Israeli Soldiers Kill Woman, Hurt Boy

[Resistance]

Atlanta Journal Constitution (AP)

JERUSALEM (AP)--Israeli soldiers destroying houses in a Palestinian refugee camp on the Gaza-Egypt border Wednesday shot and killed a woman and critically wounded a boy, residents said.

Soldiers moved into the Rafah refugee camp and destroyed five more structures after knocking down 25 the day before, residents said. The military said the mission was to destroy a tunnel used by Palestinians to smuggle in weapons. The Rafah camp is divided by the Israel-Egypt frontier.

During Wednesday's operation, soldiers exchanged gunfire with Palestinian militants. Mona Ismail, 31, a bystander, was shot in the head and died in a hospital, doctors said. Her sister and another relative, a 13-year-old boy, were wounded as the three were standing close to their home.

An 11-year-old boy was critically wounded when Israeli troops fired machine guns as cover for bulldozers demolishing houses, witnesses and doctors said.

[JasonDeter]

1. soldiers exchanged gunfire with Palestinian militants

militants = one engaged in warfare or combat.

In a gunfight if someone is trying to kill you, you must shoot back. Its unfortunate that the woman had to die but I reject it being the Israeli soldiers fault, the fault lies with the Palestinian "militants." Seems to me they had to know if they fired around civilians they had to know civilians would die. Historical patterns would show they know that. Israel is a nation of Laws and when the Palestinian people get tired of the thugs among them getting them killed maybe they will stand up and demand the terrorists stop or leave the country. There is compromise among civilized people but terrorists must be killed or jailed. There can be no compromise with terrorists.

[Resistance]

2. if someone was bulldozing your home

might you decide to shoot at the demolishers?

[JasonDeter]

4. In America? No.

America as is Israel is a nation based on The Rule Of Law. I guarantee you if the gov is bulldozing my house and I come out with a gun to stop them I'M GETTING SHOT!! So you see, here as is the case in Israel, the courts are the place to handle such disputes. When the Palestinians realize that and stop all violence and agression and murder and terrorist attacks against Israel these kinds of needless deaths will stop.

[Resistance]

6. This wasn't in either America or Israel

It was a Palestinian refugee camp in Gaza.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tinnypriv]

27. Seems you're unaware

That "The Rule Of Law" does not extend to the occupied territories.

Israel has a different civil/military administration system there.

If it isn't going to be a waste of time, I can direct you to some Israeli documentation on that.

[Resistance]

3. let's get this straight

1) Israeli forces come to demolish civilians' homes, on land that is not Israeli land, and begin the bulldozing process.

2) A group of Palestinians, in turn, shoot at the bulldozers and occupying troops.

3) Israeli troops shoot back, as cover for the bulldozers doing their job of destroying homes, and in that hail of gunfire, a Palestinian mother is shot dead, and another 13 year old bystander is hit.

And you don't find fault with the Israeli soldiers???

:crazy:

[Aidoneus]

7. more than just them..

Israeli troops have shot dead a Palestinian civilian woman during a massive invasion into the occupied Gaza Strip's Rafah refugee camp.

During Wednesday's invasion, another five civilians, including teenagers, were injured, according to witnesses and medical sources.

Bilal Shahadah, 14, was shot in the head as he walked along a street in the vast impoverished camp on the border between Gaza and Egypt after an Israeli-imposed curfew, said witnesses.

Muna Ismail, a 31-year-old mother of two, was killed by tank fire while washing clothes and baking bread in her backyard with her sister, who was wounded along with a 13-year- old nephew, said neighbour Akram Brais.

Witnesses said another 10-year-old and 15-year-old were also injured.

The Israeli army first stormed Rafah early on Tuesday, destroying at least 30 Palestinian homes and damaging another 14, leaving 400 people homeless.

The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) began distributing tents to accommodate the homeless.

--snip--

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/C4500860-5581-4CB3-A1B5-1E8862369D56.htm

[Resistance]

9. this is terrorism by Israeli forces

and it is out of control.

[JasonDeter]

10. Your premise is false.

1) It is Israel.

2) A group of Palestinian "militants" not Palestinians. Look up the word militant if you won't accept my deff.

3) Israeli troops shoot back.
Based on your own words, I rest my case.

[Aidoneus]

11. "1) It is Israel."

On what grounds?

[Aidoneus]

14. ?

[Resistance]

30. .

:shrug:

[Lithos]

12. Minor quibble

1) It is Israel.

It is land under the occupation of Israel. It is not Israeli sovereign territory.

L-

on edit, had omitted Israeli before sovereign territory.

[Aidoneus]

13. that's not a minor quibble..

[Blitz]

17. Another quibble

It is disputed land under Israeli occupation but largely under PA administrative control for many years. It is not anyone's sovereign territory at this time. Eventually, some of the land will likely go to the Arabs who are living in that area to do with as they will while some will go to Israel.

[bluesoul]

19. What land will

go to Israel? Israel already has it's land. If you're talking about any part of the West Bank, Gaza or any of the OT, you're very wrong...

[Violet_Crumble]

20. No, it's not disputed land...

For it to be disputed means that Israel is laying claim to it, which I don't think it is...


As a matter of curiosity, do you agree with Jason Deter's comment that the West Bank and Gaza Strip are part of Israel?

Violet...

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tinnypriv]

25. "Largely"

Look at a map. If Area A is bigger than a postage stamp by now you win a prize.

[Jack Rabbit]

28. There's no dispute

There's no dispute except in the minds of the Israeli right wing. The land has never been under Israeli sovereignty and is as subject to the provisions of Resolution 242 as was the Sinai. Borders can be negotiated, but Israel has no right to make any unilateral claim over one acre of land seized in 1967.

The status of the land is occupied.

[tinnypriv]

32. I think they prefer dunum

;-)

[Noon_Blue_Apples]

31. Are you saying the rule of law in Israel

and applied toward Israeli's is the same as in the OT and as applied toward Palestinians?

Like blacks in Florida and whites face the same 'rule of law'

To believe so is jingoistic rationalization...I think that is what is being objected to.

American rule of law...now thats funny

Bill

[Aidoneus]

5. likewise

if some hostile invader starts bashing up your city, you fire at them. Such forces inside occupied lands have two rights:--to stop what they're doing and leave immediately, or barring that, to bleed.

How can you reject it being the ISraeli soldiers' fault? Elaborate. It sounds rather silly and completely unconvincing as it stands.

[Muddleoftheroad]

15. Israeli troops

Were there continuing to shut down the Palestinian terror network that the Palestinians themselves refuse to deal with.

When that happens, fighting often erupts. Since the cowardly scumbag Palestinian terrorists are so brave that they hide under the skirts of women, sometimes bystanders get caught in the crossfire.

[Violet_Crumble]

16. They were demolishing peoples homes...

The formula where anything done by the IDF is covered by the excuse that it's fighting terrorism doesn't work. Israel has an obligation to afford some protection to Palestinian civilians, and it's not just an 'oh well, this happens' kind of thing, or one where Palestinian civilians can be equated to some extra skin taken off when cancer is removed...

Since when are militants legitimately fighting back when the IDF is destroying homes terrorists?

Terrorists hide under the skirts of women? Gosh, the IDF better start targetting these nasty women who protect these terrorists!!!!


Violet...

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Violet_Crumble]

21. Isn't that a tad of an over-exaggeration?

Sometimes they pretend to be ill in order to murder more people.

Something happens once and suddenly it turns into sometimes? btw, that attack was on a legitimate military target and no matter how heroic one thinks the IDF are, when they're killed it can't be called murder, not like when civilians are killed...

Violet...

[lefty_mcduff]

23. Used to be in the old days...

...valour would involve refusing to shoot if women and children were around and even *risked* getting injured (a cartoon example of this can be found in the 'ode to violence' movie Scarface).

Apparantly, not anymore.

[bluesoul]

24. In most countries that still is a rule

If innocents are involved, or even taken hostage, DO NOT SHOOT and endager anyone. Even if some criminal gets away.

[lefty_mcduff]

29. Ahm. Not exactly.

The IDF were looking for tunnels and after demolishing 30 homes (leaving hundreds homeless), they didn't find any (Wooops. Sorry about that).

So as it turns out, this was a case of people defending their homes from an unjust IDF raid. In in the ensuing battle, a child was 'critically' wounded and a woman killed.

Does any of this change your perspective?

[Aidoneus]

22. Israelis kill Palestinian child in Gaza

Another bird-catcher.. how will it be defended?

--snip--

A Palestinian child has been shot dead by Israeli troops in the Gaza Strip near the border fence with Israel, Palestinian medics have said.

The boy, named Muhsin al-Daur, 12, was killed on Thursday when soldiers opened fire at a group of youths hunting birds near the border, Palestinian security sources said.

--snip--

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/DCC8FDFA-7AB8-49E3-BDB2-DC9BCC60596B.htm

[tinnypriv]

26. The same was reported in Yediot

FWIW, although I don't have a link (different comp).