jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:31 PM
Original message |
Where can I find a list of words/phrases that are banned on DU's Guns forum? n/t |
MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:34 PM
Response to Original message |
1. Why do you ask? I'd think that if you use words used in polite |
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company you'll never have a problem.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
2. A recent thread discussed DU's policies and there are certain words/phrases that are banned. Seems |
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fair to let new DUers who participate in the Guns forum know what those words/phrases are. IMO that would reduce the number of alerts and workload on mods if such information were widely known. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=288003&mesg_id=288003
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MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
5. The terms that you can't use are those that are insulting to others. |
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I'm sure you can think of what those might be, whether you're a firearms owner or someone who thinks firearms should be strongly regulated. Use the Golden Rule when you write and ask yourself if you'd like to be called something or another.
It shouldn't be too hard to figure out.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
7. I take your response to my OP question as "I don't know". Thanks for your input. n/t |
MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
9. Actually, I do know, as it happens. |
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It's a very short list, and you already know the terms. If not, proofread your posts and see if any of the words you use are insulting to firearms owners or advocates of strong regulation. All you have to do is be reasonable and polite, and you won't have any problems.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #9 |
12. You claim "I do know" so help new DUers by posting the link for which I asked. n/t |
MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:21 PM
Response to Reply #12 |
15. I don't have such a link. I have seen various statements by the admins |
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on this subject and have internalized the information. I also have enough common sense to know what is insulting when used as a label for someone with whom I disagree. As those who know me know, being disagreeable is something I'm quite good at, but I try to do it in a polite way, as in this exchange.
The general rule of thumb might be: If you have to wonder if the terminology you are about to use is appropriate, use different terminology that is less insulting. That's the rule I follow.
It's not rocket science.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #15 |
Caliman73
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
11. That is where I would disagree to an extent. |
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Using "insulting" as a guide is unclear. There are some who participate in the forum who are insulted by the mere presence and arguments supporting the possession and use of firearms by anyone other than the military of civilian authorities. There are some who want all firearms melted down and consider anyone who would even think neutrally about firearms to be disturbed or wantonly destructive. Similarly there are those on the side of possession of firearms who are insulted by the insinuation that there should be restrictions on the possession of long arms or handguns as it is a civil right. They seem to be insulted by the idea that one would not be open to using a firearm to defend themselves or loved ones.
I agree with you on the Golden Rule (although that is creeping into Religion :rofl: ). Clear but flexible guidelines are good. People tend to lose perspective when passions are inflamed.
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MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #11 |
14. I know what you're saying, of course, but civility is really so easy |
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to do. The basic rules of DU forbid personal attacks. So, all a person has to do is ask him or herself whether they'd feel insulted or attacked by being called a particular name. Of course, it would require a little thought and a bit of putting oneself in another's shoes for a moment.
For example, someone who preferred not to eat animal products would have to think about someone who does eat them when writing a term like "murderer" in reference to the latter. With that thought, a better word could easily be chosen. Perhaps something like "carnivore." Using a less insulting term would, perhaps, lead the carnivore not to use a term such as "granola-cruncher" in a response. Civility would be maintained. The disagreement would be less intense.
There are many such examples, of course. One need only read GD for a while to view many others. :rofl:
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xchrom
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:41 PM
Response to Original message |
3. Wouldn't providing that list get somebody banned? Nt |
jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
4. Not if it was a mod or DU admin. I asked where I could find a list, not that the list be provided. n |
Caliman73
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Mon Apr-05-10 12:59 PM
Response to Original message |
6. I don't think there is an exhaustive list. |
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I saw the thread from February with the clarification from Krispos42. Some of the terms were the typical ones used by both sides: Obvious ones = hoplophobe, gun nut, gun grabber, gun worshiper, etc..
Basically it was some of the obvious terms plus a notice that the mods were stepping up activity to restore or I guess implement some civility into discourse on the forum. They asked us to alert on what we thought were infractions to the DU forum rules. I would imagine as Mineral Man said, that keeping the language civil and the arguments on point, would go far in maintaining that civility.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
8. Thanks. I didn't ask for "an exhaustive list", just the current list to which anyone could refer new |
MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
17. See this thread for further guidance. |
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http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=288003&mesg_id=288003N.B.: If you're looking at the list of threads in the Gun topic, it's the thread immediately under the one you started. Its title is pretty clear, it seems to me.
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MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
18. Ah, never mind. I see you have read that thread already. |
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Edited on Mon Apr-05-10 01:27 PM by MineralMan
Which begs the question of why you posted this thread, since you had already read the thread to which you requested a link. It is the very thread you were seeking.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
20. Please reread the OP. n/t |
MineralMan
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #20 |
21. Uh, there is no such list. DU's admins apparently believe that |
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DUers are smart enough to figure out for themselves what is civil and what is not. A few examples of name-calling expressions were given, along with a call for improved civility. No list of words is needed, as I have said in other replies to you. Just some common sense and respect for diverse views should be all that is required for people of good intent.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
22. Have a great day and goodbye. n/t |
jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
19. Thanks for quoting the link in my reply #2 to your #1. Have a great day. n/t |
spin
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:09 PM
Response to Original message |
10. It might make a good sticky like the one for where to post gun related topics... |
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at the top of the gun forum.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
13. Makes sense to me and IMO would lighten the workload on mods. n/t |
dashrif
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Mon Apr-05-10 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
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Edited on Mon Apr-05-10 02:02 PM by dashrif
we need a sticky mods!
edit: the silly goose that I am put a ? instead of a !
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struggle4progress
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
30. I bet the mods are all excited about the inevitable posts and PMs: |
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Hey, how was I supposed to know that calling somebody a "gun wacko fruitcake" was against the rules? The sticky only forbids "gun nut"
WTF! You mean I can't call somebody a "cryptofascist asshole advocate of gun confiscation"? Since when? The sticky only forbids "gun grabber"
OK. It is true that I called somebody a "shit-headed militia pimp," but I meant it in a nice way -- and anyway it's not on the list
Um, I checked the list carefully after it was updated, and I completely avoided the phrase "cryptofascist asshole advocate of gun confiscation" in favor of "fuckwad fascist Brady law troll," which I couldn't find on the sticky
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cowman
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #30 |
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thats pretty good LOL:toast:
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #30 |
34. ROFL, censorship is as easy to enforce as an amendment banning flag desecration. n/t |
spin
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Mon Apr-05-10 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #34 |
39. You have to admire the efforts of the moderators ... |
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it's a thankless job but they have created a more civil level of discussion in the gun forum.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #39 |
40. Believe me no one has greater admiration for DU mods than I. I have rarely hit alert on anyone |
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except in unusual cases such as a link to porn sites or advocating physical harm to others and a handful of cases when my patience was worn thin by pure hate posts.
The one thing I remember from the beginning on DU is a few people attacked pro-RKBA DUers to the point they retaliated in kind only to be promptly tomb stoned. To them it was a game to provoke pro-RKBA DUers so they were banned.
Things are infinitely better today and IMO those who are banned are provocateurs from sites like that one representing the other political party.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #30 |
37. Or using the common internet definition of a forbidden word in lieu of the word. Oh the humor that |
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awaits us in the future as DUers try to find ways to not only skirt the letter of the law but its spirit.
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demosincebirth
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Mon Apr-05-10 02:28 PM
Response to Original message |
24. Some gun owners are so sensitive. |
The Green Manalishi
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Mon Apr-05-10 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
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When you find your rights constantly under assault, even by people who *CLAIM* to be progressives, it's not suprising. Plenty of folks who are quite willing to jump into bed with the Republicans to tell us which rights we have or don't.
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Name removed
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Mon Apr-05-10 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
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Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
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spin
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Mon Apr-05-10 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
29. Actually I didn't mind the old days ... |
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when the people who dislike guns resorted to insults, then I knew I had won the argument.
It reminds me of some quotes,
Use soft words and hard arguments. English Proverb
Strong and bitter words indicate a weak cause. Victor Hugo
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
32. ROFL because in DU's Guns forum, any poster that relies on ad hominem has lost regardless of the |
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pro-con side they try to defend.
:thumbsup: :toast:
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
31. Agree and so are some who oppose gun ownership. Wonder which group has the greatest |
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proportion of sensitive members given that perhaps 65% of the population support gun ownership and 35% oppose gun ownership?
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demosincebirth
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Mon Apr-05-10 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #31 |
44. Sensible gun ownership. |
SteveM
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Sun Apr-11-10 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
55. Most people who are attacked by the disingenuous are... |
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There are a number of gun-control/prohibitionists who post here for the purpose of punking 2A-defenders and to attack their respective characters. Sometimes they take a "take the highroad" and look down on pro-2A folks; sometimes they engage in the kind of smear which would be called racist and sexist in other quarters. And that is the point: other quarters. There seems to be a license for some anti-2A people to make the kind of regular attacks on their opposition which would not be tolerated in other forums.
Frankly, I think some of the anti-2A folks don't really care about the instant issue; they are getting off to anonymous bathroom wall attacks, and feel it's okay that they can finger-paint the stalls with their auto-induced waste.
I hope this explains the "sensitivity."
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jody
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Sun Apr-11-10 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #55 |
56. Sad that some who deny pre-existing rights still call themselves "progressive liberals". n/t |
Name removed
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Mon Apr-05-10 02:34 PM
Response to Original message |
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Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
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cowman
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Mon Apr-05-10 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #26 |
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Edited on Mon Apr-05-10 02:46 PM by cowman
more wise words from cabluedem
BTW the word is spelled their not thier
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Euromutt
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:37 PM
Response to Original message |
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I think the mods have taken the Hamiltonian approach that enumerating the impermissible terms may be wrongly taken to imply that any unenumerated term is permissible. Which will inevitably lead to a session of "moderation whack-a-mole" as posters try to come up with pejoratives that the moderators haven't explicitly prohibited yet.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
36. You mean there's a slippery slope when someone begins to infringe on a fundamental right! That's |
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what those who support the Second Amendment claim about various laws that infringe upon possessing firearms arguing it could led to total bans as once existed in D.C.
As so many have asserted in various ways since the beginning of our nation, either one supports all rights for all people or no right is immune to denial by a simple majority of the people's representatives.
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Euromutt
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Mon Apr-05-10 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
46. Perhaps I expressed myself unclearly |
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Let's bear in mind we're on private property here, and in order to be here, we users have agreed to abide by the rules the owners of the property have laid out.
I meant to say that by not maintaining a list of impermissible terms, the moderators avoid having to play "Whack-a-Mole" by having posters try to circumvent the rules by using pejoratives that have not (yet) been added to the list, and instead the mods can assess a post by whether it shows an apparent intent to be abusive, rather than whether or not the exact words used appear on some list.
Whether you consider that to boil down to the same thing you described, I leave up to your judgment.
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jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 03:52 PM
Response to Original message |
38. Mea culpa to all who responded to what I thought was a simple question. You've complicated the issue |
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and along the way provided food for thought and cause to laugh.
Thanks, many thanks to all :toast:
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east texas lib
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Mon Apr-05-10 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
41. You just had to ask, didn't you? |
jody
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Mon Apr-05-10 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #41 |
42. Yes like pro-RKBA Democrats I respect and abide by the law but it's nice to know what is the law. nt |
Caliman73
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Tue Apr-06-10 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #42 |
50. The laws change from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. |
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Come on man, we should be used to that...:rofl:
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jody
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Tue Apr-06-10 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #50 |
51. Understand and those who travel with firearms or post on other forums are sometimes caught unawares. |
-..__...
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Mon Apr-05-10 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
43. I wonder what Mr. "What A Pantload" reaction would be... |
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under these new, gentler and kinder rules of engagement? :smoke:
Not that it would have stifled him any. If anything... it would have enraged him even more.
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onehandle
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Mon Apr-05-10 09:52 PM
Response to Original message |
45. A group of DUers are so sensitive that they have their own special rules to protect their feelings? |
jody
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Tue Apr-06-10 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #45 |
49. Can you imagine a set of rules for supporters of Georgia v. Georgia Tech OR Alabama v. Auburn et al |
Euromutt
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Tue Apr-06-10 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
52. Yep; that's why the term "hoplophobe" has been off-limits for... |
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...well, since before I joined DU. The rules had to be expanded because the same people who couldn't take it were evidently still quite eager to dish it out.
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jazzhound
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Mon Apr-05-10 11:08 PM
Response to Original message |
47. There was brief discussion in some thread regarding how each "team" |
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should be referred to. Someone fairly pointed out that using the word (or prefix) *anti* came across with a negative tone. That problem could be resolved by using a pro/pro approach:
PGC = pro gun control PGR = pro gun rights
Of course this can become quite absurd because the phrase "gun control" means so many different things to different people. So then you have to define gun control. Ah well ---- bottom line, keep your front porch clean before you complain 'bout the other person's porch.
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jody
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Tue Apr-06-10 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #47 |
48. I missed the discussion re "anti" so I may have unintentionally used it. DU says we have two forums |
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one of which is to discuss 2nd Amendment and that's DU's Guns forum.
SCOTUS said in D.C. v. Heller that the Second Amendment protects an individual, pre-existing right to keep and bear arms for self-defense.
I routinely use pro-RKBA to express support for and now to acknowledge that natural, inherent, inalienable/unalienable right.
Is there an acceptable DU way to identify those who oppose SCOTUS' decision?
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east texas lib
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Tue Apr-06-10 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #48 |
53. Is there an acceptable DU way to identify those who oppose SCOTUS' decision? |
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Edited on Tue Apr-06-10 07:00 PM by east texas lib
;-) We'll call them, oh, unarmed.
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jody
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Tue Apr-06-10 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #53 |
54. Good suggestion with a slight modification -- "pro-unarmed" or perhaps "pro-defenseless" n/t |
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