Brady Campaign warns of Red Ryder BB Gun hazard

[DonP]

From today's Chicago Tribune;

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/ct-met-red-ryder-mon-20101219,0,4678373.story?page=2&track=rss

"The Red Ryder's status as toy and weapon presents somewhat of a dilemma for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, a leading advocacy group. It has no official position on BB guns, communications director Caroline Brewer said. "People think that if an organization gets a little serious about these things, that they're trying to spoil people's fun," she said. "But when you see that these things are dangerous and that children get hurt, we think it's our responsibility to warn people."


Would it be so hard for her to just suggest that eye protection might mitigate any possible "shoot your eye out" concerns? Oh, never mind, that would be actually showing concern for gun safety and the Brady group has no interest in safe firearm use from what I've read.

Well, from this story and the number of Red Ryders I've seen walking out the doors at Bass Pro and Cabela's alone, the Brady cautions, like most of their other comments are being ignored.

[Kennah]

1. You'll shoot yer eye out! You'll shoot yer eye out! You'll shoot yer eye out!

C+

[DJ13]

2. Too late!

[FSogol]

3. Was there no end to this conspiracy of irrational prejudice against Red Ryder and his peacemaker?

:rofl:

[Katya Mullethov]

48. None

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rEuTwYALho

[wtmusic]

4. What planet are you from where kids wear eye protection to shoot a BB gun?

Nice (fake) concern for gun safety :eyes:

[DonP]

5. From the planet where we actually teach gun safety - what's your smart ass excuse? ntxt

[wtmusic]

6. Not what I asked

Kids don't wear them, the shooter isn't usually the one who's injured, and eye injuries make up a small fraction of the 30,000 kids admitted to ERs each year with BB/pellet gun injuries.

Responding to the smartass OP, which apparently considers Brady's well-advised warning as a joke.

Unrec. :thumbsdown:

[DonP]

18. The fact that you hung around a lot of stupid parents doesn't prove the rule

Not everyone had a lot of stupid, careless parents in their neighborhood. I weep for your ruined childhood in a neighborhood just chock full of stupid people.

We were taught gun safety in Scouts and again at summer camp before we were ever allowed to touch a gun, BB or otherwise. The same rules that are in place today applied.

Why don't you just send the Brady bunch a nice fat check to show them how terribly supportive of them you are.

Last year they almost collected $250 whole dollars.

[wtmusic]

21. I sent Brady more than $250 last year so you're a bit off base.

But I do so because of arrogance/ignorance like that on display in your post. In fact, I'll send 'em another check right now in your name. :loveya:

"Ignored", wasn't it? :hi:

[DonP]

23. Great! You and SU, that's 2, only 4.499 million to go

[X_Digger]

24. Paul's been begging for $250,000... maybe you can help..

Helmke says Brady Campaign has a $250K budget shortfall

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x349614


Brady actually consists of at least three different entities, all of which are having problems.

http://www.bradycenter.org/xshare/pdf/annual-reports/current.pdf

The Brady Campaign is half a million dollars in the hole as of FY 2009 (see p.18 of the above pdf.)

The Brady Center lost $300,000 this past year (p. 18 again).

The Brady PAC has less than $10,000 on hand. (http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/lookup2.php?strID=C00113449&cycle=2010 )

eta: added italics

[friendly_iconoclast]

29. No, actually you didn't- unless your name is Michael Wolkowitz....

...or the Brady Campaign is hiding income from the Federal Election Commission.

So which is it?

http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/pacgave2.php?cycle=2010&cmte=C00113449

PACs
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence Contributors
Select a Cycle: 2010 2008 2006 2004 2002 2000 1998

Individual donors gave 1 large ($200+) contributions to this PAC in 2009-2010.


Contrib Occupation Date Amount
WOLKOWITZ, MICHAEL
HASTINGS-ON-HUDSON, NY 10706 MJM CREATIVE SERVICES, INC./PRODUCE 12/31/09 $2,500

METHODOLOGY: The numbers on this page are based on contributions from individuals giving $200 or more, as reported to the Federal Election Commission.

[PavePusher]

30. The Brady Bunch?

The group that's never seen a gun safety program they liked? The ones that have never in the history of their organisation run any firearms safety programs, evah? That Brady Bunch?

We're proud of you, really...

[friendly_iconoclast]

32. Yeah. That 'progressive' group that gave a whopping *$2,750* to Dems!

http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/pacgot.php?cycle=2010&cmte=C00113449

PACs
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence Contributions to Federal Candidates
Select a Cycle: 2010 2008 2006 2004 2002 2000 1998

House
Total to Democrats: $1,250
Total to Republicans: $0 Recipient Total
Connolly, Gerry (D-VA) $250
Hare, Phil (D-IL) $250
Kilroy, Mary Jo (D-OH) $250
Maffei, Dan (D-NY) $250
McMahon, Michael E (D-NY) $250
Senate
Total to Democrats: $1,500
Total to Republicans: $0 Recipient Total
Gillibrand, Kirsten (D-NY) $1,000
Merkley, Jeff (D-OR) $500

Can you say, "All hat and no cattle"?

[sharesunited]

37. You don't accept their premise. I do.

Public policy regarding guns should be to promote their overall inaccessibility to society at large.

Gun safety programs concede: The People Should Have Guns point.

I would fully support them for that position alone.

[oneshooter]

38. So, how much have you donated to them? n/t

[sharesunited]

39. A couple of hundred. Sorry I couldn't have sent more.

The human services and domestic animal and wildlife and environmental protection have to get their share.

OMG and the surgical charity.

And the political opinion board.

And the pastor.

So many to choose from. GIVE everybody!

[Katya Mullethov]

45. Damn that's inspiring

That makes me feel like sending Sarah a pack of Luckies .

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[PavePusher]

47. Uh.... what? n/t

[Straw Man]

42. Safety.

Gun safety programs concede: The People Should Have Guns point.

And safe-sex programs concede the "Teenagers Will Have Sex" point. But for some people, ideology trumps pragmatism. Sound familiar?

[X_Digger]

7. I always did..

That was one of the rules. My father told me that if I ever intentionally broke one of the rules, he'd break the gun over his knee, and that would be the end of that.

Rule 1. Never point the gun at anything you don't want to shoot.
Rule 2. Always assume that it's cocked/loaded, and keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot.
Rule 3. Always be safe- eye protection, and know what's behind what you're shooting at.
Rule 4. Safety on, until you are ready to shoot.
Rule 5. Never leave it laying around. It should be in your hand, on the bench, or in the rack.
Rule 6. Always clean up after yourself. No cans and / or targets laying around.

Those were fairly straightforward, even for a kid to understand. I had a 'shooting bag' that santa gave me the same year I got my first pellet rifle. It had two of those little cardboard tubes of bb's, a plastic container of pellets, a pack of paper targets, some thumbtacks, and a cast-off pair of my dad's safety glasses.

Those rules mirror fairly closely the rules that I teach new shooters-

The Four Cardinal Rules:
1. All guns are loaded. Treat any gun as loaded until you have verified yourself that it isn’t.
2. Never point a gun at something you’re not prepared to destroy.
3. Keep your finger straight and off the trigger until you’re ready to fire.
4. Be sure of your target and what is behind it.

Ancillary Rules:
5. Know your firearm. Be sure you understand how to load, unload, and check if a gun is loaded.
6. If a gun doesn’t fire when you pull the trigger, keep it pointed in a safe direction for 1 minute.
7. If a gun fires but the recoil feels ‘light’, stop immediately.
8. Store guns so they are not accessible to unauthorized persons.
9. Never hand a gun to another person without first checking that it is unloaded.
10. When someone hands a gun to you, refer to rule number one, even if you just saw them check it.
11. Never rely on a mechanical safety. The most important safety device sits squarely between your ears.

At the Range:
12. Wear eye and ear protection as appropriate.
13. Don’t load or unload your gun unless you’re at the firing line.
14. Listen to and follow all instruction by the range master.

[wtmusic]

8. You were lucky

You had a Dad who was responsible. I did too, and learned gun safety at an early age.

Most parents aren't - Ralphie's were case in point. That's why they are dangerous, and why Brady is not out of line with pointing it out

[X_Digger]

15. *hint* fictional parents in a story set in the 50's is not a sound basis for comparison to reality.

Do you have any stats to back up your "most parents aren't"?

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00039773.htm

From the article:

"An estimated 3.2 million nonpowder guns are sold in the United States each year;"

"Based on these reports, an estimated 47,137 (95% confidence interval {CI}=39,746-54,528) children and teenagers were treated for BB or pellet GSWs in hospital EDs during this period (an average of 23,600 per year or 65 per day)"

So 25,000 injuries per 3,200,000 sold equates to less than one percent of sales. (And that's not even counting the existing 'nonpowder guns' in people's hands. If we assume an average 'lifetime' of two years per gun, the stat drops to less than half of one percent.)

[Euromutt]

25. Your "case in point" consists of a work of fiction?

I would have thought it should be superfluous to point out that A Christmas Story is a work of fiction, and that the behavior of the characters is driven by the scriptwriter's need to drive the plot rather than based on how they would behave if they were real people. And it's set in the 1940s, and we've come some distance in Health & Safety since then.

[jazzhound]

43. Still waiting for you explanation regarding your lie

about the conclusion of the Kellermann "study":

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=334436#334468

[Callisto32]

46. On Danger

Anything that throws a projectile is potentially dangerous. So is anything with a sharp edge or that is massive, or that has a ledge from which you can fall. I have no problem with someone pointing ANY of that out. You should certainly teach children that fire is hot, knives are sharp, the stuff under the sink is poisonous and that firearms are dangerous. The problem is when groups go beyond that and being to advocate the ban of such things. Most tools are useful precisely because they can be classified as dangerous. A drill bit that can't put holes in something isn't very good at what it does. The same is true for a knife that cannot cut, or a hammer without sufficient mass to put the laws of inertia to work.

If the Brady Campaign was just saying "these things are dangerous, and people aren't educated about them, so we are spreading the word about just how dangerous they are and showing people how to be safe" I would be on here talking about how they are doing good work. Unfortunately, they are not. Instead they bitch and whine about the Eddie Eagle program, which is at least trying to do some basic education.

[Katya Mullethov]

13. Mine

My spawn had already seen what happened with Ralphie's first Red Ryder Round several times before they were old enough to shoot . having been hit by enough percussion cap bits ,lead spatter , and seen others get walloped by pistol range ricochets they certainly BELIEVE in the possibility . It took a few months , but they instinctively double up with foam -AND- muffs for anything center fire too .
?t=1291613554
The little tiny yellow plastic spitting airsoft is always used on paper for bedroom Mozambigue drills ,and I will admit,we never use anything for those as they are quite anemic .

Eyes and ears aside , trigger and muzzle discipline is our major concern . And they will pick a row of movie marquee posters apart too . They were quick to learn that everyone ,in every poster with a gun , every frickin time........ has their dick skinner on the trigger .

But maybe that's just my planet .

[spin]

36. When I allow my grandkids to shoot pellet guns at targets ...

I always have them wear safety glasses. My daughter would kill me if one of her kids lost their eye sight because I didn't enforce the same safety rules I used when I taught her how to shoot. I also wear safety glasses when I shoot pellet guns and of course firearms.

The pellet gun I shoot the most is a Beeman P1 Magnum in .177 caliber. It will fire a pellet at either 380 or 600 fps and is capable of amazing accuracy.

[damntexdem]

9. You could put your eye out.

hadda be said

[sharesunited]

10. Rejoicing in sightless children? Even Scrooge and the Grinch would disapprove of that.

[DonP]

16. No, you go blind from the soap in your mouth. not the BB gun.

That just cracked his glasses. Making him hold the soap in his mouth is what made him go blind.

[sharesunited]

17. I told you not to use LIFEBUOY!

The Brady Campaign has my full support.

[DonP]

19. So you're the one who sent the $20 last year! ntxt

[PavePusher]

31. See # 30. n/t

[Straw Man]

40. Rejoicing in sightless children?

But you're the one who said...

Public policy regarding guns should be to promote their overall inaccessibility to society at large.

Gun safety programs concede: The People Should Have Guns point.

So you would rather see more gun accidents occur than concede an ideological point. How very... reprehensible.

"Put your eye out, son. It's for a good cause."

[Ian David]

11. It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye.

[TheCowsCameHome]

12. Yup. You'd be "an Davd"

:hi:

[Ian David]

14. LOL! n/t

[Euromutt]

26. ...and then it's HILARIOUS! (n/t)

[ProgressiveProfessor]

20. Why is the Brady Bunch still with us and why would any sentient take them seriously?

[DonP]

22. One poster keeps sending them money - $250 last year alone he says

Considering their record of very few, if any, public donations, that might be an apocryphal comment, but at least there's one person. But another poster claims to "support them completely" - whatever that means.

[friendly_iconoclast]

33. Hell, I gave them $25 earlier this year after losing a bet.

[Euromutt]

27. I do seem to hear a distinct scraping sound coming from that barrel over there...

I mean, unless you want me to believe that the entire staff of the Brady Campaign was unaware of the existence of air guns up to this year, the only plausible explanation is that, up to now, they weren't concerned. And the only reason they're professing concern now is because they're fast running out of things to make dire prognostications about.

[X_Digger]

28. Especially considering the crime rate is still going down..

http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/fbi-data-shows-violent-782910.html

Tip of the hat to bemildred for posting this in LBN.

[Kennah]

34. And ...

... keep away from that turkey. You'll get worms.

[Euromutt]

35. And don't sit too close to the TV, don't swim right after eating...

...dress up warm or you'll catch a cold, don't touch that frog or it'll give you warts, masturbation will make you go blind/deaf/grow hairy palms.

We could go on all day.