Guardsman accidentally kills self cleaning gun

[onehandle]

CLEVELAND, Tenn. — A Tennessee Guardsman has died in an accident the night before a ceremony to honor his unit's service in Iraq.

The Cleveland-based 252nd Military Police Company of the Tennessee Army National Guard served a 10-month combat tour without a single casualty. But on Saturday night, Spc. Joshua Meeks accidentally shot himself in the head while cleaning a new 9mm pistol.

"He loved the Army more than anything in the world," Spc. Mark Michaels told the Chattanooga Times-Free Press. Michaels, who served with Meeks and was also his brother-in-law, said he witnessed the accident. He and several other members of the unit were staying with the Meeks before the ceremony.

Marion County Sheriff Bo Burnett said deputies got a call at around 10:30 p.m. The Tennessee Bureau of Investigation and the county medical examiner also responded.

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2010/11/ap-guardsman-accidentally-shoots-self-111510

[ChairmanAgnostic]

1. that title has to go.

he killed a self cleaning gun?

[Leftist Agitator]

2. Rule #1: Don't point the barrel at anything that you don't want to die.

Rules #2, #3, and #4: CHECK THE FUCKING CHAMBER!!!!

[Euromutt]

6. That's rule #2, actually

Rule #1 is "assume the gun is loaded," therefore rule #2 is "don't let the muzzle point at anything you don't want to get a <insert appropriate caliber> hole in it."

There is no rule "check the fucking chamber" because the rule is that you should treat the weapon on the assumption that there is a round in the chamber, even if you've checked it. More than once.

The unwritten proviso is that you can let your guard down when the part of the weapon that holds the chamber (e.g. the slide or upper receiver) has been separated from the part that holds the trigger (e.g. the frame or the lower receiver).

[Leftist Agitator]

16. You are, of course, 100% correct.

Any gun, even if you are sure it is unloaded, should always be treated as loaded.

Just the same, eject the magazine, clear the chamber with the muzzle pointed in a safe direction, clear it again and put the slide stop on (for semi-auto pistols that have a slide stop), shake any potentially lodged round out of the action, and you're highly unlikely to accidentally shoot something.

I have cleaned dozens of weapons, from rifles to revolvers, semi-auto pistols and semi-auto shotguns with nary an incidence of accidental discharge.

This sounds like a terminal case of stupidity to me, with all respect to the deceased.

As you said, Rule #2: Don't point the barrel at anything that you don't want an X caliber hole in. Including your skull.

[Bosso 63]

3. Suicide

[spin]

9. I've know of several cases where a person shot while cleaning a firearm ...

actually committed suicide.

[onehandle]

13. I have a high school friend who shot himself in the leg while maintaining his guns.

On two separate occasions.

He is also a die-hard Libertarian, so that might explain much.

[slackmaster]

14. Your friend is obviously a dumbass

:nuke:

[RSillsbee]

29. A dumbass w/ horrible taste in friends? NT

[RamboLiberal]

20. The nice way to have the family believe it was an accident

or to not spread what happened beyond the immediate family. And maybe to collect on the insurance. I wouldn't be surprised if you're friendly with local officials it would be allowed to go down this way.

[TheWraith]

26. Yep. That's always been a popular euphemism for suicide.

Particularly many years ago when there was a greater stigma towards suicide.

In fact, unless you're being dumb it's very hard to accidentally shoot yourself while cleaning a gun, since that by definition requires that you first disassemble the gun.

[Katya Mullethov]

4. Who hasn't done that ?

Some people owe their very existance , and were placed on this Earth solely to serve as a warning to others .

[east texas lib]

24. Very true...

It's best not to befriend them, less sadness that way.

[Euromutt]

5. Speaking as an infantryman...

...what can you expect from the fucking Military Police?

[one-eyed fat man]

11. Speaking as a tanker

I second your opinion of MP's.

When the MP's are chasing you down the tank trail at Grafenwöhr, turning off the service stop light and having the driver do a quick stop is great fun.

Tanks do not leave skidmarks. The tow pintle neatly punches through a jeep radiator when the MP's jeep rear ends the tank.

http://www.vintagemilitarytrucks.com/M170_Jeep_127th_Med_Det_Deggondorf,Germany_hit_by_M41_Walker_Bulldog_Tank_6th_Armored_CAV_REGT.jpg

[AtheistCrusader]

27. That jeep has bigger problems than a new radiator...

[RSillsbee]

30. W- I- M- P

you can't spell wimp without the MP

Artillery

[DissedByBush]

31. Got worse with M1s

I was in a tanker unit, although not a tanker myself.

Tank was on a road and braked hard, the physics of such a sudden weight transfer making the rear end lift a bit.

And settle back down on the hood of the car that was following it and had rammed underneath the tank.

[RSillsbee]

7. Who "cleans" a fully assembled weapon?

This was a suicide.

[RamboLiberal]

21. Maybe - and people can be damned stupid with guns

We weren't there. There was a houseful of witnesses. Who knows.

[cleanhippie]

8. Was there a point to be made here?

If there is one, I am not seeing it.

[RSillsbee]

10. The point was that the military can't be trusted w/ firearms NT

[RamboLiberal]

12. More on the story

He said his brother had just bought a 9-millimeter pistol, and pulled it out Saturday night to clean and show his friends.

That's when the gun accidentally fired.

"He was sitting back and having a good time, he was showing them the new gun that he got," says Jake.

That's when things inside the home went horribly wrong. The 9-millimeter pistol Meeks was cleaning accidentally discharged.

http://www.wrcbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=13500766

Dillivan got the news late Saturday night. He says it was so shocking because Meeks was someone who knew his weapons well.

"He loved his guns, he babied his guns, he named them, he took care of them, cleaned them and that was kinda his heart and soul," says Dillivan.

http://www.wrcbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=13507324

He was also a part time deputy. You'd think a guy like this would have the knowledge to check the chamber and point it somewhere safe.

Wonder if any alcohol was involved though cops did say no one appeared drunk. Or could his family & friends be covering up a suicide?

Sad.

[spin]

15. Modern firearms do not "accidentally discharge" ...

it does sound like alcohol was involved, probably LOTS of alcohol.

[Leftist Agitator]

17. I can't help but wonder what make of 9mm this was...

A reputable manufacturer does drop tests and safety tests that almost eliminate the possibility of an accidental discharge.

Though I have seen a 7mm Remington Magnum Rifle fire when the bolt was abruptly closed.

Scary shit, considering the round's power and/or deadliness.

The lesson to be learned is "Don't point the muzzle of a firearm at anything that you don't want to die. Ever, under any circumstances."

[RamboLiberal]

19. I'd bet the trigger was pulled

AD's can happen but with modern firearms unlikely. Most are ND's. Now one factor that has caused some police and other gun owners to put a round where not intended including wounding oneself or someone in area is that some handguns do require the trigger to be pulled before the slide can be removed for cleaning. That's why you always remove the mag and then check the chamber.

[Leftist Agitator]

22. That's what I said in reply #2.

Assume that the gun is always loaded. Don't point it anything that you don't want to die.

Also, clear the chamber, put the slide stop on, manually shake any lodged round out, clear it again, and you're most likely OK.

[RamboLiberal]

25. Yep - you have to guard against any type of brain fart

I've seen someone remove the mag & forget to rack the round out the chamber.

Or rack the round out then remove the mag forgetting that doing that put another round in the chamber.

Pull trigger - one helluva surprise.

And with a bunch of people around talking, etc. I can see how that could happen.

Now that still doesn't explain how he pointed it at his head.

Now I've seen some people at the range have a bad habit in competition shooting when told to unload, show clear, hammer down or pull trigger be pointing it damn near their foot. RO's usually correct that real quick.

[spin]

23. True, but you don't point the muzzle of the firearms at you head ...

as you pull the trigger.

[RamboLiberal]

32. If it wasn't a suicide

Then maybe he and/or his friends were screwing around with the gun. Read of this kind of incident at least once a month.

[Euromutt]

33. There's a maxim on the wall of every armory in the Dutch army's Training Command

Wees vertrouwd met wapens, maar vertrouw hun nooit.

It works better in Dutch because of the variety of uses of the verb vertrouwen; by itself, it means "to trust" but vertrouwd zijn met means "to be familiar/competent with." But loosely translated, the maxim means:

"Be familiar with firearms, but never trust them."

<Staff Sgt Dillivan> says it was so shocking because Meeks was someone who knew his weapons well.

"He loved his guns, he babied his guns, he named them, he took care of them, cleaned them and that was kinda his heart and soul," says Dillivan.

http://www.wrcbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=13507324

Assuming that SSGT Dillivan's statement is accurate, I'd say that might be something to which we can trace the problem: Meeks' appreciation for his firearms caused him to forget that your gun doesn't (because it can't) love you back. It's an inanimate device, and when you pull the trigger, it won't not discharge just because it happens to be pointed at you, or someone you love.

[proteus_lives]

18. Ban accidents, it's the only way we'll be safe.

[AtheistCrusader]

28. Suicide, or suicide by alcohol. Not clear yet.

One of the two.