Situation of human rights in the Occupied Palestinian Land - UN report

[Tom Joad]

Special Rapporteur on the situation of human rights in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, Professor John Dugard Universities of Leiden (Netherlands) and Pretoria (South Africa)

http://www.reliefweb.int/rw/RWB.NSF/db900SID/KHII-6QZ4AE?OpenDocument&rc=1&emid=ACOS-635PFR
<snip>
Gaza is under siege. Israel controls its airspace and has resumed sonic booms which terrorize and traumatize its people. The targeted killing of militants is on the increase. Inevitably, as in the past, such killings have resulted in the killing and wounding of innocent bystanders. Israel also controls Gaza's territorial sea and fires missiles into the territory from ships at sea. The no-go area along the border of Gaza has been extended to some 500-600 metres to enable the Israeli Defence Forces (IDF) to prevent the firing of Qassam rockets by Palestinian militants. IDF policy now allows it to fire shells up to 100 metres from civilian houses. Within Gaza, medical services have been seriously affected by the prohibition on the funding of medical equipment and medical supplies managed by the Hamas-led Palestinian Authority. The non-payment of salaries to Palestinian Authority employees has affected both hospitals and schools as employees cannot afford to travel to work. Unemployment and poverty are on the increase. After a long period of closure of the Karni commercial crossing, this crossing has been re-opened but it still processes only a limited number of trucks with the result that Gaza is still short of basic foodstuffs and is unable to export its produce.

Human rights violations in the West Bank have also intensified.

<snip>
There has been a sharp increase in the number of checkpoints in the West Bank since Hamas was elected to office. There are now over 500 checkpoints and roadblocks that make the travel of Palestinians within the West Bank itself virtually impossible.

<snip>

Israeli control over the Jordan Valley is intensifying. Settlements are expanding and life is being made intolerable for Palestinians in the area. Only Palestinians with Jordan Valley identity papers are allowed into the area and it is virtually impossible for such persons to leave the Jordan Valley.
More...

This is really an important docuement. Please read it.

[mike_c]

1. kick-- this is a heartbreaking report....

It's siege, starvation, and bombardment-- the classic way to exterminate a population.

[Tom Joad]

2. The purpose is to regulate Palestinians to as little land as possible,

then take the rest for Israel.
Manifest Destiny, Israel-style.

[DELUSIONAL]

4. Sort of like the US reservations for Native Americans

which was genocide.

As much as things change -- they stay the same.

Psychological Torture -- the aim of the Israeli leaders seems like they are trying to make life so miserable that the Palestinians will leave.

Both Israel and Palestine have a right to exist.

The US by aligning herself with Israel is putting the lives of the inmates of the US at risk.

Far better that the US become neutral and respond in a neutral way --

But as long as there are hard core Israel supporter -- the ones who ignore and excuse everything that the Israeli army and leaders do then Israel will continue to act like outlaws, and terrorists. (IF any other nations committed a fraction of the offense against their neighbors these same people would join the world in condemning the genocide.)

I just want to see children be allowed to be children -- no matter their race or where they were born. I want children to be able to play and to LIVE.

[Scorpio2000]

5. Hyperbole

"(IF any other nations committed a fraction of the offense against their neighbors these same people would join the world in condemning the genocide.)
"

The only thing the Israelis are guilty of is self defense. Negotiation doesn't seem to work with the Palestinians. It's been tried for nearly 40 years with the same result.
Arafat's response (intifada) to Camp David is a perfect example. What was his counter offer to Barak? Murder and Mayhem. Where did it get the Palestinian people?

If any other nation were attacked on a daily basis, they'd make short work of their aggressive neighbors and be done with it. The rules are always different when it comes to jews.
The real obscenity, is the micro-focus on israel, with accusations of genocide, when there are real genocides (Darfur) happening RIGHT NOW. Factually the population growth rate in Gaza is the highest in the world. Either the Israelis are very poor "genociders", or someone's making up fairy tales.
http://www.library.cornell.edu/colldev/mideast/gazpop.htm

[antonini]

6. Some odd concepts ...

"The only thing the Israelis are guilty of is self defense. Negotiation doesn't seem to work with the Palestinians. It's been tried for nearly 40 years with the same result."

Taking another nation's land by force, driving its inhabitants away in fear for their lives, and refusing to even pay them for the houses the invaders moved into is exactly the kind of "negotiation" American Indians were treated to.

It's very similar to white South Africa's various attempts to "negotiate" with the blacks to convince them to peacefully accept being dominated and abused.

There are other things Israelis are guilty of besides this strange "self-defense" -- like blatant violations of the UN charter and a raft of resolutions calling on them to leave territories they took by force. And that's only a start.

[Phx_Dem]

10. What do you suggest the Israelis do?

[mike_c]

7. Israeli's are always the first to play the race card...

...or ethnicity card or whatever you want to call it. I think just the opposite is true-- the world condemns Israel for it's shameful treatment of the Palestinians, but Israelis want to think that the "rules" really are different for them, that a history of being oppressed excuses their oppression of others. It doesn't. The rules aren't different for Israelis-- and you can jewish persecution complex because I don't give a rat's buttocks about it-- I mean, I'm an atheist, a multiculturalist-- which part of jewishness do you honestly think I might dislike? Or do you think the persecution of jews is just so deeply ingrained into us white european ancestor types that we do it reflexively, that we can't help ourselves?

That is precisely the mentality that leads one to call the brutal oppression of the Palestinians "self defense." Only somene responding to a persecution complex of pathological dimensions would warp the use of collective punishment, the rocketing of civilian crowds from gunship platforms, the use of children for sniper practice, or the deliberate isolation and starvation of people under siege as "self defense."

The truth is that Israelis (and their zionist predecessors) have done considerable injury to the Palestinians and they are rightfully angry about it. Peace is always attainable, even in situations like this one-- the problem is that one must always work for peace, and the price of peace includes giving justice to those harmed. Israel has done much injustice, and the price of peace would be steep, so Israelis prefer to prolong the oppression and injustice rather than face the cost of peace and justice.

[Scorpio2000]

8. Hamas is calling the shots for the Palestinians

"Israel has done much injustice, and the price of peace would be steep, so Israelis prefer to prolong the oppression and injustice rather than face the cost of peace and justice."

Very dramatic!
Do you honestly believe that:
"Israelis prefer to prolong the oppression and injustice rather than face the cost of peace and justice."

Where were you in 2000 when Barak was talking to Arafat? What was Arafat's counter offer?
I'll give you a hint: Intifada. 6 years of death and destruction.

Arafat knew that if he made peace with Israel that he would most certainly have been sent to meet his maker prematurely.
Since Hamas is calling the shots for the Palestinians, I don't think that peace with Israel is what Hamas intends.

[Tom Joad]

9. Old myths die hard. Myth # 1563-- Barak's "generous offer"

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=1113

<snip>
Locking in occupation

To understand what actually happened at Camp David, it's necessary to know that for many years the PLO has officially called for a two-state solution in which Israel would keep the 78 percent of the Palestine Mandate (as Britain's protectorate was called) that it has controlled since 1948, and a Palestinian state would be formed on the remaining 22 percent that Israel has occupied since the 1967 war (the West Bank, the Gaza Strip and East Jerusalem). Israel would withdraw completely from those lands, return to the pre-1967 borders and a resolution to the problem of the Palestinian refugees who were forced to flee their homes in 1948 would be negotiated between the two sides. Then, in exchange, the Palestinians would agree to recognize Israel (PLO Declaration, 12/7/88; PLO Negotiations Department).

Although some people describe Israel's Camp David proposal as practically a return to the 1967 borders, it was far from that. Under the plan, Israel would have withdrawn completely from the small Gaza Strip. But it would annex strategically important and highly valuable sections of the West Bank--while retaining "security control" over other parts--that would have made it impossible for the Palestinians to travel or trade freely within their own state without the permission of the Israeli government (Political Science Quarterly, 6/22/01; New York Times, 7/26/01; Report on Israeli Settlement in the Occupied Territories, 9-10/00; Robert Malley, New York Review of Books, 8/9/01).

The annexations and security arrangements would divide the West Bank into three disconnected cantons. In exchange for taking fertile West Bank lands that happen to contain most of the region’s scarce water aquifers, Israel offered to give up a piece of its own territory in the Negev Desert--about one-tenth the size of the land it would annex--including a former toxic waste dump.

Because of the geographic placement of Israel’s proposed West Bank annexations, Palestinians living in their new “independent state” would be forced to cross Israeli territory every time they traveled or shipped goods from one section of the West Bank to another, and Israel could close those routes at will. Israel would also retain a network of so-called “bypass roads” that would crisscross the Palestinian state while remaining sovereign Israeli territory, further dividing the West Bank.

More....

[Scorpio2000]

11. They do Indeed

"Old myths die hard. Myth # 1563-- Barak's "generous offer""

It doesn't matter what Barak's "generous" offer was. What matters is what Arafat's counter offer was.
We're still living with Arafat's generous counter offer. Aside from his slap in Bill Clinton's face.
(5000 plus dead and counting)

[Tom Joad]

14. The intifadah was not Arafat's choice. It was the response of a

oppressed people to a failed policy of Oslo, to conditions steadily worsening. Settlements expanded during Oslo. The number of checkpoints grew, the mobility of Palestinians grew worse.

In the first few months of that intifadah, it was the Israelis who were doing almost all the shooting, the Palestinians dying.

It started after Sharon's military escorted provocative visit to one of the holiest sites in the Muslim world.

The reason for the intifadah is the occupation. For those who may not know, it is Israel that is in a military occupation of Palestinian land, not the other way around.

[Scorpio2000]

15. Intifada does not mean "Peace"

"It started after Sharon's military escorted provocative visit to one of the holiest sites in the Muslim world."


Intifada is the antithesis of peace negotiations.

It's a myth that Sharon's visit "sparked" the intifada. Sharon cleared his visit with thw WAQF months in advance. They knew he was coming to the site to pray at the Western Wall during the Jewish Holy Days.

Sharon was also warned of an assassination attempt, hence the small army that accompanied him.
The Temple Mount is THE Holiest Jewish site. The Muslim claim is based on the interpretation of a dream "The Night Journey"

Sharon stated: 'The Temple Mount is in our hands and will remain in our hands. It is the holiest site in Judaism and it is the right of every Jew to visit the Temple Mount.'

As always, there's more to the story than just dramatic talking points.
http://www.eretzyisroel.org/~jkatz/alaksa.html

[Tom Joad]

23. Another "From Time Immemorial" believin' vanity website.

World Net Daily sponsored. Man, you really know how to pick the "progressive" websites, don't you.
Aren't you just a little embarrassed by that?

World Net Daily also thinks Ann Coulter is a hero.
Joan Peters too.

[Tom Joad]

24. No, intifadah means uprising.

Not surrendering to an unjust status quo.

I can imagine that people in positions of privilege find the whole concept very threatening.


"The spirit of resistance to government is so valuable on certain occasions, that I wish it to be always kept alive. It will often be exercised when wrong, but better so than not to be exercised at all. I like a little resistance now and then. It is like a storm in the atmosphere."

--Thomas Jefferson to Abigail Adams, 1787.

[Scorpio2000]

25. Intifada means "Eternal War"

"No, intifadah means uprising."

It also means "No negotiation"

[Tom Joad]

27. According to who?? WorldNetDaily?

[mike_c]

12. not the peace israel wants, certainly (if they want peace at all)....

The price of peace might be a significantly smaller or less powerful Israel, or perhaps no Israel at all. Frankly, I think the only just solution is a one-state solution in which Israelis and Palestinians accommodate one another's joint citizenship-- that would no longer be a "jewish state," but if a jewish state can only be maintained by apartheid and ethnic cleansing, then it will always be inherently unjust and peace will never be possible. So the problem that I see is not Hama's intractability but Israel's unilateralism and refusal to consider just alternatives to zionist domination.

on edit: as for Barak's "offer", I have asked numerous Israelis and Americans whether they would accept the diametrically opposed equivalent, i.e. something like Palestinian expansion into the original partition granted to Israel, or incursion of some other foreign occupation into their state or town. I ask you the same question-- would you accept such a generous offer? The universal answer is "Never!"

[Scorpio2000]

13. Things look pretty black and white to you, zero sum and all that

"The price of peace might be a significantly smaller or less powerful Israel, or perhaps no Israel at all. Frankly, I think the only just solution is a one-state solution in which Israelis and Palestinians accommodate one another's joint citizenship--"

There's always an other option (or two). Considering that Jordan already has 80% Palestinian population, the price of peace may indeed be a one state solution. Israel. Many "palestinians" already hold Jordanian passports. (or have you forgotten that other OCCUPATION?)

Being that there currently IS NO other Palestinian State. It's beginning to like like there won't ever be an independent "palestine". At least not with Hamas at the helm.
Let's give Abu Mazen a chance, he seems to be a bit more rational and pragmatic.

[mike_c]

16. that is such convoluted and self-serving logic....

There is currently no other Palestinian state because Israel seized land and drove Palestians off of it beyond their original mandate, because the arab states did not accept the original partition as it was imposed upon them anyway, and because Israel has continued to suppress the Palestinian refugees and their descendents in the West Bank, Gaza, and East Jerusalem. There is no Palestinian state because Israelis regard the minority of the Palestine Mandate outside their original usurption as their birthright and the Palestinians who already live there as pests. So you use the absence of an independent Palestinian state to justify Israel's continued oppression of the Palestinians, or its continued denial of their right to statehood within their own country? This is why there will never be peace in Israel. You cannot maintain a nation founded upon the principle of racist oppression without continual violence. And when Barak offered to kick them a little less while they were down in exchange for their recognition of Israel's right to kick them perpetually, you term that a "generous offer?" I ask you again, would you have accepted such an offer?

You condemn the intifada-- do you likewise condemn the zionist violence that produced the nakba? In their place, would you accept your oppression without resisting?

[Scorpio2000]

17. "Palestinians" accepted Jordanian and Egyptian Oppression w/o resisting

"There is currently no other Palestinian state because Israel seized land and drove Palestians off of it beyond their original mandate"

Pretty simplistic but emotive. Did you forget about the 1948 war?
There is no palestinian state, because Trans Jordan wanted a Pan-Arab State, and Syria was claiming "Southern Syria". Trans Jordan wanted Haifa for shipping oil from his neighbors to Europe (the Suex Canal hadn't been built yet).
Egypt didn't want to be left out of the land grab.
The net result was a loss of MORE territory for the "palestinians" and a 20 year brutal military occupation by Jordan and Egypt.

Had the partition been accepted, Israel would today be a Bantustan sitting along side an Arab Bantustan.

Had Trans Jordan, Syia and Egypt been successful, there would never be a "palestinian" state, as is evident during the 20 years that they OCCUPIED "palestinian" land.

[mike_c]

18. look, we can argue this all day long and we're going to get nowhere....

Not only do we see history differently, but we have different hopes for the future. That is apparently another reason why there will never be peace in Israel.

It is clear to both of us, I think, that the Palestine Mandate would not have continued as a British protectorate and that arab states and the zionists alike capitalized on that weakness. Maybe the Balfour Declaration itself doomed it-- I don't know. The zionists triumphed, but the real losers were not the arab states who wanted that land themselves, but the muslim semites who lived there already-- the people who have come to be known as "Palestinians." Israelis revile them, at least institutionally and in many instances personally. It shouldn't surprise anyone that neighboring arab states participated in the expansionist chicanery-- that's the sort of thing that happens when neocolonialist powers collapse (a lesson the United States should heed).

It also doesn't alter the current situation. It is not those states that occupy the West Bank, Gaza, and East Jerusalem today-- Israel is the oppressor now. Likewise, zionism is the force that set this whole tragedy in motion, back during the early nineteenth century. The Palestinians are under seige-- one can point fingers at Jordan, Egypt, and Syria for their roles in both the carving up of the Mandate and the injustices endured by the refugees-- and justifiably so-- but those roles have ended and were never really the impetus of the current injustices suffered by the Palestinians anyway. Had the Palestine Mandate collapsed without the zionist presence, I seriously doubt that the muslim population would have been displaced from their cities and villages to the extent that happened under Israeli violence-- they would not have been pushed into the refugee ghettos of Gaza and the West Bank. Most were not seeking an independent state in 1948-- I doubt that becoming citizens of Trans Jordan, Egypt, or Syria while continuing to tend their flocks and olive groves would have been nearly as egregious as being relegated to the squalor of the camps. The very notion of an independent Palestinian state is largely a response to zionist incursions into the Mandate. The treatment they received under arab occupation simply cannot be viewed outside the context of their status as refugees rather than as a self-sustaining population. Any future arab machinations will also occur within that context.

That's another reason why I believe a one state solution is the only viable solution for the Palestinians in the long term. A two state solution marginalizes them, just as the homelands concept marginalized black South Africans.

They do not deserve this injustice-- and the fact that they struggle against it does not make them deserve it any more. It has been said many times that there can be no peace without justice. The Palestinians are owed much justice, whether from Israel or from the pan arab states. If Israel wants peace it must begin to give them that justice. The Isrealis want to see complexity here, they want to say that this problem or that problem can't be fixed because it's connected to so many other problems, but there is less fundamental complexity than they imagine. If we can admit that many parties have wronged the Palestinians that is one thing-- but to withhold justice because others share the blame only exacerbates the crimes. And the Palestinians continue to not deserve the injustice being done to them.

Shalom.

[Scorpio2000]

19. There already is One State, and there's room for another

"A two state solution marginalizes them, just as the homelands concept marginalized black South Africans. "

A two state solution, means just that, two states living side by side in peace. S Africa was quite a different story, but bringing into the issue is a nice touch.

Are you saying that the "palestinians" aren't capable of running their own nation?
Why would the Palestinians be marginalized in their own nation?

[Jim Sagle]

20. No one cares what you think the price of peace is.

The peace of a one-state solution is the peace of the mass grave.

[Scorpio2000]

21. Uncle Hajj Amin al Husseini

There was NO state when the local Arab population was visitng pogroms on Palestinian Jews in the 1920s and 30s.
The majority of today's Arab states are Judenrein. That's where "One State" ultimately leads.

[Jim Sagle]

32. Which is the whole point. And everybody goddamn well knows it.

[mike_c]

22. no, it's the peace of Israel losing its beloved apartheid....

The peace Israelis fear more than any other-- a peace based on justice rather than oppression.

[Jim Sagle]

26. Justice would occur in short order if the Palestinian leaders would

just declare a state and start governing, and stop murdering Israeli civillians.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Scorpio2000]

29. Wishful thinking

Look what a stellar job they've done with Gaza. It's a veritable model for the world to follow.

[Jim Sagle]

30. Fuckin' A.

[pelsar]

35. and thats what is all about:...

but i shall add some info:
pre intifada II, during camp david, i was in the reserves in the westbank watching, amoung other things what was called "weddings" i.e. PA military maneuvers. We were briefed on what to expect if Camp David fails, they didnt know what the actual "spark"would be, but the scenario was precise...and Intifada II started off exactly as we were briefed...i.e. it was a planned operation from the start.

secondly, all through out intifada II when israel would pull back, the jihadnikim would fill in the gap, though not obvious to all, it was to us. Gaza is a larger more obvious example of that...and its precisly Gaza and the palestenian society that makes all the "one state solution" into the farce that it really is.

Unless of course one feels that persecuting gays, moral squads with guns is an acceptable society....some here seem to think so....

for anyone with open eyes (western liberal values), the present palestenian society of gaza is a failure.....a society based on warlords and fiefdoms....Even rafah has been closed down as an exit to egypt....(for some reason the europeans observers there believe israeli intelligence, when its their own skins at stake....)

yessir.....lets expand the gaza society and let more people under the "democratic" society repesentative of hamas...for this is where the far left meets the far religious right

of course where will the gays of "palestenians go"....they wont be able to escape to israel?...as will those couples that dare hold hands in public? (both have had their examples in gaza recently-the couple was dragged through the streets)

[Scorpio2000]

3. Exterminate is a strong word

Perhaps if the Israelis tried a different approach and asked the Palestinians to please stop firing Kassam and Katyusha missiles...

The Palestinians continue to create their own problems, exacerbate those problems and then complain about it.
Even Abbas doesn't think firing missiles is helping the situation.

"Meanwhile, Palestinian Authority Chairman Mahmoud Abbas called on militant groups to stop firing rockets against Israel, warning that they would be responsible for any Israeli retaliation."
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArtVty.jhtml?sw=abbas+kassam&itemNo=729131

[pelsar]

36. DAMN EGYPTIANS!

why arent they opening up RAFAH!...why do the limit the import and export?....why are they keeping the gazans in like "prisoners??

[Scorpio2000]

38. It's a crime against humanity

It's true. Gaza is a Concentration camp and the people of Gaza are being strangled....Palestinians are routinely stopped at CHECKPOINTS, they're travel is restricted etc...by Egypt and Gazans themselves.

[Scurrilous]

37. Palestinians in Jordan Valley feel strangled by Israel

<snip>

"Israel is cutting off Palestinians in the Jordan Valley from neighbouring villages and preventing access to vital sources of income in a bid to force them out, local villagers say.

The valley has served as Israel's western border and a major strategic asset since the Jewish state occupied the West Bank in 1967, allowing Israel to block weapons smuggling and prevent radical Islamists from infiltrating from Iraq and Iran.

But with the army applying strict travel restrictions through a network of checkpoints on all roads leading to the main hub of Nablus and nearby villages in the occupied West Bank, villagers in Al-Jiftlik feel strangled.

"Israel wants to cut off the Palestinians from all signs of life, especially from the commercial side," said Tamer Hamdan, a farmer who owns lands around the enclaved village and whose income depends on Nablus's market.

"They want to force us to leave our land by cutting our sources of living."

Thirty-five percent of Palestinian agricultural produce comes from the Jordan Valley, but Israeli restrictions mean farmers are often unable to reach the markets in Nablus and villages on time to sell their produce."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060622/wl_mideast_afp/mideastpolitics_060622155029