LAPD gets swindled, buys back de-milled movie replicas

[Merchant Marine]

LAPD and the LA Times had their annual feel-good buyback in Compton today, and amongst the take of generic handguns and hunting rifles were these classic shots of a cache of matching "Assault Weapons"



But there's a little problem with those rifles.



No charging handle, no fire selector, no magazine release. These are not real or functional rifles. Didn't stop the times from reporting them as a bunch of "Assault Weapons".

[FSogol]

1. At least it'll slow down Hollywood's production of action movies.

:shrug:

[TPaine7]

2. LOL!

The studio will probably come calling for their stolen props. I wonder if the LAPD and/or the LA Times can be charged with "receiving stolen goods." Too bad DA's are part of the same political system that the Cop-O-Crats serve.

[zonkers]

3. Were tehy also made of licorice?

[Craftsman]

4. Those aren't even real AR's.

[metalbot]

5. They are AP74's - a 22LR mockup of the AR

[Katya Mullethov]

6. Worn out , die cast , Armi Jager Ap74's

They still got took .

[Euromutt]

56. You and metalbot are absolutely right!

Look at the lower photo, at the rifle on the far right that's muzzle down and partially obscured by the one at the front: on the upper receiver below the carrying handle, you can actually read where it says "A P 74 - Made in Italy"!

[Katya Mullethov]

74. Hey , we " try "

Thats all that -really- matters aint it ?

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

7. lol... good. n/t

[rrneck]

8. Heh,

[Tejas]

15. Deputy Wiegel will get you for that.

Shame on you for insulting Reno, she's going to take her nightstick after you!

[Hoopla Phil]

9. That's funny. So how much was LA paying for a "gun" at this scheme?

[MichaelHarris]

11. I wonder

would this be the right time to laugh at police officers trying to get guns off the street when so many have died this year? Think of the number in and around Seattle alone? Worship of the gun seems crazy to me.

[Hoopla Phil]

12. So you don't know what they were paying at this scheme?

Hey, how about it being the time to go back and answerer all those inconvenient questions people asked you in another thread that you seem to have abandoned. LMFAO FAIL!

[MichaelHarris]

14. already did

all you guys did was digress to name calling and personal attacks, just as you did with this suggestion. You never addressed if it was appropriate to make fun of police officers who were trying to make society a little safer in light of all the recent deaths. You did what you always do, attack. You had no defense.

[Hoopla Phil]

16. Nope and NOPE. Lol. You ran from every valid point made. Please follow the link

and try.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=277780&mesg_id=278524

And you know the rules. Answer a question before you get to ask a question. Maybe THAT is way you abandoned the thread you started. . .Hummmm. . .Ha Ha Ha!

[MichaelHarris]

17. hahahahaha

will you point me to that rule.

[Hoopla Phil]

18. LOL MORE evasions and non answeres. Here is the link Mike

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=277780&mesg_id=278524

[MichaelHarris]

20. speaking of evasion

once again, is it appropriate to make fun of police officers trying to make society safer in light of the recent police officer murders in and around the Seattle area? Man you're just too easy, could you find someone more challenging for me to debate?

[Katya Mullethov]

21. Those arent guns

Clubs is the technical term for what they pissed off money on "trying" . You want real guns you have to spend real money . Otherwise you get junk .

[MichaelHarris]

23. not

the fake guns, the idea of gun buy-back. You knew that though, it was a horribly veiled attempt at evasion.

[Katya Mullethov]

26. Pardon my ecomomy of words

There is more than just a bunch of possibly blank firing Italian AR knock offs sans charging handles .
Look closely in these piles and tell me what YOU see .

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gifts-for-guns-pictures,0,2242463.photogallery

[MichaelHarris]

27. is there any chance

you're going to answer the question? Is your gun worship that strong? you're now against cops trying to get guns off the streets? I mean it's been what, 4 hours and neither one of you guys answered the question. Do you think it's OK to laugh at cops trying to make society safer in the aftermath of all the police officer deaths this year? Is your love of the gun that strong? How many hours will I need to wait for an answer, should I start a mission accomplished clock?

Off-duty police officer shot in Philadelphia
Police say an off-duty Philadelphia officer has been shot in an attempted robbery and a second person has been killed in the shooting.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2010642788_apusofficershot.html?syndication=rss

A gun that might have been bought back.

Seattle police say officer killed in shooting
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2010178541_apusseattleofficerkilled1stldwritethru.html?prmid=obnetwork

Police arrest 3 suspected of killing Vegas officer
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2010307571_apusoffdutyofficerslain.html?prmid=obinsite

2 deputies wounded at Fauquier, Va., courthouse
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/30/AR2009123002889.html

Why do you hate law enforcement?

[Katya Mullethov]

28. Police gun buys* are laughable at best

The photographs of their take is representative of the other trophy shots by various PDs over the years . Their vibrant altruism with other peoples money does not make them immune to the market price . They like to offer somewhere between less and way less than market for a functioning cheap gun . This attracts the buckets of cracked pot metal reciever 1 shot wonders that the pawn and gun shops save up over the year , and stuff in private hands the none of the dealers wanted . There are the occasional prizes like the baby Nambu that popped up about a month ago . But for the most part , people are nowhere as stupid as some would believe .

If someone can get thousand(s)more for something , there is little reason to believe they would leave that money on the table or risk giving it to a sticky fingered cop .


edit to add
* You cannot buy back somehting that never belonged to you .

[MichaelHarris]

29. so you

do hate law enforcement and think they are "laughable" when they try to make society safer?

[Merchant Marine]

30. Buybacks are only good for two things

1: Helping pawnshops clean out their junk bins.
2: Allowing criminals a guaranteed method of disposing of murder weapons.

Buyback weapons are melted down without checks of serial numbers or ballistics testing. How many of those guns melted down by LAPD were the missing links in an unsolved murder case?

[MichaelHarris]

31. so

any attempt to remove guns from the streets is stupid and law enforcement should be laughed at when they try? That's what this thread boils down to.

[Merchant Marine]

33. No, you're putting words in my mouth.

Guns confiscated from criminals are "removed from the streets". Seized gang caches are "removed from the streets".

The sort of guns that get turned in at buybacks are mostly A) Pawnshop rejects that would be scrapped anyway B) Inherited or relative's guns that the person doesn't know the value of or C) Crime guns being turned in for guaranteed disposal on the taxpayer's dime.

Of those, only group C is coming "Off the streets" and very little good is coming of it as those guns are evidence that should be used to fight crime, not aid and abet it.

[MichaelHarris]

34. don't you think

law enforcement is smart enough to document ballistics on those guns turned in?

[Katya Mullethov]

37. They sure do run numbers

And sometimes they do ballistics on the stuff that actually works .

[Merchant Marine]

47. The police promise amnesty for turned-in guns

Some departments check serials for stolen property, but I doubt they're very thorough. They don't do ballistics tests because a bought-back gun is not admissible evidence after they've taken it, because they've already promised not to use it as evidence.

[Katya Mullethov]

35. "Trying" only cuts it in government

Well , government and "MOM". She is happy if you try .

To reitterate , as my cetation like squeeking may be hard to interpret .




Burning other peoples money does not make them immune from the market .

They lie and misrepresent the take .

Gun buys create artificial value for junk guns that would otherwise have been destroyed long ago .

They were never their guns to begin with . That's goodspeak with several subliminal connotations
that I will not abide .

[MichaelHarris]

36. so then

you don't support getting sub-standard weapons off the street and out of the hands of criminals. Congratulations, you just showed your true allegiance to the gun at the expense of the Peace Keeper. The gungion has a police officer who lost friends recently in the line of duty, I hope he doesn't see your post. You should be ashamed, your blind faith in the gun disgusts me.

[Katya Mullethov]

40. Were they bludgeoned to death ?

With a non-functioning firearm ?

[Katya Mullethov]

70. Of course I dont , They will be armed so let it be junk

I would prefer they experience an out of battery every single time they try to operate a weapon (if their quarry isnt near enough to collect any shrapnel) .

Claiming you know someone who knows someone that was shot does not in any way validate your logic nor the accusations that I maintain any reverence for ballisto-religious iconography

To reitterate with and different phrasing lest my cetation like squeeking proved indecipherable .

Trying doesnt cut it .

They insult me with their mental masturbation .

It is a waste of money

[SteveM]

62. Is this more of that sarcasm thing? Or a little Rush to judgment (nt)

[TPaine7]

39. I'll answer your questions. Let me know if I miss any.

you're going to answer the question?

Yes

Is your gun worship that strong?

I don't worship guns. Do you worship stupidity?

you're now against cops trying to get guns off the streets?

Yes. I am absolutely against cops trying to get "guns off the streets." That stupid sound bite was made up by stupid or dishonest people who want to strip Americans of their right to bear arms ON THE STREETS among other places.

Now if you want to see if people support police keeping guns IN THE HANDS OF FELONS off the streets, say so. Don't try to confuse the two; I am not impressed.

Do you think it's OK to laugh at cops trying to make society safer in the aftermath of all the police officer deaths this year?

This is sophistry. It is as legitimate as if I asked you if you are still on your cannibalistic diet, or if you buried all of your murder victims in the woods. I can not blame you for the sophistry; you don't seem clever enough to have made it up--you're probably innocent.

I, at least, am not laughing at the police--by which I mean the cops who daily do their best to serve and protect. I am laughing at the politicians, the ones who wear police badges and sit behind desks and the ones who wear suits and sit in mayoral offices. Those are the clowns. They know that their political theater doesn't make anyone safer. They are simply suckering their poor, poorly educated, gullible and desperate "clientele."

The line cops know how useless this all is, and they no doubt hate it (although there are probably a few "true believers", mostly young officers).

The bottom line is that this is not an attempt to "make society safer", it's a sick joke. If a felon accidentally turns in a good weapon, and he needs to shoot a rival, he will simply use another gun. Do you imagine that he will stop shooting people? Are even you that whipped by the gun control reality distortion field?

Why do you hate law enforcement?

Why do you hate America and fantasize about terrorism?

Yes, that question is an answer. Get someone to explain it to you.

[MichaelHarris]

44. hahahahaha

I love the last one, now I hate America, that's rich!

[rd_kent]

60. I noticed how you had NO RESPONSE to the fact that all of your talking points got hammered.

You ignore that and make a joke? Who is evading again?

[Hoopla Phil]

66. About par for Mike

[SteveM]

63. Even over a computer screen, your "laughter" seems strained and hollow(nt)

[Euromutt]

53. I'll take a stab at the answer (pardon the pun)

When the LA County Sheriff's Dept. "buys back" 58 guns that turn out to be deactivated .22LR knockoffs suitable at best for cheap motion pictures, then yes, it's fair to make fun of the particular deputies who accepted them as being real.

It is definitely fair to make fun of the Los Angeles Times for describing them as "civilian versions of military assault rifles" rather than the deactivated lookalikes that they are.

And it's fair enough to question the effectiveness of these "gift cards for guns" exchange programs. There's not a lot of evidence that the weapons handed in are guns that were likely to be used in crime (had they not been handed in). Mostly, it seems to be a way to get rid of unwanted firearms with a minimum of fuss, provided the owner's not taking too much of a loss on it. I don't see anyone handing in Glocks, "Wonder Nines" or 1911s.

[taurus145]

69. Why do you hate law enforcement?

Why do you hate the supreme law of the land, the Constitution?

[Hoopla Phil]

42. Once again. If you want a question answered you have to first answer the

question asked of you. It is really very simple. Please try to keep up.

[Hoopla Phil]

19. How about this question that you ran from Mike?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=277780&mesg_id=278510

Would you want to disarm all Cops too, so they don't get drunk and shoot someone? There are several examples if you follow the like to your post that you abandoned.

[Katya Mullethov]

22. Hand out that pile of Ravens and Jennings as their issue weapons

Seeing they are so eager to get those death machines "off the streets" .

[Hoopla Phil]

41. So you are ignorant of forum decorum. This may explain why you run

from so many posts. To not answer a question and then ask another question is very bad decorum in the interwebs. Until you answer you have no legitimate ground to ask a question. Insisting so only paints you as intellectually dishonest and a poor debater.

Have a nice day.

[MichaelHarris]

43. running away?

8 hours and counting, you never answered the question.

[Hoopla Phil]

48. Here's the link AGAIN. And I'm still waiting as well. . . tick tock

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=277780&mesg_id=278524

Too bad you abandoned that thread you started. Couldn't face the facts and truth I see.

[MichaelHarris]

52. are you talking about

the cop drinking question? I answered but the question makes no sense in relation to the discussion. just like now, you make absolutely no sense. You continue to play child games. I assume you have no intention of answering the question, therefore you support guns in the hands of criminals. You belittle the work of law enforcement to do whatever they legally can to get guns out of the hands of criminals and off the street. Your non-answer proves this, most at DU always knew this. Congratulations, gun love over the lives of police officers. Do I need to post their names?



I think the kids call this getting owned, you just got owned and revealed.

[Hoopla Phil]

64. Read up thread smart guy. You have not answered the question yet you make personal attacks.

You accuse others of personal attacks and refusing to answer your questions yet you are guilty of those yourself. You now are making ad hominem attacks without any provocation. Congratulations on letting your true character show through.

When you answer my question then you can ask a question. It is that simple. Making additional attacks will not change that.

[Hoopla Phil]

49. And yo continue to show your ignorance of forum decorum. Want an answer? Give an answer.

Still waiting. . .

[Hoopla Phil]

65. Still waiting on an answer.

[DrCory]

71. There is an important question you have yet to answer...

In this thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x270147

Perhaps you should do so before accusing anyone else of running away.

[MichaelHarris]

73. answered

[DrCory]

75. NOT Answered...No cite or reference to an official source.

Surely there must be SOME kind of evidence you can provide other than a link to your own photo gallery.

[taurus145]

68. It's a "rule" of civil intercourse. n/t

[PavePusher]

46. Yes, it is thoroughly appropriate.

You shouldn't cry "Wolf!" unless you know what a wolf is.

[rd_kent]

59. "Worship of the gun seems crazy to me." And YOU accuse others of personal attacks?

Hypocrite.

[Hoopla Phil]

13. I wonder. . .If mike will EVER go answer the questions/points made at this post of his.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=277780&mesg_id=278524

LMFAO!!!!!!!!!

[burrfoot]

24. You know,

I actually took the time to write what I thought was a thoughtful response to Mike in that thread. He bamboozled me with his appeal to rational discourse, I guess. I probably should have known it was too good to be true.

I know I'm not the only one who did so, either. Seems like maybe a waste of time....except that it's nice to get the chance to organize your thoughts in that format every once in a while.

:shrug:

[Hoopla Phil]

45. I did the same once this week with another member.

Had never seen that person in the gun forums before and they have never been back. Mike has been around for a while throwing out anti gun rhetoric that sound like it's straight from the Brady handbook. His normal mode of operation is to spew forth the Brady talking points and then leave when faced with the real facts and figures - like when Brady counts Cop v. gang shooting or gang v. gang shooting as a "child" victim of gun violence.

Of course Mike says such posts are personal attacks and gets his feelings hurt so he leaves.

[burrfoot]

25. Schadenfreude. It

doesn't make you a bad person. Is violent gun death horrible and sad? Sure is. Is the LAPD buying a ton of VERY obviously fake guns funny? You betcha!! Is the gun buy-back program valuable? Again, yes! Holy crap!! All three things are true, and have no bearing on each other!!!!!



:evilgrin:

[Merchant Marine]

32. You're bad at context

I'm mainly trying to mock the sensationalist media hounds at the LA Times who couldn't even figure out the difference between an AR-15 and a pot metal replica. This was splashed across my front page this morning, and it was clear something was wrong with those rifles from a distance. But there they were being labeled as "civilian assault rifles" and some cop was quoted as being so relieved that they were "Off the streets". Doesn't this sort of farce insult your journalistic integrity?

And yeah, its funny that LAPD shelled out for 10+ fake guns, but they have to take everything people turn in so its not their fault. Some guy turned in 5 airsoft guns with the orange tips still on them at the last local buyback and got paid for them. I've seen pictures from midwest buybacks where somebody turned in a metal pipe duct-taped to a tree branch and got cash for it.

[MichaelHarris]

38. fake guns

have been used in robberies and home invasions, but you knew that.

[AtheistCrusader]

50. Buying them back with a $100 gift card sounds like an exercise in futility to me.

Considering you could go get another toy gun for a few bucks.

It's just a bad scheme. Someone who knows something about firearms should be having SOME sort of look at the weapons before forking over any of their budget.

At least the bald guy on the left has somewhat of a 'what the fuck is this thing' expression on his face. It gives me a little hope.

[benEzra]

54. So have fingers in pockets.

So, you are saying that paying beat-up prop guns (at maybe 5 times their actual value) from people cleaning out their film studio warehouses is an effective way to reduce gun violence?

It seems to me that if more robbers and home invaders used nonfunctional movie guns instead of the real thing, we'd be better off. But hey, what do I know.

[AtheistCrusader]

51. Actually, the OP laughed at the Times

for labeling what we can easily see in a small, cropped photo, as an 'assault weapon', when in fact it's either a non-firing training device, a toy, or a movie prop.

[rd_kent]

58. "Worship of the gun seems crazy to me." - Statements like that mean you are not serious about this.

You are just another hyperbole spewing, no solid argument having, emotional response giving, ignorant fool.

[aikoaiko]

72. I laugh at useless policy. Is there any evidence that gun buybacks reduce crime or violence?

What do you mean by guns off the street? Do you mean illegally possessed guns? Then sure that is admirable but I am more concerned with police using those funds to get criminals off the street.

Do you mean any gun, even those in legally possessed, then no I don't think the police have any compelling reason to entice people to turn in legally possessed weapons.

In fact, I think police should sell all weapons not needed for evidence in a crime to FFLs to resell to law abiding folks who can pass a background check.

[taurus145]

10. Bwahahahahahaha PRICELESS

[east texas lib]

55. Well at least those deadly "assault props" are off the street.

After years of horrifying carnage inflicted upon my favorite charactors of military action flicks,
SOMETHING had to be done.

[Xenotime]

57. They look real enough to commit a crime. Which is good enough for me.

[rd_kent]

61. Being ignorant is good enough for you?

Spending money for something that is fake sounds good to you?

[benEzra]

67. They were probably used in a few fake crimes, and numerous fake wars.

Too bad the LAPD chose to buy them with real money.

I'm pretty sure those "guns" didn't come from gang members, but from some enterprising movie prop rental guy who saw an opportunity to sell worn-out props for a hundred bucks each. They look pretty old, and unless they were made for a Vietnam movie or something, the handguard style would date them prior to the 1980's or earlier, I suspect. They're not even particularly realistic looking by today's standards.

[Glassunion]

76. What did you expect from Hollywoo... I mean the "News"