Contested data stoke the debate over gun ban

[flaminlib]

Both friends, foes of renewing law say facts back them up

"Washington -- The two sides in the Senate debate over extending the decade-old ban on assault weapons are convinced of the bill's value -- and both think they have the numbers to prove it."



http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/04/19/MNGKU67AHL1.DTL



Just stirring the pot a bit....

This is my favorite excerpt:

"Craig had his own statistics, from the Justice Department, to prove his point.

"Before the semiautomatic-firearms ban, less than 2 percent of crimes in this country were semi-auto. After the ban, from 1997 and forward, less than 2 percent were. Same figure,'' he said."

Note that Feinstein didnt provide a source for her stats. A common tactic. When they say "Contested Data".. I wonder what Feinstein is referring to.

[Wubbman]

1. Feinstein's source...

Feinstein doesn't need a source! She knows everything! I don't understand why anyone would disagree with her. :'(

[flaminlib]

2. Me neither

"Feinstein doesn't need a source! She knows everything! I don't understand why anyone would disagree with her."


Yes, thats fairly common with some people.

[MrBenchley]

4. Say, wubbman...

Inasmuch as the story makes clear that Feinstein is referring to ATF data....I don't understand why anyone would slur a respected Democrat.

By the way, speaking of data, what did you find out about Larry Pratt and Ted Nugent?

[Wubbman]

5. Feinstein-respected?

You can respect who you want, Mr. B, but I'll never respect her. Read the AW post to find out about Nugent & Pratt.

[MrBenchley]

8. Yeah, she is respected...

Although pieces of shit like those asswipes cheering Cheney in Pittsburgh this weekend hate her.

"but I'll never respect her"
And the only thing you could find out about Nugent is that you didn't like the way he presented his rancid argument. Gotcha.

[Wubbman]

10. Oh please...

Thats not what I said about Nugent. Go back and read it again. I believe my exact words were something along the lines of "I wasn't interested in his argument (on immigration), but I felt he could have presented it in a much more civil fashion," or something like that.

[MrBenchley]

15. That's EXACTLY what you said...

[MrBenchley]

3. Gee, this is MY favorite part

flamin: "Note that Feinstein didnt provide a source for her stats. A common tactic."
From the story: "Feinstein has said the proof that her law has worked is that the percentage of assault weapons recovered at crime scenes dropped from 3.57 percent of the total in 1995 to 1.22 percent in 2002, according to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms figures. "

Myself, I wonder what "lib" thinks Larry Craig is a source of anything but horseshit? That's the same Larry Craig who iscalled "leader of the black helicopter caucus in Congress."

[flaminlib]

6. Woops

Ok, got me there. The source wasnt offered in the original statement.

However, is 1.2% or even 3.57% statistically signficant? Another way to phrase those statistics might be, In 7 years, the percent of weapons recovered at crime scenes that were not affected by the AWB rose from 96.43% to 98.8%.

Oh yeah, ill sleep better. Your tax dollars at work. I wonder how many cops could have been hired for all the money Feinstein alone has committed to this "invaluable" bill.

[MrBenchley]

12. Lots of flamin' but...

..which one is which?

today it's:
"Oh yeah, ill sleep better. Your tax dollars at work. I wonder how many cops could have been hired for all the money Feinstein alone has committed to this "invaluable" bill."

Sunday it was:
"flaminlib
128. Are you ok?
(me): "Kerry supports renewing strenghtening the AWB."
flamin: So do I, said it many times.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=51931

[flaminlib]

17. What is your point?

[MrBenchley]

19. Screamingly obvious

[flaminlib]

20. No point? The clock is ticking here.

I kinda thought so.

[MrBenchley]

21. A screamingly obvious point...

So tell us again how you support strengthening and renewing the AWB...as you claimed yesterday.

[RoeBear]

7. Now does that percentage...

..refer to the 1994 definition of an assault weapons? If so I would hardly be surprised that guns that weren't manufactured after 1994 would show up at less crime scenes. That hardly makes the law effective.

[OpSomBlood]

9. I was about to say the same thing...

Highly questionable statistic considering that the commonly-accepted definition of "assault weapon" was radically changed with the 1994 AWB.

[Dolomite]

11. Sigh - DiFi and her Kristillnacht gun control fantasies…

… will one day be the end of her political career.

"No gun anywhere in America has been confiscated from a legal owner because of this ban,'' Feinstein told the Senate.

And this statement is technically 100% accurate… when you replace the words “legal” with “living”, and “America” with “Waco, Texas”.

She’s all Janet Reno and shit - when she should be more like, say, Russ Feingold.

[MrBenchley]

13. Holy Koresh!!

Wow....there's a figure the voters identify with...the whacko from Waco.

[iverglas]

14. I'm not entirely sure

But I believe that someone just called a US Democratic legislator a Nazi.

Can someone confirm or deny for me?

.

[MrBenchley]

16. Not to mention a slur against Janet Reno

out of the blue...

But then this would be a pretty astonishing thread, even if it had appeared on Free Republic....you might not have realized, as I did not, that citing the ATF was making an unsupported argument.

[flaminlib]

18. You like that 2% reduction eh?