Proposal to ban guns at polls withdrawn (Lancaster County, Pennsylvania)

[shadowrider]

Lancaster County voters will not be barred from packing heat at the 235 local polling places during the general election next week.

Mary Stehman, chief clerk of the county's Board of Elections, on Wednesday withdrew a resolution she had proposed to the county commissioners Tuesday, which would have banned the possession of firearms at county polling sites.

Stehman said she withdrew the resolution after reviewing state gun laws, which prevent municipal governments from regulating when and where guns can be carried.

"I am absolutely certain if this resolution would have been passed there would have been some sort of challenge," Commissioner Craig Lehman said.

Stehman got the idea for the resolution from a letter sent by the Department of State last month to all 67 Pennsylvania counties which stated individual counties interested in banning guns at polling places could do so on their own.

" … if a county wishes to prohibit firearms in the polling place, the county Board of Elections should pass a resolution clarifying this matter," the letter states.

It then lists several sections of the Pennsylvania Elections Code that could be cited to justify such resolutions.

But Lehman said state and federal law are pretty clear that counties can't legislate gun possession.

"I would hope the Department of State would have provided the legal justification for its direction, but it clearly doesn't address the Uniform Firearms Act at all," he said.

The act is a set of Pennsylvania statutes that spells out a citizen's right to keep and bear arms in the state.

State Rep. Bryan Cutler, an avid hunter and gun owner, said he's annoyed the Department of State sent out such letters to Pennsylvania counties.

He said he spoke with department officials Wednesday, who agreed counties cannot pass resolutions banning the possession of firearms.

And Cutler is planning to request the department send another letter to all 67 counties explaining that fact.

"A letter of recision clearly is in order here," he said.


http://articles.lancasteronline.com/local/4/305413

[ManiacJoe]

1. Have to give credit to Stehman for

actually doing the research.

[Ruby the Liberal]

2. No offense to the CCW people here, but FFS, who feels the need to carry a weapon into a polling

station (regionally being places of worship and/or elementary/local schools)?

Please.

[TheCowsCameHome]

3. +1

[PavePusher]

4. I carry everywhere I am allowed by law.

If I have no ill intentions (except, of course, to criminals), why should I make an exception for voting?

The burden of proof is on you. I doubt you can make a case that Civil Rights may only be exercised one at a time.

[rfranklin]

5. And if you can plug a few Republicans so much the better...

I support your right to do so!

[spin]

7. I assume your statement is an attempt at humor ...

we have so much hostility in our country today between political parties that it is surprising that we haven't seen more violence.

It's not necessary or wise to shoot people who disagree with you over politics.

[TheWraith]

10. Be patient. The violence may yet come.

Particularly if the wingnuts fail to take the House.

[spin]

17. I will agree that some of these fools have made comments that disturbed me.

They are a little to flippant when they talk about "Second Amendment remedies".

[rrneck]

22. It may be more likely if they do take the house. nt

[PavePusher]

9. I'm not too worried about political violence.

It's very rare here in the U.S., and mostly grossly exagerated by the press.

But comments like yours sure don't help the situation.

[ManiacJoe]

6. You ask the wrong question.

What makes polling places so special that we need to take the gun off and leave it outside when most other places allow them? (Ignore the school issue for the sake of the discussion.)

[Ruby the Liberal]

14. You can't ignore "the school issue" if that is the location of the polling places

[PavePusher]

16. Which yet again begs the question:

What makes a school a place where non-criminals can't/shouldn't be armed?

Rather non-sensical when you actually think through it.

[ManiacJoe]

18. Thus the parenthesized discussion suggestion.

:shrug:
Feel free to offer an answer to the question.

[spin]

8. In Florida, I can't carry a firearm in a polling place ...

however I can and have carried a firearm in a church (on the extremely rare occasions when I have been in one).

I don't believe God or Jesus has any obligation to protect me merely because I am in a place of worship.

[AtheistCrusader]

11. Seriously. If you don't need it, no one ever need know. If you do need it, to hell with decorum.

[spin]

15. Good point. (n/t)

[AtheistCrusader]

12. My polling place is my living room.

This state is mail-in only.

Previously I carried. Would you prefer I left it in the car, where it might get stolen?

[Hoyt]

23. Hey, toters can't go into Chuck E Cheeze without their pistol tucked in their pants.

I bet they would really have a problem walking into a public polling place without their weapon.

Why would anyone feel the need to tote to vote.

[shadowrider]

24. Once again you fail to understand

It isn't about "tote to vote".

It's about personal protection and never knowing when and where, someone, for some reason, real or imagined, decides it's time for you to die.

But I don't expect you to understand that.

[PavePusher]

25. Stuff that Strawman(tm) faster!

It's leaking out its... bottom.

[friendly_iconoclast]

26. What's with the, ahem, "preoccupation" with guns and Chuck E Cheese

Is there some synergy between bad pizza, loud games and smokeless powder that you haven't been telling us about?:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=345085#345126

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=345085#345192

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=313841#346129

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=324016#324582

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=332266#332320

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=334510#334875

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=334510#334888


This is my favorite example of your work- five gun-CEC mentions in one thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=337922#338863

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=337922#338888

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=337922#338904

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=337922#338958

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=337922#339048

[SteveM]

28. God, you like Chuck E Cheeze?

"Why would anyone feel the need to tote to vote."

Perhaps they don't feel the need to tote to vote. They are just carrying routinely. Do you have any evidence that someone needs to "tote to vote?"

[Glassunion]

29. Holy Shit! The timing is impeccable

http://www.wibc.com/news/Story.aspx?id=1303852
http://mobile.fox59.com/wap/news/text.jsp?sid=283&nid=27016462&cid=14026&scid=-1&ith=2&title=Local+News
http://www.wthr.com/story/13419233/chuck-e-cheese-restaurant-on-west-side-robbed

and

http://www.contracostatimes.com/california/ci_16418699?nclick_check=1
""It is not a place you would associate as dangerous, it is a place for families and kids," Hart said"

[Kolesar]

30. They have to, because burglars are waiting in the church parking lot to steal their guns

...from the glove box. :sarcasm:

[Glassunion]

31. Right... Nothing bad ever happens in certain places...

http://www.kitv.com/r/25538988/detail.html
http://www.fresnobee.com/2010/10/28/2137189/local-briefs-arrest-made-in-shooting.html

[Kolesar]

32. yeah, you really care about the dead gang members :sarcasm:

I don't think that even *you* believe that something like that would happen at a polling place. I doubt that you think there are burglaries at the polling place. You know, there are people out and about, a.k.a. witnesses ?

[Glassunion]

34. Think again...

http://www.thebostonchannel.com/r/17495781/detail.html

[Kolesar]

35. that's not a car burglary

go read my other posts.

Your citation of a crime at 1:30 in the morning was truly off base, too.

[Glassunion]

36. So what? That is not what I replying to...

"I don't think that even *you* believe that something like that would happen at a polling place. I doubt that you think there are burglaries at the polling place. You know, there are people out and about, a.k.a. witnesses ?"

That statement is what I was replying to.

As for the 1:30am, that is when that poor guy was found, but again... So what? Your statements are leading me to believe that nothing bad could happen at these places. So I gave you examples of bad things happening at these places. That's all. Nothing more.

[Kolesar]

38. Kolesar (1000+ posts) Mon Nov-01-10 05:02 PM

Response to Reply #2
30. They have to, because burglars are waiting in the church parking lot to steal their guns
...from the glove box.
Less ghastly cultures than America don't embrace firearms

[Glassunion]

40. I will spell out my though process. Maybe it will help.

In Post #2 Ruby the Liberal wrote "No offense to the CCW people here, but FFS, who feels the need to carry a weapon into a polling station (regionally being places of worship and/or elementary/local schools)? Please.

Then you in post 30 said: They have to, because burglars are waiting in the church parking lot to steal their guns...from the glove box.

(Thought Process: You were replying to the question as to why people carry guns into a polling place being as they are churches, schools etc... To which you replied that we do that because basically we don't want them stolen from our cars because nothing bad happens in these locations. To which I replied with examples of bad things happening in the very parking lots of these places "Post 31".)

Then you posted in #32: I don't think that even *you* believe that something like that would happen at a polling place. I doubt that you think there are burglaries at the polling place. You know, there are people out and about, a.k.a. witnesses?

(Thought Process: You basically stated that nothing bad could possibly happen and that I could not believe that it would at a polling place because of all of the witnesses. To which I replied with a robbery that happened to a woman as she left a polling location after voting)

Now here we are. Maybe we were just having two different conversations. Happens sometimes in the forums. Emotion and context is sometimes lost when just looking at the typed word.

[Kolesar]

41. So did little old lady leave her weapon at home because guns were not allowed in the polling place?

That citiation is not relevant.

[Glassunion]

42. That was not the point I was trying to make.

The point I was trying to make is: That yes indeed, you can be a victim of violent crime, even when voting at a supposedly safe place.

Again... I'm afraid the context was lost in the typed word. Sorry for any confusion.

[jazzhound]

43. Afraid that we're dealing with gun-aversive dyslexia here.

[shadowrider]

45. Nigeria doesn't embrace firearms and that country is far less ghastly than America

Oh.

wait.

Nevermind.

[RSillsbee]

13. I have every intention of being heeled when I go to vote

Next Tuesday what's the big deal ?

[oneshooter]

19. Can not carry, even concealed, in a polling place in Texas. n/t

[Katya Mullethov]

20. Are open carry nightsticks still cool ?

[shadowrider]

21. == snort == n/t

[Hoopla Phil]

27. Here's one police officer that doesn't thing guns should be banned at the polls.

http://www.bangordailynews.com/story/Greater-Bangor/Bangor-police-officer-denied-right-to-vote-after-refusing-to-surrender-weapon,157603

[Kolesar]

33. Lunatic

Dearing flipped the safety question around.

“What if someone else had come in with a gun concealed? Then I wouldn’t have my gun to protect people and do my job,” he said.
*****
Is someone going to steal the election at gun point?

[shadowrider]

37. He's a lunatic yet you trust him with a gun BECAUSE he's a LEO.

Shouldn't he be fired, in your opinion?

[Kolesar]

39. I don't know what you are asking...eom

[Hoopla Phil]

44. I bet he passed his last psych evaluation. But I you go and rely on

your own unbiased professional opinion.


(do I really need the sarcasm thingy?)

[Katya Mullethov]

46. A simmering madness induced

by the lifelong torment of precognition
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=346487&mesg_id=346487

Or maybe there was no magic involved at at all and he is simply one of these rare individuals that can look at things that have happened in the past , recognizes patterns , and then uses these examples to plan for the future . No matter what , he has been reminded of what it feels like to be a subject again . LOL .