Rachel Corrie trial resumes

[ConsAreLiars]

...
"When our daughter was killed, the Israeli government promised a thorough, credible and transparent investigation into her death, and neither our family nor our government believes that standard has been met," Cindy Corrie said. “After seven years, we hope the government witnesses will be compelled by this trial to provide some of the answers that have so long been denied us.”

The lawsuit charges that Corrie’s killing was intentional. Alternately, it charges that the Israeli government was negligent for allowing Israeli soldiers and military commanders to act recklessly using an armored military bulldozer without due regard to the presence of unarmed, nonviolent civilians in Rafah. It also alleges that the Israeli military failed to take appropriate and necessary measures to protect Corrie’s life, in violation of obligations under Israeli and international law.
...
“We pursue this case not just for our daughter ... but for the many civilians killed in Gaza, still remembered, still loved, still awaiting justice,” Craig Corrie said.
http://www.eurasiareview.com/201010068813/rachel-corrie-trial-resumes.html

[TexasProgresive]

1. K&R

Thanks for the update. I didn't know her parents were pursuing this. May they be strong and prevail.

[polly7]

2. Good for them! I can't imagine what they've gone

through and still suffer with. She was such a beautiful person.

http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/

[oberliner]

3. Why does the death of 1 white woman get so much more attention than the deaths of so many non-whites

Is it racism?

[Ken Burch]

4. I can't believe you'd lower yourself to post such a thing.

You should be ashamed of yourself.

It's time for the right-wing of the "pro-Israel" crowd to stop obsessively mocking and demonizing Rachel. She wasn't evil and nothing she did harmed anyone in Israel or anywhere else. And she was brave enough to sacrifice her life for what she stood for.
Israel's survival does NOT depend on Rachel being posthumously dissed at every opportunity.

[oberliner]

7. It is a question - no mockery or demonizing included

You don't think that white American women who are killed receive more attention than non-whites?

[Ken Burch]

9. perhaps.

But then again, Palestinians are more or less Caucasian in appearance themselves(it's hard to tell them apart from Mizrahim, as far as that goes, depending on how they're dressed or groomed).

But that's not what the thing with Rachel is about.

And I suppose my response was based on the fact that, everytime any thread about this woman appears, at least some people who identify as "pro-Israel" feel obliged to make insulting comments about her.

I do think that Rachel's physical appearance(the fact that, through the sheer happenstance of genetics, she had fair skin and blonde hair) may cause a reflex response among some "pro-Israeli" posters, who subconsciously associate anyone with such an appearance with Naziism. Rachel was blonde; she wasn't Aryan. And she was not driven by any ill feeling towards Jews whatsoever. So she doesn't deserve to be treated like she was a loyal daughter of the Reich or something.

Rachel's death probably got more attention due to the fact of her being American. But if she had been an African-American or Latino or Native American(or, let's say it, if she had been Jewish) and had died doing exactly the same thing, the feeling of outrage would have been just as deep. It wasn't about Rachel being "white".

[oberliner]

10. I think its the Natalee Holloway/Jessica Lynch phenomenon

Nothing to do with any "pathological response about Nazis or anything of that ilk.

Simply put, these folks, for whatever reasons - but clearly in some measure due to their being young pretty white women - generate more attention and sympathy than others in similar situations who do not have the same characteristics.

To say nothing of the fact that they are American - and thus elevated even further in the minds and perceptions of many, quite broadly.

I am not sure which of the components - young, female, white, pretty, American - is most salient in this or the other cases, but the combination of the five certainly goes a long way.

[Violet_Crumble]

6. It's got to do with her being an American, not whether she's white or not...

Not at all sure why you tried to turn a thread about the lawsuit (which, btw, is very newsworthy) into a race issue...

[oberliner]

8. Disagree

You may not be aware of this not living in the US, but most Americans can tell you about the staggering difference between the coverage given to Jessica Lynch and Shoshana Johnson.

[Violet_Crumble]

11. You may not be aware of this, but the coverage has been global....

So I'm not sure what living in the US or not has to do with it. The amount of coverage is due to Rachel Corrie being an American and an international activist who was killed by Israel in the Occupied Territories.

[oberliner]

12. Not in the US it hasn't

There have been documentary films as well as a play about her but not about others in similar circumstances who were non-white.

[Violet_Crumble]

13. Again, the media coverage has been global...

So what non-white American pro-Palestinian activists are there who have been killed by the IDF? To be honest, I'm finding the fixation on a person's skin colour to be just a bit creepy...

[oberliner]

14. Again, it has not been that way in the United States

This is my only frame of reference as this is where I live.

I agree with you that the fixation of a person's skin color is very creepy.

In fact, that is precisely the point I am trying to make.

Do you even know who Shoshanna Johnson is?

I suggest you Google for more info.

[Violet_Crumble]

15. Are you now trying to make out you don't read the international media?

It doesn't matter where someone lives. If they've got internet access and are frequenting a forum like this, there's no way they're only reading US articles. And if you did actually agree with me that fixating on someone's skin colour is creepy, you wouldn't be engaging in it yrself...

[oberliner]

16. i asked a question about race

That hardly represents a fixation.

The fixation comes from those who give more attention to a victim when they are of one particular race than if they are of another race.

I am critical of those who would have such a fixation (such as with Natalee Holloway and Jessica Lynch).

Nothing in the question diminishes the tragedies that befell those people - including Rachel Corrie.

And yes I do read international news sources online, but that wasn't my point.

[Violet_Crumble]

17. You started it up when no-one else was talking about it and have continued on since then...

I think it is verging on fixation when the colour of a person becomes such a big issue the way it has in this thread. It's kind of creepy.

Anyway, to get back to the OP, it'll be interesting to see whether Rachel Corrie's parents are going to be successful with their lawsuit and I'll be following the case with interest...

[oberliner]

18. Everyone was already talking about it

That is the whole point of my question.

That you would want to redirect focus again to the question of this lawsuit helps to illustrate the issue in fact.

That there is even a lawsuit (for one dollar) drives the point home.

If you are uncomfortable dealing with race then that is one thing, but to say that people "aren't talking" about race is like saying people weren't talking about race when they were making movies about Jessica Lynch.

[Violet_Crumble]

19. No, yr post was the first mention of race in this thread...

Gosh, do you think just maybe I want to talk about the lawsuit because that's what the OPs about? I'll leave you to go on about what colour people are on yr own...

[oberliner]

20. And yet - it didn't

It may have been the first to ask the question, but the very existence of the thread is in and of itself a mention of race.

[Ken Burch]

33. How long are you going to try to belabor this trivial point?

Is Rachel's skin color really worth derailing the whole thread?

[Violet_Crumble]

34. Ken, it's a really good idea to just give this one a wide berth...

Check yr inbox in a minute or two, okay?

[Ken Burch]

35. Will do.

n/t.

[oberliner]

45. I really don't think it's trivial

What is it about the OP that is worth responding to? Hasn't this story been discussed enough? There is nothing new here other than an ongoing lawsuit for $1. The story itself is seven years old. What is interesting is that it is still generating news this many years later.

[Mosby]

22. Furkan Dogan was also an American

Do you think there will be plays and books written about him? How about dozens of memorial websites? Why do you suppose that is?

[Violet_Crumble]

30. I'm aware he was an American. There's been a lot of media coverage...

Surely yr not trying to make out there hasn’t been a lot of media attention when it comes to his killing by Israel? If so, you would be incorrect. As to whether there’ll be books and memorial sites for him, I have no idea. Why?

[Ken Burch]

32. There may well be such plays.

Rachel Corrie's death did NOT get special attention because she was fair-skinned and blonde. And it was a white guy that killed her, as far as that goes.

[TomClash]

23. Right

He is using this as another means of deflecting the issue from an Israeli atrocity to "a young woman who only received attention because she was white."

And, oh, by the way, it not only trivializes what Rachel Corrie was doing but it is an indirect means of implying that people who write and post about Rachel Corrie are "racist" while bolstering their own progressive credentials as truly "concerned" about crimes against women of color.

Pretty neat, huh?

[Violet_Crumble]

31. I sometimes get sucked into the attempts to deflect attention away from some issues..

It really doesn't deserve any more attention being paid to it. Rachel Corrie's death gained widespread global media attention for several reasons. They were:

• She was a foreign peace activist. And being an American also raised criticism of US funding for a country that kills US citizens
  
• The circumstances of her death were incredibly tragic.
  
• There's been denial from the IDF as to the responsibility for her death
  
• Her family has campaigned nonstop for justice to be done.
  

[TomClash]

42. An excellent synapsis

She had the courage of her convictions. Those convictions just didn't happen to be expressed in the fashion approved by Israel and its American apologists.

To say she got (limited) msm coverage because she was white is demeaning and baseless. That Israel's US defenders siting in their living rooms in their nice white neighborhoods make comparisons to various women and girls of color who have been killed or disappeared is even worse. For one thing it ignores the political element of Corrie's death.

[oberliner]

44. Synapsis is the pairing of two homologous chromosomes that occurs during meiosis

I think you mean synopsis.

In any case, the coverage she received is not primarily from the msm but rather from the non-msm. Google her name if you would like to see the extent to which this seven year old incident has been covered.

There has even been an off-Broadway play about her story.

Did Tom Hurndall's death not have a political component?

[TomClash]

49. Yes I meant synopsis, obviously

Thanks, I am all too aware of the off-Broadway play. And I also well aware of who tried to stop that play from being performed in New York.

So now you are complaining that she received too much non-msm coverage? Since she was a pretty white girl, why wasn't the MSM all over this? Yes, it's a rhetorical question.

Tom Hurndall's killer received a severe prison sentence for manslaughter. Hurndall was British and unlike the American Government in Rachel's case, the Brits went to bat for Hurndall to get justice for his death. Rachel's killers went free.

[oberliner]

51. Who tried to stop the play from being performed in New York?

And did you get a chance to see it?

Look, I am not complaining about anything. I just believe that her coverage was influenced by the fact that she was young, white, and female.

People are welcome to disagree with me on that and I am happy to drop the subject as long as I am not being accused of the various things you accused me of just for asking the question.

[Violet_Crumble]

46. It's the attacks on her by 'supporters' of Israel that I find revolting

I haven't seen that sort of hatred aimed at other civilian victims of the conflict, and I think the rage has in it's own sick way assisted in keeping her in public view. It seems logical to me that if there are people who want attention on her to go away (not saying they all are the sort who rage and say hateful things about her), then they shouldn't give attention to those who are interested in what happened to Rachel corrie. Just the same as those of us who are interested in discussing her should ignore attempts to derail discussions about her.

[TomClash]

50. Good point

The attacks on her are revolting, but that is in part because she is American. Israel's US supporters see her as a threat to the relationship and so she must be discredited, just like the jewish heroes who risk their careers to assist in seeking justice for Palestinians. Norman Finkelstein and the hatchet job done by the Alan Dershowitz to deny him tenure at DePaul is but one example.

[oberliner]

43. The atrocity took place seven years ago

The issue has received a good deal of attention, both at the time and in the years since.

By no means is her being white the only reason she received attention. Why you put that in quotation marks when it is not a quote is beyond me.

My progressive credentials do not need to be "bolstered" by any expression of concern about crimes against women of color.

This incident is seven years old and people are still talking about it. Many people have been killed in the conflict since then including American citizens of various races. None have received the kind of attention this case has received.

What is so threatening about responding to an observation about the degree and extent of the coverage this incident has received and its possible relation to race?

[shira]

47. The baiting continues 7 years later, this game of blindly demonizing Israel. n/t

[txaslftist]

60. Kinda like the holocaust

It just keeps coming up - even what, 75 years in the past?

Don't get why folks just can't get over stuff.

[TomClash]

56. People are still talking about it because a civil trial is being conducted

You introduced race into the discussion when that clearly has nothing to do with it.

[oberliner]

57. There are lots of civil trials being conducted that don't get talked about

I didn't introduce race into the discussion - it's already there.

[TomClash]

59. Not many in Israel where an American peace activist got run over by a bulldozer

That's why the parents brought the civil suit.

You introduced race in the discussion - check out the third post on this thread. It's there because you put it there.

[ConsAreLiars]

52. Well said and observed.

That is a tactic to divert, practiced constantly here, and nothing more.

And also and attempt to smear those who see people as people. even (horrors!) those of Arab descent and/or of Muslim faiths.

Some do it slickly, others crudely, but is used by those who cannot use common morality and human decency or international law or the Geneva Conventions as a defense, which is pretty much always.

[azurnoir]

5. Army investigator testifies in Rachel Corrie trial

The military official charged with investigating Rachel Corrie's killing in Gaza testified Friday that he had not been to the site of the killing because he thought it was dangerous, the Rachel Corrie Foundation said.

<snip>

Head of the Military Police Special Investigative Unit Shalom Michaeli testified at Haifa District Court that he could have gone to the site of Rachel's killing in an armored vehicle but had chosen not to because it was dangerous and the terrain had changed, a statement from the foundation said.

The statement referred to several other flaws in the investigation which surfaced during Michaeli's testimony. The investigator said he ordered only a partial transcript of radio transmissions because he did not think it important to transcribe the full audio. Further, a video recording of the incident revealed that the camera operator panned away from the scene minutes before Corrie was killed, but Michaeli said he had not thought it relevant to question the operator. The investigator testified in a written affidavit that when he inspected the bulldozer which killed Corrie he found no traces of blood, but told the court Friday the vehicle could have been washed "or even painted" before he inspected it.

Craig Corrie said he was struck by Michaeli's failure "to look for evidence, to secure evidence, to resolve conflicting evidence, and to turn evidence over to this court. This is not what we and the U.S. government were promised by the government of Israel when Rachel was killed and it is not what we will accept now."

The commander of a second bulldozer present when Corrie was killed also testified Friday, and said he did know how Corrie was hurt, or remember much about the incident. The foundation noted that this contradicted a detailed affidavit he signed eight weeks ago.

http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=322150

[shira]

21. Actual video of Corrie death...

http://www.stoptheism.com/index.php

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[shira]

25. I could care less about little green footballs, the video doesn't lie. As to Rightwing...

...you can't be taken seriously WRT politics when people like yourself cannot find common ground with Israel's Liberal Zionists.

If it were up to you and the rest of the Gideon Levy cheerleading anti-zionist crowd, there would be a one-state solution imposed with full Right of Return and the extreme, fascist Rightwing antisemitic PLO empowered and in control of Israel (that is, if Hamas doesn't somehow win control again). A PLO that has never once shown a desire to act liberal in any way, shape, or form. They deny basic human rights to Palestinians now. Imagine how it would be in a 1-state nightmare.

But to you, that's justice - right? And an Israel with Liberal Zionists running the ship is Rightwing in contrast?

:eyes:

[Tripmann]

26. Guess its ok to link to a site endorsed by LGF, but pointing it out gets your post deleted.

[shira]

27. I had no idea LGF endorsed it, not that I give a rip. Have you seen the video? n/t

[Tripmann]

29. Sorry shira. As a liberal I don't visit sites endorsed by little green footballs.

And as a member of DU I don't remark on their content (or use it to make a statement).

[oberliner]

28. LGF has kind of transformed itself

I think the person running it had some kind of political awakening.

Here is an article on the topic:

Little Green Footballs' Charles Johnson Breaks With The Right

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/01/little-green-footballs-ch_n_375357.html

[Violet_Crumble]

36. Pointing it out should be okay as long as we point it out politely...

My skin was crawling when I clicked on that link, not because of any connection with LGF, where as I understand it, Charles Johnston has had a bit of an epiphany and the tone has changed a fair bit, but because that lunatic Lee Kaplan runs the site that's linked to. I watched the video and it doesn't show Rachel Corrie's death anyway, but has a voiceover from some person (presumably that Kaplan weirdo) informing everyone that it's impossible to see through the bulldozer screen and other bits of personal opinion that aren't supported by the video.

[ConsAreLiars]

37. As usual, from the killing-her-was-lovely-fun contingent,

just an over-dubbed POV of the murderer's defense strategy.

[shira]

38. The video shows how the ISM's account of the incident is contradictory & dishonest. Of course...

...those who are convinced Israel is always guilty and cannot possibly ever be in the right, regardless of evidence, will believe whatever they wish.

[oberliner]

40. I cannot imagine anyone claiming that "killing-her-was-lovely-fun"

Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Violet_Crumble]

48. On that site they call the killing of another ISM member poetic justice

It really is a sick and disgusting website which when it isn't obsessing over the ISM is spewing bigoted anti Arab generalizations. now I've read more, I've found out that person doing the talking over the grainy video which cut away before the bulldozer ran her over was that lee Kaplan lunatic. I certainly hope no ones going to try claiming lee Kaplan is liberal or progreesive

[txaslftist]

61. ballsy post.

good for you.

[oberliner]

39. Please note that they are suing for $1 in damages

That's not a million - that's one dollar.

[Name removed]

54. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[azurnoir]

55. I think damages is the key word in this case

if Rachel's parents had asked for more money some of those critical of Rachel's actions or those that think Rachel was deserving of her fate, something I have seen stated on DU more than once, would claim that Rachel's parents were using her death for profit if for themselves then some other organization.

[ConsAreLiars]

58. Let me try again to point out what is obvious to any but a spinner.

In a way that I hope passes the censors.

Everywhere when a civil suit is brought for $1, the intent is to establish guilt via civil suit when the state authorities give a wink and a nod and a thumbs up to a murderer or other deviant or criminal.

Your implication that this amount has anything to do with the magnitude of the crime or the suffering involved as despicable as anything your collaborators have ever posted. Probably even more. There is sick, and there is beyond sick.

[Violet_Crumble]

53. Corrie family appeals decision allowing soldiers to testify behind screen

Lawyers for the family of Rachel Corrie filed an appeal with the Israeli Supreme Court on Sunday, challenging a decision to allow soldiers to testify behind a screen in the lawsuit filed against the State of Israel for the unlawful killing of the American peace activist in Rafah, Gaza.

State attorneys made the highly unusual request in court on Thursday, October 7 arguing that they were necessary to protect the soldiers’ safety and prevent their images from being circulated. Haifa District Court Judge Oded Gershon granted the request, ruling that all but two soldiers, who were both already known to the public, would be permitted to provide their testimony hidden from public view.

Corrie attorneys opposed the motion, arguing that allowing the soldiers to testify behind a screen infringes upon the fundamental right to an open, fair and transparent trial. They argued that the government request was based on an overbroad security certificate issued by Defense Minister Ehud Barak in 2008, was not supported by concrete evidence to substantiate their concerns for the soldiers’ safety or security. The lawyers will also ask the Supreme Court to review Judge Gershon’s decision not to allow the family to see the witnesses even if the public could not.

Attorney Hussein Abu Hussein, who represents the Corrie family, stated:

“An open and transparent judicial process is the only way to guarantee a fair trial. There is no reason why these soldiers should testify behind a screen. The government’s request is a shameless attempt to add a cloud of secrecy to civil trial and shield the soldiers from the discomfort of telling the truth in an open court.”

Attorneys for the family requested urgent review of the appeal and decision made, prior to October 17, when testimony of the next soldier in the case is anticipated to resume.

http://palsolidarity.org/2010/10/14923/

[txaslftist]

62. Well, you wouldn't want him to have to look her mom in the eye.

I mean, that might traumatize him.