Fears that President-elect Barack Obama and a Democratic-controlled Congress will tighten restrictions on firearms have prompted gun aficionados nationwide to rush out and buy firearms. That trend played out over the weekend during the gun show at the Richmond Raceway Complex in Henrico County, which saw higher-than-usual attendance.

But Alice Mountjoy, government-relations coordinator for the Virginia Center for Public Safety, a gun-control advocacy group, said people who are afraid of Obama's politics are being paranoid, noting that the president-elect has said he respects the Second Amendment.

Last month, there was a 15 percent increase in the number of background checks for gun purchases nationwide, compared with the year before, according to The Associated Press. The number was up about 8 percent for the year as of Oct. 26.

...

http://www.inrich.com/cva/ric/news.apx.-content-articles-RTD-2008-11-17-0145.html

[TheCowsCameHome]

1. "Everybody's scared to death" he says.

What a bunch of assholes.

[SpiralHawk]

2. Republicons live and breath fear.

Fear, anger, and hate is all they got. Pitiful.

[TheCowsCameHome]

4. These fools would let their kids go barefoot and hungry

as long as the could stroke their gun barrels without interruption.

Absolutely sickening.

[benEzra]

9. Gun owners generally make slightly more than the national average...

given that it requires disposable income to buy a $1000 AR-15. Hence, gun owners statistically tend to be somewhat more educated than the national average and have slightly higher incomes.

FWIW, the only people I've ever met who view guns as sexual objects are those who loathe them. There's an interesting psychological study...

And yes, I'll probably thread the muzzle of my carbine for a muzzle brake at some point, in the unlikely even that another silly ban on threaded muzzles and protruding handgrips passes.

[gorfle]

19. On threaded muzzles.

I have an SAR-1 with an unthreaded barrel.

Even if they pass a new ban that prohibits them, how would they know if I threaded it before or after the new ban?

[benEzra]

24. They wouldn't. That's one aspect of the utter stupidity of such a rule.

Banning threading the muzzle of a rifle for a brake or flash suppressor penalizes only the scrupulously law-abiding---those who are so conscientious that they would not break the law even if they knew with 100% certainty that they could get away with it.

Needless to say, someone willing to illegally threaten others with a gun, or use a gun in a crime, would have no such compunctions.

The other aspect of the stupidity, of course, was the assumption that a screw-on brake is more dangerous than a pin-on brake or no brake at all, or that a rifle with a handgrip that sticks out is more dangerous than a rifle with a straight stock...

[SteveM]

26. So, you don't see the irony in this guy's statement:

"I appreciate the Democrats completely, because they sell more guns and ammo than anyone else has for us."er

If and when you see the irony, would you explain how gun-control works for the Democratic Party, and if you wish, how it has worked to solve any number of societal problems.

You really need to see a professional about your "stroke."

[SteveM]

27. Enough "fear, anger, and hate" left over for gun-controllers to use...

right here in these threads. Why do you suppose that so many gun-controllers/prohibitionists continue to throw stones at the yellow jacket nest? Is it lurid fascination? A need for confrontation? A craving for a danger experienced vicariously and remotely, or a full-throated addiction to very real punishment? Do you know what the yellow jacket nest is? If not, please answer this question:

Do you support reenactment of the assault weapons ban?

[geckosfeet]

3. Won't they be surprised,

when nothing happens and they find that they have 10 years worth of explosives to store.

What a fucking bunch of lemmings.

[really annoyed]

25. Agreed

I don't get the obsession with guns or the logic that the Second Amendment gives everybody a right to own an assault weapon - Supreme Court ruled that some forms of gun control are lawful. (D.C. v Heller)

[raimius]

32. Can't see the forrest through the trees

DC v Heller was a MAJOR victory for gun-rights activists. SCOTUS ruled that there is an individual right, protected via the Constitution to keep and bear arms for lawful purposes, unconnected with the militia. It did not go to extremes and try to cast doubt on all gun-regulations, but it vastly narrowed the "acceptible" forms of gun control in federal law.

[trollybob]

33. All you need to know about Justice Antonin Scalia

is that the idiot goes hunting with Dick Cheney.

[LiberalFighter]

5. I don't understand why so many would spend so much on a gun.

Those are some serious money they are asking for pistols and rifles.

[benEzra]

10. A $1200 AR-15 costs a whole lot less money than a good set of golf clubs

and a country club membership, I suspect, and will still be perfectly functional a hundred years from now if properly maintained.

You want to see guns that are really expensive, though, check out the small market in civilian-transferable NFA Title 2/Class III restricted automatic weapons. A civilian transferable pre-1986 AK-47 will run you about $17,000, assuming you can get Federal authorization to own one, and some rare collectibles will run in excess of $100,000. Obviously, only wealthy collectors need apply...

[slackmaster]

17. Making a firearm that is safe, reliable, and accurate requires a great deal of precision work

High-quality materials and the best available manufacturing processes.

You can buy a cheap pistol or rifle, but you get what you pay for.

[gorfle]

20. Yup.

Basically any quality pistol is going to cost you $350 and up. You can get a Ruger 10/22 rifle for around $200, and rifles go up from there. A civilian AK-47 variant will cost you about $400 and up. An AR-15 variant will cost you about $800 and up.

The good news is that firearms tend to hold their value pretty well. Bans make them more valuable.

The cost is why I don't have a problem with limits on the number of firearms people can buy in a month. I'm lucky to be able to afford one every 3-5 years. I can't imagine someone buying multiple firearms in the same month.

[57_TomCat]

23. I have often bought or traded several guns in a month...

One day as a policeman I went to work with a .38 Special S&W Model 15 Combat Masterpiece, found a bigger .357 magnum S&W Model 28 Highway Patrolman and I traded for it. On the way home traded the Model 28 for a .357 S&W Model 19 Combat Magnum that had come into the same shop that afternoon. The next payday (Same month)I went back and got my Model 15 back for the house as well as purchased a Remington 870 police shotgun. Later (same month)I found a great deal on a .38 S&W model 36 Chief Special and a Ruger Mini-14. Picked'em both up.

Of course after I got married my aquisition schedule took a turn for the worse. :D She did not like eating beans and franks 5 day a week. :)

[SteveM]

28. It is easy to understand within the context of market forces...

If the public thinks ANY product/service is going to be restricted, banned or rendered out of production, and that public (including speculators) wants the product/service, then there will increased demand and a concomitant rise in price.

Pistols prices don't seem to suffer so much from this Democratic Party-induced speculation; many reliable auto-loading pistols are below $300. The speculation centers on semi-auto carbines (so-called "assault weapons").

There is a bright side to all this: Since some 15,000,000 citizens own arms in the class of semi-auto carbines, and that number is being super-charged by the DNC and Obama's stand, then this already large constituency will grow too large to antagonize (save for a few gun-control extremists in these and other forums), and the impetus for passing another assault weapons ban will die out. Of course, there will be a push to open a new front in the culture wars, but guns may no longer be the excuse.

I do find it ironic that those who would decry "flooding the streets" with this kind of weapon don't seem to see the irony of just who is actually causing the flood. (Hint: it ain't Noah or God.)

[jody]

6. Now that Obama says he will renew the AWB and repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, 80+ million gun-owners

have reason to stock up.

See http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=190897&mesg_id=190897

53 million voters with guns in their household voted in the last election, 19 million for Obama and 33 million for McCain.

I guess Obama believes renewing the AWB and repealing the Tiahrt Amendment are what 19 million voters wanted when they helped him win with almost 67 million votes against McCain's 58 million.

I'm not convinced that all gun-owners who supported Obama will accept that position. :shrug:

President Elect Obama hasn't even taken office and he's already managed to piss off nearly 30% of his supporters.

[LaurenG]

7. Yeah - my husband loves target practice

and the range this Saturday here was packed. We were also out Saturday morning and the road in front of the Convention Center was stalled out. I told my husband it had to be a gun show and sure enough it was and the parking lot was at capacity with people lined up out the door. :(

[jody]

8. "people lined up out the door"! I hope they don't line up at the ballot box in 2010 and encourage

their friends to vote.

[LaurenG]

11. I think they'll see that Obama was the best thing that could have happened

to them by 2012. At least I'm hoping.

Yeah there is usually a full parking lot at the Sharonville show but Saturday was odd. Maybe they had just opened the doors but still the line was really long.

[jody]

12. We Dems can retain the presidency and lose control of congress. Bill Clinton proved that and he said

the Dem party's association with the AWB was a major factor in losing control of congress.

[Old Codger]

13. that will happen too

If they go ahead and renew that AWB..... That is nothing but a knee jerk, feel good useless move..can't have an AR-15 but can have a mini 14, same ammo, same rate of fire, same capacity mags, just one looks scarier that the other... bunch of imbeciles..

[aikoaiko]

14. And this is how we will lose seats in both houses in two years.

People are going out and spending their hard earned money on guns and ammo. But this is happening with a bit of resentment because it under the coercion of the threat of gun bans and ammo tax hikes. The seeds of discontent are being planted and nurtured everyday the threat looms.

As a collector and shooter, there are several guns I'd like to own in my life time. Half my family comes from Poland and I've always wanted to get a semi-automatic version of a Polish Tantal, for example. Now that I have a son, I want to get two. I've bought an AR lower and some mags recently, but I can't afford to purchase more. I've got bills and Christmas is coming up. I won't spend money unwisely, but I resent that my President and Congress members from my party have threatened to ban or restrict guns that are perfectly legal. Unwise gun control causes resentment and voters will take it on in elections.

Obama, like Clinton, may be able to weather signing into law more gun control, but Congress persons are not as secure.

[Old Codger]

15. That they are

They have to run again soon. Personally I have always been totally against having all branches controlled by the same party, it gives them too much power to do as they please. BUT this time around I really feel that this is what was needed in order to try to straighten out the mess they have left us. Now it remains to be seen whether or not they have the necessary control on their own to rein in any attempts to cram laws through regardless of need. They can use this power to d a lot of good, close gitmo, end the mess in Iraq, make real attempts at making the world a better, safer place, OR they can get greedy and go on a power spree and end up losing control next election cycle... A lot of us are waiting anxiously to see which way they will go.

[Lex1775]

16. Only 5700?

You guys should see an average Crossroads of the West gun show here in Phoenix, 5700 would be a low turnout.

[boozepusher]

29. The big Wannemacher show in Tulsa

brings about 35,000! The show covers 10 acres and has 4,000 tables. It's worth the price of admission just to people watch.

[gorfle]

18. "being paranoid"

But Alice Mountjoy, government-relations coordinator for the Virginia Center for Public Safety, a gun-control advocacy group, said people who are afraid of Obama's politics are being paranoid, noting that the president-elect has said he respects the Second Amendment.

Is it "being paranoid" when the re-instating of the assault weapons ban is part of both the Democratic Party Platform and President-Elect Obama's agenda (www.change.gov)?

[jody]

21. Perhaps it is not 80+ million gun-owners but gun-grabbers who are paranoid. n/t

[krispos42]

22. This is the legacy of the 90's Democrats

And there are those here that cheer on such moves. Those that see gun ownership as part of the "red state" mentality that is inheirently inferior and dangerous and must be stopped at all costs. Who don't care if any such AWB renewal is effective, or reasonable, or Constitutional, just as long as it disarms the 'crazies'.


And how do the anti-gun people know the pro-gun people are crazy? Because they're getting really upset about the anti-gun people trying to put into effect another AWB!



"Hi, we think gun owners are dangerous conservative regressives and we're going to strike out at you by limiting your gun rights. And if you object, you're only proving that you ARE dangerous conservative regressives that NEED to have their gun ownership limited, or, preferably, removed altogether!"


Ta-da!

[SteveM]

30. Here is my speculation on "90's Democrats:"

By the 90's (and certainly starting earlier), Democratic "leadership" had pretty much jettisoned the gestalt of the Democratic Party with regards to social reform. What ever the criticisms of the New Deal and the Great Society, there was a fairly clear disposition in the Democratic Party which stood for expanded civil rights, programs to remedy the worst effects of poverty, and efforts to preserve the environment. With the rise of the Democratic Leadership Council, the Party signaled its retreat from a more ideological base in favor of an amorphous "third way" characterized by bureaucratic jargon-jive ("bringing together stake-holders," "win-win solutions," and forever "moving forward") which was somehow supposed to signal old-line activists that we are sort of on your side, and to render hazy the Party's purpose to the more suspicious.

But the de-natured solution of the "new" Democrats made the Party more easy to label (esp. by Republicans), and worse, throttled the normal passions and idealism of activists. Without any real flesh & blood cause to center one's energies upon, some Democratic activists dropped out in favor of single-cause pressure groups while others locked onto icons and stereotypes of the opposition and centered their passion -- or libido -- on the prohibition of firearms. The while male bogey who denied civil rights to minorities, beat "their" women, and who cock-strutted about in the hunting fields was the perfect foil for a post-sixties culture war. And the DNC (misled as to how wide and deep the gun-control "cause" was from the beginning) was uncharacteristically willing to allow this ginned-up and rabid activism to sit at the table of the Party's policy round table (after all, they didn't really threaten the new corporate detente).

And there it remains, as institutionalized as any other interest group that makes up the Party pastiche.

[SteveM]

31. k & r (nt)