Family home in Al Funduq to be demolished in three days

[Tom Joad]

http://www.iwps-pal.org/en/articles/article.php?id=1081

A family in Al Funduq (in the West Bank) had a demolition order delivered to their home while both were at work yesterday, 16th May. The paper was left on the door. It was the third final order and it left them three days to leave before destruction of their home.

The man, 29 years old is a worker for the Red Crescent Society. The woman, 25 years old, is a school-teacher. They have two children, four years and 8 months old. The house, which had been built for them to move in after their wedding, is 150 square meters and an approximate value of NIS 180,000 or USD $45,350.

The house has been under threat of demolition since February 2006, when the first demolition order was delivered. The second demolition
order followed in May 2006. Each time, the family has retained an attorney in an attempt to appeal against the demolition. They paid out approximately NIS 12,000 or USD $3020 USD to the lawyers and nothing was achieved. The order which had been left by Israeli soldiers on the door of their house yesterday, the family retained a third lawyer for NIS 7,940 or USD $2000.

Last year, one of the man’s brothers had his home demolished (see IWPS HR Report No. 279) nearby to this house. The reason given then was lack of a permit to build. Reasons given for this year’s slated demolition is also lack of a permit to build. The family has a deed to the property dated from 1964.

[breakaleg]

1. Outrageous. nt

[damntexdem]

2. The Trail of Tears redux.

[Shaktimaan]

3. My favorite part of the article.

Report written by: Sue

That's it. "Sue."

At least now I know where you're getting your news, Tom. From Sue.

[Lurking Dem]

4. Priceless.

:rofl:

[Violet_Crumble]

6. So are you disputing this home is going to be demolished?

Or are things like home demolitions just so far less important to you than pointing out that someone's name is Sue? If you have anything to suggest that this report isn't accurate, feel free to share it, but if you don't, maybe you'd like to comment on the actual report itself?

[Tom Joad]

9. Now if i had an article from someone from World Net Daily, they would be impressed.

go figure.

[oberliner]

More details needed

I'd be curious to know who built this house and why did they not acquire a permit before doing so. Wasn't this family concerned about moving into a house that they knew was built illegally. They must have suspected (from their brother's experience) that they'd be faced with this situation as a result.

Also, the piece states that "nothing was achieved" in spite of the money paid to lawyers. I'd be interested in finding out more specifics about that experience as well.

[Tom Joad]

21. I want to see if the home is saved myself. I will try to get a follow-up.

[msmcghee]

39. I guess that report wan't too acurate after all . .

. . this being ten days since it was written and no reports so far of any demolition there.

[barb162]

5. I wish the article had described what the lawyers had to say

In my municipality, you can have a deed to property for a hundred years. But if you don't have a permit to build on the property and you try to build, you are in serious trouble; the city would stop you dead in your tracks. I wonder if they tried to get a permit in the first place.

[breakaleg]

7. Really? So, what if you are a settler and you build a structure without a permit, even on land you

don't even happen to own? Would that place be torn down?

Give me a break.

[barb162]

14. Seems to me you're trying to make this into a political argument

when the article indicates it's a zoning law problem.

[Tom Joad]

10. Are you able to participate in elections in your municipality?

This is in the West Bank. These Palestinians haven't the slightest input into who decides who gets permits or who does not get permits.

If Israel is going to make such decisions, then Palestinians in the West Bank should have a say as to who runs Israel. Otherwise they should be left alone.

[UndertheOcean]

11. I don't see the IDF apologists replying your point..

probably because they have no response.

[Shaktimaan]

12. Or perhaps because

Tom seldom has any of his facts in order and we tire of pointing out every single piece of untrue propaganda that he posts all the time. Don't we deserve a break occasionally?

In this case, Tom asserts that the Palestinians have no authority regarding building permits. This is true in areas of the West Bank run by Israel. But 98% of West Bank Palestinians are living in areas entirely under the control of the Palestinian Authority, who do get to decide how to allocate building permits anywhere in their jurisdiction. And contrary to what Tom thinks, the Palestinians do hold elections to determine which civil servants will be representing them.

As far as their getting left alone by Israel, the way it works Tom, is that after you start and subsequently lose a war, (or several wars in this case), you are expected to then stop fighting. Israel is unable to leave the Palestinians alone until the Palestinians leave them alone. It will get increasingly worse for the average Palestinian as Israel slowly tightens its security, cutting off jobs and opportunities for these poor people, until the Palestinians decide that they would rather have a nice, peaceful, functioning society over a shitty, corrupt, dangerous society that clings mindlessly to its insistence on perpetual war with Israel. Perpetual war has consequences. And as a democracy they are responsible for the leaders they elect.

[Violet_Crumble]

13. That's a Pot Kettle Black moment...

In this case, Tom asserts that the Palestinians have no authority regarding building permits. This is true in areas of the West Bank run by Israel. But 98% of West Bank Palestinians are living in areas entirely under the control of the Palestinian Authority, who do get to decide how to allocate building permits anywhere in their jurisdiction.

Hold on. I remember you trying to claim that Israel had withdrawn from the West Bank during the Oslo period, and when I corrected you and told you that the withdrawal was confined to a very small part of the West Bank, you claimed you hadn't gotten yr claim wrong because people should know that when you said Israel withdrew from the West Bank, you actually meant Israel only withdrew from a small section of the West Bank. So why are you now bailing up Tom for something similar?

btw, I tried to locate any map that shows 98% of the West Bank not being under Israeli control. I couldn't find anything and I looked through both books and googled my little heart out, so where did you come up with that 98% figure from?

[Behind the Aegis]

17. Looking for the wrong thing.

VC: "btw, I tried to locate any map that shows 98% of the West Bank not being under Israeli control. I couldn't find anything and I looked through both books and googled my little heart out, so where did you come up with that 98% figure from?"

S: "But 98% of West Bank Palestinians are living in areas entirely under the control of the Palestinian Authority, who do get to decide how to allocate building permits anywhere in their jurisdiction."

Shaktimaan said "98% of West Bank Palestinians" are living under Palestinian control, not that the West Bank, as a land mass, was 98% under Palestinian rule.

Hope that helps. ;)

[Violet_Crumble]

27. Thanks for that. My slightly revised question for Shakti is this:

I can't find anything that says that 98% of West Bank Palestinians are living in areas entirely under the control of the Palestinian Authority, and I'd like to know where Shakti came up with that 98% figure from...

[Tom Joad]

23. What kind of security are Palestinians allowed? None,it seems, when their homes are demolished

at the whim of an occupation army.

Why does Israel see this family as a threat?
Why punish this family?

Why must the Israeli regime continue its campaign of terror?

[Shaktimaan]

24. So then,

requiring that Palestinians follow the law is terrorism? Yet firing rockets at Israeli schools in an attempt to massacre children is "self-defense?"

[Tom Joad]

25. follow the law? Under a system in which they have no voice?

Under a system where they are denied things like building permits?

Yes, demolishing a family home is a form of terrorism. You may not understand that if you do not have a family, or if you have multiple homes, but yes, it is a very much an act of violence directed toward civilians.

"Firing rockets at Israeli schools in an attempt to massacre children is "self-defense?"

Who said that targeting civilians was a form of "self-defense"? Did you say that?

[barb162]

15. Maybe this question can be answered by checking if other

Palestinians have built houses WITH permits in the area. And by checking what the lawyers had to say as I indicated in my first post.

[Tom Joad]

8. Apartheid. Not just a word, but real fact. These are Israeli military

unelected, unaccountable by the people under military occupation, telling a family that they can't build, they can't stay in their home.

[barb162]

18. Zoning law violation are real facts too.. Not just words, but real facts

[Tom Joad]

19. Barb, why does Israel decide for the West Bank? Why is Israel the enforcer

shouldn't the Palestinian authorities be making these decisions?

It might be one thing for Israel to do this for a Arab village in Israel (at least the residents are granted Israeli citizenship, and have a vote) but this is the west bank... no vote over those who rule over them.

Like South Africa.

[sabbat hunter]

22. why didnt they get a building permit?

i knwo that if i tried to build a home here NYC without a permit, i would be ordered to destroy it, face fines, possible jail.

why didnt they get a permit. now if you tell me they tried to get a permit but were denied by the israelis i would be agaisnt the removal of the house, but if they just failed to do so, that is their own fault.

[Tom Joad]

26. They don't live in Israel, why does Israel have jurisdiction over the West Bank?

Do you seriously believe the occupation army is fair in its distribution of building permits?
I am not sure in this specific case, but in many instances Palestinians are denied permits. It is just put on hold or denied outright.

Now, if you were denied a permit by NY City, you might also be pissed, you might think it was unfair, but at least, theoretically, you know you have some voice in the city administrators, that they could also be accountable to you.

So it is something like taxation without representation here (which was a main reason for the violent intifadah against the British here).

[oberliner]

16. This is not an article

It is a press release (or action alert) from a partisan organization.

More valuable would be a true investigative piece that included interviews with someone from the Israeli government discussing the building permit process in general and the circumstances involved in this case in particular.

That information could be presented alongside interviews with this family describing their perspective on the situation.

Readers could then draw their own conclusions and take whatever action they deem appropriate.

[barb162]

20. I emailed this group and asked them for some more info

a few hours ago, such as did this family apply for a permit, were they rejected, what reason(s) were given, could the appropriate zoning ordinances be supplied, etc.

[Violet_Crumble]

28. Information on home demolitions in the West Bank...

From BTselem:

'Over the past three decades of occupation, Israel has employed in the West Bank a policy of planning, development, and building that severely restricts construction by Palestinians, while allocating broad expanses of land to establish and expand Jewish settlements. In this way, Israel has created a situation in which thousands of Palestinians are unable to obtain permits to build on their land, and are compelled to build without a permit because they have no other way to provide shelter for their families.
Israel froze planning in Palestinian towns and villages. The existing planning schemes, which date back fifty years and more, serve as the basis for approval - more often rejection - of applications for building permits. Land registration has been frozen for thirty years, making it easy to deny applications for permits on the grounds of failure to prove ownership of the land. Israel administers the building authorities, which have no Palestinian representation. A Palestinian wanting to obtain a building permit to build on his land in Area C must undergo a prolonged, complicated, and expensive procedure, which generally results in denial of the application.

In this situation, and with no option, many Palestinians are compelled to build without a permit. The construction is not a political act or an act of protest. Rather, the construction is the only way left to them to provide housing for themselves and their families.

Rather than change this situation, Israel has adopted a policy of mass demolition of Palestinian houses. In the past ten years, the authorities have demolished more than 2,200 residences, leaving more than 13,000 Palestinians homeless. This policy continues today in Area C.

At the same time, at least 155 Israeli settlements, containing more than 170,000 Jewish Israeli citizens, have been established. These settlements benefit from an efficient system of planning and supervision of construction, and establishment of comprehensive planning schemes for all the settlements. Despite this, thousands of houses were built in these settlements without permits. Israel refrained from demolishing these houses, and instead issued retroactive building permits for thousand of houses constructed without permits. This building-permit policy blatantly discriminates between settlers and Palestinians.

Planning and building is a purely civilian matter. The military authorities have the right to intervene in planning and building only where patently military matters are involved. Conversely, individuals have a basic right to be involved in determining the future of their surroundings, including the right to elect and direct the planning and building authorities, and occupation cannot justify denial of this right.'

http://www.btselem.org/English/Planning%5Fand%5FBuilding/

Is anyone going to try to argue that the policy is fair?

[Tom Joad]

29. No, they are going to argue that B'Tselem is biased. You know the drill, Violet

[oberliner]

30. So this policy only applies to Area C

where 2 percent of the Palestinian population resides. Is that correct?

[Violet_Crumble]

32. Where did you get the bit about 2% of the population living there?

I didn't see that in the BTselem report I posted. fwiw, I wouldn't care if it was only 1% of the Palestinian population - it's clearly wrong and when compared to the building and planning in Israeli settlements, very discriminatory....

[oberliner]

33. Population information for The West Bank can be found here

This site notes that all but 40,000 West Bank Palestinians live in Areas A and B. (of a total population of around 2 million as of 2000)

http://www.prb.org/Articles/2002/TheWestBankandGazaAPopulationProfile.aspx

I just wonder what the procedure is for Palestinians who seek building permits from the PA in Areas A and B where the vast majority of the Palestinian population resides.

Is it easy (or easier) to acquire these permits? Do people build houses without getting these permits? If they do, what is the consequence?

[Tom Joad]

34. I doubt the Israeli military rarely, if ever, gives out building permits to the Palestinians.

[Violet_Crumble]

35. As I said in the post you replied to...

Even if it were 1% or lower of the population, the policy is wrong and discriminatory. Do you agree or disagree?

[Violet_Crumble]

36. Kick for Oberliner n/t

[Violet_Crumble]

37. So, do you agree with Israel's policy? n/t

[oberliner]

40. Sorry it has taken so long to reply to your question

So many threads, so little time!

Anyway, I don't agree with Israel's policy. In fact, I don't agree that Israel should be occupying the West Bank. I think that there should be an independent Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza and I have also said that I believe that something like what is outlined in the Geneva Accords should be implemented. Unfortunately, it does not seem like the Palestinians and the Israelis are interested in going down that road any time soon.

That said, I think it is important to be aware that the majority of Palestinians do not live in Area C and are not impacted by this particular Israeli policy. I wish that the part of the Oslo agreement that gave Palestinians autonomy over Areas A and B could have led to a commitment from the Palestinian side to end attacks on Israeli civilians so that we could move to the phase where Area C is handed over to the PA as well as outlined in that agreement.

[breakaleg]

31. Note the different treatment of illegal Israeli settlers vs. Palestinians on their own land.

"Demolition of houses as a policy of discrimination

Broad-scale building without permits occurs in Palestinian villages and in Israeli settlements. In the Palestinian villages, the building is conducted by private individuals, who are desperate because of the absence of planning schemes to meet their needs, the lack of permits to build on their land, or the refusal of the authorities to grant them building permits. When they have built, the authorities have responded aggressively, demolishing thousands of houses over the years of occupation, without offering a meaningful solution to the housing shortage.

Israeli settlers built thousands of housing units, public facilities, and industrial structures without permits. Government ministries, primarily the Ministry of Housing, erected a high percentage of these structures. Private construction companies and individual settlers also built without permits in most of the settlements. The authorities take a forgiving attitude toward building without a permit in the settlements, and have refrained - except for one case, as far as we know - from demolishing houses built without a permit. Instead, the authorities retroactively approve plans validating such construction."

[msmcghee]

38. The incident reported in the article . .

. . occurred May 16 - claiming that the house was scheduled for demolition in 3 days.

That was 10 days ago. No report of any demolition so far.

[oberliner]

41. Any update on this story?

Has the home been demolished or is the order still being appealed?

[oberliner]

42. What is the status of the home?

Any update on this?

[barb162]

43. I emailed the group in May over a month ago; no response.

See post 20. If I get a response from them, I'll post it asap.

[Tom Joad]

44. I have personal contacts there now...

so i should be able to get an answer on that soon.
They (IWPS) should do a better job on following up on these things, although their resources are stretched thin. They could use better computer equipment for sure. Still, no excuse.

[number6]

45. Outrageous. nt

:( :( :(