One of the BIG Reasons supporters of gun control tend to LOSE

[virginia mountainman]

I recently read in another post. About a gun control groups collapse, and lack of "volunteers" to help with there stated goals of civil rights restrictions.

This is absolutely no surprise to many of us, in the pro civil rights community, when the majority find your cause abhorrent, finding help and money, is a problem.

As a Virgina resident, I am finely tuned to the gun rights movement here, I make it a point o KNOW what legislation is in the works, so I can act on it, and with the use of the phone, and email, let other Virginia "volunteers" know what is up, and where it is at.

We are known, to flood town council meetings, newspapers, even the capitol, with hundreds of "volunteers" and at the same meeting, the anti civil rights, "volunteers" can only muster one or two folks, at BEST.

Here is an example of this...

In Virginia, their is a proposed rule change, to allow Concealed Handgun Permit holders to carry in State Forests, they can carry practically everywhere else, including State Parks, already, so this is just bringing the State Forest rules in line with the rest of Virginia.

The Dept of Forestry, put on a government website, the ability to, make comments on the proposed rule change..

http://townhall.virginia.gov/L/ViewStage.cfm?stageid=5042

In a matter of days, their are nearly 2,000 PRO GUN comments, from Virginia Residents, and NOT A SINGLE ONE FROM THE ANTI GUN SIDE....NOT A SINGLE ONE..

I guess the "Virginians Against Hand Gun Violance" did not get the memo.

This is part of the reason, they continually loose. They don't even show up to the "party" and when they do, they do so in woefully unprepared ways, and talk about "things that go up".

[CountAllVotes]

1. it is "lose" not "losses"

pro gun or not, the right word is "lose"

[virginia mountainman]

3. LOL good catch, Long night at work....NT

[bluestateguy]

2. The gun control "movement" is not grass roots

It is based in Washington DC think tanks, east coast/west coast newspaper editorial boardrooms and San Francisco townhouses.

[walkaway]

4. "Virginians Against Hand Goon Violance" didn't seem like...

anything worth commenting on.

[rrneck]

5. It's difficult to get past the reality on the ground.

Debates regarding the finer points of statistical analysis, constitutional law, and the similarities and differences between international cultures notwithstanding, the reality is that when violence occurs it must be dealt with immediately and decisively using whatever tools are at hand. If intervention by any civil authority were available, the aggressor would no doubt be aware of it and the attack would not occur. Almost nobody gets mugged in a police station.

We may succeed through the expansion of firearms regulation in creating less lethal criminals. In the process we will also create more completely defenseless victims. To my mind, further restrictions on the means to defend oneself will unnecessarily expand the disparity of force between aggressors and victims without offering any remedy for those who would be giving up a means to defend themselves.

The people in this country, right or wrong, are currently in the process of determining how and where they may arm themselves and who may exercise that right. The firearms that have been and are being manufactured will not go away for hundreds of years. Laws are being passed as a result of the codification of popular consent regarding the proper use, transportation, and storage of those firearms within our cultural, technological and historical location in history.

No matter what any of us may think about guns, the ship has left the dock and we can help steer it along its set course or we can abandon it, but it ain't gonna turn around.

[TPaine7]

12. Brilliant Post! +1

Debates regarding the finer points of statistical analysis, constitutional law, and the similarities and differences between international cultures notwithstanding, the reality is that when violence occurs it must be dealt with immediately and decisively using whatever tools are at hand. If intervention by any civil authority were available, the aggressor would no doubt be aware of it and the attack would not occur. Almost nobody gets mugged in a police station.

We may succeed through the expansion of firearms regulation in creating less lethal criminals. In the process we will also create more completely defenseless victims. To my mind, further restrictions on the means to defend oneself will unnecessarily expand the disparity of force between aggressors and victims without offering any remedy for those who would be giving up a means to defend themselves.

The people in this country, right or wrong, are currently in the process of determining how and where they may arm themselves and who may exercise that right. The firearms that have been and are being manufactured will not go away for hundreds of years. Laws are being passed as a result of the codification of popular consent regarding the proper use, transportation, and storage of those firearms within our cultural, technological and historical location in history.

No matter what any of us may think about guns, the ship has left the dock and we can help steer it along its set course or we can abandon it, but it ain't gonna turn around.

Given the reality that America is making up her own mind--and she's getting it right, too--the antis are almost not worth answering. Unfortunately, there is the chance that the pendulum could swing, and I don't like their more plausible arguments going unanswered.

[safeinOhio]

6. I'm all for gun rights

I think we have won on the issue and it is now becoming a dead horse. When an anti brings it up we can defend our point of view, and know we are in the majority. We are now in the biggest fight of all against banks, multi-nation corporations, fundies,a lack of human rights and campaign finance. I say we spend most of our energy on those issues. When gun rights come up, we will be there.

[Tim01]

8. Agree and dissagree.

Team Obama has made it clear they intend to attack gun rights. I am concerned that if we stop paying attention for a second they will be back at it. For now, this issue is not going away in the democratic party, it is just on the back burner.

Divide and conquer. Concentrate your fire. Old strategies that still work.

If you as an individual simultaneously work to fix banks, multi-nation corporations, fundies,a lack of human rights and campaign finance. You will not do much on any one of them. You simply don't have the resources to be effective on so many fronts. If you try to, they have applied to you "divide and conquer".

So, concentrate your fire seems like a good way to counter divide and conquer. A few years ago I picked my issues of guns and the environment. I may shift some of my energy from guns to the environment for now. But just some.

BTW, if it is a dead horse, it has only been a dead horse for some weeks or months.

[eqfan592]

13. I wouldn't say it's a dead horse...

..As another poster has pointed out, this is a very divisive issue that is regularly used against the progressive movement. The movement would do better if it were to not only abandon this issue, but come down strongly in support of our civil liberties, just as it does when it comes to other amendments in the constitution besides the 2nd.

But some people just hate guns, and they also seem to hate people who don't hate guns, and there are more of those people in our camp than there is in the other sadly.

[spin]

17. So our party panders to that very liberal base...

just like the Republicans pander to the Christian Fundies and the anti-abortion crowd.

If our party dropped the gun control issue and instead favored enforcing existing law, we would be guaranteed to increase support and gain voters for the truly important issues such as health care.

Supporting draconian gun control laws only results in our shooting ourselves in the foot.

[SteveM]

15. The issue has greatly receded, but there continues a danger...

The core of gun-control activists remain in the DNC, and in some Democratic-controlled bureaus of "northern"/coastal cities. As long as it remains in the party structure, the Party will be threatened each time some lame gun-control measure is advanced. These folks "nationalized" the issue because they could see that wide-spread gun control was not possible on a state-by-state, city-by-city basis. Now, we all have to live with that "nationalization:" when a Carolyn McCarthy rips another one in New York, a worthy Democrat in a Border state, or in the upper West winces. It is especially galling to me and others that the Brady Campaign is the one most-cited in MSM and the one most relied upon by these Demo gun-controllers. We don't need the GOP in the pilot house.

BTW, I am greatly concerned about guaranteed health care. If Obama can pull off some kind of universal & acceptable plan within the next four years, he will have a second term.

[chibajoe]

7. You need to learn how to use a comma

No matter how compelling your argument, if you come across as an illiterate hick, nobody will listen to you.

[safeinOhio]

9. You sound like my Mom.

[spin]

10. K&R (n/t)

[gorfle]

11. K&R n/t

.

[X_Digger]

14. k&r! n/t

[Buzz cook]

16. So you think money has nothing to do with it?

Given the amount of money that goes into the anti-law side of the argument, is there any wonder at the disparity of outcome?

Just like books claiming democrats are the children of Satan out sell books that say they aren't.