No Irish model for Palestinians

[barb162]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1695592,00.html

No Irish model for Palestinians

The pathology and psychology of Hamas are radically different to the IRA, writes Henry McDonald

Thursday January 26, 2006


Twenty-five years ago this month, Bobby Sands and his comrades were contemplating a fresh hunger strike aimed at restoring political status for republican inmates in the Maze prison. Their eventual decision to go on the fast resulted in Sands and nine other republicans (six IRA and three INLA prisoners) dying in the H-blocks.
In tandem with the prison protest, the Provisional republican movement began the first tentative steps towards involvement in electoral politics.

Previously, Sinn Féin had called for boycotts in Northern Ireland elections, both to Westminster and local government. But when Sands won a by-election - he was elected as MP for Fermanagh/South Tyrone prior to his death after 66 days on hunger strike - the republican leadership realised there was much to be gained by standing for elections in the north.

Thus began the twin track strategy of "Ballot Box and Armalite". By the end of the 1980s there were Sinn Féin chairmen of local district councils and ex-IRA prisoners sitting on committees administering the burial of the dead and the collection of rubbish. By the mid-1990s the Armalite was ditched and the strategy was now on a single track.

snip

[regnaD kciN]

1. That was fairly irrational...

It seems to boil down to the notion that the IRA wasn't as dangerous because it didn't engage in suicide bombings. The fact that they were quite ready to set off bombs where their own operatives didn't die (but with equally-fatal results to the targets) seems not to be the same to the author. The widows and orphans of those killed by each might beg to differ.

Of course, the fact that the author has to dredge up the usual Muslim stereotypes (they don't mind dying in suicide bombings because they they "get to have sex with dozens of virgins") only suggests to me that what we have here is the usual "clash of civilizations" claptrap.

[bemildred]

2. It's deeply irrational, and ignorant too.

There are differences and there are similarities.
The similarities are interesting and possibly telling.

And the dual political-military strategy is old as the hills,
to the point that you have to figure you are dealing with morons
when they won't pursue both tracks, although there are cases
as with the Allies in WWII where it is a deliberate strategic
decision to demand "unconditional surrender", or the 3rd Punic
War (and many colonial wars) where the goal was extermination.

And anybody that thinks that "terrorism" and ordinary military
operations are not much the same thing is ignorant of military
history in ways I cannot begin to remedy here. "Terrorism" is
just war without convention forces engagements in many respects.
The notion that civilian populations ought to be innocent bystanders
in war is a pleasant one, but it does not coincide with the
historical facts, and it has more to do with keeping the civilians
fat dumb and stupid while the big shots get the war going than
any actual concern for the welfare of the civilians.

[barb162]

3. No Geneva Convention back during those ol' Punic War days

Not that so many countries or the people on the ground think about the GC rules when they are in armed battle.

[bemildred]

6. Or in Kosovo, or Iraq, or the Occupied Territories.

Just to name a couple recent examples.

I defy anyone to show me a war anywhere in which
the Geneva Conventions have been scrupulously
adhered to. Where any informed civilian in his
right mind would voluntarily rely on their
protections for even a moment. But that is not
a matter of individual weakness, as you seem
to suggest, it is state policy and always has
been.

[barb162]

4. Maybe he is indicating that Hamas is far more extremist than

any of the Irish groups. "Hamas ... is all or nothing"

As to Muslim stereotypes, well we can't get into the minds of the suiciders, can we. However, I have seen enough videos of the suiciders reading off their statements before they go off on their suicide mission that to me at least there is a certain sick sameness to it all. Whether it rises to the level of stereotype is for each of us to determine.


Oh, and Um Nidal was elected....

http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=1536576

Mariam Farahat, who was elected to the Palestinian parliament, can work a crowd like a veteran politician — shaking hands and greeting supporters. When she gets on the stage at a Hamas rally, she is the star attraction. She was one of Hamas' most popular candidates in Wednesday's election.

In Gaza, Farahat is known as Um Nidal, or Mother of the Struggle — a mother who sent three of her six sons on Hamas suicide missions against Israeli targets. snip

[Coastie for Truth]

5. Something to think about - economic development of Palestine

First - I accept and support a two state solution with two viable, democratic states side by side - with sufficient aid to the Palestinian state to "jump start" a viable, democratic state.

Second - I accept the fact that the initial "seed money" for economic development will somehow be regarded as a "gift."

My fundamental question - does Hamas have the credibility in the money markets to attract investment in for-profit, entrepreneurial enterprises?

Remember - Ireland had that going for it.