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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 11:12 AM
Original message
Slouching toward a Palestinian Holocaust

Slouching toward a Palestinian Holocaust


From Znet


There is little doubt that the Nazi Holocaust was as close to unconditional evil as has been revealed throughout the entire bloody history of the human species. Its massiveness, unconcealed genocidal intent, and reliance on the mentality and instruments of modernity give its enactment in the death camps of Europe a special status in our moral imagination. ….

Against this background, it is especially painful for me, as an American Jew, to feel compelled to portray the ongoing and intensifying abuse of the Palestinian people by Israel through a reliance on such an inflammatory metaphor as 'holocaust.' …..(snip)

Is it an irresponsible overstatement to associate the treatment of Palestinians with this criminalized Nazi record of collective atrocity? I think not. The recent developments in Gaza are especially disturbing because they express so vividly a deliberate intention on the part of Israel and its allies to subject an entire human community to life-endangering conditions of utmost cruelty.


snip… details of what Falk sees transpiring in Gaza under the nose of the Israel, US, Europe, Egypt et.al.

Conclusion from Falk…

Israel is currently stiffening the boycott on economic relations that has brought the people of Gaza to the brink of collective starvation. this set of policies, carried on for more than four decades, has imposed a sub-human existence on a people that have been repeatedly and systematically made the target of a variety of severe forms of collective punishment. The entire population of Gaza is treated as the 'enemy' of Israel, and little pretext is made in Tel Aviv of acknowledging the innocence of this long victimized civilian society.

To persist with such an approach under present circumstances is indeed genocidal, and risks destroying an entire Palestinian community that is an integral part of an ethnic whole.
It is this prospect that makes appropriate the warning of a Palestinian holocaust in the making, and should remind the world of the famous post-Nazi pledge of 'never again.'


Comment: Read the whole thing.
As we approach the 60th anniversary of the Palestinian Nakba or catastrophe—the forced ethnic cleansing of over 700,000 indigenous people from their homeland, I think this essay is of vital importance. It is vital that people do all they can to prevent a far worse catastrophe from occurring. Don’t say you didn’t know!


About the author:
Richard A. Falk
Richard Falk is Professor Emeritus of International Law and Practice at Princeton University and Distinguished Visiting Professor at the University of California at Santa Barbara.

Added info: Falk is the Albert G. Milbank Professor of International Law and Practice at Princeton University since 1965. B.S. (economics), Wharton School, University of Pennsylvania (1952); LL.B., Yale Law School (1955); J.S.D., Harvard University (1962). He has been on the editorial boards of about ten journals and magazines, including the American Journal of International Law (1961-) and The Nation (1978-). …Prof. Falk has provided expert testimony in many high profile cases and legislative and administrative hearings. He has been a member of international panels of jurors addressing "Marcos' Policies in the Philippines," "The Armenian Genocide," "Reagan's War Against Nicaragua," Nuclear Warfare, "Puerto Rico: A History of Repression and Struggle," and "Amazonia: Development and Human Rights." Prof. Falk has written extensively on international law and the law of war.
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Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
1. "Is it an irresponsible overstatement...
...to associate the treatment of Palestinians with this criminalized Nazi record of collective atrocity? I think not. The recent developments in Gaza are especially disturbing because they express so vividly a deliberate intention on the part of Israel and its allies to subject an entire human community to life-endangering conditions of utmost cruelty."

I would have to agree.
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pelsar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 09:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. the allies?..
Israel and its allies..just curious...these allies...can we name them?

the US, Egypt (arabs), western europe?
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Mr_Jefferson_24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Your point?
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
2. How to prevent a Palestinian holocaust
Edited on Mon Jul-09-07 03:00 PM by oberliner
Here's one way to prevent more tragedy:

Hamas declares that it is unconditionally renouncing violence as a means of resistance and invalidates its previous charter calling for Israel's destruction.

Hamas recognizes the state of Israel and vows to work towards creating a permanent agreement establishing a Palestinian state at peace with Israel.

Hamas announces that it will do everything in its power to prevent any attacks against Israel vowing to arrest any Palestinians who are planning such attacks.

If the leadership of Hamas was to take this bold step, the region could begin to move away from tragedy and towards peaceful coexistance and mutual benefit.



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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Fully agree...
and it would also be a good idea for Hamas to stop killing other Palestinians.
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. why is the burden on the occupied, and not on the occupiers?
that seems backward. Much the same logic as bush saying that the US will withdrawal from Iraq once the Iraqis renounce violence and resistance.

why has not Israel renounced terror/violence for the purpose of dispossessing Palestinians of their homes and farms?
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. If the result is a dramatic improvement in the conditions for the Palestinians
Then, backward or not, wouldn't it be worth it?
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. If the result is Bantustans for Palestinians, the way forward promoted by Bushboy and olmert
would it not be worthless?

remember, Palestinians do not wish merely better prison conditions, they want liberation.
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Violence is not the answer
Edited on Mon Jul-09-07 04:20 PM by oberliner
Embracing peace, rejecting violent resistance.

If the Palestinian leadership truly committed themselves to those ideals, the results would be positive for everyone.
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. so you believe Israel should reject violence?
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. I believe in two states living in peace
Here's what I am proposing:

Hamas announces that from this moment forward their movement is completely opposed to violence of any kind.

Israel will no longer be able to use security as a pretext for any of its actions because the Palestinian leadership will crack down on anyone who violates the new Hamas peace charter.

There will be no rockets launched at Israel. No weapons stockpiled. No suicide attacks. No verbal incitement.

The only message coming from the Palestinian leadership will be one of peace.

The Palestinian leadership will then present to Israel exactly what it wants its state to look like and negotiations can go on from there.

It seems like this step would bring about the eventual reality of two states living side by side at peace with one another a lot faster and with a lot less suffering for all.

The violent approach doesn't seem to lead to anything but never ending conflict.

Why not try the peace approach?
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
9. Doesn't that analogy basically require
that the German and Polish Jews were dead set, at all costs, to destroy the German state, possibly making sure that the Germans were driven out? That they had been killing Germans in order to gain power?

In other words, it's worse than Hitler's paranoid idea that the Jews were undermining and weakening the German state and defiling German blood, as well as conspiring to take over through economic means.

Nice, subtle way of saying Israelis make Hitler look like a peach.
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. 750,000 Palestinians were driven out of *their homeland*.
It was not the other way around.
why doesn't israel, in the interest in peace, welcome them back?
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-10-07 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Hundreds of thousands of Jews were driven out of their homelands as well
Edited on Tue Jul-10-07 11:41 AM by oberliner
Just as there now exists a Jewish state for them to call home so should there be a Palestinian state for the Palestinians to call home.

In the interest of peace, let's all work towards making this dream a reality.

Most Palestinians and Israelis can see the solution and the mutual benefits that will come from implementing it.

Palestinian and Israeli leaders need to step up and make some difficult compromises so that we can finally bring this conflict to a peaceful conclusion.

Ordinary people can help facilitate this by eschewing groups that advocate violent resistance and embracing those who seek realistic solutions.

I wish we could generate more energy behind the Geneva Accords as a jumping off point.
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-10-07 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Great post!
I hope that the planned dialogue between the Arab League and Israel will contitute a step toward these goals.

'Ordinary people can help facilitate this by eschewing groups that advocate violent resistance and embracing those who seek realistic solutions.'

I agree. This organization is interesting from this point of view:

http://www.onevoicemovement.com

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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. It says nothing about the issues...
i looked at that group before... and i don't mean to slight the people involved. But for example, Jason Alexander was asked about the illegal Annexation Wall being built that was taking Palestinian farmland, and he said the One Voice organization has no position on that....
now many people might think that taking land by military force is a terrible violence... and yet this group is silent. and that is just one example.

It kind of reminds me of that old coca-cola commercial, where you see a hundreds of people standing on a hill holding hands and they break out in song... "I like to teach the world to sing, in perfect harmony" that makes people feel good, and is a great way to sell a cola... it is not a realistic way to solve a conflict.

It is a way to preserve the status quo. If the civil rights movement followed that route, there would be endless dialog groups where they held discussions about "How do you feel about not being served at the lunch counter?" (but no action to abolish segregation, since they would have no position on that)

That is the direction many of these Israel/Palestinian dialog groups take... (although some dialog groups go from mere sharing of experiences to concrete action)
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #15
24. Great group!
Thanks for the link!

Nice to see a group of Palestinians and Israelis who are able to say without reservation that they support a two state solution to the conflict.

There are too many groups that claim to be working for peace who refuse to articulate any specific vision of what that peace might look like.

Take, for instance, the US Campaign to End the Israeli Occupation. This group will not endorse the two-state solution.

To some, as long as the occupation ends, it doesn't really matter what comes next.

The One Voice group and others like them are looking at the broader view. They may not know exactly how to get there - but they know that the majority of Israelis and Palestinians share the same goals and they have for too long been prevented by extremists on both sides from achieving them.

Two states, living side by side, at peace with one another. Good for Israelis, good for Palestinians, good for the world.

How do we get there? What will the borders be? What about Jerusalem? What about the Right of Return? What about the settlements?

These questions can only be answered if Israelis and Palestinians embrace leaders who are committed to making difficult sacrifices in order to make this vision a reality.


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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-10-07 11:58 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. why should palestinians be held accountable for the actions of other nations?
Shouldn't syria be responsible for the actions of syria, france for the actions of france and so on?
But Palestinians were pushed out of their homeland... and they were the ones pushed into the sea (some quite literally).

Is that supposed to be forgotten? Why can't Israel take responsibility for its actions and its responsibility under international law.
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leftynyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 05:06 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. How about them being responsible for themselves
The Palestinians are being treated like children by people like you. According to you, they can't help acting out and killing eachother...and besides, it's Israel's fault anyway. Simple thinking. Very tiresome.
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. I would like to see Israel held accountable for its crimes against the Palestinians
and for the US to end its aid to the occupation regime.

Palestinians have mistreated each other in some ways, but it pales in comparison to the monstrous crimes that have been committed against them.
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leftynyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. So what, in your opinion,
Edited on Wed Jul-11-07 12:24 PM by leftynyc
are the Palestinians responsible for? Mistreatment?? That's what you call what went on in Gaza with Hamas? Even Egypt is siding with Abbas. The US is not going to turn it's back on Israel - that's a fantasy. And whose monstrous crime was it that they didn't have a state between 48-67? The Lebanese army is about to decimate the refugee camp there. Is that Israel's fault also? Their "brothers" in the mid east have treated them with nothing but contempt and only care about them when they need to use them to distract their citizens and people like you from the horrors going on in their countries. They had a chance at a nation in 48 and decided to shit on themselves instead. What other country in history has had a chance at a do-over?
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aranthus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 02:50 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. The refugee story is a myth.
Tom posted>"750,000 Palestinians were driven out of *their homeland*. It was not the other way around.
why doesn't israel, in the interest in peace, welcome them back?"

First of all because this isn't true. Even if there were as many as 750,000 Arab refugees, very few of them were intentionally displaced (20 to 30 thousand, mostly from the Tel Aviv to Jerusalem corridor). 30 to 50 thousand left either before the war, or on their own. The rest became refugees the way that most refugees have been created in every other war; they ran away from battles. That's what happens to civilians in war time; they tend to become refugees. By the way, the Israelis have over the years allowed around 50 thousand Palestinians to return.

Second, because there wouldn't have been any Palestinian refugees if the Palestinians had not started a war to prevent the Jews from having their own state. While the Palestinians aren't the only ones to blame for their own situation, they have the biggest share. No one asks the Poles to take back the millions of Germans who were intentionally driven out of Eastern Germany at the end of WWII so that the area could be given to Poland. That's because the Germans started the war. The same principle applies to Israel/Palestine.

Third, because allowing the Palestinians to return would would make Israel into another Arab majority state, thereby destroying the national rights of the Jews. Why should the Jews have to give up their state when the refugee problem is mostly someone else's fault?

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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 06:42 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. many historians -- including many Israeli and Zionist historians would disagree with you
And would definitely affirm that what happened in 1948 did comprise a massive ethnic cleansing:

The first and largest wave of Palestinian refugees occurred before May 14, 1948 the date of the Declaration of Independence and the arrival of the Arab armies on May 15, 1948 -- essentially in the wake of the Dir Yassin massacre on April 9, 1948 that was perpetrated by Lehi and Irgun with the Haganah's connivance and the unfolding of the Haganah's (the leading Zionist military force) Plan D and was on going at that time of and after. (page 31 - Avi Shlaim - The Iron Wall: Israel and the Arab world and numerous other sources) Certainly the vast majority of exiles occurred before the end of of the 1948 War. But there were smaller waves of refugees afterwords.

this article by :

Fred M. Donner
Professor of Near Eastern History
The Oriental Institute
The University of Chicago
Chicago, Ill. link:

http://www.princeton.edu/~paw/web_exclusives/more/more_letters/letters_doran.html

"By 1914, the population of Palestine was about 650,000. Of this, the Jewish population was about 80,000, or a little over 12 percent. Of the 88 percent remaining, 570,000 people, Israeli and non-Israeli scholars estimate that at least 550,000 were Palestinians (Christian or Muslim) who were descendants of families in Palestine already in the 1840s — or almost 85 percent of the total 1914 population of Palestine."

"As we see, most Palestinians of today can trace their ancestry to families who have been resident in Palestine for hundreds of years. The debate over immigration figures is, of course, merely part of the broader effort by Palestinians and Israelis to de-legitimize each other by claiming the other side to be interlopers. Mr. Schell's evident desire to cast doubt on the historical roots of the Palestinians' claim to their land suggests that he has been taken in, like many other people, by such works as Joan Peters's tract "From Time Immemorial," which popularized for obvious political purposes the myth that many Palestinians were descendants of recent immigrants.Such a view is simply not supported by the evidence. "

http://www.princeton.edu/~paw/web_exclusives/more/more_letters/letters_doran.html

______________________

this article by world renowned Israeli historian Avi Shlaim of Oxford regarding transfer:

London Review of Books, 9 June 1994.

link to full article:

http://users.ox.ac.uk/~ssfc0005/It%20Can%20Be%20Done.html

"While the ethics of transfer had never troubled Ben-Gurion unduly, the growing strength of the Yishuv eventually convinced him of its practical feasibility. On 12 July 1937, for instance, Ben-Gurion confided to his diary:

The compulsory transfer of the Arabs from the valleys of the proposed Jewish state could give us something which we never had ... a Galilee free from Arab population .... We must uproot from our hearts the assumption that the thing is not possible. It can be done.

The more Ben-Gurion thought about it, the more convinced he became that "the thing" could not only be done but had to be done. On 5 October 1937, he wrote to his son with startling candor:

We must expel Arabs and take their places ... and, if we have to use force - not to dispossess the Arabs of the Negev and Transjordan, but to guarantee our own right to settle in those places - then we have force at our disposal.

The letter reveals not only the extent to which partition became associated in Ben Gurion's mind with the expulsion of Arabs from the Jewish state but also the nature and extent of his territorial expansionism. The letter implied that the area allocated for the Jewish state by the Peel Commission will later be expanded to include the Negev and Transjordan. Like Vladimir Jabotinsky, the founder and leader of Revisionist Zionism, Ben-Gurion was a territorial maximalist. Unlike Jabotinsky, Ben-Gurion believed that the territorial aims of Zionism could best be advanced by means of a gradualist strategy.

When the UN voted in favour of the partition of Palestine on 29 November 1947, the struggle for Palestine entered its decisive phase. Ben-Gurion and his colleagues in the Jewish Agency accepted the partition plan despite deep misgivings about the prospect of a substantial Arab minority, a fifth column as they saw it, in their midst. the Palestinians rejected the partition plan with some vehemence as illegal, immoral and impractical. By resorting to force to frustrate the UN plan, they presented Ben-Gurion with an opportunity, which he was not slow to exploit, for extending the borders of the proposed Jewish state and for reducing the number of Arabs inside it. By 7 November 1949, when the guns finally fell silent, 730,000 persons, or 80 per cent of the Arab population of Palestine, had become refugees. "

link to full article:

http://users.ox.ac.uk/~ssfc0005/It%20Can%20Be%20Done.html

___________________

And there is also a historic record of other Zionist:

Let me quote former Israeli Foreign Minister and Israeli historian Shlomo Ben-Ami from "Scars of War Wounds of Peace: the Israeli-Arab Tragedy", page 25-26

http://www.amazon.com/Scars-War-Wounds-Peace-Israeli-Arab/dp/0195181581/sr=1-1/qid=1166681762/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/102-8701952-4352901?ie=UTF8&s=books

"The idea of transfer of Arabs had a long pedigree in Zionist thought. Moral scruples hardly intervened in what was normally seen as a realistic and logical solution, a matter of expediency. Israel Zangvill, the founding father of the concept, advocated transfer as early as 1916. For as he said, ' if we wish to give a country to a people without a country, it is utter foolishness to allow it to be the country of two people...."

"The idea of transfer was not the intimate dream of only the activists and militants of the Zionist movement. A mass exodus of Arabs from Palestine was no great tragedy, according to Menachem Usishkink, a leader of the General Zionist. To him the message of the Arab Revolt was that coexistence was out of the question and it was now either the Arabs or the Jews, but not both. Even Aharon Zislong, a member of the extreme Left of the Zionist Labour movements, who during the 1948 war would go on record as being scandalized by the atrocities committed against the Arab population, saw no 'moral flaw' in transfer of the Arabs...But again, Ben Gurion's voice had always a special meaning and relevance. At a Zionist meeting in June 1938 he was as explicit as he could be. 'I support compulsory transfer. I don't see in it anything immoral.' But he also knew that transfer would be possible only in the midst of war, not in 'normal times.' What might be impossible in such times, he said 'is possible in revolutionary times.' The problem was, then, not moral, perhaps not even political,it was a function of timing, this meant war"

and from page 43:

" Benny Morris found no evidence to show 'that either the leaders of the Arab states or the Mufti ordered or directly encouraged the mass exodus'. Indeed Morris found evidence to the effect that the local Arab leadership and militia commanders discouraged flight, and the Arab radio stations issued calls to the Palestinians to stay put, and even to return to their homes if they had already left. True, there were more than a few cases where local Arab commanders ordered the evacuation of villages. But these seemed to gave been tactical decisions taken under very specific military conditions..."

From page 44:

"The first major wave of Arab exodus in April-May 1948, essentially in the wake of the Dir Yassin massacre that was perpetrated by Lehi and Irgun with the Haganah's connivance and the unfolding of Plan D, might perhaps have taken the leadership of the Yishuv by surprise. But they undoubtedly saw an opportunity to be exploited, a phenomenon to rejoice at -- Manachem Begin wrote in his memoirs, The Revolt, that 'out of evil, however, good came-and be encouraged. 'Doesn't he have anything more important to do?' was Ben-Gurion's reaction when told, during his visit to Haifa on 1 May 1948 that a local Jewish leader was trying to convince Arabs not to leave. 'Drive them out!' was Ben-Gurion's instruction to Yigal Allon, as recorded by Yitzak Rabin in a censored passage of his memoirs published in a censored passage of his memoirs published in 1979, with regard to the Arabs of Lydda after the city had been taken over on 11 July 1948....Plan D, however, was a major cause for the exodus, for it was strategically driven by the notion of creating Jewish contiguity even beyond the partition lines and, therefore by the desire to have a Jewish state with the smallest number of Arabs.

The debate about whether or not the mass exodus of Palestinians was the result of a Zionist design or the inevitable concomitant of war could not ignore the ideological constructs that motivated the Zionist enterprise. The philosophy of transfer was not a marginal, esoteric article....These ideological constructs provided a legitimate environment for commanders in the field to encourage the eviction of the local population even when no precise order to that effect was issued by the political leaders. As early as February 1948, that is before the mass exodus had started but after he witnessed how Arabs had fled West Jerusalem, Ben-Gurion could not hide his excitement."

from page 42:

"The reality on the ground was at times far simpler and more cruel than what Ben-Gurion was ready to acknowledge. It was that of an Arab community in a state of terror facing a ruthless Israeli army whose path to victory was paved not only by its exploits against the regular Arab armies, but also by the intimidation, at at times atrocities and massacres it perpetrated against the civilian Arab community. A panic-stricken Arab community was uprooted under the impact of massacres that would be carved into the Arabs' monument of grief and hatred."
__________________

Nakba's Oral History Interviews:

http://www.palestineremembered.com/OralHistory/Interviews-Listing/Story1151.html
____________

Israeli Haifa University historian Professor Ilan Pappe's lecture in Amsterdam in January 2007
--The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine--

on Windows Media Mp3 (left click to listen online or right click and click on 'save target as') to download:

http://webdisk.planet.nl/houck006/publiek/album/Lectures/Broadband/Ilan%20Pappe%201.mp3

Map showing the massive destruction of Palestinian towns after al-Nakba in 1948 - link: http://www.palestineremembered.com/Acre/Maps/Story572.html



.
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poverlay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Wow, what a post. Thanks for all the research. That must have taken you awhile. Here I thought
it was all the fault of Egypt... :sarcasm:

Seriously though: Great job & thanks.
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Tom Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-11-07 10:06 AM
Response to Reply #18
22. revisionist history sucks, no matter who is the victim.
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