AIPAC, the Religious Right and American foreign policy

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

By Rodrigue Tremblay
Online Journal Guest Writer

http://onlinejournal.com/artman/publish/article_1135.shtml

Nobody can understand what's going on politically in the United States without being aware that a political coalition of major pro-Likud groups, pro-Israel neoconservative intellectuals and Christian Zionists is exerting a tremendously powerful influence on the American government and its policies.

Over time, this large pro-Israel Lobby, spearheaded by the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), has extended its comprehensive grasp over large segments of the U.S. government, including the vice president's office, the Pentagon and the State Department, besides controlling the legislative apparatus of Congress. It is being assisted in this task by powerful allies in the two main political parties, in major corporate media and by some richly financed so-called "think-tanks," such as the American Enterprise Institute, the Heritage Foundation, or the Washington Institute for Near East Policy .

AIPAC is the centerpiece of this coordinated system. For example, it keeps voting statistics on each congressional representative and senator, which are then transmitted to political donors to act accordingly. AIPAC also organizes regular all-expense-paid trips to Israel and meetings with Israeli ministers and personalities for congressmen and their staffs, and for other state and local American politicians. Not receiving this imprimatur is a major handicap for any ambitious American politician, even if he can rely on a personal fortune.

In Washington, in order to have a better access to decision makers, 'The Lobby' even has developed the habit of recruiting personnel for senators and House members' offices. And, when elections come, 'The Lobby' makes sure that lukewarm, independent-minded or dissenting politicians are punished and defeated. It is a source of such political power, campaign financing and media propaganda that no U.S. politician can dare ignore its demands without fear of being destroyed. As veteran columnist Robert Novak recently pointed out, thanks to the influence of AIPAC and 'The Lobby,' "Washington remains largely a bipartisan, criticism-free zone for Israel."...

[ChairmanAgnostic]

1. this too shall pass

no political structure, organization, bribed group of congresscritters, nor paraty survives forever.
AIPAC will be indicted, fined, or caught again stealing US secrets, and ultimately, the American people will shake off this horrific, destructive and illegal relationship.

[Poll_Blind]

7. I disagree. My understanding of AIPAC is not that it is a single...

...monolithic slab which can either be toppled or stand tall. AIPAC is more like a flock of birds, or a school of fish- it is the titular head of at least 100 sub-organizations all working together, all flying or swimming generally in the same direction. Moreso, the worst of AIPAC's behavior is least-represented, in my opinion, by those organizations, local American Jewish organizations working as constituents to promote as positive a relationship as is legally possible. There is nothing illegal in this model- the role of constituents in affecting governmental decisions is a powerful tool of the people.

  But while the above describes the majority of AIPAC, physically, as an organization there is another part of AIPAC which is far more important and which leverages the constituency which AIPAC is directly in touch with: the communications directly between the Israeli government (usually via the Israeli embassy) and AIPAC. This allows Israel to communicate directly to American constituents the Israeli "needs" so that the American constituents can directly press their representatives on the matter. Here is an actual example of such explicit messages received from American Jewish constituents, from Holocaust II?: Saving Israel from Suicide, containing excerpted portions of They Dare to Speak Out: People and Institutions Confront Israel's Lobby (italicized to differentiate):

In advance of Carter's decisions ot provide a high technology missile to Israel, a procession of Jewish groups came, one after another to say:

Please explain to us why the Pentagon is refusing to sell AIM 9-L missiles to Israel. Don't you know what this means? This missile is necessary so the Israelis will be able to shoot down the counterpart missile on the Mig 21 which carries the Eight Ball 935.

A former high-ranking official in security affairs cites the intimidating effect of this procession on career specialists:

When you have to explain your position day after day, week after week, to American Jewish groups- first, say, from Kansas City, then Chicago, then East Overshoe- you see what you are up against. These are people from different parts of the country, but they come in with the very same information, the same set of questions, the same criticism.

  They know what you have done even in private meetings. They will say, "Mr. Smith, we understand that in interagency meetings, you frequently take a hard line against technology transfers to Israel. We'd like you to explain yourself."

Jewish groups in turn press Capitol Hill into action:

We'll get letters from Congressmen: "We need an explanation. We're hearing from constituents that Israel's security is threatened by the refusal of the Pentagon to release the AIM 9-L missile. Please, Mr. Secretary, can you give me your rationale for the refusal?"

  AIPAC's most successful strategies are because of this direct communication with the Israeli government which, as you can see above, are able to feed AIPAC and its sub-organizations exactly what is needed so that the constituents can place pressure where appropriate.

  If AIPAC were to suffer some great political catastrophe and lose all credibility it would not affect the sub-organizations of constituents which actually, fiber by fiber, compose AIPAC's muscle. While I recommend organizations like Stop AIPAC, removing AIPAC from the scene, in my final analysis, would change very little. If AIPAC were to disappear overnight, the various sub-organizations which really provide the power (the constituents) would in no-way be touched and another organization to marshall their power would be created long before AIPAC, to use an airplane analogy, crashed.

  What, in my opinion, is important to focus on is the relationship between AIPAC (or whatever successor organizations spring up, should it lose political clout as an organization) and the Israeli government. There are arguable cases of AIPAC influence (again directed and initiated at the behest of the Israeli government) which are detrimental to the United States in a very real and measurable way. Again, from Holocaust II?: Saving Israel from Suicide:

The Lobby and the Jackson-Vanik Amendment

  It is also impossible to estimate the full damage to the American farm economy and long-term effects on the U.S. balance of trade by the passage, in 1974, of the so-called Jackson-Vanik Amendment to the 1974 Trade Act, which was sponsored by the Israeli partisans in Congress and pushed through by the Israeli Lobby.
  This law cut off Russians from Export-Import Bank financing and denied the most favored nation tariff treatment until emigration for Russian Jews was made easier and substantially increased in numbers.
  The Soviets reacted by sharply reducing the number of Jews allowed to leave and simply bought their wheat and other agricultural products from other countries.
  Nobody explained to the American farmer why he could not sell his wheat, or why the American taxpayer had to buy his surplus from him and store it at an enormous cost, or how this is related in any way to how many Jews emigrate from the Soviet Union."

  Examination of the influence of a foreign nation on American constituents to pursuede representatives to create legislation which is favorable to that foreign nation while detrimental to other American constituents is something ripe for further exploration and long overdue.

PB

[RethugAssKicker]

2. It was very obvious in the last 2 months during the Israel/Lebaneese

War. Not one congress person or Senator had anything negative to say
about Israel... That was proof of just how enormously powerful AIPAC is !

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

3. That was/is very telling of their immense influence.

[IndianaGreen]

8. What we have here is the conjunction of 3 forces, all for the bad

AIPAC has a legitimate mission, not unlike that of CANF (Cuban-American National Foundation), which is to remain alert to any developments that may impact relations between the US and Israel. As with CANF, that mission entails a rigid ideological orthodoxy. CANF opposes anything and anyone that calls for a change in the status quo in regards to US-Cuba relations. Anyone calling for normalization of relations and lifting of the embargo is immediately labeled as a "communist" or a "fellow traveler." This labeling is often accompanied by threats, harassment, and ostracism.

AIPAC opposes anything and anyone that calls for a change in the status quo in regards to US-Israel relations. Anyone calling for an end to the Occupation of Palestine and for a more balanced foreign policy in regards to Israel and her neighbors is immediately labeled an "enemy" of Israel or an "anti-Semite. This labeling is often accompanied by threats, harassment, and ostracism.

The difference between CANF and AIPAC, is that CANF is blinded by their total hatred of the Cuban government, while AIPAC is blinded by their irrational fear that failure to support 100-percent of what Israel does would lead to a new holocaust.

As to the Christian Right, they see Jews in the same way as that American general in Vietnam saw all Vietnamese, whom he referred to as "gooks." The general was quoted as saying that "inside every gook there was an American struggling to come out." The Christian Right version of this racist statement is "inside every Jew there is a Christian struggling to come out." If you don't believe me, just read what their apocalyptic beliefs say about Jews and Israel, in the end, there are no more Jews!

The neocons only care about power, and there is no power they love more than American imperial power. To them Israel is just a convenient proxy to advance their PNAC agenda in the Middle East.

[KoKo]

4. This is disturbing from the article: Office of Global Anti-Semitism...?

Set up in the US State Department, funded by taxpayer money? And, what is it they do with that money? Could they be capable of propaganda campaigns?



Quote from the Article:

Another example of the type of power 'The Lobby' carries these days in Washington, D.C., is its success in establishing within the State Department, with taxpayers' money, a special interest agency, called the 'Office of Global Anti-Semitism'. In a move reminiscent of what happened during past centuries under totalitarian regimes, this new 'agency' is totally devoted to monitoring around the world instances, among other things, of criticism of Israel or of American pro-Israel policies. The creation of this new department of Inquisition was mandated by a law, , that President George W. Bush signed on October 16, 2004. Who says that reality is not stranger than fiction!

[IndianaGreen]

5. The same espionage is being set up on college campus

any academic expression of opposition to Israel's policies, from faculty or students, is quickly reported as "anti-Semitic activity." From there, there but a short step to being labeled a "terrorist" supporter.

[Poll_Blind]

11. A well-known example of this is "CampusWatch", another tool used...

...to gather information and bully educational organizations to punish professors or to dissuade educational institutions from allowing certain speakers on campus based on their criticism of Israel.

PB

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

6. I suspect they spend their time compiling enemies lists...

...and devising ways/plans to punish/silence criticism of Israel and AIPAC.

[Poll_Blind]

10. Yes, and with the ability of the Israeli government to directly...

...communicate with its constituents and vice-versa (both via AIPAC), I am very interested to see what Gregg Rickman actually does within this position. Since the formation of the post there has been not a peep out of it, that I have been able to find anyway.

  It is worth the briefest note that the State Department fought the creation of this position but lost out to AIPAC, unsurprisingly.

  I sincerely hope that the creation of this post which, in effect, would allow the Bush Administration to formally opine (at least) or charge (at most) about whether or not a writing, publication, individual, group, or media in any form is anti-Semitic, would be put only to the noblest uses. However, experience with the administration indicates otherwise and I am concerned that it will become another tool to be abused by the administration toward it's own ends.

  Are we, as a nation, adequately prepared to defend against such a governmental organization if, or more likely, when it is misused at the hands of the Bush Administration? The neo-McCarthyism which flows from many administration-friendly media organizations, if adequately fed with the ammunition of charges of anti-Semitism, could be a much more effective and destructive tool than we have ever seen in regards to destroying public lives, careers, etc.

  Should this potential abuse come to pass and be exposed it arguably would create misguided resentment, anger or violence against American Jews, nearly the least responsible for it's actions.

PB

[KoKo]

14. I would wonder being of French/Irish/English Descent if a "Special Office"

could be instituted in the State Department for those who feel "French/Irish/English" descent aren't being discriminated agains...given that "Freedom Fries" has been a known trashing of the French and it's still being "Memed" out there by CNBC's Joe Kernan and that Bush refused to meet Irish rep of IRA, Jerry Adams and well...OMG...my English Heritage just does a :puke: with Tony Blair...(I had ancestors die over folks like Blair).

UGH! And I wonder how many other DU'ers who have a very different AMERICAN HERITAGE from me might be wondering why our Tax Dollars go to one particular American Group who seems to have a "lock" on heritage support. :shrug:

[Marrak]

15. Set up in the US State Department...

Like a state within State?
:wtf:

[KoKo]

16. You know that's a good point. Are we setting up "State Within a State"

with this bill which seems to support one American Group over all the others.

It's something that's worrysome...it seems to me..anyway. I thought growing up in my "Civic's Classes" than in AMERICA no group was above the law...no group within was to be declared a SUPREME above all others.

I guess I was taught wrong...that our US State Department would "ENDOW" one group "Rights above all others."

I guess the COLD WAR is just GOING ON...along with old Joe "McCarthy." :-(

This really isn't good for democracy. And as much as Bushies/NeoCon's support Democracy...doesn't "DEMOCRACY BEGINS AT HOME" ...like the old saying "CHARITY BEGINS AT HOME!"

Or, as I said, was I just taught wrong by teachers from Elementary School on through College? Did everything I learned in my life be PROVED WRONG? :shrug: (Including all the books I read about Democracy, too?)

[Marrak]

35. Also, just for thought

Israel, Preznit Bush, NeoConmen rationale: Hez'ballah: "a terrorist State with a State"

[Behind the Aegis]

9. what a paranoid bunch!

Some of these posts...:eyes: Geez! AIPAC is demonized as much as "Islamofacism." I find it morbidly fascinating how paranoid some here get. "AIPAC" has the same effect on some here that "terrorism" has on people at the other site (FR).

[ChairmanAgnostic]

12. justly so. AIPAC is evil. Israel is not. but, AIPAC is not Israel.

[KoKo]

17. Can you quote a "Demonization Post" on this thread. "Horns & Tails"

with "fire spitting out of their eyes and Hitler's Emblem on their Breast?"

Please...help me here. Where is the post on this thread that says what you say? If I said it, I will be the FIRST TO APOLOGIZE TO YOU!!!

Where? :shrug:

[Behind the Aegis]

30. Sure...

"Are we setting up "State Within a State" with this bill which seems to support one American Group over all the others." post 16

"I would wonder being of French/Irish/English Descent if a "Special Office"
could be instituted in the State Department for those who feel "French/Irish/English" descent aren't being discriminated agains...given that "Freedom Fries" has been a known trashing of the French and it's still being "Memed" out there by CNBC's Joe Kernan and that Bush refused to meet Irish rep of IRA, Jerry Adams and well...OMG...my English Heritage just does a with Tony Blair...(I had ancestors die over folks like Blair).

UGH! And I wonder how many other DU'ers who have a very different AMERICAN HERITAGE from me might be wondering why our Tax Dollars go to one particular American Group who seems to have a "lock" on heritage support." post 14

Basically both posts are examples of 'special powers' of AIPAC by being able to have a special office created. The second post is offensive because it minimizes anti-Semitism. When is the last time a French person or some of French heritage was GUNNED DOWN for BEING French?! When was the last time a march was planned to march in honor of a man who systematically murdered half of the population of France?! With the rare exception, and usually only in cities with high populations, do we ever see discrimination against people for being Irish!

This special office you are so insulted and disturbed by, do you know anything about it? Do you know it was to be established, but I couldn't find anything that suggests this has happened. Are you even familiar with the HR measure that was introduced to discuss this issue? I doubt it. So, here are some links to read: H. R. 4230, H. R. 4230(this is a PDF, so you have to Adobe Acrobat to read it...if you need help accessing it, let me know), and finally, H.R. 4230. Do notice that there is only one mention of Israel!

Why is combating anti-Semitism so offensive? Though I would personally like an office that dealt with all "-isms" and "-phobias," I doubt we are going to get that anytime soon. I am quite familiar with the FBI hate crime stats and anti-Semitism is, indeed, a real problem in this country. Despite a slight dip last year, anti-Semitism is at an all time high in this country and throughout the world. This "office" is not about propaganda, it is about tracking and combating anti-Semitism in its many forms. So I ask again, why is that offensive?

[KoKo]

32. You don't think Irish were persecuted? Or, French slurred in the US today

for not joining Bush's coalition? Do you know what Irish went through in America without a special bill or special group in the US State Department addressing the slander and prejudice they encountered when they came here? What about "Freedom Fries" and every time I turn on CNBC or CNN they are laughing at the French. Just yesterday former REP Dick Armey was on C-Span saying the French wouldn't fight for themselves during WWII (he failed to mention the "French Underground/Resistance" who gave US and Brits great intelligence and locations for where to send the paratroopers in during WWII.

I can't defend my Brit heritage. Many of my anscestors were persecuted and sent into Tower of London for one reason or the other. But prejudice can everywhere for all groups and it's getting worse with the O'Lielly's and Coulters fueling it along with Limbaugh. Aside from our African-Americans who were brought here against their will...I can't see suddenly creating a whole group who will work on looking for "Anti-Semiticsm," with all our tax dollars. :shrug:

BTW...I didn't see in the examples you gave any "essense of Nazism" either. Thanks for the links to the bills, though. I do have PDF and will check out.

[Behind the Aegis]

36. You have got to be kidding me?!

"You don't think Irish were persecuted?" I said as much in my post! Discrimination against the Irish is well documented in this country. Outside of a bar fight in South Boston, when have you read anything like: "Irish man beaten to death for being Irish?" When have you heard, "No Irish need apply" recently? As for the "slander" of "freedom" fries...give me a break! :eyes: If that is the worst that the French-Americans are going through...well, as wrong-minded as it is...it still isn't what Jews are facing in this country!

I still fail to see how you can't see this creation as a positive thing. As I have already said, a more inclusive group would have been nice, but tracking and combating anti-Semitism is still very important. You don't seem to think it is all that important though. We have already had one Jew gunned down, are more deaths needed? More violence? What? Do you really not know the type of discrimination that Jews face in this country? If you don't, I will be more than happy to point you in the direction to educate on the issue of anti-Semitism in this country.

"BTW...I didn't see in the examples you gave any "essense of Nazism" either." Well, I never claimed there was, that was you. Besides, what is the "essence of Nazism," anyway? Are you saying that someone has to act like a Nazi before it is serious enough to take notice?

[KoKo]

38. That you don't know the History of Irish in America speaks more to your

ignorance than your "Passion" for your cause.

I find your post really offensive. You think YOU are the only group who has ever been persecuted? You know NOTHING...of IRISH AMERICANS and the IRISH IN GREAT BRITAIN...to say such a DEMEANING THING out here on this Board.

It's really too disgusting....SHAME ON YOU!~!!! SHAME!!!

[ShawnGreen]

39. How Many Irish Did Britain Kill?

I want to be informed?


How many Jews did the National Socialists and their allies kill?

[KoKo]

40. Huh? Do your own search of this.. you want ME to do it for your ignorance

of history? :rofl: Not falling for that old one.

If you don't know what the Irish have suffered then do your OWN RESEARCH...FGS! What...? you think I will do it for you? You want me to discuss the whole history of the World in the last 500 years so you can do another "Carp and Snipe" post?

If you don't know then you are as ignorant of History, as I thought. Go to a used books store and pick up a book. ANY BOOk would probably give you a "Primary Read" to come back here and discuss.

[ShawnGreen]

42. "you want ME to do it for your ignorance"

I come here to learn. Not to trade insults. As far as being ignorant I thought there were no such things as stupid questions but only stupid answers.


I found a link to hate groups in America. I think it's a reliable source. I wonder how many of them are targeting the Irish:




http://www.splcenter.org/intel/map/hate.jsp

[KoKo]

44. Good for YOU...you found a link to "Hate Groups in America" you are

learning...here's another: http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2004_05_02_dneiwert_archive.html

A great site for those who want some news about HATE GROUPS in AMERICA.

He's a really nice and well informed person...which may or may not matter to you...but it does to me. Lots of good links on that site if you REALLY want to know about "Hate Groups" that aren't your OWN Pet Project...

Enjoy...and Peace to You! Check it out.....

[ShawnGreen]

45. It Seems Like An Intersesting Site

I will bookmark it and read it later.

But I thought we were discussing anti-semitism as well as anti-Irish sentiments in America and abroad. Despite your assertions that I am historically illiterate I am somewhat aware of the travails faced by the Irish including the Great Famine and anti-Irish sentiment in this country, especially in the late nineteenth and early twenttieth century.


I oppose bigotry in any form whether the target be a hapless Jew in France who was beat up by Muslim toughs, a Muslim who is singled out for profiling in a Heathrow airport, or Gwen Araujo , a transgendered teenager who was killed by some sexually confused young men.

I don't know why you have a big problem with an Office Of Anti-Semitism. If as a result of that office one person is spared from feeling the sting of bigotry which can be quite real, I think it's a good thing.

[KoKo]

48. Basically because it segments one group out over another as worthy

of having it's own Office in our Government payed by my and yours and others taxpayers dollars to support one group, only. The targests of "anti-semiticsm."

They have a budget and will use the money to send "Talking Points Memo's" to all our media. The groups that support his "Office/State within a State" will send their advocates from the Think Tanks onto C-Span and the Pundit shows all hawking that "Anti-Semiticsm" is on the Rise in America.

I don't see anyone covering other hate groups that are rearing their ugly head in America. Look at George "Maccaca" Allen whose own mother is reported French, Tunisian and Jewish. He ran around California with a Confederate flag on his lapel...he did vandalism at the CA College he attended which is reported to be racist.. THIS IS THE FACE OF THE REPUGS!

Put a Group into the US State Department funded by Taxpayer dollars that will rout out "Anti-Semiticsm." You think a well funded GROUP isn't going to see Anti-Semiticsm under every rock and moss pile...with all that funding from us Taxpayers? When did the Repugs/Bushies ever turn down an opportunity to increase funding for any Big Government Program...which includes putting one group ahead of another on their list of "Preferences."

:shrug: that's what I'm talking about and what the article from the Original Poster was talking about. At least that was my drift of a read of the "original" article.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

50. delete

[KoKo]

46. Here's another one very current after you finish with Orcinus's History:

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:a7QUoSd-ZPQJ:www.blackjournalism.com/hate.htm+Groups+fighting+Hate+in+America,+Southern+Poverty+Law+Center&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=6

[Behind the Aegis]

49. Again, you have got to be kidding me!?

Twice now, I have said that the Irish have faced discrimination in this country. However, with the exception of some small, isolated events, anti-Irish sentiment is almost unheard of in the US.

The only ignorance being displayed is your own. It is to your shame that you continue to minimize and deride anti-Semitism because of your "disgust" with Israel, that says much about you, as well. I have never said, or even indicated that Jews are the only ones that are persecuted in this country and around the world. The fact that you even launch a strawman like that at me is offensive.

I know quite a bit about a variety of discrimination from recent to the past. I had the good fortune to have some descent educators over the years. It is also a shame that you are so engrossed with your own issues that you didn't bother to read my posts clearly or you chose not to take the post in its entirety.

[Tom Joad]

20. I actually agree that people make AIPAC out to be more than it is

Sometimes people ascribe almost mystical powers to it. It has no special powers at all, it is a simple, human, well organized institution.

I do think anyone who values a foreign policy of peace and justice would oppose it, because it is opposite the extremist agenda of AIPAC (AIPAC takes positions that are more extreme and anti-Palestinian than even feels comfortable for Bush, and certainly many organizations like Brit Tzedek v'Shalom ) It is extremist, no doubt about that.

I'm not into calling people or organizations "evil". Such a Bush-like worldview i reject.

I will do all i can to organize against all lobbies that promote militarism, racism and policies that are detrimental to our planet and its peaceful existence. if aipac wants to organize for militaristic policies, people have the right to openly oppose them, to let politicians know that we want a better foreign policy.

Look at what happened to the National Rifle Assoc. Politicians used to line up to be associated with it. Now, that is not always the case, because of people organizing for sensible gun laws, not all politicians want to be associated with it, and many (though not all) distance themselves from it.

[maalak]

13. Hezbollah = good, AIPAC = evil

does that pretty much sum up the general sentiment here at DU?

[KoKo]

18. Why would you say that? Do you realize how many of us are "Questioning?

Folks, like me, trying to get a grip on what's going on?

Don't you think that some of us DU'ers coming down here to "I/P Forum" are really seeking answers to what happened in Lebanon?

I'm one who is trying to figure this all out...hoping for "honest discussion." :shrug: Why do you go on the "attack" about this?

[Marrak]

23. Some people...

rely on truthiness...but don't pay 'em no heed! Keep digging...it'll blow your mind. But ultimately, hopefully, the thing you'll realize is we need an even-handed approach or this tinderbox will ignite the whole Mideast. The U.S. is the power, Israel is the ally, and we will have to re-establish that fact. With Israel. And, the tough part is the World will have to recognize that. so imagine the custer bombs from the U.S. adding to the cluster-fuck we've blazenly, and blindly marched into. We are in the credibility hole now, and require a new policy direction away from the brink. When I think about this summer's new war and the herky-jerky ADD man in the whitehouse...well, we've got a ways to go.

[KoKo]

24. What I know is that Carter and Clinton seemed to try with Peace Accords

and what (seemed to most Americans) honest "peace brokering efforts" in the ME to try to get Israel to deal with the Palestinian tinderbox. It seemed Reagan has so much support he didn't have to do much because all was cool..Poppy went and invaded Iraq to undo the mess he's made there when Saddam invaded Kuwait...and Clinton tried to broker peace again...following Carter..but by then the "cow was outta the barn" and the NeoCons were working behind the scenes to get their agenda on the FRONT PAGE while other dogs of SCANDAL were nipping on Clinton's heels and Penis. So...whatevr Clinton did is considered by the "Current History" was bad..."Failed to Get Osama, Failed to bring Peace to ME, Failed this/Failed that ...hell, I don't even like him much as a Rep of the Dem Party anymore...but he NEVER DESERVED the TRASHING HE GOT! He did try to do another "Camp David Peace Mission" and DEMS did learn from VIETNAM that DIPLOMACY OVER WAR is better than WAR!!!

So...I hear what you say...understand it..but there's time now that things are so dire and out of control that some new strategy must take hold. REPUGS/NEOCONS hate "Peace Initiatives." We have two more years of the "Idiot" and his puppetmasters.

How will we survive this? And, I'm telling you this DU'er had enough with Iraq Invasion and to go into IRAN!!!!!! CODE RED ALERT. WHY SHOULD WE DO THIS?

[maalak]

26. why? look at post #12

there certainly are a few that seem interested in getting a grip on what's going on... but far more seem to treat AIPAC like a modern-day version of the "Elders of Zion"...

[ShawnGreen]

43. Maybe He Learned From You

"I'm one who is trying to figure this all out...hoping for "honest discussion." Why do you go on the "attack" about this?"


I asked you question about Ireland and Great Britain and you called me ignorant, twice.

[Tom Joad]

21. Simplistic statements are sometimes preferred. I offer yours as

a case in point.

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[maalak]

25. lol... so because i support Israel, i'm a "spy" and member of Likud?

thanks for proving my point... it seems like democrats who also support Israel are increasingly unwelcome here.

[CrushTheDLC]

28. Democrats are always welcome here

Whether they be Jew, Christian, Muslim, Atheist, Hindu, or whatever. Infiltrators from other RIGHT WING websites who exist only to brand others as "anti semites" are NOT.

[maalak]

29. i haven't branded anyone an anti-semite and i came here from DailyKos...

...after reading about the rhetoric going on here, i found it hard to believe the tone that was taking place over there and was told it was even worse here.

sadly, i haven't found that to be too far off the mark. :|

[IntiRaymi]

31. Well, color me disobedient!

How exactly should we think, oh wise one?
So sorry to have disappointed you!!

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

33. If you disagree with all or some of the...

...author's points or claims in the piece referenced in the OP, why not articulate a counter argument to those points or claims, rather than just make a meaningless declaration of your disapproval of "the tone."

[maalak]

34. in talking about the "tone" i was responding to the accusation...

that i was a "spy" who was both a member of Likud and an infiltrator from a right-wing web site....

[IntiRaymi]

27. False choices, red herrings.

As usual.

[Tom Joad]

19. Check this out for the peace and justice alternative to AIPAC

http://www.endtheoccupation.org/
The people shall lead us away from militarism that AIPAC and its assorted groups espouse.

And check this out too.
http://www.stopaipac.org

[Marrak]

37. If Americans only knew!

This is right on target!
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNQv5YSg_YA>:patriot:

[KoKo]

41. Does anyone remember this article is about AIPAC and their Influence

on American Foreign Policy? What about that...is the article valid or not?

:shrug:

I'm guilty of getting "sidetracked, too." The issue is the ARTICLE!

[Marrak]

47. Jimmy Carter has a new...

book due out in Nov 2006: Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid
:dem: :kick: :patriot: